KitchenAid KDS-15 - leaking

[mdelvecc]

Hi everyone...

What a great forum this is. Such a wealth of knowledge here! I've already downloaded the service manual for my KDS-15, thanks to the generous folks here that scanned it in.

So... this machine came with our house, original equipment when built in 1965. I've just recently started to attempt to fix the old gal. We were told it didn't work when we bought the house, so it's been sitting and waiting for some love. I first fired it up and found it to be immediately leaking badly from below. Further inspection revealed broken and cracked hoses. I've replaced all of those. Unfortunately I had to do this from the front, as someone before us tiled up to the dishwasher, preventing it from being removed! No amount of height adjustment on the legs or even cutting will get it free. I would have to break floor tiles or bullnose countertop tiles. I'm stuck working only from the front unless I get stuck and have to cut access up into the subfloor from underneath.

Anyway, now there is just a small leak from the seal between the tub and the pump. My worry is that this seal cannot be replaced with the machine installed. Any experience here? Does anyone have the seal or the part number for the seal? If I can get the motor out, should I also be replacing the shaft seal at the same time?

Thanks in advance. I'll post some photos as well... I promise I'll clean her up when the work is done!
-Matt

 

[mdelvecc]

And... inside pic

of said machine. Parts removed while I'm working on it... I have everything, luckily.

 

[mdelvecc]

Leak area

Shown here...

 

[toploader55]

Yikes !!!

Ouch !

Gee, I hope the sump isn't shot. Looks like alot of corrosion and rust. Especially the motor and the sump.

The experts will be chiming in shortly. Stevet... What do you think ?

 

[combo52]

Leaking KDS-15

The tank seal between the tank and pump housing is replaceable without moving this DW, in fact nearly every part of this DW is serviceable without the need to ever remove this DW from it place of installation. You may be able to save your motor, but it may be easier to get a complete better condition pump and motor assembly from a 15-17 series DW to complete your rebuilding [ in any case you should replace the drain impeller and water seal unless yours is in near perfect condition ]. Once you remove the pump and motor assembly you may need to do some cleaning and re-coating of the tank flange if the rust is much more than surface rust that will clean off easily.

 

[mdelvecc]

sounds like...

I'll be removing the pump and motor to see what it looks like from there. Great to know that it can come out from the front! Thanks combo52. I'll report back with what I find.

 

[stevet]

WHOA!!!! NELLIE

Before you go hogwild trying to get the pump out, make sure that you already have the gaskets and pump seal in your hands. These parts are generally no longer available and while the pumps for the 15,16 and 17 are essentially identical except for the washarm supports, the gaskets are different. The 16 and 17's use the same gaskets but the 15 is unique to that model series alone. Also, you must take out the parts above the tank line before dropping it down to the floor.

Also, in light that you have the tile in the way, it could present a problem in giving you clearance. I would suggest that you completely remove the brackets that secure the machine to the counter and then raise the machine up as high as you can to gain more space.

Otherwise, did you remove the counter brackets and then try lowering the feet and see if you could slide it out from under the bull nose tile?

Also, is there actually water dripping from that rust spot? It may have already sealed itself and maybe you can affect a repair from the top to prevent it from getting worse. If you are not careful and the rust is really bad, you may rip a chuck of tank out of the bottom trying to get the motor out.

Procede carefully but make sure you have those parts noted above.

 

[mdelvecc]

Ok... holding off

Thanks stevet. I don't have any gaskets at this time, no. If anyone has parts they'd like to sell, please let me know.

In response to your comments... I may be able to get another 3/8" of working clearance by removing the counter brackets and raising the feet, which would be helpful. However, removing the machine won't happen no matter what I remove or where the feet are positioned. It's hard to completely describe, but the opening is shy about 1/4" assuming NO LEGS... just to the metal frame itself. So I'm not able to remove it without tiles coming out.

Yes, there is water dripping down from the rust spot when I test the machine. That's why I assume some combination of the rust and/or a bad gasket there is the issue.

 

[stevet]

photos???

can you get a few shots of the rust on the inside? Maybe John or some of the others can help assess the damage and suggest a fix that will stop or slow the process.

 

[mdelvecc]

would I

Need to then remove the wash arm support to get photos of the lower part of the tank? The only rust I can see from inside before disassembling anything further is right next to the heater element.

Thank you!

 

[mdelvecc]

Went ahead

and took out everything but the motor/drain pump. How bad is it, doc?

 

[mdelvecc]

one more

pic

 

[toploader55]

Yikes !!!!!!!!!

I'm anxious to hear about the fix on that.

I'm gettin' the chills looking at that.

 

[mdelvecc]

me too!

I think the previous homeowner must have just let it sit with water in there for years!

 

[mdelvecc]

An update!

Well, I took a chance at tightening the motor mounting bolts, as they were a bit loose. Poured in some water and no leak! Imagine that! Put the innards back, ran a cycle, and no drips. I might just have a functional KDS after all. Will run some dishes this weekend to put her through the paces. Looking forward to cleaning up and using this baby. I know some day that rust will get the best of it, but for now, it's running.

 

[rp2813]

Great news!  Someone here might have a suggestion for something that can be used to repair the rusted areas and keep them from getting any worse.  I think I've read about JB Weld being used, but perhaps not in a dishwasher application where a heating element is in close proximity.

 

[toploader55]

JB Weld

I used the JB Weld for a sump repair on my KA Regency. Worked Great/ Use the one for "Potable Water". The Prep is important.

 

[toploader55]

BTW...

I just started up my KDS 55 (the portable version of your machine).

The machine would fill for the first 4 cycles(Prewash, Rinse Wash, and the first rinse). It would not fill for the last two. Hmmmmm.....

Turns out I took apart the wash arm support and low and behold, the Port for the Pressure Switch was plugged. Some very carefull, gentle digging and the machine yet again is running like it was just ubcrated. 48 years Young and still scrubbing like all get out. (That's very New Jersian, "all get out" ).

And that was Stevet's suggestion.

I thought it was the timer.

 

[rp2813]

Epoxy Patch

In reading the recent thread about scoring a $2 KDS-18, I saw a couple of posts that suggested epoxy patch for chipped areas that have rusted.  I don't know if that's the same thing as JB Weld, but I'm sure your helpful hunky hardware man at ACE will.

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