Old AC Repair or Chuck?

[launderess]

Well after many vain efforts my 1990's Friedrich air conditioner simply wasn't working correctly so had the repair guy in to take a peek. His prompt answer after testing the unit was that the motor (compressor) is going, causing it to over heat and thus stop the unit from cooling.

Normally once a compressor goes on non-central air conditioners it is time to replace the unit as the repair costs normally equals what one would pay for a new AC. Only time replacement is usually done is if the unit is still under warranty and therefore parts and some or all labour costs are covered.

Spoke to a local AC parts store, and while they will sell me the part required for much less than what the repair service quoted, I'm stuck as one has to find a qualified HVAC person to do the work, and not all like the idea of using parts customers have bought themselves. Oh they will say it is about assuring quality and such, but am quite sure it is also about protecting their nice little mark-up.

Good news is that once the compressor is changed, the unit should be good to go for another 10 or 20 years. Just have to get over the $$$$ in repair bills. Also am rather fond of the older mechanical controled air conditioners, verus today's electronic thermostat models. The EER on wall units is not that much different on what is being sold today compared to my unit, as wall ACs by design are not the most efficient. There is also the added cost of having to change the sleeve/grille to suit a newer unit.

Thoughts?

TIA
L.

 

[DADoES]

Difficult decision!

Friedrich is the highest quality window unit on the market today, IMO. If yours is otherwise in good condition, EER is up there, performance is otherwise positive, and matching the fit on a new one would be problematical, it'd perhaps be worth the effort to investigate a tech to handle the compressor install.

Note that Friedrich does still have a model line with mechanical controls. Or did last time I had a look-see.

 

[rp2813]

You can always try Craig's List for an installer. I got my 40 gallon gas water heater installed by a guy from Craig's List and he was anything but a flake. Most of these people are moonlighters who are professionals trying to make some extra money. When I had my water heater replaced, and the one at my mom's, both done by Craig's Listers, they took the old water heaters away. I doubt they would have done so if they didn't work for a HVAC or plumbing outfit already and had access to a dumpster.

 

[toggleswitch]

Agree with Dadoes/ Glenn.

If you must replace, please consider a newer Friedrich that fits into a "standard" Fedders (the defacto standard) wall-sleeve. Any problems with unit you can just slide out and replace. And I'd keep get the blocking cover for such a sleeve sleeve in case pne has no untit (in the FAR FAR future) for a day or two during repairs.

I believe the efficiency found in back-breathers rivals that which is found on units such as your that project further towards the outdoors and suck air in from the sides to cool the compressor and condenser(outdoor) coil (outside).

Of course if you must spend $, I'm all for the Mitsuish Mr. Slims ype split ductless systems that are nearly silent indoors. [Friedrich makes the split-systems as well.] One outdoor unit can handle up to 4 indoor units. I have seen this and similar type units wall-mounted by way of steel brackets, thereby emulating your current install.

Much luck.

http://www.friedrich.com/ductless/

 

[toggleswitch]

Not that you asked but............

Units that discharge cooled air back into the room via a large grille on the right side are Asian (Japanese?) made (inspired?) and tend to be very quiet.

GE IIRC slaps their logo on these foreign invaders.

Don't fear the interior styrofoam air-channels and passageway. They won't rust/rattle and happen to absorb sound and they wont give off the black specks of disinegrating insulation that fly out of old A/C's.

P.S.
A GE sleeve (that holds a GE A/C)fits inside a Fedders /Friedrich "standard" sleeve with no addtional modifications.
Other units, though, won't fit a GE sleeve which is a tad smaller.

Too much said.

Bonne chance!

http://products.geappliances.com/Ap...EQUEST=SUBCATEGORY&SITEID=GEA&CATEGORY=CA0006

 

[alr2903]

Rp2813

Thats exactly what we do call a professional company for the Have to have it fixed now, list. But you can always mention the wish list items, many times $50.00 can solve a lot of problems, doesnt take them long either, when its HVAC, plumbing or electrical, they can knock out in 1 hr, what would kill half my weekend.

 

[Cybrvanr]

Does GE still make any of the spike/spine fin coil air conditioners, or did they sell that design to Trane when they broke off from them?

 

[launderess]

Thanks For The Suggestions/Comments Gang

Please keep them coming.

Should clear up one little confusion; our wall sleeve is the standard "Fedders A" type which fits both that and Friedrich wall units amoung others. However about 1995 or so Friedrich changed the design of their wall units so that the outside grille has about 2/3 of the louvers facing one way, the remaining 1/3 the other. Apparently Friedrich and now IIRC Fedders newer wall units take in air from one direction while exhausting heated air from another. If the grille is not changed and one uses the standard horizontal type grilles, unit performance will suffer eventually. According to Friedrich techs this is because the unit will be taking in the same hot air it discharged, causing the commpressor to work harder.

Now you see why I am loathe to get rid of my older unit, which uses a different sort of system to remove and take in air. Friedrich techs told me that the desgin changes were in response to the EPA/government energy requirments for ACs.

As mentioned however, modern "back breathers" (thank you for that Toggle) aren't that much more efficient than previous models. Certianly my unit from the 1990's is not that far if any behind what is offered today. Also my unit uses good old fashioned Freon (well whatever R12 is), so when it blows cold air, it is pretty damn cold.

