New Speed Queen washers and dryers!
- Thread starter pulsator
- Start date
Help Support :
Random quotes from LG:
"Tilted Drum and Extra Large Door Opening: Tilted drum and extra large opening make it possible to load and unload clothing more easily."
"The ultra-large stainless steel drum offers extreme durability and is tilted to improve efficiency and allow easier access for large items. ..."
"Tilted Drum and Extra Large Door Opening: Tilted drum and extra large opening make it possible to load and unload clothing more easily."
"The ultra-large stainless steel drum offers extreme durability and is tilted to improve efficiency and allow easier access for large items. ..."
Actually
Many large commercial front loaders have tilted drums as well. Thought the incline may be slight, never the less it is still there. Rationale being a slightly tilted drum is eaiser to load and unload.
Many large commercial front loaders have tilted drums as well. Thought the incline may be slight, never the less it is still there. Rationale being a slightly tilted drum is eaiser to load and unload.
norfolksouthern
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2009
- Messages
- 544
Tilted drum or not, my concern would be how most of these manufacturers are infusing the drum bearings to a plastic outer tub, making them impossible to replace. A few weeks ago, I saw a recent model Frigidaire front loader up for sale for $20.00, and it was because of this problem exactly. What do you do with a machine that can't be fixed?
NorfolkSouthern
NorfolkSouthern
Like I Said
And have been saying,
Front loading washing machines have always been more expensive to design and produce versus top loaders. The only way a factory is going to make money is to either build them with great quality and charge accordingly, but sell few units, or make cuts and changes in design where possible to bring the price down, then sell many units to make the money.
Commercial front loaders cost several thousands of dollars, and even then BOL and MOL models don't have half the useless bell and whistles domestic as domestic units. What you are getting as a washing machine that will stand up to use, even hard use for year after year. When something goes wrong it is repaired, and the unit goes back into service. This includes but not limited to bearings, tub seals, motors and the rest.
Amercians by and large were not and are not thrilled with "HE" front loaders, but they are being forced upon the populace in he name of energy savings. Americans certianly are not in the mood by and large to pay $1500 or more for a washing machine.
The great old major appliance makers saw what was coming down the pike years ago, and got out of the business. General Motors, Rayetheon (sp?) and the lot did research and saw formerly "major" appliances were becoming consumer goods, and soon customers wouldn't pay high prices for what was considered a basic good.
Aside from key players leaving the market, innovation and design stagnated or even ceased. Why put all that R&D money into a new washing machine when Mrs. Average Housewife wasn't prepared to spend more than "X% dollars, regardless.
Another thing major applince producers learned, was that if they kept on building goods that rarely needed replacement or repair, it was killing their market. Aside from perhaps moving and or setting up house, most people do not purchase a washing machine unless the current one gives up the ghost.
And have been saying,
Front loading washing machines have always been more expensive to design and produce versus top loaders. The only way a factory is going to make money is to either build them with great quality and charge accordingly, but sell few units, or make cuts and changes in design where possible to bring the price down, then sell many units to make the money.
Commercial front loaders cost several thousands of dollars, and even then BOL and MOL models don't have half the useless bell and whistles domestic as domestic units. What you are getting as a washing machine that will stand up to use, even hard use for year after year. When something goes wrong it is repaired, and the unit goes back into service. This includes but not limited to bearings, tub seals, motors and the rest.
Amercians by and large were not and are not thrilled with "HE" front loaders, but they are being forced upon the populace in he name of energy savings. Americans certianly are not in the mood by and large to pay $1500 or more for a washing machine.
The great old major appliance makers saw what was coming down the pike years ago, and got out of the business. General Motors, Rayetheon (sp?) and the lot did research and saw formerly "major" appliances were becoming consumer goods, and soon customers wouldn't pay high prices for what was considered a basic good.
Aside from key players leaving the market, innovation and design stagnated or even ceased. Why put all that R&D money into a new washing machine when Mrs. Average Housewife wasn't prepared to spend more than "X% dollars, regardless.
Another thing major applince producers learned, was that if they kept on building goods that rarely needed replacement or repair, it was killing their market. Aside from perhaps moving and or setting up house, most people do not purchase a washing machine unless the current one gives up the ghost.
Innovation and design stagnated?
F&P SmartDrive
Calypso
Neptune FL
Harmony
Neptune TL
HE/3/4/5/2 - Duet
Oasis/Cabrio/Bravos/AquaSmart
Whirlpool direct-drive w/auto load sensing
Perhaps not all as successful as was hoped/expected ... but they were/are on the market.
