toploader55
Well-known member
Here's some pics of "Kaydee" I think she's in great shape. As far as the drain valve goes... What do you guys think ? I'm not a tech but might give something a try.
Pics of KD2-P and Drain Valve Issues
- Thread starter toploader55
- Start date
toploader55
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Drain Valve
Leaking
Leaking
toploader55
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Here she is...
Nice
Nice
toploader55
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Interior
Sweet
Sweet
toploader55
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Drain Valve
One more shot
One more shot
toploader55
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Sump
No Rust
No Rust
toploader55
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Sump
Again
Again
stevet
Well-known member
WOW!!!
Toploader..thanks for posting the pictures of this perfect machine. Just the condition of the interior is enough to make it a constant source 0f conversation! Makes me wish I still had my front loading portable unit of the same vintage!
As far as that funny Cork in the drain valve.. that was where the overflow hose would have gone if this was a front loader. Since it had the pump drain, I wonder why they chose to leave it out of the design. But you can remove the cork and install a new one or get one of those rubber stoppers at Home depot with the wingnut on it and insert it into the opening and then tighten it up. There is no pressure from the pump on it so it won't blow out. or you can get a car radiator hose to fit the valve neck cut it back so it doesnt hit anything and then put a pipe cap in the other end and clamp it in place. should last another 50 years!
The valve stem leak was always the bane of that valve design. There was no real fix for it except to replace the valve. The part number for the valve was 77818 so you may be able to find one on ebay or maybe there are some still haunting the shelves at Hobart's parts distribution center(call your local Hobart office @ 1-888-4HOBART) or maybe even Whirlpool may have a few hanging around! The only problem I foresee would be getting the water reservoir on the bottom of the valve apart from the old valve. Years of buildup makes it a difficult proposition.There is an O-Ring inside the neck of the reservoir to seal it against the valve body. You may want to get that as well. I don't have those parts manuals anymore but I am sure someone on this forum does and can provide that number and that should still be available thru Hobart.
Based on the fact that you have a pumped drain and there is no overflow, the water should only leak during the actual drain periods when the complete charge of water goes past the valve shaft. maybe you can rig up a small container to catch the drip and then it will evaporate away over the next few hours.
Toploader..thanks for posting the pictures of this perfect machine. Just the condition of the interior is enough to make it a constant source 0f conversation! Makes me wish I still had my front loading portable unit of the same vintage!
As far as that funny Cork in the drain valve.. that was where the overflow hose would have gone if this was a front loader. Since it had the pump drain, I wonder why they chose to leave it out of the design. But you can remove the cork and install a new one or get one of those rubber stoppers at Home depot with the wingnut on it and insert it into the opening and then tighten it up. There is no pressure from the pump on it so it won't blow out. or you can get a car radiator hose to fit the valve neck cut it back so it doesnt hit anything and then put a pipe cap in the other end and clamp it in place. should last another 50 years!
The valve stem leak was always the bane of that valve design. There was no real fix for it except to replace the valve. The part number for the valve was 77818 so you may be able to find one on ebay or maybe there are some still haunting the shelves at Hobart's parts distribution center(call your local Hobart office @ 1-888-4HOBART) or maybe even Whirlpool may have a few hanging around! The only problem I foresee would be getting the water reservoir on the bottom of the valve apart from the old valve. Years of buildup makes it a difficult proposition.There is an O-Ring inside the neck of the reservoir to seal it against the valve body. You may want to get that as well. I don't have those parts manuals anymore but I am sure someone on this forum does and can provide that number and that should still be available thru Hobart.
Based on the fact that you have a pumped drain and there is no overflow, the water should only leak during the actual drain periods when the complete charge of water goes past the valve shaft. maybe you can rig up a small container to catch the drip and then it will evaporate away over the next few hours.
Very nice machine!
Your drain valve issue is a common one with these vintage KA's - Steve's idea about catching the water in something for the time being is a pretty good one. A couple of people here have had good luck with those valves "healing" themselves after using them for a while. Once things get hot and wet and used for a while, the parts start to behave again. Some chanting and incantations can't hurt either ;-) Exhaustive searches for spare parts have been done and it's rare to find them, but you never know. Try the old KitchenAid dealers in your area - Hobart distributors in the area may have some old parts around too.
Good luck - it's worth the effort for sure, what a beauty!
