Hotpoint dishwasher from 50's detergent dispenser question...

[turbokinetic]

One of my fridge repair customers slipped this in when I was not looking LOL.  I have managed to sort out the fill valve and drain pump, but the detergent dispenser has me in a quandary. 

 

I made a video explaining it; but in summary this is the problem.  The detergent cup dumps into the tub as soon as the door is closed.  The timer sequence starts by flowing water into the tub and draining simultaneously to flus and heat up the tub. This looks to me like it will simply flush the detergent down the drain before the wash even starts. 

The manual shows a different detergent setup. I am reaching out to those with experience on these to help me understand what is missing or incorrect here.  

 

As I say in the video, I have been told these dishwashers were much less effective than modern ones. This is a project for someone who understands this and is willing to accept it if it is working as intended. 

 

Sincerely,

David

 

 

 

 

[cycla-fabric]

Hi David, from what you are showing, it looks like the detergent dispenser has been replaced, as these Hotpoint dishwashers have 2 wash periods in them and the detergent dispenser shown in the book shows that it should have 2 separate cups to hold the detergent for both wash periods. Wash water would fill the dispenser and the weight of the water would cause the dispenser to open for each wash period. You need to find the right dispenser for this machine. Maybe someone on this sight can help you with locating that part, maybe ebay. We had a 1956 Hotpoint that used this same 2 compartment dispenser when I was growing up, and that was a long time ago.

Doug

 

[turbokinetic]

Thank you Doug. I appreciate it and figured something was not correct. Will continue looking for the correct part. If anyone has a lead on one, please let me know!

 

[launderess]

Visuals....

 

[turbokinetic]

Thank you for the video!

 

[launderess]

YW, twernt nothin..

 

[americana4]

It looks to me that this is an earlier model, before the one shown in your manual. I've used a '51 model which had only the one indentation open cup shown. It had the same cycle sequence, with a brief spray & drain flush followed by 2 5 minute wash periods.
I think the theory was that the deep cup would shield the tablespoon of detergent from the spray & prevent it from being washed out until the drain closed. The manual stated that "there was enough detergent left on the dishes and tub for the second wash".
Both may have been slightly wishful thinking, but seemed to work well enough for the time period, when most dishes were pre rinsed.
The 51 model had the center glass rack which had to be removed to load the bottom. Later models had an independent, better designed top rack. Perhaps the 2 section dispenser and improved to rack came together with the later models.

 

[turbokinetic]

Tom; thank you so much for that information. There were a few other small discrepancies in the manual, as well. I figured it was probably a year model difference thing.  

I expect detergent "pods" may be an option for this machine, in the hopes that they don't dissolve during the initial spray flush. Will keep looking for the later style dispenser cup and also looking for a timer knob.  There is a knob on eBay by Lorain Furniture but it doesn't seem to be the correct type for this timer shaft. I think it is for a newer model, but again I have never seen the correct one so it's hard to tell.

 

Sincerely,

David 

 

[combo52]

Early 50s hot point dishwasher

Yay David will get you restoring dishwashers and washing machines yet putting your expertise to work solving difficult problems.

I doubt somebody switched the detergent dispenser on this model you have there does seem to be a discrepancy however they made both types of dispensers. The models had the wash cycle. I think you could use pods With good results in this dishwasher.

How did you hook up the electric drain pump electrically, I believe originally the drain solenoid was energized when the dishwasher was Not draining, and the solenoid was deenergized when the dishwasher was draining.

We have the same dishwasher in our museum collection with the single shot detergent cup.

The thing about these early gravity, drain machines says they could not overflow. The water would just start flowing down the drain if the inlet valve malfunctioned, that was an amazingly complicated inlet valve used Machines very cool that’s for sure.

John

 

[turbokinetic]

Hi John, thanks for your input on this dishwasher!  You are absolutely correct about the drain solenoid being energized to "hold" and de-energized to drain.  I used a relay to invert the signal from the timer. The relay sends power to the drain pump whenever the timer is running and the timer signal to the drain solenoid is off.  I was hopeful that the drain pump wouldn't overheat during the extended run at the end of the cycle but so far it has not seemed to have a problem. 

I still have a few tweaks to make on this. We are considering making it so that the heating element works during the wash cycle, as per the cycle of operation for the newer models shown in the manual. I have an adjustable high-limit thermostat to attach to the bottom of the tub as a safety device, as an abundance of caution. Will make more videos on this when I have more opportunities to work on it. 

 

[launderess]

"....drain solenoid being energized to "hold" and de-energized to drain.."

Is basically same system long used in commercial/industrial h-axis washing machines including those found in laundromats that have dump valves instead of pumps.

When machine has power or whatever drain valve is shut. OTOH loss of power is what triggers valve to open and dump water.

It's an ingenious system in so much as if there is a power cut water will simply drain out of washer. On most domestic h-axis washers there is usually some sort of spigot or hose that allows one to drain water out of machine when pump cannot (as in loss of power).

 

[rollermatic]

love the commercial!

mary dancing around as that hotpoint elf is the entire commercial in my book!

 

[launderess]

Mary Tyler Moore was terminated from "Happy Hotpoint" elf while waiting for her first (and only) child to be born. Visible changes in her figure made wearing the costume impossible much less any attempt at concealing her condition.