Potscrubber III?

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New Sump

Efficient by several orders. The new sump and pump holds roughly about 1/3 the water of the old sump and pump. Given the water charge and number of fills, this machine will wash and rinse circles around newer machines.

You are lucky, no matter what people say older GE machines are simply the best overall in every way possible.
 
Well when I first seen the sump I thought that it looked very odd. I was wondering if there was a way to block off the bottom so it would retain less water. Glad they updated the part.

In college I lived in a apartment that had one of the later 90s GE dishwasher. Very BOL, was out of the potscrubber series but this one was not badged as such it was so BOL. Had heavy, normal, and light on the dial, a heated dry rocker and that was it. Didn’t have multi orbit, the passive filtration, the power shower, or an extended wash. Nonetheless if you loaded it right it cleaned well enough. That dishwasher lead to a lot of arguments with my roommates at the time. They where always upset that would go behind them and rearrange the dishwasher. At the time I was very conscious about utilities cost and only ran it when it was absolutely full. I always bobloaded it before I knew there was such a thing haha. Also I could never get them to understand the limits of a tower wash system.

I’m looking forward to getting this installed and pushing the performance of it. I’ve been very satisfied with my Bosch will this make me forget it?? Stay tuned!
 
Honestly, you might forget about the Bosch. The dishwasher you had in college had less water per charge, one less fill on normal, a longer but not extended main wash, no fine filter, no multi orbit wash arm, no power shower and a weaker heater. All in all yours was just bare bones and the cycles built around energy savings.

This one on the other hand has everything that will make it clean without leaving particles and residue behind.

Please do before and after loads, I'm excited!
 
Had some free time today to work on swapping the Potscrubber out for the Bosch. It fought me a bit, the house it came out of have different size connections than the new ones in my Apartment. Had to get an entirely new drain house and put some adapters on to make the fill valve work but I got it. The freestanding connections box is a bit awkward to work with, whoever put the water inlet directly over the electrical connection probably didn’t think that all the way through. I guess I’ll know it’s leaking when the whole thing shorts out.

Anyways it’s on its Maiden wash now. This load wasn’t terribly challenging, some dried oatmeal in the lower rack will probably be the crustiest thing. I did put a blender cup in the corner of the rack to see how well the power tower does. After running it out of the cabinet I was a little concerned about noise level...while I do enjoy the drama and splashiness of a vintage dishwasher this apartment had a very open floor plan and sometime you just want to do dishes and not fuss with it. The Bosch excelled in this area, but with the insulation jacket on and the machine in the cabinet it’s not too bad. Putting the kick plate on should quiet it down even further.

It seems to fill ok but just checking, in the last picture Is that an acceptable fill level for a full fill?

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Fill level

Yes, that’s the correct fill level for the first pre-rinse/pre-wash. A couple of subsequent fills in the cycle will be a little less. They are typically in between pre-washing and post-wash rinses.

It looks great installed. You will like the performance, and it holds a surprisingly large load! Enjoy!!
 
Good for you!

We had a Potscrubber III fall into our laps two weeks ago.

Filthy, otherwise worked great.

Having done a lot of Potscrubbers through the years (no II, though), here's some stuff I've learned (a lot with the help of the folks around here) which might be useful:

1) That multi-orbital spray arm, even if it were clogged and broken in two and leaking out the sides is one million, billion, trillion times better than the whirligig piece of sh---- which came after.

There is NO comparison.

Now, they do clog and there is a tiny little slit on one side of one arm which tends to clog up, stopping the arm from rotating as fast as it needs to. There is also a thin gasket it's supposed to ride on which sometimes fails and makes screeching noises. If it's failed, just yank the super thin gasket. We have one in use at a friend's house which has cleaned perfectly without it now for 13 years. Better with, of course.

2) The filter cover and the sump pump cover and the cover over the flood-sensor all get filled up with the most horrid gunk over time. They were meant to be cleaned by real enzymes and real phosphate and real chlorine bleach and truly hot water. Too many people used the eco-friendly trash and too cool water and too short cycles these past 20 years. Better unscrew them and clean them thoroughly. Don't put your bare hands into the sump, there's always sharp things in there to attack you. It does need a good cleaning, though. 

3) The power-shower arm also gets clogged and, in contrast to what many say who didn't know these units in the old, high water days, it DOES contribute to cleaning, not just removing yibblets from the top rack. The last iterations of this machine are always in cavitation because they don't have enough water to really work well. 

4) The one-way valve under the big filter in the back gets clogged. Clean it.

5) Combo52 is, as always, right. You can use a sealant. I've had success (again, running 13 years now with nary a drip) using the blue teflon tape (20x thicker than the usual white junk). It's removable and hasn't crept in those 13 years or five years or on the one we did two weeks ago. Lots of folks don't know there are different PTFE tapes, so they throw them all in one bucket. Of course RTV silicone will work, too.