Another thing I do like about dial/mechanical controlled ACs is that power problems do not seem to affect some as much as the newer electronic models. When I called Friedrich today to get information, had to wait on hold forever. Asked the tech why the long hold times/high call volume, and it seemed lots of calls were coming from my area. Guess why? Parts of NYC/Westchester had blackout yesterday (parts are still without power, but that is also due to bad thunderstorms), and people were calling because their electronic ACs needed to be reset, and they didn't have a clue. My old baby, simply will power on once the juice is turned back on. No muss no fuss.

Will wait and see what the repair service gives me as firm price tomorrow for the compressor, and may try to call their bluff if the price is way out of line. Know people have mouths to feed, but charging $250 above cost for a compressor is just galling, IMHO. But then again they may have us by the short and curlies if no other AC service will install a compressor supplied by a customer. Called a few companies late today and they were all like "where did you get a compressor from?" "don't tell me Friedrich sent it to you as they do not do that, the compressor is the heart of the machine....". So you can see what I am up against.

L.

 

[gocartwasher]

now days its society says Chuck

you remove the alumimum copper coils they are worth $$$$ at a salvage yard

 

[toggleswitch]

HMMM....
IIRC the front grilles of GE are detachable and change-able. Thought the "Fedders A" was as well..

~Does GE still make any of the spike/spine fin coil air conditioners, or did they sell that design to Trane when they broke off from them?

If nothing else this site teaches the metric system AND how to dig/research on the WWW. *LOL*

I thought Trane was a division of, or spin-off of American-Standard.


http://www.fedders.com/catalog/appliances/roomac/fed_ab.htm

 

[toggleswitch]

Friedrich

http://www.friedrich.com/current/php_prodline.php?line=UFS

 

[launderess]

Rear grille

 

[toggleswitch]

Lookie likey grille-y (sold) separately.

see page 10.

http://www.friedrich.com/new_pdf/92013601_11-04_US_IO_Manual.pdf

 

[toggleswitch]

pardonnez-moi!

Yes I meant rear grille.

 

[launderess]

Yes, know the rear grille is sold on it's own, but the building won't allow anyone to make changes to the outside of building, that includes changing AC grilles. You can install an AC into the sleeve, but that is about it.

Thanks for doing the leg work though.

L.

 

[partscounterman]

Need to be reset?

I have two cheep chinee-built ACs with the electronic type control. Our power goes on and off like fireflies (Thank You Peg Bracken) and I have never had to "reset" my units, nor the electronically controlled unit we have down at work. What line of crap are they trying to feed you anyway?

I think you should have your old cold fixed. Nothing cools like dichlorodiflouromethane (CFC-12). Find an old guy to do it.

 

[danemodsandy]

One Other Consideration!

I don't know a whole lot about Friedrich, so this is generic advice, okay?

Most air-conditioners today have no provision for exhausting air from the room; they just cool what's in the room. That's fine for SEER ratings, but it's not so great if you have smoke or odours you'd like to get rid of quickly. You also can't draw in outside air on cooler days, thus getting cool air without running the compressor.

If you can find a unit that has the exhaust provision, you'll be way better off, trust me. Manufacturers' literature and advertising makes no mention of the deleted exhaust provision, so you have to look at the actual model you wish to buy. Look for an actual control; don't rely on ad-speak like "four-way air control". I've seen that in A/C advertising, and you know what it means? It means the louvers can be tilted up, down, left, or right, that's what it means!

Oh, the mendacity.... Just know what you're getting if you buy a new unit, is all I'm saying.

 

[DADoES]

In my observation of window units over the years, none of the exhaust or fresh-air provisions had a significant effect. Only a very small portion of the airflow is typically directed out the exhaust port, and very little intake occurs from a fresh-air port. I've never used any air-exchange feature on any of the units I've used or owned, and all of them have had at least an exhaust provision. I wouldn't make the presence or absence of it a primary (or even a secondary) selection criteria, myself.

 

[panthera]

my two cents

The HVAC guys who set up my folk's heat pump this year told me they try very hard to stay away from the "real thing" (dichlorodiflouromethane (CFC-12) as partscounterman puts it.

The repairs are simple but they have to keep records and the Feds make a big scene and threaten enormous fines if anything is out of line.

So they will discourage a customer from repairing one, even if they might lose a sale because of it.

That said, there are folks out there who specialize in conversions and repairs; they like real machines. So why not do some looking around outside of the usual channels. An older guy or gal who is "retired" but certified is not going to waste that expensive equipment and training, not in NYC.

Or someone like us who appreciates the real thing.

As for the grills, if yours is failing, I bet everyone else's is too...or they already did replace theirs and nobody has noticed or said a thing...cause they did their own already.

By the by, I put in several window air conditioners for friends over the last two summers (have to do something with my hands when I'm in the States). The instruction manuals frequently spoke of "reset" conditions, so I don't doubt that there might be problems after a brown-out or power failure. I am not talking about the electronics in the air-conditioners; I mean those little gfi plugs they come with...they are really sensitive and trip easily under such conditions.

Can you imagine the size of a non-interruptible power supply for one of these? Just a morning thought...