Here comes the Groom

[speed_queen75]

Look Guys

I did not say that all are this way, but where i live that is the case, i have met an awesome man Nathan, and i love him very much, and no i don't have it all wrong, sure i will admit there are some awesome gay men, that are sincere and loving, but that is a RARE breed, kinda like the ABC-O-MATIC, where i live in Cleveland and Chattanooga most all the gay men i know have changed partners ever other day, unlike my straight friends, who, some of them have married their high school sweet hearts, one of my good friends Mitch, is marrying a girl who is wheelchair bound in July, and i will be his best man, something like that would more than likely NOT happen in the gay community, for the most part it's about how big you are, whether or not you body is a Greek Adonis, and how much money you have. I do however have one gay friend that has been in his relationship since high school, and he is now 29. All i am saying is that most of your straight men will accept a woman based on her inner qualities alone and not her looks, where as a gay man would be more about your looks alone, which we all know that looks fade away, but you character remains with you till the day you die. Sorry if i offended anyone, i know that there are some awesome gay men on this site, i just wish more were out in the world, so our community would not have such a HORRIBLE reputation, for being, whores, shallow, stuck up. uppity and conceded, why i say all this? Well in my town that is how we are looked upon.

 

[oldhouseman]

Dude you have

some issues and some points but you have to work through them. Life will be what you want it to be but YOU have to make it happen.

The community you build and the people you surround yourself with make the difference.

You have valid points. Those issues exist in every community.

Really they do. People here can confirm that.

You have to reach within yourself and build your community with the people you choose to let into your life.

Life choices may seem small or unimportant at times but they are always important in small details. You are known by the company you keep.

Look for like minded quality people that have values.

Your community of friends are going to be the people who reflect your values.

Think about your values. Think about your friends. What needs to improve?

The next move is yours. Life is what you make it.

 

[jeffg]

Speed Queen, I respect your views. But to be honest, most gay people I know are either in a long-term committed relationship, or are looking for one.

Also, it's ridiculous to rant about a TV show that caters to fantasy. What TV show doesn't? It's bullshit because it's supposed to be bullshit.

 

[speed_queen75]

Life is what you make of it?

Well if that were the case, then answer me this, why is it that everyone desires to be loved and in a loving relationship, and desperately seeks it, as the good book says, "seek and ye shall find" you and i both know that is not the case, but they cannot find it, and why is it many of us desire to be successful, and work VERY hard at it, but seem to struggle every step of the way, Life, i am afraid, my friend, is not what YOU make of it, you are dealt the cards your given, and you have to live with it, not everyone will have a partner, no matter how badly they desire it, and not everyone will be rich, even tho they so desperately work hard at it. I have had to work for everything i have, and had some rough times, then there are people that are just handed stuff to them on silver platters. So no oldhouseman, life is not want you make of it, your either blessed and favored, or always handed the shit end of the stick and that my dear friend is REALITY. THE END.....

 

[ha_asfan]

Funny How Things Are....

In the states we are two guys living together, people call us "partners", "roommates" and "...you and your friend". In Tel Aviv, we are "domestic partners" and "husbands" to each other. In the states, we are considered old old old and totally out of touch and in Tel Aviv, well, no one is old and out of touch. What it comes down to is personal perspective, respect, love,loving and clean fresh sheets. As long as you have an identity, a clear and vital acknowledgment of who and what you are, chances are you're in good shape. Pity the poor people who want to be everything and in reality, well, aren't much of anything. Just like Marilyn Monroe said "Stake your claim".

 

[Brent-Aucoin]

Blah Blah Blah

Well,
This is clip is so silly!
All long as I have watched television, and have worked in television, I have never seen any program that was worthwhile for the gay community. Every sitcom that I have ever seen always made the gay person more "tolerable". This is not different in anything from the past as far as television is concerned, to me. For instance, you have to have the "fag-hag" in the scene, and this time, she is giving them away, and makes fun of them! And in the end, she does not even know what to call this "union". Oh, and don't forget, that on this VERY IMPORTANT day, the guys forget the most important thing...THE RINGS!
Notice everyone's faces. They really don't look happy, most of them look disgusted.
Always, the homosexual is always less than. Always made fun of. Or at worst, they are evil, or dying from something that there is no cure of, and because of their "life-style", they deserve.
I will tell you good writing......
Let's take this scene. Let's have the same wedding, but this time it is in a church that both of the males, or females grew up in. Instead of a "fag-hag" giving the speech, let it be one of the grooms parents. Yea, Parents that were also in a gay relationship, and raised him, to be as perfect as he appears. Let most of the crowd be gay, and not high five slapping straight people!
I don't think we would see anything like this anytime soon on prime time.
I know, many people will say "but it is a start for gay people". I say, this has been going on since the first day of film, and gay people always fall into this "He is nice, but you know he is gay" realm. It is gross! I wish they would just leave the "gay" characters as they see them, out.
I think if most of you thought about your own lives, and those that you have known that lived amazing lives as a homosexual, you could come up with a better story for television, without making fun of them, or pointing out their weakness.
None of this was to offend. I just wanted to point out that this scene, and the characters that these guys play are only for ratings! Not for boosting up the gay vote in the USA!!
Peace!
Brent