6) The heating element was de-rated to about 500 Watts from 900 but the design was still for the 900. This means you pretty much have to either feed this machine 125F water for reals or run it at the temp. boost/potscrubber settings for that phenomenal clean. 

Remember, it was this series that beat KA dishwashers in cleaning in the Consumer Research tests. They hated admitting it and were not happy to have to do so, but it's true - these dishwashers did the best cleaning job (especially in the corners of the top basket) of any dishwasher ever tested. Runs rings around the current two-drops of luke warm water trash.

 

You'll love this machine. Many folks will tell you that you must, simply must replace the shaded pole motor. That's one of those religious beliefs. I have NEVER, not ONCE had one fail and I've repaired/cleaned/restored over 30 of them in various Potscrubbers. Not once. I do oil them as GE recommends. Yes, of course the SIEMENS capacitor split-phase induction motors are quieter and run well. Sure, if you must, go for it. But, again, it's a religious objection to shaded-pole, not an actual cleaning ability driven argument.

 

If you do have to replace the impeller/seal/soft-food disposer, do the whole unit including the drain solenoid. By the time one is done, the other is done, too. The kits are OK if the unit is only 30 years old or so and otherwise in good condition.

 

So, that's my two cents, for what they're worth. Clean everything, including inside the door and that gasket and the two removable corner gaskets at the bottom. Use the highest heat settings, good detergent and rinse-aid and you'll be totally happy. 

 

 
 
Thank you all for the advice and kind words. This was a fairly easy machine to work on, I could have got it done faster but I’ve been so busy with work lately. I’m looking forward to putting it through it’s paces. I think there’s a certain charm to an old school TOL appliance, and this certainly looks sharp and lends of air of solidity to the kitchen. Might have to look out for SS panels, it would match the rest of the appliances and give a modern look. I did clean under the float valve, it actually wasn’t too nasty. The one way valve did get pulled as I had to put a new drain hose on, there wasn’t anything in it. I did not check the valve in the filtration system, it seems to drain just fine so I’ll leave it for now. I do want to address the rusting on the inner door but that will be a project for later. I can clean that valve then. I know the new motor is China made but I think it was the right move. It’s very quiet and doesn’t surge as the water sloshes about. Now that it’s in the cabinet I think the noise level is just right. Just loud enough to remind you it’s hard at work but if you just want to watch TV the sound of the power tower sweeping around the door will fall right into the back ground. I personally find it southing to listen. The power shower was clean with no clogs, there was a small bit of plastic stuck in one of the holes of the lower wash arm but that was really the only foreign debris in it. The Teflon seal in the multi orbit system is probably about on its last leg, it looks very thin and the arm does groan a bit as it’s going about. I did have a little issue with some water getting between the inner door and the color panels, also the detergent dispenser was washing out. I figured these problems maybe be related so I took the door apart and tightened and cleaned the dispensers. All the dishes are done up now will have to wait a few days for another load to test it out.
 
That seal is super duper thin

Even brand new, it appears to have been in use for 90 years with five full washloads a day.

It might quiet down over time. It works without it, but I'd only pull it if you have no choice.

I'm so glad it's working for you. Water in the door can mean various things (I always install them with a slight tilt to the back) but it's quite possible the gasket has either worn out or come loose. The new ones cost too much to believe, there are two styles I know of, one thicker, the other thinner. You can usually find one of these machines at Habitat for $10 in good condition and grab various parts, including the gaskets. The newer ones didn't clean as well because their timers were set to starve them of water more than anything else.

You can also tighter the door latch a bit at the top. Or, one of the corner gaskets has come loose?
 
Uncle Owl Face would be proud of you

I'm not an engineer and high-school geometry was a very long time ago, but, yes, I believe the wash arm's patterns are nutations of an orbit. Euler's second law? Way too long ago.

Anyway, there were three wash arms from the post PotscrubberII era. This one, on the higher-end machines caused Consumer Reports to dethrone KA and announce (with tremendous reluctance, they were bought and sold to KA) that this dishwasher was better at cleaning. Much better.

 

A simple mechanism (looks like a cam to me, but I'm not an engineer) throws the arm out and then draws it back in during it's rotation. It isn't truly random, but it does make sure that even the further most corners of the top rack get thorough coverage.

 

A second variation also uses whirligigs on top of a regular arm  (Frigidaire does that on some, still, today) and they were absolutely the most horrible, terrible, clog-prone, stupid, worthless trash GE ever put on the market, doing great harm to my opinion of them.

 

The third variation, the one still in use on the last of the Potscrubbers (the ones you get from Home Depot for 250-350$), doesn't nutate, it just rotates and sprays water through big holes. Does a pretty good job, given enough water, to be honest.

