Minivan opinions and going to be applying for my first car loan!

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My Mazda 626 WAS at least, in part, made or built by Ford. I lost count of the pieces and parts that had the Ford logo stamped into them, one for sure being the oil filler cap, and I once had to have a replacement key made, it too was Ford- the only one that would fit, and had Ford stamped into it. The engine was definitely Ford, I had to have the timing belt changed at 105,000 miles, as required, and the mechanic said he couldn't find the part for a mazda, but found the same part number under (I believe) a Ford Focus. 2.0 4 cylinder engine. The car gave me nothing but trouble from the day I bought it, and the dealer wouldn't stand behind the warranty I was given. It had barely 100,000 miles on it, all one owner, when I bought it, and by 120,000 it needed either the engine rebuilt or replaced. Burned more oil than gas, lost compression on one cylinder, and ran terrible. Was stalling constantly and smoking like a freight train when I sold it. Apparently the new owners replaced the engine, because I've seen it several times since. The transmission was terrible and jerky, the only things that ever worked properly were the windows and air conditioner.
 
That's a new one on me.

 

I worked around the motor industry until 2000 and am a keen motorist with more than a passing interest in the geekier, statistical side of cars more than the performance.

 

Only the first Odyssey was sold in this country with a V6 and then only the top model. All the rest have been 4cyl. We get both the Accord Euro and the American Accord, both badged as Honda Accord. I've not heard of any issues with the V6 or gearboxes, but then Honda Australia are pretty snappy to fix these things given the Marques reputation.

 

Mazdas in Oz have never suffered in that way. No doubt because they were Mazda manufactured in Japan using only Mazda parts. That the gearboxes (and other parts) in certain 626 models in the US have a Ford product that became known for high fail rates is simply appalling. 

 

When Ford was assembling the 626 here and selling it as the Ford Telstar, we had some minor issues....mostly quality control related rather than engineering related. Certainly nothing that would cause component failure. But then, Ford were assembling a Japanese designed car in its entirety, not splicing major, locally sourced parts into it which was simply asking for trouble.

 

Auto Alliance International have a LOT to answer for.

 

 
 
I think I've narrowed it to a short list, based on reviews and my preferences- Time will tell once I've actually applied for the loan and actually do some shopping, but here goes- 1. Mazda MPV-2004/2005, 2. Chrysler/Dodge 2004+, 3. Toyota Sienna 2003+
I found mostly glowing reviews on the MPV, and like the looks more than the other two, not so "soccer mom's carpool" if that makes sense. I have mixed thoughts about giving Mazda a second chance. The Dodge/Chrysler vans seem to have mixed reviews, but there are a lot of them out there- they do have the lowest resale values of the bunch, which can be a good and bad thing. I don't necessarily hate the looks, but not my absolute favorite either. The interiors of the MPV and Chrysler vans are nicely laid out and comfortable. I have found fairly good reviews on the Toyota Sienna, it seems when they are good, they are really good, but when they are bad it can be a nightmare. Not particularly fond of the exterior looks on the 2003 or 2004+ Siennas, and have not seen the interior yet. The Toyotas have the highest used resale value, which again could be a good thing or a bad thing. I'm thinking on going to apply for the loan this week, just to see where I get. I will need a bit of time to put together the $ for a down payment, so likely won't make a purchase for at least a few weeks. At least this time I have a vehicle to drive in the meantime, I didn't have that luxury the last time around- I needed a car and I needed one NOW and cheap. Found the Impala within a week.
 
Well from what I can gather, the Mazda MPV from 2002 came with a 3.0 V6 and 5spd automatic.

This is a Mazda AJ series motor.

The previous, smaller V6 was a Ford motor.
 
Mini-Van Choices

Hi Dustin, One thing I forgot to mention that you may want to consider is a NEW Dodge Caravan, Chrysler just stopped building the current DCs [ they are still building the Chrysler T&Cs ] but there are still some on dealer lots at great prices. My brother picked up one at the end of last year for UNDER 18,000.00 out the door and another friend here on AW just bought a loaded one for around 23,000.00. All the current vans have the same great engine and transmission, and Jeff has been getting over 30 MPG on his appliance acquisition trips.