 

[brisnat81]

Not a Fag Hag

Hi Brent,

It would appear that you dont watch Brothers and Sisters. The "Fag Hag" is actually the sister of one of the gay men, and if you'd seen the whole series that sort of debarcle is commonplace and usually happens with any of the characters in any episode. The kerfuffle isnt unique to this wedding ceremony. When that fag hag "Kitty" got married, she left the alter with her husband mid nuptuals to resolve a mini crisis.

To me, the purpose of that scene wasnt to further gay rights, it was part of an amusing sitcom where a family member demonstrted his love for his partner in the same way the rest of the family interacts.

I think everyone is taking it too seriously, its an amusing sitcom full of funnies and furphies and I think thats what the writers intended.

 

[Brent-Aucoin]

Whatever

I totally see what the "Writer" intended. Or the network that is hosting this intended this to be.
You show me a serious gay "Union" on a television network, and I will say that is progress.
There is nothing serious about this. It is silly, and very insulting to the gay community.
It is all so "thrown together".
What queen would do this for their wedding? Or as far as you are saying about the sitcom, let a "fag-hag" do the sermon. I don't care what her role is. Sister, ex-wife, blah, blah, blah, she is insulting. You would never say this at a union that you cared about the victims.
In television, you always have to pretend that some viewer is "just tuning in". And in the case of the viewers that have been watching all along, you got them, so let's just keep insulting their intelligences.
It is poor. You will never convince me.
Glad that you are getting something out of the network. And I am sure that you are also.
Wake up!
Brent

 

[jeffg]

Good grief. It's a TV show. If you want reality turn off your TV and go find some.

This show like every other on commercial TV has sponsors and will cater to a hetero audience. Get over it already.

 

[maytagbear]

Let's dance,

or run a load of dishes, or watch some "Dexter" on Netflix.

Lawrence/Maytagbear

 

[toggleswitch]

Doesn't the shit end of the stick mean someone had a jol

~So no oldhouseman, life is not want you make of it, your either blessed and favored, or always handed the shit end of the stick and that my dear friend is REALITY. THE END.....

First of all there are MANY ways to believe, think and process. No single opinion is Gospel, ever. BTW, those who don't bend, break. It is CRUCIAL that we all learn to be flexible if we aren't already. The earlier in life the better.

The biggest truth on the planet:
EVERYONE is EXACTLY where they want to be in life OR THEY WOULD CHANGE IT.

There is a saying in my ethnic group. "Life is like a cucumber. Some eat it and are refreshed; and others eat it and get gas." Your choice.

Dear sirs- life is all about asjusting one's attitude, overcoming pre-conceived notions and the ability to overcome obstacles. It is said that life is 10% inspiration and 90% perspiration.

Everyone on the planet sees life through:
Their culture (read: the LIMITATIONS of their culture).
Their language (read: the LIMITATIONS of their language).
Their religion(read: the LIMITATIONS of their religion).
Their pre-conceived notions and their expectations. And their interpretation of events that they have already experienced. Bittneress and anger only robs the holder of such emotions of their health.

Those who keep turning their heads back to reflect upon what was, miss the train that is about to hit them NOW. A word of advice. LET GO OF ALL PAST ANGER AND BITERNESS. It serves NO ONE. Even the past BTW can be changed by changing one's current perceptions of life.

Gay life is just like straight life except we get a bit more unjust discrimination and hate, and less legal protection and are denied the ability to marry. So what. It is what it is and it ain't gonna be changin' overnight. You can choose to be defeated or to toughen up and conquer. Homosexuality ain't for sissies, it's a HUGE and difficult life-lesson. Not in and of itself, mind you, but because of what various un-enlightened memebers of society do against us. Newsfladh: Whining about it changes nothing. But G-od only gives people as much as they can handle. So decide to handle it. We all can and we all have to. Period. Another ethnic saying "Just the DESIRE to so something is half the battle."