 

One must never upset the KA folks (we've had several ourselves and yes, they're wonderful, the very best, truly the holy grail, blah, blah, blah), but this design really would have made the 18" dishwashers clean well in the corners and it runs rings around everything else when you're dealing with truly dirty dishes.
 
The multi orbit works kinda like a kitchen aid stand mixer, it rotated off center so it makes two circles as it goes around. Every picture below is one full turn, hopefully you can see how it’s in a different place everyone. Also you can see the track and pinion gear that the eccentric orbit runs on.

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What a great job you're doing on this nice machine, Cameron!  I've been following this thread with interest as I have a GSD1250 that I intend to fix up myself.   This thread has been really interesting and useful!

 

One thing I don't get is the power of the heater.  When I read reply #13 (photo #14) a few weeks ago, I was surprised to see the heater listed as 115V 3A.  That would make it just 345 W.  I remember thinking that this would have to be the lowest-power heater I have ever seen in a dishwasher.  But in reply #37 panthera mentions that you have the 900 W heater.  So how can we tell?  Does this mean the heater has been replaced at some point, or the label isn't original to this machine?  I did think the heater was pretty big -- I don't think mine has a heater that big.

 

Great thread of an an excellent restoration. 

Mark
 
I decided to do a little experiment to see how much the Calrod can raise the temperature of the wash water. The incoming hot water at the tap was measured at 115 degrees. I used the power scrub cycle with the extended main wash. The sequence leading up the main wash is pre wash, pre rinse, pre rinse, main wash. The temperature at the beginning of the main wash was measured at 109 degrees, the temperature at the end of the main wash was measured at 120 degrees. The main wash is not quite 30 minutes long.

It does call for 140 water, I was hoping to see the water get a little warmer by the end of the wash but it is what it is. I usually used the power scrub cycle in my Bosch which provided a 165 Degree wash. I’m learning to use the super racks, the upper rack is very spacious.

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Well there is a closeup of the timing diagram...I’m not the best at reading one of these but it looks like the heater is on for most of the main wash.

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Without the extender I'm counting a 9 minute main wash. Assuming the extender prolongs the wash time by a factor of 3 that would be 27 minutes of main wash. 5 1/2 minute final rinse, with the extender about 16 1/2 minutes.

Considering your fills are over 2 gallons (more water to heat) I'd raise the temp on your water heater.
 
Several potscrubber heating elements I have tested

Came in pretty close to 500 watts. I remember reading in an appliance for him sometime in the late 1980s that general electric had decided to de-rate the elements down to prevent damage to the plastic liner.
Given that this is a purely resistive load I think ohm's law will work quite well enough for it even though it is an AC measurement.
I'm getting pretty consistently 29.x-31.x Ohm's and at our 124VAC (that's pretty steady) we're around 500W.
 
GE Pots-Scrubber 3

Hi Mark, Reply #45, I had not noticed that 3 Amp draw on the name tag, We have almost the identical DW in our wall of DWs at the museum and ours lists the heater draw at 6 Amps, total draw at 9 Amps with the motor Amps being listed at 5 Amps, it does not add up,  and on this DW the heater is listed at 3  Amps and the motor at 5 Amps yet again GE says this adds up to 7 Amps even though for nearly 1/2 the cycle both the motor and heater are both running together.

 

I think WE need to do some real testing.

 

Someone said something about inlet valves and float switches failing on US DWs.

 

Inlet valves will wear out-fail on almost all DWs if they last long enough otherwise between 5 and 20 + years.

 

Float Switches will NEVER fail in over 99% of DWs even if the DW lasts more than 30+ years, a FS is a safety overfill device on US DWs and even though it can cycle thousands of times without wear the great majority of DWs will never have the FS cycle even once in the operating life of the machine.

 

The only thing I have ever seen make a FS fail is if water leaks on it or into it long enough for it to corrode and fail.

 

John L.
 
More testing...

Dropped down to Menards and purchased a Kill a Watt meter. Dropped the timer into the dry cycle with heated dry engaged and looked at the measurements...3.42 amps and 409 watts. Will have to take measurements next time I run it through a full cycle. In my opinion, since this was designed for 140 degree water the heater is more to maintain the temperature and not raise it.

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Heater Power

Well that certainly clears that one up, Cameron!  Very useful gadget indeed.  

Once the dry cycle starts, I imagine the heater's power draw will begin to drop as it heats up and its resistance increases.  Whereas when it's heating the water it should continue to keep drawing the higher amount.
 
@marky_mark: spot on! That would be my theory as well.

I'd take the current draw during or right after the main wash fill has ended to take the motor into account, then the reading several minutes into the main-wash to get both of the motor and heater running together. Subtract the motor from that number and you'll get the heater wattage. Watts setting (not VA) can also get the job done.
 
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