"It's a brand new stove! Why do only two burners work?!"
"We only subscribed to two."
"And is that why the convection doesn't work in the oven?"
"Well, you said we probably wouldn't use it."
Let's hope appliance makers aren't contemplating something like this.
- Thread starter joeekaitis
- Start date
Help Support :
"It's a brand new stove! Why do only two burners work?!"
"We only subscribed to two."
"And is that why the convection doesn't work in the oven?"
"Well, you said we probably wouldn't use it."
Seriously, paying to subscribe for a remote start or choosing air conditioning or windows that will open so you can do that in place of it, I hope isn't going to cause a lot of people to give up driving...
Ditto for appliances, if my ice maker stops or I forgot I can no longer use the detergent dispenser in my clothes washer or even my dishwasher because I'm behind in my payments for and they neglected to send me a shut-off notice...
-- Dave
Ditto for appliances, if my ice maker stops or I forgot I can no longer use the detergent dispenser in my clothes washer or even my dishwasher because I'm behind in my payments for and they neglected to send me a shut-off notice...
-- Dave
I read several months ago that automobile companies are considering a recurring paid subscription for some features such as remote start, heated seats, and adaptive cruise.
Capitalism has truly run amok.
I"m more than tired of this effing bs. I was reading last night about younger generations do't see any reason to own anything. FORTUNATELY, one individual in the article had a sense of reality--she said if I get laid off, I still have my car and a roof over my head and I can take it from there!!!!
We are there already...
I drive 2017 VW Golf wagon. It is a MOL version with satnav, lots of extra safety and driver-assist features. (It also has an optional Driver-Assist pack.)
It's a very good car but has one thing that really annoys me. It has the capability for voice control of satnav, phone and some other functions, but this feature is "locked out" and will only be activated if I pay an extra $400 for the PIN code to "unlock" the feature. My partner drives a Skoda from 2013, a smaller, cheaper model and it came with the voice activation as standard.
An aside for American readers: Skoda is a Czech brand of car that is part of the VW group. The engineering is all VW, the major parts in this car are all have Audi and VW logos on them. Skoda is VW's "value" brand - you generally pay less for a Skoda and get more features than the equivalent VW. Build quality is superb - owner satisfaction ratings generally have Skoda owners happier with their "VW" than owners of actual VWs. Skoda have their own styling and features but are always based on a VW floorpan and mechanicals. Our Skoda Fabia is a VW Polo under the skin; the next model up, the Skoda Octavia, is based on a VW Golf.
VW in Australia are rather opaque about this "locked feature" situation. They don't acknowledge it upfront - they offer to sell you a "Voice Activation Module" that can be "installed" to your car by the service department. I was offered this at the time of sale but declined to pay the extra. Later I asked the service department what exactly was in the "voice activation module" and where would it be installed in the car, he said that the feature is already in the car's software, but locked out, and the "Voice Activation Module" is just a PIN, unique to each car, that is entered into the car's computer by their technician after the owner has paid the "unlock fee." (I called it the "ransom fee.") The service department can't access that number from VW until the fee is paid. (Though no doubt some of that fee is a commission to the dealer.)
I think this is outrageous, and I wonder if it is legal? I would quite like the feature but won't be paying $400 for it.
I drive 2017 VW Golf wagon. It is a MOL version with satnav, lots of extra safety and driver-assist features. (It also has an optional Driver-Assist pack.)
It's a very good car but has one thing that really annoys me. It has the capability for voice control of satnav, phone and some other functions, but this feature is "locked out" and will only be activated if I pay an extra $400 for the PIN code to "unlock" the feature. My partner drives a Skoda from 2013, a smaller, cheaper model and it came with the voice activation as standard.
An aside for American readers: Skoda is a Czech brand of car that is part of the VW group. The engineering is all VW, the major parts in this car are all have Audi and VW logos on them. Skoda is VW's "value" brand - you generally pay less for a Skoda and get more features than the equivalent VW. Build quality is superb - owner satisfaction ratings generally have Skoda owners happier with their "VW" than owners of actual VWs. Skoda have their own styling and features but are always based on a VW floorpan and mechanicals. Our Skoda Fabia is a VW Polo under the skin; the next model up, the Skoda Octavia, is based on a VW Golf.
VW in Australia are rather opaque about this "locked feature" situation. They don't acknowledge it upfront - they offer to sell you a "Voice Activation Module" that can be "installed" to your car by the service department. I was offered this at the time of sale but declined to pay the extra. Later I asked the service department what exactly was in the "voice activation module" and where would it be installed in the car, he said that the feature is already in the car's software, but locked out, and the "Voice Activation Module" is just a PIN, unique to each car, that is entered into the car's computer by their technician after the owner has paid the "unlock fee." (I called it the "ransom fee.") The service department can't access that number from VW until the fee is paid. (Though no doubt some of that fee is a commission to the dealer.)