Your drain valve issue is a common one with these vintage KA's - Steve's idea about catching the water in something for the time being is a pretty good one. A couple of people here have had good luck with those valves "healing" themselves after using them for a while. Once things get hot and wet and used for a while, the parts start to behave again. Some chanting and incantations can't hurt either ;-) Exhaustive searches for spare parts have been done and it's rare to find them, but you never know. Try the old KitchenAid dealers in your area - Hobart distributors in the area may have some old parts around too.
Good luck - it's worth the effort for sure, what a beauty!
You could also take the cork out (if you can get it out with damaging it) and put some silicone on it and force it back in. Let it dry overnight and that should cure the cork leak.
You know, if you cannot find that drain valve assembly, you could put a drain valve (its a flow through valve) from a later KA dishwasher a bit further down the drain hose line and seal up the original plunger. I'm sure the later drain valves are still available. I've used this KA drain valve procedure in early Bendix bolt-down washers and it has worked perfecly.
You know, if you cannot find that drain valve assembly, you could put a drain valve (its a flow through valve) from a later KA dishwasher a bit further down the drain hose line and seal up the original plunger. I'm sure the later drain valves are still available. I've used this KA drain valve procedure in early Bendix bolt-down washers and it has worked perfecly.
wow look at that
Nice machine, looks in such good condition, made to last and last. I have a question in regards to older top loaders, how do you load the bottom rack, does the top rack come out completly to load the bottom. The ones that I have had, the top rack comes up when you open the lid. May seem like a stupid question but I have never seen one close up like this.
Jon
Nice machine, looks in such good condition, made to last and last. I have a question in regards to older top loaders, how do you load the bottom rack, does the top rack come out completly to load the bottom. The ones that I have had, the top rack comes up when you open the lid. May seem like a stupid question but I have never seen one close up like this.
Jon
toploader55
Well-known member
Thanks Guys
Some really great ideas. Coldspot 66 is on his way to Prince-O-Perc's party today. He's offered to take a look as well. I am so nervous about some of this stuff I just don't want to damage anything. As I said before, I am not a tech.,but I suppose yoou have to learn sooner or later.
I am Very Happy about the compliments. I feel she's a real peach.
Here's a few more pics :
Some really great ideas. Coldspot 66 is on his way to Prince-O-Perc's party today. He's offered to take a look as well. I am so nervous about some of this stuff I just don't want to damage anything. As I said before, I am not a tech.,but I suppose yoou have to learn sooner or later.
I am Very Happy about the compliments. I feel she's a real peach.
Here's a few more pics :
toploader55
Well-known member
Silverware Basket
Mint
Mint
toploader55
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Original Label on Lid
Commended by Parent's Magazine,McCalls Magazine and The Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval
Commended by Parent's Magazine,McCalls Magazine and The Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval
toploader55
Well-known member
Control Dial
Nice Shape
Nice Shape
toploader55
Well-known member
This is the Kicker
The Original Packet with the Operating Manuel, Congratulations Card,Warrenty Envelope, and a Information Card on other Fine KitchenAid Appliances.
The Original Packet with the Operating Manuel, Congratulations Card,Warrenty Envelope, and a Information Card on other Fine KitchenAid Appliances.
toploader55
Well-known member
To Retro Man NH
Just took a shot to answer your question. This pic is the center portion of the upper rack in the "Load" position. You can reach the lower rack for Plates and Silverware. The 2 top side racks are for Glasses,Cups and Mugs. The Center rack is for mixing Bowls, Serving pieces etc.
Just took a shot to answer your question. This pic is the center portion of the upper rack in the "Load" position. You can reach the lower rack for Plates and Silverware. The 2 top side racks are for Glasses,Cups and Mugs. The Center rack is for mixing Bowls, Serving pieces etc.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Nice shots, Eddie. That's the first I've seen of the KD2P dishwasher detergent dispenser. Mine came without one, and so I've been using gel-packs instead. These work fine, but...
Also the photo of the "loading position" for the center top rack is helpful. For some reason my KD2P manual doesn't mention that. I've been hanging it off the side of the machine but the position indicated might be better.
Question: does the lid on your machine stay down when the latch is released, or does it pop up? I had to restore the hinges on my machine, and had to find new springs. I finally settled on a hinge/spring combination that keeps the top up when it raised, but the lid will pop up as soon as the latch is release. Not a problem for me, but perhaps an issue if someone unfamiliar with the dishwasher might inadvertantly release the lid and it might fly up uncontrolled and damage something...
