Report states we are all covered in s---- fecal matter....

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Not Really:

I don't want to drag this off too much, but I recommend you read Richard White's Book "Smoke-Screens: The Truth About Tobacco." There are over 200 references in that book, many of which I visited myself (Including FORCES or FOREST). There are several other publications that analyse the data from the last 100 years or so in the way this book does, although I haven't had time to deal those publications myself. 

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www.forces.org

Personally, I can tell you that I too believed that smoking was a deadly habit. This book changed my opinions, as it showed me how facts have been distorted and taken out of context to fit the opinions of researchers. The involvement of the drug industry and 5% effective smoking-cessation products has not helped this case. The other worrying facts are those of what the Government will target once they are "done with" smoking. Right now, Smokers are demonised in society (Wrongly so, since they produce billions more in the tax revenue than they "cost" society - and since smoking is an inelastic good, increasing the price deters very little from smoking in the first place), but after smoking the government will head after Alcohol, Fast Food and so on. It wasn't just laundry/dishwashing detergents and our appliances that are being nannied and controlled by those who "know better."

No, I won't advocate something that is potentially bad for you (Yes, I admitted it. All the evidence in the world for either side cannot be conclusively proven) - nor will I partake in such an activity, although I understand the reasons of others for smoking - which isn't necessarily based off addiction (Smoking causes a release of Dopamine, making you feel good. People get "addicted" to feeling good... You can't blame them for that). 

 

As for the Petro-Chemicals in detergents, I don't really think that adding oils would be in anyone's interests in the laundry detergents. When you add your finger into detergent and feel that residue, that is the water softening agents in the detergents, plus the surfactants. A similar feeling is present in mechanically-softened water supplies. Washing your hands makes your hands feel "slippery," a feeling that isn't easy to remove (and is non present in regular, hard or non-softened water). This is a reaction between the Sodium Chloride present in the water you are using and the Sodium Stearate (I think) in many manufactured detergent-like soaps. 

The argument based off oil in detergent is somewhat unfounded, as even home-made soaps made for hundreds of years contained animal fats, and people still had properly-rinsed, clean bodies (and they lived a pretty long time too, considering Surgical Practice). Our hair also contains oils that one does not need or want to wash away, since this keeps our hair alive and not fraying/splitting/breaking/fall-out(ing), the same with our skin, except this helps protect us against the Sun's harmful rays, provided we don't wash the oils off so frequently they cannot buildup and do their job. 

I also have to bite at your "stiff clothes" claim - this seems to result from the higher spin speeds in washers compacting the fibres of items in the wash, as any item dried or aired in a tumble-dryer will not have this stiff feeling, as the fibres have been returned to their natural, un-compressed state. 

 

My largest gripe is the suggestion that laundry detergents create the scum buildup inside washing machines. That is incorrect. What you are referring to is perhaps fabric softeners and oils from the clothes (Body oils or not) that are not being suspended correctly in the wash water to be flushed away. Like I said previously, they will go wherever is 'easiest,' which more often than not ends up being on the outer-drum of your washer - especially in conditions where one uses only cold-water to wash their clothes. 

That is a claim that has been proven many times over before here: In cases where not enough water or water that is too cold is used (The problem is both - , your machine will buildup garbage unless you purposefully run a "Clean Washer" cycle). This issue is being compounded by "Eco-Warriors" insisting that Cold-Water washing poses no harm to them, their washers or anyone else... Well it does, especially if you ruin so many washers from this. 
 
When I wash anything that makes contact with my skin! (undergarments,socks slippers,bandanas,bathtowels,or beachtowels, I use Spray-Nine . If there's a strong odor lurking in the load,I add some Clorox Splashless chlorine bleach..Usually no more then 1/4 C.
 
It also depends on the strain of E. coli.

As already mentioned, our lower intestines normally are loaded with a beneficial strain of E. coli. It's when it gets replaced by a toxic strain of E. coli (formerly known as Shigella) that the fun starts.

Also, E. coli will not reproduce on clean laundry left in the washer. It requires a food source to multiply, and cotton, wool, or other common clothing fibers are not a food source for E. coli.
 
Washing machines and bugs

I found this article interesting. I have just been reading it now.

Doesn't seem like our machines will ever get things sterile ;)

The article is from Which? (to US folks - this is UK equivalent of Consumer Reports I think)

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www.which.co.uk
 
what a SH...!

Goodness, gents..

I did not even take the time to go through all of these postings, but hey: Just the fact that the first one (fear provoking one) is written in red and the major keywords blue and underlined: This is proof of a substantial rainbow press fearmongering.

We live in times of most hygienic laundering ever, still those corporations and fashion queens tell us not to be at ease with ourselves but to be terrorized and agonized by so-called "germs". Contradictory enough: Most of all people enjoy a good and decent making out (or even juicier than that) - still there is this irrational fear of "yeeeks-yikes-OMG" panic.

Now can it be more schizophrenic? I for my part consider this thread as closed, no matter what may come from there in the future.
*headshakes over here in sheer disbelief*

PS: Kids that are not digging in sand/dirt/grit will be pansies in grown-up age. (Prussian proverb, my grandma told it to me).
 