 

If you let the dealer do the financing you may be surprised how affordable a NEW van might be. Just go in and take a test drive and look you might be surprised, you are young it not like you will not need this van in a few years, LOL.

 

Another great thing about a Dodge Caravan is DC has the highest percentage of US parts and build content of ANY car-truck sold in America @ 74%and it is union built. I have never been able to understand why any American would want to drive around in a Japanese car, especially when living in Michigan.

 

Cars in the Midwest get pretty rusty, if I was looking for a used car I would go farther south to find one. Also it is not a good thing that a car brand holds its value well when buying a 10 year old car. You are paying too much for it, its not like you are going to sell it in five years for a profit.

 

Toyota's are very good cars for folks that can afford NEW ones, but they are expensive to repair and maintain, reliability data really only goes back about 6 years in sources like CRs, so there is no real proof that a 10 YO Toyota is any better than a 10YO Chrysler van.
 
Toyota's Are Expensive?

I don't know where this comes from, in all honesty. 

 

Sure, if you service them at a $tealer (or an Indy that prey upon people's stupidity), like any car, that gets expensive. Especially when they con owner's into needing "Power Steering Flushes" every service, and other ludicrous things that are something you do every 50K miles or something. 

 

Basically, what got our LandCruiser to where it is now until the Engine rebuild (and of course, some work on the transmission, and ORIGINAL clutch not long before) - Frequent servicing. It basically only ever needed tires, fuel and some basic servicing. A local, trustworthy independent took care of all this for many, many years, for a good price by Australian standards. 

 

On the other hand, for several of those years, we owned a domestic EB Ford Falcon from the same year (1993). Same mechanic. 

Head-Gasket was done at least 3 times (common problem on these vehicles)

Warped brake rotors (Another common issue)

Plus other silly stuff that kept breaking when it shouldn't had (there was also plenty of major work coming up too). The car only had half the mileage; at about 150K, and was a highway car for all its life till we had it. The LandCruiser was always a highway car, from the time it was bought (about 1995), and never needed anywhere near this much work.

We spent about 3x what the Falcon was worth in the 4 years before we got the Corolla. And that was a car manufactured domestically. Ford and Holden wonder why people don't want their cars, and why the Government won't subsidise them anymore - They can't build a competitive product. Their cars are oversized, unreliable (in comparison with the imports) and people don't want them. Let them crash. Serves them right for holding out their hand, promising the world and delivering NOTHING to the taxpayers. 

THAT is why people don't want domestics, even in the heart of Michigan. If they're not as good as the competition, why bother?

 

OTOH, the Corolla has been the same as the LC - Cheap to service and run since we got it in 2009. Doing the same duty as the Falcon. 

(Heck, even my '93 Bimmer has gone better than the Falcon. Longer service intervals, 30mpg on the highway, and 25 in the city. Who could ask for more?)

 

Why do people drive Japanese cars? Because Toyota built their reputation they have on very reliable, economical cars. This is reflected in the purchase price. They are hard to break! 

Toyota made sure their cars coming from the factories were built to very exact tolerances. They had very high quality-control standards, whereas domestics didn't. The Camry is the best-selling Mid-size car (sedan) in Australia for 20 years now - and there is a very good reason for this. 

Even our taxi fleets are progressing onto the much-maligned Camry's, Avalon's and Pri-i - and cannot get enough of them. The economy and low cost of maintenance is what wins them over. 
 
I found the interior in my friend's 2005 Sienna to be very nice, although it was an XLE model. The only issue was the seats were a bit uncomfortable, but they were leather and you mention you wanted cloth.

I looked on cars.com to get an idea of prices, and most in the 2004-05 range shown seem to have over 130k miles on them and are listed at $7500.

I'm seeing around the same prices on Dodges from that area with a little less miles.

The idea about getting a new Dodge is a good one, if you were comfotable spending that much money. Personally, I don't think I'll ever buy a brand new car, but the prices noted seem to be pretty good for what you would be getting, and can only get better since it is a discontinued model.
 
