Kitchenaide help

[lesto]

I need to remove a clog from a Hobart Kitchenaide superba Monterey (late 80's I believe) and am not sure the correct way to remove the drain base from inside the tub. The 4-vane impeller was easy to remove but I'm not sure which screws to remove to lift the base up under the imperller in order to get the clog out. Apparently the person who has this machine before allowed their kid to throw money in it because we found a few pennys in it when we were first working on it and we suspect there's another one blcoking the pump as weive checked both drain hoses and the pump is running at full speed with no sounds of motor strain.
Any help would be appreciated.

Les

 

[gyrafoam]

Les---

send Combo52 an e-mail. He will know exactly what to do.

Best wishes!

 

[soberleaf]

or

get ahold of stevet!

 

[stevet]

Start with the right Model number

The Superba Monterey KDS21-M did not have a 4 vane impeller for the wash nor the drain. This unit came with the curved vane wash impeller which was installed with the vanes facing down and the drain impeller/Shaft seal assembly was an all metal design,unlike the previous styles used in Kichenaid machines.
By any chance, is there a drain solenoid that you can identify in case you mis-identified the machine? If so,make sure the linkage on it moves freely and if so, then check to see that it energized when you hit cancel/drain.

Why not just remove the hose from the sink, or the inlet side of the drain valve and let the water drain into a pan? them remove the hose from the bottom of the pump next to the motor and see what's in the line? It can be clogged up anywhere between the dishwasher and the connection to the sink, disposer or air gap if equipped with one.

Get back to us. we will get you back in business.
Steve

 

[lesto]

Hi Steve,
We did remove the two hoses to make sure they were clear and let them drain into a pan but the unit just isn't pumping out at the rate it should. When I get home this evening I'll post the exact model number.
Mine definitely has the 4 vane impeller, has an all black front with 7 silver pushbutton controls (3 cycle selectors on the left of the handle and 4 option buttons on the right) and says Kitchen Aide Superba Monterey on the upper left.
Thanks for helping me out!

Les

 

[gansky1]

Wash Arm - Not Impeller?

Do you mean the wash-arm has four 'spokes' - called the 4 - Way Hydrosweep Wash Arm?

The impeller(s) are inside the pump, not visible without disassembly. The very old dishwashers from other makers had impeller washing action - a small spiral or metal fan-shaped device in the bottom of the tank to disperse the water. KitchenAid never used an impeller for their dishwashers - only wash arms and in fact, most impellers were completely gone by the early 60's, I think Westinghouse was the last to use this style of washing.

Good luck with your repair!

 

[lesto]

Hi Greg,
I meant the wash arm has 4 blades. Thanks for clearing this up for me. I was obviously using the wrong terminology.
Here is the model numbers I gotfrom the plate on the machine:
72026855

KUD521MSO.
And I meant to say all 7 buttons are to the right of the handle.

Thanka again for all your help!

 

[stevet]

Whirlpool!!! Yuck KUDS21MSO

Well, it is not a built by Hobart Monterrey..It is one that was built after the buy by Whirlpool. The KUD gives it away. Hobart never used "U" designation and WP did. But be that as it may,it wasn't until the 23 series machines that WP changed the pumps to their Power Module pump system. Your unit has the metal disposer/drain impeller and like Gansky said, none of the pump workings can be seen from opening the door or removing the washarm. It has to be disassembled to see what is the problem.
But first, make absolutely sure that the drain the hose drains into is not clogged or sluggish. There is only so much resistance any dishwasher can pump against and if it is too much, the unit(no matter what brand) will not be able to pump all the water out.

I suggest you get a 5 gallon pail and disconnect the drain from the sink and let it drain into the pail. If all the water leaves the machine, you know your problem is in the plumbing.
Since you said the lines are clear, then this would seem to be the most likely scenario. These units had very well protected pumps and drains and it is really unlikely that a coin would work its way into the pump without some really horrendous noise coming from the drain system.

If and when you disassemble the pump, you will see that the metal drain impeller was actually part of a miniature garbage disposer which really ground up just about anything sent its way. They don't usually fail to drain out. The typical failure is the seal just fails and it leaks water.
Now there could be some kind of paper or plastic wrap all inside preventing the water from draining, so a pump breakdown is probably a good idea too. Just remember where everything comes out of and return it back exactly as you found it including the rubber o-ring on the shaft as well as the shims you will find there. They must be put back in their correct locations as some shim the botton drain impeller and some shim the wash impeller and they are not the same outside diameter so you can mess them up and have worse problems.

Just take your time and you will succeed. If you want a breakdown of this, let me know and I will scan and email it to you.

 

[lesto]

Thanks for all the help, Steve. I've checked my plumbignand everything is clear so the problem must be somewhere in or near the pump so I'll take a crack at it this weekend. If you don't mind I'd love a scan of the breakdown.

Thanks,
Les

 

[soberleaf]

i had a

peice of plastic lodged in the drain pump of one of my kd-17
kitchenaids that caused a similiar problem. it was there because the machine had been run without the coarse filter in place.

i agree with everyone else, the best thing is to tear into the pump and see what you find! who knows what will be there. anymore whenever i get a new kitchenaid (new to me at least) the first thing i do is take the pump apart to have a look.

good luck

 

[stevet]

on the way!

Les, I am emailing you a scan of the pump breakdown and repair procedures for your review!. any questions, please let me know
Steve

 

[lesto]

Thanks, Steve. That will be a huge help. I'm beginning to think it's the drain solenoid not opening the drain completely. Will check it before breaking down the pump but I wasn't sure where the solenoid is located so any help with that I'd love. E-mail me at [email protected].

Thanks!

 

[coldspot66]

If it has the W/P pump module, disconnect the drain hose at the pump and unscrew the drain valve extension. Small round objects will block the flow of drain water, as it is a smallish opening. That may be your only problem. Try it before disassembling the motor/pump.

 

[coldspot66]

oops, disregard my previous post. It is NOT the W/P style pump module, if it's a "21". check the blue drain/check valve for an obstuction before you tear into the pump.

 

[stevet]

On the SPOT, Coldspot!

Les, the 21-22 series had no solenoid and used the reversing motor to pump the water out.(the 23 used the power module from WP and reversed as well with a checkvalve of different design.) Like Coldspot mentioned, sometimes the checkvalve which is located bewteen the 2 pieces of the drain valve inside the bracket in front of the motor, gets something caught in it. It DOES actually come apart into two pieces so dont be afraid to take it apart and check for proper operation. Who knows, maybe someone serviced the machine and put it back in backwards; hence, little or no drain action!

P.S. I will re-email the breakdown to you in case you did not get it.

 

[lesto]

Thanks you guys! This is a big help. I'm sure you're right about this model having no solenoid because the motor does pause between wash and drain. I'll clean out the checkvalve. Thanks for resending the breakdown. I'll be watching for it and I'll let you know what I find in that blue drain check.

 

[stevet]

Address check

Les, I resent the file to the address you gave above but I am not sure it was a valid email address. Is it? My outlook express burped a bit on me when I typed it in.
Steve

 

[lesto]

Hi Steve,
I got your email just fine. I'll let you know what i find.

Les

 

[lesto]

Success! The problem was indeed the blue check valve The rubber seal between the two pieces of the valve was blocking part of the opening. Now that it's back in place the machine is draining beautifully and is now washing the breakfast dishes.

Thanks to you all for your help. Now I can get to cleaning those rollers on the 1-18!

 

[stevet]

while you are at it...

How about a trailer hitch or two?