I apologize for pontificating. But one more point, and I hope to G-d its all been somewhat coherent!

Everything begins with a thought.
Thoughts become emotions.
Emotions becoem actions.
Actions become results.
[This concept "universal truth" is reflected in the four suits of Tarot cards of the Minor Arcana (and later evolved into the four suits of playing cards).]

Here it is all boiled down:

Change your thoughts and you have changed the entire scope of reality.

No matter what... we are all loved..even those who dont get the caviar on a silver platter.

Put together your thumb pointer and middle finger. and bend the pinkie and middle finger in toward your palm. This is how the Easter Orthodox Christian make the sign of the cross.The three fingers togeher are representatinve of Father, Son and Holy Spirit which is symbolic of Body, Mind, and soul, all of what makes a person a person. Now the two fingers are the important part. This signiifes the two natures of all humans. Phsyical and Divine (God-like) LISTEN UP! We are all composed of HUMAN and G-D. it is YOUR job to let the G-d part shine through and guide you.

Since we are all collectively and individually G-d, no one is "junk" CAPISH?

Rant over.
PEACE AND LOVE to all.
(I need a cigarette)

 

[bobbins]

I saw this episode last night and it brought wonderful memories of me and my partner getting married last summer. In Canada it is 100% legal to get married!

We had over 200 guests at our wedding (many of them were old ladies with hats…lol) We had an outdoor ceremony at a park off of the ocean, officiated by an Unitiarian Minister and a reception in an Italian Hall with a large commercial kitchen (I think I spent more time playing around with the Hobart Dishwasher!!!).

Our wedding went really well. The day before, we had over 15 friends come by the hall and park to help us stuff cannelloni noodles, fry meatballs, roll buns, and decorate. Later that night, I picked up my sisters from the airport. Being that I was raised as an Italian Catholic, my parents had issues about gay weddings and choosed not to attend, however they accept the fact that I am gay and adore my partner (I think they may have regreted not attending it).

The wedding day was very special. In the morning, I was busy baking 400 buns and warming up the sauce. In my head, I could hear my mom’s voice, “Why don’t you just buy the buns from Safeway? It would be much easier.” However, I wanted to make sure our guests smelled the aroma of freshly baked bread and tomato sauce as they arrived in the hall – just as I remember when I visited Grandma and Grandpa house.

As my partner and I started to head back home to change for the wedding, we decided to drive to a store and buy new shirts and ties (YES, we forgot to buy our clothes for the wedding). We were relieved that we did not encounter anyone we knew at the store. When we got back home (with 40 minutes to spare), our sisters helped us get ready. When we arrived at the park, I was so relaxed and happy to see our friends and family. Many of my cousins, aunts, and uncles made a special trip that day. I was bit sad not to see my parents. This wedding was so meaningful for us. Many friends also came that day to give us their blessing. Everyone looked smashing and happy!

My partner and I really loved our ceremony. Our native friend designed our rings. He carved our rings with a salmon and frog. After the ceremony, we all went to the Italian Hall, and my husband and I served everyone wine, appetizers, homemade buns, watermelon salad, cannelloni, spare ribs, meatballs, and wedding cake with ice cream. By the way, this was lunch! We were pleasantly surprised that our friends, two extremely fine singers, performed some very lovely and touching songs to honour us and our guests. Our sisters gave wonderful toasts.

Before the wedding, the Food network wanted to film our wedding on national TV because it was unique and interesting. We chosen not to as it would have taken the appeal of the wedding away.

Bob

 

[buffster]

Great show! Great episode!

Thanks for starting this thread Robert.

Yes, it's network TV. And, as most of us know, network TV has its pitfalls and limitations. But, personally, for a network show, I think it is well written; the characters are somewhat complex for a change (more so than typical network TV anyway); and it has a stellar cast. Yes, it's a little reminiscent of Thirty Something--well, after all, it is produced by Ken Olin and his wife Patricia Wettig is part of the ensemble cast.

If you missed it, you can watch the full episode online. Follow the link below.

On a slightly separate topic...

IMHO, one of the wonderful things about being part of the Automatic Washer and Vacuumland families is gleaning insights from the many diverse perspectives members bring to this forum. This thread is a prime example of just how different our thinking can be. I personally, see it as a wonderful learning opportunity.