F&P SmartDrive
Calypso
Neptune FL
Harmony
Neptune TL
HE/3/4/5/2 - Duet
Oasis/Cabrio/Bravos/AquaSmart
Whirlpool direct-drive w/auto load sensing
Perhaps not all as successful as was hoped/expected ... but they were/are on the market.
mysteryclock
Well-known member
Disposable culture
NorfolkSouthern ,
Clearly someone needs to post some real inside Money Shots of the SQ FLs so their construction and repairability can be assessed! Any takers? I would if I had one.
Launderess,
Well said! The only thing I would add is that given what's happened recently I sense that the the tide may be ~starting~ to turn back towards quality and repairability vs. the highly disposable culture we've been in. In other words, people are beginning to prefer things that last and can be fixed vs. something with a lot of extra bells and whistles that may crap out after 3-5 years.
Having a W/D set that is now starting to crap out after 3 1/2 years, I know I'm in that boat. And I have no idea how repairable it will be down the road, wrt. bearings, etc. <sigh>
NorfolkSouthern ,
Clearly someone needs to post some real inside Money Shots of the SQ FLs so their construction and repairability can be assessed! Any takers? I would if I had one.
Launderess,
Well said! The only thing I would add is that given what's happened recently I sense that the the tide may be ~starting~ to turn back towards quality and repairability vs. the highly disposable culture we've been in. In other words, people are beginning to prefer things that last and can be fixed vs. something with a lot of extra bells and whistles that may crap out after 3-5 years.
Having a W/D set that is now starting to crap out after 3 1/2 years, I know I'm in that boat. And I have no idea how repairable it will be down the road, wrt. bearings, etc. <sigh>
mysteryclock
Well-known member
Good to see you here...
...suburbanmd!
OK, here is my fully-qualified *personal* statement on horizontal vs. tilted performance, the latter of which I will comment on. No marketing literature required.
On my machine, a late 2005(ish) Bosch Nexxt 500 series, I've noticed that its particular combination of drum tilt and paddle design means that on small loads, the back 1/2 of the drum is where the clothes get washed. On medium loads, its probably the back 3/4. When it is jammed full, the whole drum is used, but the pile is thicker in the back.
After spin, small loads are rammed against the back 1/4 of the drum and back plate. On medium loads, about the back 1/2, and full on the back 3/4.
** Of course, the exception to this are my 4-year-old's socks and mini-washcloths which always seem to end up stuck in the door gasket. This does highlight the clear advantage of a tilted drum, namely the ability to open the door and toss things back into the mix that get stuck.
What all of this tells me, again on my particular machine, is that most of the wash action (so to speak) occurs in the back. They wash there, they end up there, and that makes sense since it is on the downhill side of the tilt and that's where the visible water is.
On really full loads, the clothes in the front are pretty much just flopping around on the drum without much / any liquid under them (but obviously on them and the other clothes.) Yes they'll turn over and end up in the back eventually, but their duration in the front is less-productive than their time in the back. Even the water scooped up by the paddles tends towards the back.
Hence, my hypothesis about true HA machines vs. tilted ones. It is a nice theory, at least.
Did that make sense or am I just rambling on again?
;-)
...suburbanmd!
OK, here is my fully-qualified *personal* statement on horizontal vs. tilted performance, the latter of which I will comment on. No marketing literature required.
On my machine, a late 2005(ish) Bosch Nexxt 500 series, I've noticed that its particular combination of drum tilt and paddle design means that on small loads, the back 1/2 of the drum is where the clothes get washed. On medium loads, its probably the back 3/4. When it is jammed full, the whole drum is used, but the pile is thicker in the back.
After spin, small loads are rammed against the back 1/4 of the drum and back plate. On medium loads, about the back 1/2, and full on the back 3/4.
** Of course, the exception to this are my 4-year-old's socks and mini-washcloths which always seem to end up stuck in the door gasket. This does highlight the clear advantage of a tilted drum, namely the ability to open the door and toss things back into the mix that get stuck.
What all of this tells me, again on my particular machine, is that most of the wash action (so to speak) occurs in the back. They wash there, they end up there, and that makes sense since it is on the downhill side of the tilt and that's where the visible water is.
On really full loads, the clothes in the front are pretty much just flopping around on the drum without much / any liquid under them (but obviously on them and the other clothes.) Yes they'll turn over and end up in the back eventually, but their duration in the front is less-productive than their time in the back. Even the water scooped up by the paddles tends towards the back.
Hence, my hypothesis about true HA machines vs. tilted ones. It is a nice theory, at least.
Did that make sense or am I just rambling on again?
;-)
Horizontal vs. tilted axis
My opinion is also personal, and, like yours, derived from my own observations. I believe the shallow pool of water at the bottom is there to get the clothes wet, not to wash them directly. But you've got Speed Queen, or at least their marketing department, on your side.
