Liquid Soap Does It Again!

[whirlcool]

Over the past month or so we have been using Purex Baby detergent for our laundry. It's cheap and has a very pleasant smell to it, plus it's hypoallergenic. My skin doesn't complain about it.

This morning we were washing the first load of our laundry cycle. It happened to be towels. We couldn't get a clean rinse even after three deep water rinses. So just by chance I decided to run a cycle with no clothing in the machine from scratch.
Sure enough, even though we added NO detergent we got a generous suds cake on the water, even after three hot water rinses there were still a lot of suds in the water. It was like we OD'ed the machine on liquid Tide or something.

The cause? Liquid detergent residue in the outer tub. I'll tell you, it didn't take long for this build up to occur.

Back to powder for us again!

And yes, everything in this house is washed with either warm or very hot water.
No cold water only here.

 

[launderess]

It's Not So Much The Soap

But the heavy dosages of surfactants most liquid detergents contain which seem to cause all the problems. In many formulas the stuff is very difficult to rinse away and leaves a residue not only on laundry but one assumes in the machine as well.

Have had better luck using Tide HE Free/Clear liquid and soap jelly (shaved leaves of laundry bar soaps from my stash) when one wishes to go "nature boy" on things.

 

[roscoe62]

I can't figure it out either I have had the same issue, a suds lock on towels using minimal amounts of liquid HE detergent, and is difficult to clear the machine, and after some time has passed using the HE liquid on all loads there is the same problem, too many suds, and rinsing difficulty.Two people I work with have experienced the same thing.When I used the liquid I wouldn't even go to line one on the cap as recommended and the issue remains the same.
Recently I did have a sample of the Purex Triple Action arrive in the mail and did three loads with it and results were good, but I remain reluctant to continue with a full bottle knowing I could have the same problem again.
Sorry to hear your day of laundry became a dogs breakfast,I've been there, and now even the Powdered Tide HE detergent, since it has been concentrated, does the same thing to me. I contacted P&G about this they are sending me a refund.
So since the only luck I have had is with Persil Universal Powder and Megaperl Color,I have bitten the bullet and invested in one of each again.
When I can use such small dosages and get great results and no rinsing issues taking up time, the Persils from my experience speaks for itself.
I hope you have better luck with the powdered He detergent.

 

[roscoe62]

@launderess

That explains why the clothes feel different when using a liquid.When I use a powder I have noticed towels are more absorbent and I do not use any softner on towels.

Tks Launderess

 

[launderess]

If Possible Check The Final Spin's Extracted Water

Since our washers drain into a sink can see what is going on, and usually use the final rinse water to determine if laundry has been rinsed "clean". If one sees froth coming out of the wash as it's spun will stop the machine and reset to another rinse.

You can also set the washer to rinse after removing the finished laundry and after it fills set it to drain. If one sees lots of froth/soap coming out of the hose that is the soap/detergent residue "pulled" from the wash as it was extracted but was not pumped out. This residue is what sits sitting and rots inside the pump and hose as it's a buffet for mould and germs.

 

[liberatordeluxe]

Liquids

I have the same problem with liquids in the UK. They never rinse away properly even after 5 deep rinses so they must leave residue on the outer tub of the washing machine. Why none of the detergent manufacturers have sorted this problem out is beyond me. Powder or tablets don't seem to be a problem though for some reason and you would think that liquids would be easier to rinse but that isn't the case.

 

[launderess]

It Comes Down To Chemistry My Lad

Liquid laundry detergents use blends of non and anionic surfactants along with various amounts of soap to make up for the detergency power missing by not using alkaline substances such as washing soda. Some laundry liquids such as Tide do contain borax but nothing in the amounts used in a powdered detergents.

Also by nature liquid detergents do not contain oxygen bleaches which can lead to poor cleaning results. To work around this detergent makers have increased the surfactant chemistry to compensate. New "Pod" type detergents are finding ways around mixing oxygen bleach with liquid detergents by keeping the two separate within the pouch until they are mixed in the wash.

That being said have some vintage Wisk in my stash and am here to tell you regardless of top or front loading machine one has to be very careful of dosage. Too much and the stuff will take ages to rinse away (if ever), too little and cleaning results will be poor.