Also the photo of the "loading position" for the center top rack is helpful. For some reason my KD2P manual doesn't mention that. I've been hanging it off the side of the machine but the position indicated might be better.
Question: does the lid on your machine stay down when the latch is released, or does it pop up? I had to restore the hinges on my machine, and had to find new springs. I finally settled on a hinge/spring combination that keeps the top up when it raised, but the lid will pop up as soon as the latch is release. Not a problem for me, but perhaps an issue if someone unfamiliar with the dishwasher might inadvertantly release the lid and it might fly up uncontrolled and damage something...
toploader55
Well-known member
Mr. Sudsmaster
The lid on my machine does spring open. I adjusted the tension on the cover springs as it would only remain open 1/2 way which was a pain. The soap dispensor is cool. I am still amazed at the overall condition of this machine. I remember the first one I saw like that was on a 50's model Under the counter KA when I was about 9-10 yrs old. Now...My owner's manuel on page four illustrates the "loading" position for the center of the top rack on Page 4. I was wondering myself "What the hell do you do with this thing while loading". Then after reading the manuel for about the 12 th time, there it is.
Tell me...Do you use your machine on a daily basis ? I use my Kenwhirl most of the time, and then I'll use the Mobile Maid for a few days, and I'm hoping soon to be using the KA. Thanks for writing.
The lid on my machine does spring open. I adjusted the tension on the cover springs as it would only remain open 1/2 way which was a pain. The soap dispensor is cool. I am still amazed at the overall condition of this machine. I remember the first one I saw like that was on a 50's model Under the counter KA when I was about 9-10 yrs old. Now...My owner's manuel on page four illustrates the "loading" position for the center of the top rack on Page 4. I was wondering myself "What the hell do you do with this thing while loading". Then after reading the manuel for about the 12 th time, there it is.
Tell me...Do you use your machine on a daily basis ? I use my Kenwhirl most of the time, and then I'll use the Mobile Maid for a few days, and I'm hoping soon to be using the KA. Thanks for writing.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
The quality of the build on the KD2P is excellent. I noticed that when I had it apart, that every square inch of the thing is porcelain glass over steel - even the underside and sides of the tub and inside of the cabinet panels. It is clearly built to last. Well, not the pot metal hinges - be careful - the ones on mine were broken (at the point where the springs attach), probably from the lid flying open once too often. So I made new hinges out of billet stainless steel.
I don't use the KD2P as much as I would like, mainly because its in a second kitchen on an enclosed patio. I don't generate too many dishes out there, so the workhorse is the Bosch SHU43C in the main kitchen. Occasionally when I have too many dishes to load into the Bosch I'll run the extra stuff in the KD, partly to keep the drain valve in action.
I was wondering if you could do me a favor, and take a few closeup shots of the soap dispenser. Most helpful would be shots from three angles: top, front side, right side. From that - along with inch measurements for the three dimensions length height width, and I could probably fabricate a replacement.
You'll also notice that the machine runs a lot quieter when the racks are installed, and even more when it's got a full load of dishes. The unimpeded spray from that wash arm will otherwise cause a deep drumming on the underside of the lid.
I don't use the KD2P as much as I would like, mainly because its in a second kitchen on an enclosed patio. I don't generate too many dishes out there, so the workhorse is the Bosch SHU43C in the main kitchen. Occasionally when I have too many dishes to load into the Bosch I'll run the extra stuff in the KD, partly to keep the drain valve in action.
I was wondering if you could do me a favor, and take a few closeup shots of the soap dispenser. Most helpful would be shots from three angles: top, front side, right side. From that - along with inch measurements for the three dimensions length height width, and I could probably fabricate a replacement.
You'll also notice that the machine runs a lot quieter when the racks are installed, and even more when it's got a full load of dishes. The unimpeded spray from that wash arm will otherwise cause a deep drumming on the underside of the lid.
stevet
Well-known member
Flow Thru doesnt work here!
Excellent suggestion, Unimatic.. However, these machines were designed to have the drain valve in an open position at all times except when the machine starts running. In other words, the solenoid holds the drain valve closed. The later models with the flow thru solenoids were held closed by the valve itself and then opened when it was time to drain.