Picked up a Chrysler Town and Country van yesterday at the dealership, when I dropped my Jeep off for servicing. It is a 2015. 3 rows of leather reclining seats. Top of the line with all options I think. 1st time driving one of these, its like driving a living room. I don't for one care for this at all. Not that I haven't had or driving large vehicles before, but this just seems large and unresponsive in handling. I hope you test drive all these vehicles to see what you are most comfortable in and driving comfort. I don't understand how all these soccer moms drive these.

Jon
 
Update! Did some car shopping today with my Dad, who worked for Chrysler for years, and does 99% of the repairs on our vehicles- so he knows his stuff. I looked at several, but narrowed down to a couple that just stood out. The first was a 2002 Chevy Venture- this one was marked $3995 but we had a talk with the salesman and I can get it for $3500 with no trade, or $2500 with my car, so a trade of $1000, which I feel is fair. It has 129,000 miles and was a southern car so not a speck of rust, although there is a spot on both bumpers where the paint is beginning to peel. No real dents though, and it still looks nice. However, the interior is a bit rough. The drivers seat has some wear and a small rip, and the other seats are dirty so will need to be shampooed. We found a couple issues that the dealer agreed to fix if we decided to buy it, but nothing horrible. Has everything I wanted except a CD player. Not a deal breaker. My Dad is concerned about the engine's reputation for leaking intake gaskets and head gaskets- which don't seem to be leaking yet, but it does have the same engine as my Impala, which has had the intake gaskets done twice and the head gaskets once since I've owned it. The second vehicle, which I actually perferred, was a 2009 Dodge Grand Caravan. It was in overall excellent condition inside and out, and we didn't find any issues, but it was owned by a delivery service for the first 3 years of it's life, so it has high miles, 250,000. The first 200,000 were put on by the delivery service, then it was bought by the dealer for his family. They no longer need the extra seating, so it is for sale. My Dad said it has an excellent engine so should run for many more miles if I maintain it- which I have done religiously with every vehicle I've owned. He figured it could go 400-500,000. The mileage is my only concern, but what eases that somewhat is that it is still new enough to put a new engine or transmission in if it fails. The asking price on that one is $4995, but my Dad figures we could get it for $4000-4500, because it's been there for a while. I didn't ask at that dealer about a trade in, but I don't have a problem selling mine privately for around $1500. We didn't drive either of them, but started the engines and both sounded really smooth, no ticks or rattles, the Dodge actually sounded a bit better than the Chevy, which sounded as if there could be a minor exhaust leak somewhere. I think I'd be happy with either of them, but if I had to make a decision not based on price, I'd go for the Dodge, even with it's quarter of a million miles. I'm going to sleep on it tonight, then I think go apply for a loan tomorrow. We will see what the outcome is.
 
Good Progress On Van Shopping

Hi Dustin, I would skip the Chevy, Chevy Ventures were never really good Mini-vans, when buying a used car that you intend to keep a long time you want to avoid cars that were poor sellers in the first place, for the same reason I would not even consider the Mazda Vans. My partner owns a auto dealer-repair company and he said that parts for the Mazda s cost a fortune.

 

I would probably skip the 2009 Dodge as well, 250,000 miles is just too many to be buying it now and making payments on it, that van is going to sit on the lot a long time, around here you couldn't get $2500 for a van with that many miles on it that is 6 years old and no bank would finance a car with that many miles on it.

 

Around the DC area you could get a 8-12 yo van for $4000-6000 that is in excellent condition with no rust issues. I would also try to keep total mileage around a 100,000, but sometimes more is not a deal breaker if the van is fairly new.

 

And don't rule out buying a new Dodge Van, Just don't buy any of the extras that the dealers will try to sell, NEVER get undercoating, fabric protectors, extended warranties of any kind, and sell your old car yourself and you might be surprised how easy it is to get into a great Van that will last you more than ten years with very few problems.
 