Recently have been playing around with some of the Saint Croix laundry detergent one had sent from France. They come as little pre-measured packets of liquid and am here to tell you one is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to much for even the largest load in the Miele. Froth to die for in the wash and tons still left after the five normal rinses. One now has to slip the packet and measure out about half per wash load. Oddly when one used an entire pack for a wash load at the laundromat (50lb SQ front loader) results were perfect. Excellent cleaning and rinsing. That goes to show how much cleaning power is in those little packets of detergent.

 

[launderess]

Fabric Softener & Fabric Absorbency

All but the most BOL fabric softeners have moved on from being mainly heavy fat/oil/tallow based products, thus do not nearly interfere with absorbency of things such as towels as in the past. Even Consumer Reports has given up that ghost admitting pretty much all modern fabric softeners do not bother terry cloth items.

However if one is using soap as the main product for laundry day, and or products heavy with the stuff that is a different story. Pure soaps are always based upon some type of fats or oils, there is no getting around it. The devil is in the percentage of soap vs man made surfactants, and of course how well laundry is rinsed afterwards.

Personally am glad to have such a wide variety in my laundry stash. It's rather like washingo one's hair; never use the same product for long so there is less chance of build-up.

 

[stan]

Washing Soda

Had a similar situation with my washer... mine is a top loader.

I needed to do a small repair that involved having to remove the cabinet.

Said to my self "self" this will be a good time time to inspect for residue!

Well I found some, not a whole lot. Lint and ect stuck to the sides of the outer tub, that I was able to get loose with a rag and long stick LOL.

But while the cabinet was off (so I could really see) decided to fill with HOT water. when full I held the reset over to force the water level to come up higher than normal, and began a fast agitation, dumped in a cup and a half of washing soda, after 5 min, it began to produce foam, and I could see more lint and detergent debris breaking loose! Allowed to agitate for 20 min. Dumped and rinsed with spotless results.

Most U.S powdered laundry "detergents" now contain a fair amount of sodium carbonate (washing soda) some as much as 40%.
While most here are not fond of washing soda for many reasons... it can come in handy for several purposes! This is one!

You may want to try this (without removing the cabinet of course)

This also bring up the "washing machine cleaners' being sold in the laundry section? Have we had a discussion about this?? Are they just high priced "washing soda" ??

 

[launderess]

@stan

Was wondering when you were going to stop playing around with the "goodie box" and come back to join the living! *LOL*

 

[stan]

*LOL*

Well I thought i'd take a break from "the goody box"

(very interesting compounds found though)

 

[launderess]

Oh Lord, What Have I Done?

If it's something that will kill me or otherwise hasten my departure from this world I don't want to know! Ignorace is bliss. *LOL*

 

[stan]

Not to Worry

without going into a lot of detail (but will if you want *LOL*) they are, at this age, as harmless a table salt!

When you use them, you can defiantly say, you've gone "green" * (knew you were a nature girl) *LOL*

 

[jmurray01]

I bought a bottle of Formil liquid detergent from Lidl recently for about £2.50 and I've got no complaints.

It has currently lasted for a fortnight and still has enough liquid left for 3-4 washes.

It says to use one cap per wash, but I just use half a cap and it works great!

I think with liquid detergent the cardinal sin is using too much.

In this case parsimony prevails!

 

[mrb627]

Dispenser

Depending on the make and model of your washing machine, detergent buildup can occur in the delivery system in the machine. Some machines are better about cleaning the hose from the dispenser drawer to the tub than others. Often times it is not enough to clean out the detergent residue in the wash tub alone.

I also read somewhere years ago that different detergents can react with one another and produce some nasty results. With a recommendation for finding a particular detergent and sticking with it. Always wondered how that rated on the truth-o-meter.

Malcolm

 

[gansky1]

Is this in your electronic-control Whirlpool? Although tempted, I try to resist the temptation of Purex and some of the other "down-shelf" brands as I've had rinsing troubles too. I have switched to using mostly powders again as well, only using the liquid HE Tide for pre-treating. It does seem to rinse better but with softened water, I have to be careful with dosing the Tide.

