How hard is hard?

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dj-gabriele

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I was having a look at the average water hardness in various countries and how the hardness levels are defined.

I was astonished that "hard water" in the USA starts at 180ppm of calcium and magnesium salts per litre of water.

Here in Italy "hard water" is defines as more than 38 French degrees that is 380ppm of salts per litre.

On top of this we're advised to not over soften water as a hardness under 15 French degrees (150ppm) would be more bad than good, like bad rinsing in washing machines and decreased mineral intake.

Despite the heavy investments companies of water softening equipment put on advertising, they have not been very popular. We had one installed and after 5 years we deactivated it as the expenses of keeping it running were as much as the waterduct bills and the difference in water quality wasn't that noticeable. We only kept an activated charcoal cartridge filter that we change every now and then.

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That's interesting...

....Canberra's water is rightly considered 'soft' with a hardness rating of 4 French Degrees...or 40ppm...

Our washing machines, kettles and water heaters certainly don't suffer calcification (it is not unusual for electric hot water heaters to last 30years....they rust before the elements become ineffective from calcium).....

...and anyone who buys bottled water is a complete fool in this town as our town water is lovely to drink....

Now, as for poor rinsing, remember, you need less detergent if the water is soft....
 
According to regulations, water hardness in the Netherlands must be between 1 and 2.5 mmol/l (100-250 ppm). In Amsterdam, the water hardness is 8.4 dH (150 ppm).

The water in Amsterdam comes from different sources each with it's own hardness. In the past the main source was rain water that had been filtered through the sand in the dunes near the coast and was quite hard because of the lime content of the soil in the dunes. Nowadays a large portion of our water comes from the river Rhine. All water is softened to a hardness of 8.4 dH.
 
Molto Grazie

Interesting. Thank you for posting this Gabriele. New York City water is natually soft and collected from the mountains upstate (north). It is considred one of the healthiest and best-tasting waters in the country.

People ("everyone") drink(s) NYC water from the tap; and I always try to have some when I'm dining there.

I live just a few block outside of NYC. Water here on Long Island comes from wells in the ground and tastes like @$$. No one here drinks from the tap. Groundwater on Long Island is generally believed to be carcinogenic and otherwise unhealthy.
The carcingens come from many sources including buried fuel-oil and gasoline tanks, pesticides and fertilzers for the numerous lawns and golf-courses and from the days of heavy (and light) manufacturing.

Anyone care to discuss WHY softened water may not be fit to drink (besides salt content). I honestly have NO idea.

Also we don't have salt dispensers(for water-softening) in our dishwashers. Similarly, I wonder if front-loaders and the cultural use of tremendous heat and generally high water temperatures on the other side of the pond is related to hard water.

 
Since we live out in the sticks where public water is unheard of, everyone has a well, Most people in our area has water that is hard with calcium and/or rust. Those wells have a nasty tasting water.
Luckily we are located on top of a hill which is solid limestone, so our water is hard with lime, and there is no calcium or rust, and our water has a good taste, and our water isn't very hard 40 GPG.
 
...as she was pointing to that cubic zirconium thing you presented her with claiming it to be a REAL diamond ring. FEH!

LOL
 
My wife almost spit out her coffee when I told her what I had posted about her. She laughed so hard she had to make a mad dash for the bathroom!
 
All these different units have me a bit dizzy.

As far as I can recall, grains of hardness is roughly equivalent to German hardness units, or dH.

The water here is relatively soft, between 3 and 5 grains. That's according to the water company and my own testing.

The property also has a well that never goes dry, but that is relatively hard. I think it's somewhere in the teens of grains of hardness. It's been useful for irrigation and also for testing the ability of various water softeners to hold the minerals in suspension without precipitating them out. I've never drunk it; the test I had run 10 years ago indicated that it has too much nitrates to be potable. That may have changed since they've fixed the neighboring condo's leaky sewer pipe.
 
When I installed my Miele Dishwasher....

I phoned the local water company and they gave me a figure of 17 German degrees- considering Dover is built on chalk and our water comes from boreholes I was pretty surprised!!!.

The scale goes up to 60+ ........

Seamus
 
What a timely coincidence...All these different units have m

I'm in the process of having my Kinetico water softener evaluated and serviced. First inspection by short stocky burly bachelor Jutzi Service Rep Tom showed the Kinetico to be softening all right but not as well as it should. After running the cycles water testing Tom pointed out that the advance cam is not turning and suspects something is jamming one of the motor turbine wheels abnd it is recharging only one of the tanks alternately, mixing hard and soft in the pipes.
Tomorrow, Wednesday, the Kinetico tech is coming by to remove the head and replace whatever is necessary and since the softener has been performing like this since installation 5 years ago is is a defect covered by the lifetime warranty.
I chose this non-electric on demand softener because Stratford's water is known to be so hard and I didn't want to degrade the investment in new plumbing and fixtures associated with the bathroom renovation, as well as preserve the laundry machines and my 'maturing' skin.

I'm sure many of you know about the Kinetico but for those thgat don't, the Kinetico has no electric motor and thus no connection whatever to household current. It is a passive on-demand two tank system that uses water pressure entering the house - when called for by usage - to spin turbines that runs the cycle mechanically on alternate tanks so that one tank is always available for household use while the other recharges. Initial investment is 3-4 times the cost of a standard electric softener but with a much much longer service life of 20+ years? (because re-charging is dependent only on actual water use rather than a user programmable cycle and no added electricity costs) it is less expensive over the long run. Another plus is that a Kinetico can be simply disconnected from the house system and taken with the original owner should they move, with no loss of warranty.

The standard electromechanical softeners have a nasty habit around this town of breaking down within a year or two, particularly those that use circuit boards instead of a motor driven gearbox & timer cam to control functions in a high humidity environment aka The Basement/Laundry Room of most homes.

I know the Kinetico is working because there are no stains on my fixtures and soap lathers nicely in the washer or the shower.
But I never felt that silky/slimey feeling the the shower and I missed that. At the time I was told This was not necessary to adjust the softener for slimey-ness and I accepted that as these guys at Jutzi are the experts.

But, I noticed I was only adding a bag of salt every 6-8 months and that just didn't seem right after all these years.

The point of all this backstory is that I found this thread's discussion of grains and ppm's fascinating and went looking for Stratford's readings in relation to this area of Ontario.

Here's what I found out:
"Toronto gets its water from Lake Ontario, which has a hardness level of about 120 parts per million of calcium and magnesium," says Steve Renon, manager of technical services for Milacron Canada Inc. in Burlington, ON. "That's almost a perfect environment for metalworking fluids. But then if you go to Stratford you might hit 550 parts per million–that's a huge difference."

Btw, when Hunky Tom came into my kitchen and saw the Appliance Towers we chatted for a good 20 minutes before heading to the basement. I had a stack of Foxtrot 78's playing on the GE changer. Tom asked what radio station did I have one and when I told him it was a 78 record changer his eyes lit up like a billboard. after the basement I brought him to the front room to see the changer and of course it's hard to miss the towers of vacuum cleaners. :-)
I am looking forward to Tom's next follow-up visit to inspect the water softener...yeah, that's it...
Seriously now, I am looking forward to that silky/slimey shower soon. Tom says Ladies call it silky and guys always call it slimey. Whatever...
Dave


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