I think this is outrageous, and I wonder if it is legal? I would quite like the feature but won't be paying $400 for it.
What happened to
People plugging in their phones and using that for voice activated stuff? Because paying for $400 for a dam access code it really makes me wonder would people be better off going to the cheap phone just for the car to do that sort of stuff?
People plugging in their phones and using that for voice activated stuff? Because paying for $400 for a dam access code it really makes me wonder would people be better off going to the cheap phone just for the car to do that sort of stuff?
Sears already beat them
You had to pay $50, $100, $150 or even $200 for an extra jumper in the timer block to unlock permanent press, delicate, soak and extra rinse cycles.
You had to pay $50, $100, $150 or even $200 for an extra jumper in the timer block to unlock permanent press, delicate, soak and extra rinse cycles.
Why?
Why are they doing this? Do they think we're stupid?
Why are they doing this? Do they think we're stupid?
re: #9, CHETLATHAM
Isn't there a way to unblock stuff in the timer yourself?!
Surely that's what I would resort to do if I had paid for those features and they're there then that's what I want to use...
-- Dave
Isn't there a way to unblock stuff in the timer yourself?!
Surely that's what I would resort to do if I had paid for those features and they're there then that's what I want to use...
-- Dave
Hack
A one time fee for a feature is one thing. A monthly subscription is another. I would try to hack it. Also I hope that someone will sue and hopefully this will be found to be against some code or law.
A one time fee for a feature is one thing. A monthly subscription is another. I would try to hack it. Also I hope that someone will sue and hopefully this will be found to be against some code or law.
firedome
Well-known member
who cares...
don't need those BS features nor a new car., the five 1969 - 2011 cars we have now can last us the rest of our lives if necessary, so screw those greedy bastards. We've done just fine in almost 60 years of driving without it, it's those who just have to have all the latest tech that will suffer... oh well! The first principle of good engineering: keep it simple, stupid!
don't need those BS features nor a new car., the five 1969 - 2011 cars we have now can last us the rest of our lives if necessary, so screw those greedy bastards. We've done just fine in almost 60 years of driving without it, it's those who just have to have all the latest tech that will suffer... oh well! The first principle of good engineering: keep it simple, stupid!
Amen to this!
The first principle of good engineering: keep it simple, stupid!
Most of the electronic crap on cars today is unnecessary and a lot of it is making drivers dependent upon technology and they are losing the skills needed to drive a car without a lot of this nonsense. For instance, I wonder if the owners of cars with the automatic parking feature can still park a car without this assistance?
Just a lot of crap to break down and drive up the price of a new car. My 16 year old Honda Civic has all the technology and more than I need.
Eddie
The first principle of good engineering: keep it simple, stupid!
Most of the electronic crap on cars today is unnecessary and a lot of it is making drivers dependent upon technology and they are losing the skills needed to drive a car without a lot of this nonsense. For instance, I wonder if the owners of cars with the automatic parking feature can still park a car without this assistance?
Just a lot of crap to break down and drive up the price of a new car. My 16 year old Honda Civic has all the technology and more than I need.
Eddie
bradfordwhite
Well-known member
In the 80s/90s cars were sold with built-in garage door/gate openers also built in phones.
There was no guarantee the signal sender would be compatible or that one would necessarily need it.
The phones you had to pay for, much like now, and much like satellite radio. So this isn't a new concept.
They are just trying to apply it to other features.
I'm sure it's just them trying things out to see what will fly.
There was no guarantee the signal sender would be compatible or that one would necessarily need it.
The phones you had to pay for, much like now, and much like satellite radio. So this isn't a new concept.
They are just trying to apply it to other features.
I'm sure it's just them trying things out to see what will fly.
I hate this so much
Somebody took somezhing completely out of context there.
I have yet to see a hardware subscription model on cars where a plain buy option did not exist.
Software/entertainment solutions are something else, but hardware like heated seats ALWAYS had a buy option.
It does sound INCREDIBLY distopian - but working in retail product production, a lot of things do.
Making just one kind of seat base, wiring harness and production line REGARDLESS of if you buy the heated seats or not is MOST DEFINETLY a lot cheaper to produce.
If you only lock it down in software anyway, giving more options is just plainly obvious.
And since these cars are 90% leased anyway, those people usually don't really care.
It is pretty distopian, and certainly tries to extract value from unknowing customers.
For anybody with a bit knowledge - you just still buy the feature at the time of purchase.
