modern washers and dryers rant

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Adding nothing to the discussion since you seem to have your fingers firmly in your ears but I think I'll contribute anyway. Understand that we've been seeing quality appliances with electronic controls for decades now. There's actually a Maytag electronic stack from the 80s in my post history whose design is very dear to my heart. It's pretty unproductive of you to continue spamming the same posts over and over again; it doesn't contribute anything to the community but noise. Same goes for resurrecting archived threads only to add the same aforementioned replies. Maybe you should step back and take a breather.
 
That said, I'll input on the subject what I've said before in the recent past...

I used to be against HE washers, as well as "resource-saving" dishwashers, for the longest time. I loved the machines I had grown up with, the Whirlpool PowerClean, the Maytag-Voyager I have, the KitchenAid Superba top loader from my childhood, the Lady Kenmore my grandmother had, etc. I couldn't bear the thought of those machines being altered to use less water and to work differently, because I felt there was no way they could get any better. I had an opinion against new machines and new technology because of what I had heard and what I had seen through videos, most of them being users that were unhappy with the machines. So of course, the worst was brought out. We all know that the first people to review a product are the ones unhappy with it, and we all know that the majority of our society couldn't care less about how their clothes or dishes are washed, so they're not likely to post a video of the machine properly working the way it was intended. That's why searching YouTube for videos of these machines is a bit of a chore, because you have to filter through the repair videos, and videos of the machines malfunctioning and hearing commentary from the user about what a "piece of crap" it is. It is those videos that I can no longer take seriously, because upon paying close attention you can usually deduce that it was user error or neglect in the first place, more often than an actual design flaw.

Anyway, moving on.. I had no right to have the opinion I had against newer machines because I had never taken the chance to experience them or learn about them. That changed just less than a year ago when my Maytag Bravos XL was brought into my home. Long story short, the one HE washer design that intrigued me and impressed me from what I had learned about it, through its design and engineering history, was Whirlpool's Oasis model, also known through its cousin Fisher&Paykel SmartDrive. A chance came up for me to buy a new machine, so I took the plunge. First few days was a learning curve, but almost a year later, I wouldn't go back to a normal top-loading washer for anything in the world. Despite the lower water levels this machine uses, I've had no reservations to pile clothes in to the brim of the basket, as filthy as they can be, and with no problem whatsoever (so long as the clothes are loosely piled around the basket, with just enough of a tiny "donut-hole" in the middle so that nothing will spread across the washplate during the presoaking spins) every load I've washed has been cleaner and more thoroughly rinsed than it would in my traditional Whirlpool. More so, the machine does an excellent job rolling over even the largest of loads when instructions are followed on loading, and the load is so nearly dry because of the spin speed that drying time is cut nearly in half. In all honesty, there's no more effort that has to be put into the process of doing laundry than there was with "traditional" machines, except this machine, to me, is much more fun to watch. I plan to keep this washer until it practically crumbles into the floor. Yes, there is a lot more plastic in machines these days than in decades before, and yes, I do feel there could be an improvement in the build quality of certain components, but overall I've fallen in love with the washer, and it has renewed a desire to try new technology and machines again, so much so that I actually would love to have a new Whirlpool or KitchenAid dishwasher, and even finally bought a brand new car that is designed and built better than the previous one I had that I was convinced couldn't be beat.

Yes, there are HE washing machines, dishwashers, dryers, etc., that have not done well. For example, despite their cosmetic similarities, the VMW version of the Whirlpool Cabrio and its Maytag and Kenmore clones is VASTLY different than the true Oasis design like my Maytag and @joeypete's Kenmore. The VMW's didn't fare as well, specifically from the lack of a recirculation pump and the lack of the direct drive inverter motor. TRUST ME, I'd choose the "toy" inverter motor, as you called it, over any other. I've been infinitely impressed at the sheer amount of torque and power this thing has without the need for gears or pulleys. The point is, there will always be the good and there will always be the bad. You can't round up an entire category of products into one pile and dismiss them as junk. It is perfectly fine to have passion and enthusiasm with opinions, and in my own opinion it's preferred because it makes debates here quite interesting, and I've learned so much myself in the time I've been here. But don't try to start these bashfests about things without at least trying them yourself or listening to others that have, and bring something more to the table than repeating rants that are nothing but vague insults and accusations that are not confirmed or factual.
 
To throw in my two cents, I personally prefer doing my laundry "old school". That is precisely why there is a Newton Maytag washing machine sitting in my laundry room.