Now It CAN be done if the person is willing to install a relay set up that would energize the flow thru valve whenever the original drain solenoid is deenergized. Just also keep in mind that the coils on the flow thru valves are not made for continuous duty and usually no more than 90 -120 seconds without burning up. You would therefore have to find a voltage supply on the unit that would not be continuous, pehaps the timer motor wires since they would be deenergized if you opened the machine or the cycle was finished. Just for the record, the drain solenoid was energized at all times as long as the timer was in an active cycle and not calling for a drain period. Opening up the door would not make the d/w drain out.
Hope this helps.
Excellent suggestion, Unimatic.. However, these machines were designed to have the drain valve in an open position at all times except when the machine starts running. In other words, the solenoid holds the drain valve closed. The later models with the flow thru solenoids were held closed by the valve itself and then opened when it was time to drain.
Now It CAN be done if the person is willing to install a relay set up that would energize the flow thru valve whenever the original drain solenoid is deenergized. Just also keep in mind that the coils on the flow thru valves are not made for continuous duty and usually no more than 90 -120 seconds without burning up. You would therefore have to find a voltage supply on the unit that would not be continuous, pehaps the timer motor wires since they would be deenergized if you opened the machine or the cycle was finished. Just for the record, the drain solenoid was energized at all times as long as the timer was in an active cycle and not calling for a drain period. Opening up the door would not make the d/w drain out.
Hope this helps.
toploader55
Well-known member
Detergent Dispensor
Sudsmaster...here are your pics.
1 3/4 length
Sudsmaster...here are your pics.
1 3/4 length
toploader55
Well-known member
Detergent Dispensor
1 5/16 wide
1 5/16 wide
toploader55
Well-known member
Detergent Dispensor
1 1/2 depth
1 1/2 depth
toploader55
Well-known member
And One More
Note the clip on only this side
Note the clip on only this side
Ok, I'm seeing it leaking out of that the hole where the shaft goes in.
Looks like it's just worn down a bit.
I wonder, would it be possible to ream the hole out and install a bushing, kinda like a valve sleave in a car's cylinder head? You'd get a tight fit and that'd stop the leak...
(just a thought)
Looks like it's just worn down a bit.
I wonder, would it be possible to ream the hole out and install a bushing, kinda like a valve sleave in a car's cylinder head? You'd get a tight fit and that'd stop the leak...
(just a thought)
toploader55
Well-known member
How do you ......
How do you check this machine for particles in the drain valve (Sump) I have tried to get one of my fingers down there,(OOOH, that sounds wierd) but anyway what should I be (feeling ) or looking for ? My gut instinct is telling me the valve is junk. My gut is usually never wrong and when it is ,I am thankful.
How do you check this machine for particles in the drain valve (Sump) I have tried to get one of my fingers down there,(OOOH, that sounds wierd) but anyway what should I be (feeling ) or looking for ? My gut instinct is telling me the valve is junk. My gut is usually never wrong and when it is ,I am thankful.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Thanks for the photos of the soap dispenser!
I'm Confused
In other words, the solenoid holds the drain valve closed. The later models with the flow thru solenoids were held closed by the valve itself and then opened when it was time to drain.
Wait a minute, I thought these later model flow through valves operated like this:
Solenoid Energized: Drain line plugged so no water goes though drain hose.
Solenoid De-energized: Drain line open so water flows through drain line.
At least that is the way the one that I installed in my Bendix works.
In other words, the solenoid holds the drain valve closed. The later models with the flow thru solenoids were held closed by the valve itself and then opened when it was time to drain.
Wait a minute, I thought these later model flow through valves operated like this:
Solenoid Energized: Drain line plugged so no water goes though drain hose.
Solenoid De-energized: Drain line open so water flows through drain line.
At least that is the way the one that I installed in my Bendix works.
toploader55
Well-known member
Solenoid
Hi Robert.
On the KD2 and the machines with the Cast Iron Wash Arms before they went to the 4-way HydroSweep Arms, (I know the commercial Hobart UM-4) When the machine is off, the valve is open. When it's energized it is shut. So another words while it's filling and washing or rinsing, the valve is energized and is shut. When it calls for draining or off, it is not energized and it is open.
Hi Robert.
On the KD2 and the machines with the Cast Iron Wash Arms before they went to the 4-way HydroSweep Arms, (I know the commercial Hobart UM-4) When the machine is off, the valve is open. When it's energized it is shut. So another words while it's filling and washing or rinsing, the valve is energized and is shut. When it calls for draining or off, it is not energized and it is open.
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