There were many valid points brought up above. (I agree most strongly with what our dear Mr. Toggleswitch wrote.) And, I've lived in Los Angeles and San Francisco long enough to see the truth in what speed_queen75 and Brent-Aucoin wrote. However, IMHO, as Steve wrote, life truly is what you make of it and how you choose to view any situation or circumstance. These clubs are a prime example. Think about how awesome it is that we've all found one another and have this fabulous forum that Robert created where we can meet, exchange ideas, share our passions and build incredible friendships. I have. And, I am grateful.

I too have seen the seemlier side of "gay culture" and found it very depressing. When I was younger (and even now, from time to time) I felt I was a victim to the more negative aspects of "gay society," i.e., the adonis complex and shallow attitudes, and that they were beyond my control. And, then it started to dawn on me that if I wanted things to be different, it was up to me. (You know... If it's meant to be, it's up to me.) Instead of being angry and resentful, I tried treating others the way that I wanted and expected to be treated (you know... do unto others) and I started finding more and more people who felt like me. And, I began to encounter less attitude. (More gratitude, less attitude.) One of the greatest manifestations of the camaraderie, friendship, generosity and kindness to which I'm referring has been through the many wonderful, down-to-earth people I've met through this club and the Vacuum Cleaner Collector's Club. It's there if you really want to find it.

Loading…

abc.go.com

 

[mattl]

Gay or straight, there is more in common than not. You don't think there are superficial straits out there? What straight guy has not been crushed by a girl who thought he wasn't up to her standards? The things that Speed Queen posted about gays can pretty much be applied to certain portions of the straight world.

I really believe it boils down to your attitude. Speed Queen and to some extent Brent remind me of my cousin. We are about the same age, and are both working on houses at the moment. He is suspicious and somewhat resentful, I am not. I've purchased 10s of thousands of dollars of stuff at Home Depot and have had great service. People have gone far and above finding and getting me the things I've needed. He swears he will never go into HD because he was treated so poorly, we have the exact opposite experience. We are both doing the same thing, spending the same money but with very different outcomes. It's because of his perceptions, just as Speed Queen perceives life in a certain way and it meets his expectations, so does my cousin.

It ultimately comes down to we get what we expect and what we project.

 

[sdlee]

poor robert....

you guys have probably made him sorry he even posted this.

oh well I think the question that should be on everyones mind is why the hell would anyone marry Kevin??????!!!!!!

From the get go episode number one he has been a big cry baby, nothings ever good enough for him, and he treats his lovers (not to mention family members) like so much dog shit.I seriously quit watching the show coz I think hes a poor representation for the gays

Now that said I dont know what Hollywood has done for his charector these last episodes but obviously this guy married him. It had to be for love, right? On brothers and sisters nobody makes life changing decisions for anything but love right?

lol....it is funny what this episode and thread has brought out of the woodwork.

personally I would have married Justin, a lot less trouble and so much better looking (ooooh that wasnt shallow,was it?)

 

[toggleswitch]

That was a very very sweet ceremony. Too bad (for her) he probably looked better and carried the teddy/neglige better than she did.

Now in terms of negativity. NO NO NO NO . It just attracts more negativity and tragedy.

 

[vinvac]

Robert, again I must say Thank You for sharing this video clip. Negativity does breed negativity, Thank You Toggle.

I have read the above postings and just have to say, there are many things written above that have some truth and obviously have brought up some bad memories of our past.

The comment above about the rings..if you had watched watched the whole show, you would realize that they were not planning a wedding, nor were they going to use rings, it was simply going to be a commitment ceremony...nothing more. There was not even going to be flowers...just a simple ceremony. However, his brother and sisters and other family members gave up their wedding rings and handed them to the new couple. Also his family made sure that there were flowers and that this would be a memorable day for each of them...

Kevin's mother embraced Scotti and welcomes him to the family. Kevin and his brothers, by his brothers choice, drive hundreds of miles to convince Scotti's parents to attend the wedding...because they do care about their brother and what makes him happy...

I realize this may not be a real world event for all, and it probably brings up a lot of bad memories for many of us here, but positive energy spreads the very same way negative energy spreads...let's hope that this TV scene can help wake up many here in America, make them realize that Love is just that LOVE and why should two people gay or straight be separated for any reason.

By the way, I hate the term FAG HAG, why can't she just be the best friend of the person...just because someone is gay, that makes the company she is with something different...I have several female friends and I would never refer to them as a fag hag...I have more respect for myself than that.