With that being said, if I did not have access to that Maytag when the DD Whirlpool decided to take a dump, I would have strongly considered an LG front loader. I've had the opportunity to play with several different brands of HE washer through local friends and relatives and the LG machines, by far, are my favorite HE machines.

We are ALL entitled to our own opinion. However, we are NOT entitled to rant, rave, carry on like an infant, insult people or their preferences of laundry equipment.

I think it's high time certain people on this forum started to act their age instead of their shoe size!
 
GE's rant

Due to a remodel I replaced my Duet stacked washer and dryer with stacked LG. The old Duet pair went a good home and are happily being used after I used them for about 10 years. The new LG are great machines. While I do not typically use cold wash I did experiment with it due to the multi motion capabilities of the direct drive motor. I was rather impressed with what the cold wash managed to do. The washer has a good selection of options and I use all of them.The boost heat sanitary is great for the cat beds and towels especially beach towels. The high speed spin really reduces dryer time. The dryer is gas and is fast. I have never had a load 'over dry'. The dryer runs a check to make sure that the vent is clear before it starts. A really innovative safety feature. The washer has a magnet catch option to keep the door slightly open when not in use. Did not have any kind of mold, odors, etc. with the Duet and have not had any with the LG. All in all, the innovation from virtually all of the front load manufacturers is to be praised. I have not desire to go back to the wash the whites first in the wringer and then progressively dirtier laundry that my Grandmother did with her Thor nor to the huge water users top loaders (other than at a WashIn). I have been using front load washers for over 20+ years and have no complaints. Also, there is no way I could use a reasonably sized top load in my kitchen laundry space. I did have an apartment size Kenmore top load with its matching 120V dryer mounted on a stand over it for a period of time but in the same space I now have large extremely capable and flexible LG machines. I do not find any problems with the capabilities or engineering of my LG machines.
Harry
 
Syrius Cybernetic Cooperation...

... made the elevators that led the Great Elevator Strike, right? Just last night I read something that made me think of Milliways Restaurant:-)

I agree with JoeyPete: "They don't want to spend an hour reading the owners manual or understanding how their machine works. They just want to throw ALL their laundry in one load and have it come out sparkling clean." However, I'd add that they want that to happen regardless of cycle and water temp settings. They are too stupid and/or intellectually lazy to realize that their choices and actions affect the outcome. I'm willing to bet that these are the same people whose car windows fog up because they have the HVAC controls set wrong given the weather and number of people in the car.

That said, manufacturers are hardly innocent victims struggling to do their best.
3 examples come to mind. No worries; I'll not repeat the accompanying rants;-)

1. I have difficulty believing that GE was unaware of the fact that their TL ultra-HE machines of 2010/11 did not actually clean clothes.

2. I've noticed that some manufacturers have taken to labelling cycles with verbiage I find cryptic and uninformative such as "active", "sports", "casual", etc. What is the point of doing this?

3. Dumbing down temps. If user washes something that needs hot water, correctly selects a cycle that claims to provide hot water but actually gives warm, it is NOT user error when the item does not get clean.

As for machines not being returned when they didn't work. I can't speak to that as I didn't have that option when I was saddled with an example of #1 from above. However, I "solved" the problem by washing literally everything twice. Both times with the extra rinse. First time with detergent, second time with nothing but a splash of vinegar in the wash cycle.


Just a personal opinion for clarity: Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that at least some manufacturers are slapping the label "HE" onto practically every washer so that label has kind of stopped saying anything. It might be helpful if you said specifically what washers you're talking about when you say "HE".

Jim
 
why do my sister in law wents that kind of washer

why do my sister in law wents that particular kind of washer this i do not know they have a perfectly good direct drive 1993 kenmore washer that they could ask a tech to restore for them repaint change the agitator for an agitator with fabric sofner dispenser here is a pic of there actual washer and dryer its not the matchiong dryer to there washer but it do a better job than these cheap models that they would went to return and exchange before the first use sigh

pierreandreply4-2015102718240303012_1.jpg
 
That video, along with many of your posts, have not convinced me nor anyone here of anything, simply because there is still nothing to prove the insults and accusations you make about the broad subject of "HE" appliances. The person in that video went to an appliance store and took video of opening the lids. Okay. I can do that right now at the Lowe's five minutes away. But does that tell me how the machine will perform? Does that show me how the machine works? Can I take bags of my dirtiest laundry into Home Depot and wash it in the floor models? No, no, and no I cannot.