 

[liberatordeluxe]

Liquids

Regarding liquids do you think the problem with them is that they are now too concentrated? I have tried all makes and all leave residue even as little as 10ml. I do have an artificial water softner and never put in more than 20 ml of Amway SA8 liquid even for very dirt items but after 5 deep rinses clothes are still full of residue so it must definetley be a fault with liquids! I always thought SA8 was supposed to rinse out clean but its no better than Ariel Liquid to be honest. The powders rinse fine though. @ Launderess do you have a water softner as i wonder if that is why you have problems using liquids?

 

[whirlcool]

Yes, this is in the Whirlpool LA9800TN electronic control machine.

We had this problem a few years ago and finally got the machine cleaned out and used only powdered detergents since then. But we did like the cleaning performance of the Purex Baby detergent. It cleans really good. But it has only been a month or so and mabe 15 loads and we already are having this problem. And we are using about 1/2 of the recommended amount.

So it's back to the Tide compact and FOCA powders for now. We'll be ordering more Persil soon.

Why can't American detergent manufacturers make a Persil like detergent?

 

[miele_ge]

is it true that powder detergents can turn back to solids in

Have a dear friend who will not use powder detergent at all since her septic man said the stuff actually re solidifies in the tank.  Is this even possible??

 

 

 

[launderess]

Soft Water

No, we don't have a water softening system installed. However our area does have soft water right from the tap.

My problems with liquid detergents tend to come from two sources. One using them where they shouldn't (vintage Wisk in my stash is made for top loaders, but according to older packages could be used in front), and the fact that European detergents such as the French La Croix are designed for hard water.

Most of Europe indeed does have water much harder than what is found even in the worst areas of the United States, certainly more so than our local water. This means dosages have often to be reduced.

 

[liberatordeluxe]

Liquids

Perhaps thats the problem then liquids are designed for hard water however i can state that a friend of mine has very very hard water in Essex and Daz compact liquid never rinsed out of the clothing even after 10 rinses!!!!!! I had to throw my t shirts away becuase i couldn't get rid of the residue. Daz smells very similar to Tide so am led to believe. Daz powder and tablets rinse fine though in soft water as well.

 

[launderess]

Hard Water, Powdered Detergents and Septic Tanks

Would be willing to bet it's not so much the insoluble remains of powdered laundry detergents (Zeolites, undissloved washing soda), but the hard water minerals bound to precipitating water softeners (washing soda, borax, TSP etc) that settle out which are gunking up septic systems.

You'll often find such "gunk" coating and or at the bottom of washing machine tubs, as well as inside pumps.

 

[alr2903]

Our Webmaster Says," Solid tub machines are much cleaner machines and they rinse better".   Now if i could only find one. alr

 

[stan]

Me

too!

 

[whirlcool]

Would one of those washing machine cleaning products clear all this liquid soap gunk out of our washer?

 

[launderess]

Depends Upon What The "Gunk" Is Made From

Washing soda and surfactants along with very hot water will go along way in cleaning areas where the water can reach. Weak to mild acids will remove scale, iron rust and or mineral deposits. Products that are a blend of several types of chemicals will have a broad based action.

 

[liberatordeluxe]

Powders

The main reason i moved from powder to liquid was the fillers in powders i.e. sodium sulfate. Did or does any find that the fillers in powders or tablets are problematic for rinsing? And why do we even need fillers?

I bought a small box of Ariel colour and dissolved it in warm water but even after 15 minutes all the fillers and insolubles were there!

 

[launderess]

Insoluble Componet Of Powder Detergents

Zeolites (aluminosilicate) common to many powdered detergents does not disslove, thus that could be what you are seeing.

Used for their water softening properties, Zeolites can also leave a residue that shows up as dust or lint on laundry especially darker coloured textiles. The mineral began widespread use in laundry and dishwashing powdered detergents as a replacement in whole or part for phosphates.

 

[liberatordeluxe]

Liquids

@ Launderess have you ever tried Amway SA8 or anyone else for that matter? How do you rate its cleaning performance and rinsing ability both powder and liquid.

Currently trying Miele detergent and have has it does wash and rinse well!