Morgan

 

[Unimatic1140]

Feh

Geee, I post a nice little happy wedding ceremony that I saw on tv the night before that made me happy to see and it turns into all this. (***acts as if he didn't know that in advance***) lol

I think alot of queers need to take a lesson from straight men, who are more than likely to love a woman for her qualities and not her looks, unlike the queers

I'm sorry but that statement is so not fair to us gay men and I have to say that this has to be the most preposterous statement I've heard in a long time. Have you ever spoken to any straight women? They are constantly complaining about how men are "lookist". The term "men are pigs" was invented by women about straight men. Have you seen the statistics on cosmetic surgery, in 2007 "Women had 92 percent of cosmetic procedures". (link: http://www.cosmeticplasticsurgerystatistics.com/statistics.html#2007-FACTS ) You can bet that these women are not having surgeries to please gay men.

As for having one partner after the next, don't even get me started on the heterosexual divorce rate, according to the stats on the web:

50% percent of first marriages, 67% of second and 74% of third marriages end in divorce, according to Jennifer Baker of the Forest Institute of Professional Psychology in Springfield, Missouri.” Talk about having one marriage after the next.

My point is the evidence clearly shows that men are men, gay, straight, bi, we're all the same.

 

[speed_queen75]

Yes true men are men.

But at least i know that my straight friends, whom i might add out number my gay friends by far, are in relationships cause they love the quality of their women, and not their looks alone, yes men are pigs, what i have found to be true, especially where i live, is that the gay community is very frowned upon, for being shallow self centered, and down right stuck up, there is one gay club where i live, called Images, to even enter in this club you have to have a certain body type, be of a certain age, if you don't meet those requirements, forget it you ain't getting in, One prime example of the way gay men are in my town, is this one friend of mine, Lance, he will NOT date any guy unless they are hairless, tall, his cut off height is 6'3", built like a brick shit house, oh yes and they must be EXTREMELY masculine, drive an suv, and be hung. Now if that ain't shallow i don't know what is, i mainly have straight friends, girls and guys, with whom i am very close to, and i have grown up with them, and can tell you that they are TOTALLY, a different breed, when it comes to what they are looking for in a woman, or a man, most of them look for good wholesome qualities, and not how big they are and, what kinda xcar they drive, or even how many times a week they work out.
That is why i admire and love Nathan, he has the same thinking i do, and shares the same thoughts about the gay community, he too has been BURNED several times by many of the guys, cause he don't look right, or because he is a little on the puggy side, but what they failed to look at was Nathan as a person, and not as a body figure, i see Nathan for Nathan, his good qualities, his sense of humor, his awesome personality, his ability, to overcome most any situation and the way he uplifts me when i am have a bad day, i did not get with him cause he is hung, or because he drives a Chevy Z71, or makes $80.000.00 a year, or anything like that, i love him for who he is along with his faults, let's face it we all have them. I am not trying to down anyone, or attack anybody on this site, you guys are AWESOME people and i am VERY honored to be a member of this wonderful site, all i am saying is, i hate seeing the gay community looked down upon, because many of them have given the community a horrible reputation, that is why I am different, i don't frequent the clubs, or go to pride, i stay out of the "scene" completely. I just wish that if we are going to be gay, then we should be different in our thinking and in the way we treat others, " and i am talking about the rotten apples here", and not so shallow in our thinking, that to be gay and to have a lover, you have to be in this category "OR ELSE". I know most here think i am negative etc etc, but i am seeing the reality of things, especially in my home town, i mean come on the only gay club we have here has requirements to even get in the door, and that is VERY sad.

In closing, i want to say, i think all you guys on here are great examples of what real gay men are supposed to be, and i am so glad i am a member of this truly awesome site.

With Love Lee..

 

[danemodsandy]

Part of the Problem:

One thing that I've often wished is that people- of all genders and orientations- would not do is to patronise any establishment that practises "face control". By this, I mean what Lee has mentioned- if you don't look a certain way, you're not getting in. Such a practise is discrimination, pure if not exactly simple. It is illegal to discriminate on the basis of other physical characteristics, such as race or gender- why on Earth should it be legal to discriminate on the basis of good looks or lack thereof?

Any place that practises "face control" is a place that does not deserve anyone's money, let alone the money of the gay community. How can any thinking person fight the good fight against workplace and societal discrimination on one hand, and enjoy themselves in a place where only the beautiful are tolerated on the other? Everyone is discriminated against at some point or other. If you're lucky enough to be beautiful and rich when you're young, just wait- there's a whole bunch of discrimination waiting for you when you get older. The only way to put an end to discrimination is to demand better- not only of others, but of ourselves. The day we pick our friends and associates for physical characteristics over which they had no control, we're no better than your average KKK member.

Sorry to be so blunt, but this is a subject very close to my heart.