Again, everyone here is entitled to opinions, and what's more, we LOVE to have intelligent debates on the hows and whys of new machines vs. old machines and everything in between. What we DON'T love however, are the frequent threads being created with no intent but to slander against products without having personal experience with them and then insult anyone who has a different opinion and completely ignoring everyone else's input in the process. I, for one, am growing tired of it saturating the thread list.
 
I partly disagree with OP

I can only attest to longevity of my HE FL washer (duet) which is going on 11 yrs old, but a lot of the new HE washers do clean well. I will admit I'm not a fan of the TL HE washers, even though they do look super cool! As for the longevity I'm sure we can all agree they won't last as long as vintage washers (relatively speaking), because some of the vintage ones did have issues! Honestly, I was expecting my Duet to be dead years ago. I was VERY UPSET at first when I saw how little water it used, but as I used it and got the feel for it, I went from hating it to loving it.
 
Yeeesh

and I thought I was the resident hothead around here!

I'm probably mellowing out as I get older or perhaps it is because I went to the dark side and used PODS in my non union Frigidaire DW.

OR perhaps I have a new home and lots of exciting things to dream about. Or keep watching the union made Goodman 96% AFUE furnace run trying to understand and marvel at the same time how a simple piece of PVC exhausts what little heat is not kept in the heat exchanger.

Or I'm prowling Ebay for more Speed Queen ads.

Or I'm trolling HVAC forums learning about 35/5/370V Capacitors and how to change them. OR learning about flame sensors, rollout valves, inducer motors, silicone nitride ignitors and the like.

Or I'm fussing over my overgrown yard with too much turf type fescue and not enough bluegrass. Or I'm trying to budget for a concrete driveway/sidewalk.

Between 1-3 AM I worry about Frig now that he has eschewed PODS and come back to the land of liquids.

Or I watch social guidance films on youtube and laugh my tail off at the naivety that seems so quaint now.

Or I'm researching Murphy's oil soap and if it will work on my laminate wood floor.

Or calling dad each day hoping his back pain is not as severe as it was the day before.

Et cetera...........
 
it is what it is....call it like I see it!

your right.....he's got his finger stuck, but its not in his ears....

excuses and opinions are like assholes, every ones got one!....in any case, just blowing hot air!, out of either end!...

so guys, has any of this changed your minds?.....which do you dislike or leaving a bad taste in your mouth now, LG?, Samsung?, any HE machine?......or the OP?

don't get me wrong, we love a good debate over machines or anything laundry, look forward to reviews by a members getting a new toy, and the pros and cons they have experienced....that's the key word, experience.....about the only thing this one experienced is learning to surf YouTube...

not a village our there laying claim to this idiot....their too embarrassed!
 
I don't normally comment on these stupid threads (no insult intended toward you Jerome), but Bruce, here's the deal and you used the phrase yourself. "I did buy the service contract with them, just in case." Let's see. The phrase "buy the service contract". Let's examine this "service contract" terminology, shall we? I don't know exactly when this "service contract" phrase came into existence but I know it wasn't around 40 or 50 years ago. If I recall correctly it's only appeared in the last 15 to 20 years or so and more so in just the last ten.

The companys selling these "contracts" are doing so because they can no longer guarantee that their products will last. Products such as washers, dryers, cars, lawn mowers and so forth are considered "durable goods" or at least they are supposed to be. Several decades ago these products were durable with quality built in and came with good guarantees. There was no "service contract", there was no need for a "service contract" and no one had ever heard of a "service contract". These contracts are offered because companys know these products are of low quality, there is little or no quality control on the line, there are no unions in Korea or China or where ever the hell this shit is made so no pride is built into the product to begin with. They know the product is most likely to fail.

The first crime is selling low quality products to an unknowing public to begin with. The second crime is selling "service contracts" on durable goods that are expensive, should last and should have a strong guarantee to begin with. The third crime is producing this junk, as it depletes our natural resources and pollutes our planet. There is no energy or resource savings in durable goods that needs constant attention or replacement. Why is there such an upsurge in interest in AW if people aren't tired of the new appliances that don't last?

There is no rebuttal to this debate. You ended any logical response to this statement with your "service contract" remark. Those two words proved the point. I'm not attacking you personally, Bruce. I'm trying to impress on people in this forum that these these energy star gadgets that break down frequently, use little water or supposedly perform other little feats of magic are not going to save the planet or save anyone any money in the long run. It's just corporate chicanery that many people have fallen for.