Somebody took somezhing completely out of context there.
I have yet to see a hardware subscription model on cars where a plain buy option did not exist.
Software/entertainment solutions are something else, but hardware like heated seats ALWAYS had a buy option.
It does sound INCREDIBLY distopian - but working in retail product production, a lot of things do.
Making just one kind of seat base, wiring harness and production line REGARDLESS of if you buy the heated seats or not is MOST DEFINETLY a lot cheaper to produce.
If you only lock it down in software anyway, giving more options is just plainly obvious.
And since these cars are 90% leased anyway, those people usually don't really care.
It is pretty distopian, and certainly tries to extract value from unknowing customers.
For anybody with a bit knowledge - you just still buy the feature at the time of purchase.
Reply 11
There is! All you need is some wire, a crimper and some molex connectors.
Here is an example:
In BOL Galaxy models there is no wire jumper from contact 10A to 10 (GY2-GY) and 2A and 2 (V2-V). As a result the permanent press feature is disabled leaving a blank on half the control.
Further, contacts 11 and 15 close at different periods in the wash cycle- however despite this in Galaxy models 11 and 15 are shorted together to produce warm wash cold rinse only decal. But in the next four models up (notice the 5 different pressure switch options for each successive model, when such an option is present on the control panel) contacts 11 and 15 are taken to their respective water valves allowing for hot a wash at 14 minutes, warm wash at 12 minutes and cold wash at 10 minutes into the normal cycle- as displayed on the dial for Normal and PP. Still in the next few models up 11 and 15 are again shorted, but taken to a separate user controlled temperature selector as seen in the wiring diagram.
Like this one timer can cover a dozen models and even price matching schemes.
For the next timer in line you might see the high/low/S.I.S contacts all shorted together and taken to a single high speed winding in the one speed models, two speed models the high taken to the high and the low/interim taken to a low winding, next model up into a speed selector switch, ect.
Same goes for soak/prewash/extra rinse/auto advance. Jumpers left out on the basic models, each successive model up gets a jumper enabling each progressive feature, next models up runs the rinse auto advance contact via an extra rinse switch, still next model up runs all 3 auto advance contacts into a user selector switch ie pre wash only, prewash and wash only, soak, wash, extra rinse, ect.
A half dozen timers can cover nearly 100 models this way. I've always found the practice unethical and cheating consumers. It goes to show you how dangerous an educated public can be.
Of course I've tried to explain this to Sears sales people buying a BOL with them looking at me like I'm mentally impaired or that I genuinely believe they're going to sell me a TOL Kenmore for the price of a Galaxy. As technical minded friends have said in amused agreement "they've NOOOOOO clue what you're talking about. Zero"
There is! All you need is some wire, a crimper and some molex connectors.
Here is an example:
In BOL Galaxy models there is no wire jumper from contact 10A to 10 (GY2-GY) and 2A and 2 (V2-V). As a result the permanent press feature is disabled leaving a blank on half the control.
Further, contacts 11 and 15 close at different periods in the wash cycle- however despite this in Galaxy models 11 and 15 are shorted together to produce warm wash cold rinse only decal. But in the next four models up (notice the 5 different pressure switch options for each successive model, when such an option is present on the control panel) contacts 11 and 15 are taken to their respective water valves allowing for hot a wash at 14 minutes, warm wash at 12 minutes and cold wash at 10 minutes into the normal cycle- as displayed on the dial for Normal and PP. Still in the next few models up 11 and 15 are again shorted, but taken to a separate user controlled temperature selector as seen in the wiring diagram.
Like this one timer can cover a dozen models and even price matching schemes.
For the next timer in line you might see the high/low/S.I.S contacts all shorted together and taken to a single high speed winding in the one speed models, two speed models the high taken to the high and the low/interim taken to a low winding, next model up into a speed selector switch, ect.
Same goes for soak/prewash/extra rinse/auto advance. Jumpers left out on the basic models, each successive model up gets a jumper enabling each progressive feature, next models up runs the rinse auto advance contact via an extra rinse switch, still next model up runs all 3 auto advance contacts into a user selector switch ie pre wash only, prewash and wash only, soak, wash, extra rinse, ect.
A half dozen timers can cover nearly 100 models this way. I've always found the practice unethical and cheating consumers. It goes to show you how dangerous an educated public can be.
Of course I've tried to explain this to Sears sales people buying a BOL with them looking at me like I'm mentally impaired or that I genuinely believe they're going to sell me a TOL Kenmore for the price of a Galaxy. As technical minded friends have said in amused agreement "they've NOOOOOO clue what you're talking about. Zero"
Wiring Diagram for BOL Models