I doubt I will be buying new, I just don't want to get stuck paying for something that I can't afford. I really only have steady work May through late September, and I feel I can pay off a $3000-4000 loan (with the appox. $1500 from my car) in that time. I was looking for a lower mileage vehicle, but I'm finding nothing in my price range with less than about 130,000. The majority I've looked at have around 180,000. I was leaning toward the Chevy, but I'm feeling that it was pretty beat up for the mileage that was on it- It seems to be in about the condition cosmetically as my Impala, which has a lot more miles. The main reason I didn't write the Dodge off is because it is in really excellent condition for the mileage, the exterior looks new except for a couple of shopping cart dings, no peeling paint, no rust. The interior is equally nice- a small worn spot on the driver's seat, and the front seats are a little dirty, but no stains or anything. The rear seats and carpet are like new as if they've never been sat in. The engine compartment of the chevy is clean, like it's just been washed down (maybe to hide a leak?) While the engine compartment of the dodge is a bit dirty, but no leaks at all.
 
Disclaimer: I am not a car expert.

That said...

I have to admit I have reservations about that Dodge van. The number of miles is a real concern. Keep in mind that even if the major engine parts can go 400,000 miles, there are small things that can go wrong at this mileage, which will cost $ and irritation to deal with. Also keep in mind that as delivery vehicle, it might have seen tough service life (lots of stop and go driving). And who knows how the drivers treated it--since presumably they were employees, they probably didn't care as long as nothing happened that would make the boss mad. At least, as a business vehicle, it hopefully had good maintenance history.

One issue is the price, which is more than I'd be comfortable spending given the miles. But that is just me. And, of course, the car market is different in different parts of the US.
 
Dustin - I'm sort of late to this conversation, but I will share my positive experience with the Chrysler mini-vans. I will say upfront that I lease my "daily driver" cars, and have leased for about 20 years. Generally, I have 24 month leases, although I think I had a couple of 36 month leases. But this means that the vehicles are always new, and under full warranty for the period in which I have them. In two years, I generally don't put more than about 32K miles on the vehicle, so you wouldn't expect that I would have many maintenance issues, and I haven't with the 2007, 2009, 2011 and 2014 Chrysler Town & Country vans that I leased.

I had to really debate with myself about getting that first mini van. I always thought those were for soccer moms, not a cool guy like me ;-) But with my tendencies to want to "rescue" large, heavy things (like vintage electric stoves) I saw the value that a mini van could bring to my life. And since I was only leasing for two years, if I didn't like it I could go back to a sedan or wagon.

Within my first week of having it, I knew I made the right decision for myself. All that room - all that comfort - the smooth ride - whether hauling stoves or people, going on road trips, the van turned out to be a practical luxury! Now when I get into someone's car I think about how cramped and small it is! And the "Stow & Go" seats really are a great feature.

If I was to buy a used vehicle, it would likely be a Town & Country/Caravan. The big job is finding one that has been well cared for. That's my two-cents. Hope you find a vehicle that is right for and provides many years of good driving!
 
Brake lines

Our 2000 Chrysler Town & Country, bought new, ruptured a brake line in 2009. Stopping power was drastically reduced. Fortunately we were in slow traffic, so the ensuing collision wasn't too bad.
 
Well, now we wait. I filled out a loan application today, through my credit union, and we did some more shopping- really didn't find anything better in my price range. Did get VERY ticked off at one dealer that was more interested in financing it through "their" bank and not telling me the actual price. They just kept saying "we will only let you buy what you can afford" and so on. I told them I have a budget, ($4-5000) and that I have a time planned to have it paid off etc; what is the asking price. Never got an answer. I had filled out a credit application and I was beyond ticked so I picked it up, said "this is mine, we will be leaving now" and the salesman GRABBED it from me, and said "no, it's actually mine" and started walking away. Um. No. I said "I'll watch you shred it then, we are done here" so he shredded it. That ended my car shopping for the day.
 
Have you looked online? Try looking at local dealers online and I've seen a site, Cars.com that has a lot of listings that you can search by make and model. Personally I would stay away from the two vans you mention. I think it wouldn't be long where you'd be having the same issues as you are with the Impala. Not really an advantage there.

Maybe see if any dealers have older vans with lower miles. Sometimes new car dealers will keep older used cars on the lot if they have low mileage. Such as those traded by older people that take good care of their cars and rarely trade them. You might have trouble financing them though because of the age.
 