But, on a more personal note, it doesn't seem logical or economically sound to buy a new huge capacity washer and dryer just to wash a king sized comforter. Maybe try a smaller bed or try layering with regular sized blankets or quilts that will fit into a normal sized machine? And last of all, please quit saying, "Buy a front load washer and come into the 21st century", when others mention a vintage machine. People that are mentioning vintage machines are usually in the "Imperial" section, or they should be, and aren't interested in your front load/21st century comments.
 
I don't normally comment on these stupid threads (no insult intended toward you Jerome), but Bruce, here's the deal and you used the phrase yourself. "I did buy the service contract with them, just in case." Let's see. The phrase "buy the service contract". Let's examine this "service contract" terminology, shall we? I don't know exactly when this "service contract" phrase came into existence but I know it wasn't around 40 or 50 years ago. If I recall correctly it's only appeared in the last 15 to 20 years or so and more so in just the last ten.

The companys selling these "contracts" are doing so because they can no longer guarantee that their products will last. Products such as washers, dryers, cars, lawn mowers and so forth are considered "durable goods" or at least they are supposed to be. Several decades ago these products were durable with quality built in and came with good guarantees. There was no "service contract", there was no need for a "service contract" and no one had ever heard of a "service contract". These contracts are offered because companys know these products are of low quality, there is little or no quality control on the line, there are no unions in Korea or China or where ever the hell this shit is made so no pride is built into the product to begin with. They know the product is most likely to fail.

The first crime is selling low quality products to an unknowing public to begin with. The second crime is selling "service contracts" on durable goods that are expensive, should last and should have a strong guarantee to begin with. The third crime is producing this junk, as it depletes our natural resources and pollutes our planet. There is no energy or resource savings in durable goods that needs constant attention or replacement. Why is there such an upsurge in interest in AW if people aren't tired of the new appliances that don't last?

There is no rebuttal to this debate. You ended any logical response to this statement with your "service contract" remark. Those two words proved the point. I'm not attacking you personally, Bruce. I'm trying to impress on people in this forum that these these energy star gadgets that break down frequently, use little water or supposedly perform other little feats of magic are not going to save the planet or save anyone any money in the long run. It's just corporate chicanery that many people have fallen for.

But, on a more personal note, it doesn't seem logical or economically sound to buy a new huge capacity washer and dryer just to wash a king sized comforter. Maybe try a smaller bed or try layering with regular sized blankets or quilts that will fit into a normal sized machine? And last of all, please quit saying, "Buy a front load washer and come into the 21st century", when others mention a vintage machine. People that are mentioning vintage machines are usually in the "Imperial" section, or they should be, and aren't interested in your front load/21st century comments.
 
I didn't realize there were that many people that had forgot to check their calendars for the last 15 years. Go up to Pitcher. I think there's lots of front loaders down in those sink holes for ya.
 
Well one of us is crazy and it's not you. :)

I do see Brian's point and he makes a good one.

One thing he forgot was the every shrinking warranties on appliances.

Let's see, I purchased my GE plastic fantastic in 1999. From the factory, 10 year warranty on the tranny, lifetime on inner and outer tub, and 5 year parts warranty. IIRC labor was NOT included.

Go look at GE now. Not one machine has a warranty longer than ONE paltry year.

Moved into my newly built home in April. Came with Frig icebox (ONE year warranty, period, even on the sealed system), Whirlpool smoothtop electric (ONE year warranty)and a Frig DW (ONE year warranty).

I think he's right, too many of us have been duped by corporate BS thinking that an extended "contract" means peace of mind. No what it means is you, the manufacturer, don't have the balls to stand behind the junk you make.

But we like the 45 wash cycles and the "sanitize" options now don't we? And don't forget 6 months same as cash and NO finance charges....lol lol lol lol.

Right. Time for a wee bit of a dram and off to bed I go.
 
though I disagree with some of the notions of the OP regarding HE washers,this thread did get me thinking about the advantages/disadvantages of various types of HE washers :)Now quite curious about the wash performance of the 2010 belt drive WP cabrio I bought($40)for repair-it is now on the workbench :)
GELandry4ever:time to get a washer collection started if possible -got any machines on a "get list" :)
 
Good Lord, GE!

Why pop a gut over a machine you don't own? Why do you care what machines other people buy and use?

I have an LG front load pair and they are the best machines I have ever used. I work in a gym as a trainer and am on a sports team that practices twice a week. Believe me, I throw some very dirty, sweaty clothes at my machines and they come back perfect.

They breeze through quilted king size comforters, saving me big dry cleaning bills.

On what personal experience are you basing your hissy fit?

This is America and we are all free to choose whatever type and brand of washing machine and dryer that we want.
 
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