On a related note, some people have posted on THS that small European-style front-loaders aren't as small as they look, and big American-style front-loaders aren't as big as they look, because the former are H-axis and the latter are tilted-axis. This claim has always confused me. I can completely fill the drum of my tilted-axis Miele W4840, loosely of course, and the entire load gets clean. The only way I could understand their claim to be true, is if H-axis machines can be packed much more tightly than tilted-axis machines. But how would the clothes have room to tumble, if they were packed tightly?
My opinion is also personal, and, like yours, derived from my own observations. I believe the shallow pool of water at the bottom is there to get the clothes wet, not to wash them directly. But you've got Speed Queen, or at least their marketing department, on your side.
On a related note, some people have posted on THS that small European-style front-loaders aren't as small as they look, and big American-style front-loaders aren't as big as they look, because the former are H-axis and the latter are tilted-axis. This claim has always confused me. I can completely fill the drum of my tilted-axis Miele W4840, loosely of course, and the entire load gets clean. The only way I could understand their claim to be true, is if H-axis machines can be packed much more tightly than tilted-axis machines. But how would the clothes have room to tumble, if they were packed tightly?
askomiele
Well-known member
Shallow pool of water
Dunno if this is right. But from my observations is that the pool of water is there just to suspend the dirt. The clothes get clean by rubbing against each other. Water is needed to bring detergent inside and between the fibers to speed upt the proces. The soil is loosend and when it comes in contact with water, pulled out of the fabrics. The pool is their to have water to circulate through the load.
I use the full capacity of my washer. It's filled up loosley so there is some place between the clothes. But the drum is always full. When wetting the load, the water can flow throught the entire load and the laod gets packed. I can put a doublebed duvet in my miele GOLD 2000... but then it is really packed and just turned around in water. Yet it's good for me!
Problem is that many brands pulled the ratio down on their capacity. Few years back, a drum with capacity of 50liters = 5 kg (1kg:10l), but some models rate the same drum 50liters today at 6 kg or even 7 kg.
Miele introduced their 7kg washer on the belgian market only. But there you see that the ratio 1:10 is still used. So they have a drum of +/-70 liters.
Dunno if this is right. But from my observations is that the pool of water is there just to suspend the dirt. The clothes get clean by rubbing against each other. Water is needed to bring detergent inside and between the fibers to speed upt the proces. The soil is loosend and when it comes in contact with water, pulled out of the fabrics. The pool is their to have water to circulate through the load.
I use the full capacity of my washer. It's filled up loosley so there is some place between the clothes. But the drum is always full. When wetting the load, the water can flow throught the entire load and the laod gets packed. I can put a doublebed duvet in my miele GOLD 2000... but then it is really packed and just turned around in water. Yet it's good for me!
Problem is that many brands pulled the ratio down on their capacity. Few years back, a drum with capacity of 50liters = 5 kg (1kg:10l), but some models rate the same drum 50liters today at 6 kg or even 7 kg.
Miele introduced their 7kg washer on the belgian market only. But there you see that the ratio 1:10 is still used. So they have a drum of +/-70 liters.
just bought one !
Just got a top-loader and it makes the exact same sounds / noise as the older style maytags from the early 80's and before. It appears to be of great quality ! 3 year parts AND labor warranty on everything ! I love it !
Just got a top-loader and it makes the exact same sounds / noise as the older style maytags from the early 80's and before. It appears to be of great quality ! 3 year parts AND labor warranty on everything ! I love it !
mysteryclock
Well-known member
Let's see it!
How about some pictures and / or videos?
How about some pictures and / or videos?
queeny77
Well-known member
they are mine
Here's one of the videos
Tilted tubs and bearings
are a nice idea in order to shorten the frontloader lifespan.
Frontloaders have radial bearings. These bearings can bear ONLY radial loads, while axial loads wear them.
The load is totally radial if the axix is really horizontal, otherwise there is also an axial component. The more is tilted, the bigger is the axial component.
Some big commercial frontloaders are TILTABLE, meaning the cylinder is tilted downward while downloading BUT it is set back to horizontal position before operation
are a nice idea in order to shorten the frontloader lifespan.
Frontloaders have radial bearings. These bearings can bear ONLY radial loads, while axial loads wear them.
The load is totally radial if the axix is really horizontal, otherwise there is also an axial component. The more is tilted, the bigger is the axial component.
Some big commercial frontloaders are TILTABLE, meaning the cylinder is tilted downward while downloading BUT it is set back to horizontal position before operation
i like the design...but a few more options would be nice...excellent warranty but we'll have to see as time goes on about long lasting for the money.....my experience has been never buy first one on the market..proto type..give it a few years when they respond to customer needs and then the changes will show up.....not to mention getting the glitches out....