I had an opportunity today to drive an 07 Toyota Sienna (friend's) and although it would be out of my price range, it was a very nice vehicle. Very comfortable and easy to drive, plenty of power, good handling and very easy to park. Had a fair amout of engine noise when accelerating, but once up to speed it was quiet. I can't say anything about the interior space, it is a wheelchair accessible conversion so the rear floor has been lowered about 8 inches and the rear seats moved out to the extreme left and right. It has 119,000 miles and drove like new, although it sounded like there could be a wheel bearing starting to hum. I have to say, it felt good to be driving a van again LOL. Not that I'm buying it, but it was nice.
 
Posting another update: Loan went through, I am approved for up to $5000. We went yesterday and drove the 09 Caravan, and while it ran and drove excellent, I noticed a rattle of some sort coming from the engine after we had driven it. I'm not completely crossing it off my list, but the only way I'm buying it is if I can get a 30 day guarantee on the engine. I think there are better options for the price, and the dealer was not very flexible on the price. Going to look at a few more today and see where I'm at. Hoping to have one picked out by tuesday.
 
Well, if anyone is still out there watching this thread, I have a vehicle picked out and am set to pick it up tuesday. I found a 2005 Dodge Grand Caravan SXT with 118,000 Miles for $3300. We checked it out, drove it, and everything seems to be in excellent condition. Runs and drives great, every option except leather (which is exactly what I was looking for), only issue is one of the power sliding doors doesn't work, but it opens and closes fine manually. Not an issue for me. Everything else works perfectly. It needs new tires in the near future, but with what I'm saving on purchasing it, that won't be an issue. My car is set to be sold tomorrow (could have sold it yesterday, but with the holiday, I needed a vehicle over the weekend and they couldn't license it until tuesday anyway. I think the Caravan should serve me well for many miles, and I am very comfortable driving it. Love the Stow & Go seating, that was one of my issues with my previous van (some years ago, it was my first vehicle when I turned 16, I'm 22 now) that the seats were heavy and hard to get in and out. That one was an 87 Caravan, with lots of miles and lots of issues, or I would still be driving it. Anyway, I am excited to pick up my new van tuesday, and if anyone is interested, I will post pictures after I have it.
 
Congratulations!  Sounds like things came together and you got what you wanted.

 

Post the pictures, I know I"ve been following the thread wondering how it wold turn out, and I guess it turned out fine.
 
Sounds good. Do you have the navigation feature or the curtain airbags?

I personally would fix the power sliding doors, probably an easy fix. Though I found these a bit slow on the ones I saw. I take it the power liftgate still works?
 
It does have the side curtain airbags, no navigation. The power liftgate does work fine. The doors are a litle slow, but if you use the button on the key as you are walking to the car, it is open when you get there. My Dad said the power doors on these have issues, and it will likely be a $200 or more fix. Not worth it to me, the door opens an closes fine manually, which is all the majority of the vans I looked at had. I was able to meet with the dealer today (found it on craigslist but was being sold through a dealer) and got the majority of the paperwork done, license and insurance taken care of, and a down payment made. All I have to do tomorrow is get the payment from the credit union and take it to the dealer. Was able to bring the car home today and drive it a bit, so things worked out well so far.
 
congrats

Were still driving our 2002 dodge grand caravan sport..it has over 200 thousand miles now..except for a battery and some very minor rust on lower quarter panel its been a great van for us. We need to think about retiring it but I hate the thoughts of a car payment...anyway enjoy your new ride..Cheryl
 
>We need to think about retiring it but I hate the thoughts of a car payment...

You might just keep the current van going as long as is practical. It's surprising how long vehicles can last sometimes.

My father had late 1980s Acura Integra that he planned to replace when it hit 200,000 miles. The car would be used up, he figured. When 200K hit, he decided to try and put off the replacement. It actually became a sort of game: "Can I get another 20,000 miles?" There were plenty of small repairs, but--as he commented--he liked gambling $200-$500 would put off the inevitable payments another six months. In the end, he got nearly 300,000 miles, and it was still running when he gave up interest.
 
Thing is John its really not practical to keep this van..I have a seriously ill teenaged daughter that uses a wheelchair most of the time so I'm thinking our frequent trips to children's hospital of Pittsburgh which is 45 min away is going to be the time this van dies.I think we've almost decided to start looking in a few months. My husband is a retired auto mechanic so that's probably why this vans lasted so long.but I know the days comming....lol. cheryl
 

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