Geezus, when I learned laundry (in 1954) it was just hot water and a scoop of detergent. And nobody in my house ever went to hospital as a result of laundry. Or any other cause.

C'mon people, it didn't kill you when you took it off, did it? Why would it kill you after you wash it and put it back on? We're not talking about corporate beef (EC 0157:H7) or chicken (salmonella, which also lives in your nose). You're not going to EAT your clothes. And even so, your dryer likely 'cooks' them to an internal temp of 165F. So you COULD eat them and they STILL wouldn't hurt you.

In hospital, laundry might come from someone with MERSA so yes that has to be sterilized. If someone in your home laundrysphere had MERSA, you would know it. So why wash as if they did when you're 99.6% certain that they don't?
 
Hospital laundry needs to go into a bucket of disinfectant solution before it gets anywhere near the washing machine.

That's how we treated laundry that came back from my granny when she was in hospital. Just had a big deep container with a lid and any items got 2 hours of soaking in disinfectant solution then into a normal wash with a prewash cycle selected to pre-rinse them.

Hospital laundry is a totally different problem due to the high risk of MSRA and a couple of other antibiotic resistant nasties!
 
Yet home launderers--characteristically in Europe--seem compelled toward hospital standards--"boil wash"--when it's extremely expensive (EU has VERY high electric rates) and the necessity is seldom indicated by circumstance.

Not to say anyone is dis-entitled to launder as they see fit. They most certainly are. Some are driven by practicality, others by obsession, others in between. I've got an obsessive streak myself and nobody is going to talk me out of it.
 
Generally I believe it`s a good thing to get in touch with "some" dirt to build up (and keep up) immune system.
The constant use of disinfectants in private homes is usually considered more harm than good. Personally I don`t see the point to use antibacterial wipes or antibacterial hand soap and so on in my home.
Also I`ve never heard of someone getting a serious disease from poorly washed clothes.
I even skip the deodorant more often, after all I take a shower every day and I find a little body odor very sexy as long as it`s not too pronounced.

But everyone who has ever experienced funky smells in his clean clothes will probably agree that laundry hygiene is important. Complaints about freshly laundered clothes that smell like vomit after only a few hours of wearing are frequently found in German houshold internet forums.
I think we change clothes more often than ever before, but thanks to low temp washing, the advent of color care detergents and since ironing is widely out of fashion nowadays, laundry hygiene has become much worse in the last 30 years.
 
formula for ?

Rusty; I don't understand, how much baking soda do you use per wash. Is it one 6 oz dose initally followed by another, with the white vinegar in the softener? Also, what's the mixture of baking soda and vinegar for shampoo. I also use the vinegar 2 oz with 2 oz of water in the softener and try to line dry. The softener is just chemicals residue that remains in the fabric making it feel "soft". For detergent I agree, the chemicals are very bad for you and leave a residue that is absorbed thru the skin. Many people in my neighborhood and at work are getting cancer. Why is this? Absorbtion of chemicals thru the skin and lungs. I believe you are 100% correct in trying to avoid these things and hopefully in the future, people will realize this. les
 
formulas

We've all read about what a miracle Baking soda is.  And I've experienced that myself.  One of the secrets is to simply let stuff soak in it.  Vinegar helps too.

 

Apply this thinking to laundry, your hair, your teeth, your body, etc.

 

I've made baking soda and vinegar "on tap" if you will, in my home.  Vinegar works to sterilize, like bleach, though it takes longer, but it isn't toxic.   

 

For Laundry-

one to two 16 oz. boxes.  depends on size of load, what your washing, and how oily and dirty it is.

 

Lets say I'm washings sheets(fitted, flat, two cases, maybe some under garments).  I'll load half, empty a full box spreading it around, then load the rest. Start the washer.

After it has started tumbling and the water has flowed, diluting the soda, push pause. Ideally you want  everything to be in contact with the solution and not be diluted with too much water.

 

After the soak 30-45 minutes, restart, the washer may continue to fill with water to fulfill it's weight calculations.  After I'm confident its done filling OR while it is going through the first drain/spin, add about 8 oz. of soda to the detergent dispenser and fill the softner dispenser all the way up (about 8 oz. ) with white vinegar.  Let it complete the cycle.  Hang clothes to dry.

 

With more fragile and lighter soil clothes, I wouldn't do the second batch of soda and I may only soak for 1/2 hour.

 

Hair solution-

I have an old spray bottle that the sprayer broke.  This works perfect.  Fill half way with hot water.  Use the funnel and put about 1/4 cup of baking soda in.  Shake. 

The solution should be thicker, a diluted milky white.  The baking soda should be so concentrated that it all does not dilute in the water so that if you let the bottle sit after a few minutes, the soda will settle to the bottom, as you  may see in the picture.

 

You mix like this each time your going to clean your hair.  Now, you may not need as much.  I have a full head of thick hair and a full beard, which is just as much hair.  I always use up almost all of the solution each time.

 

The trick is the amount of time that the solution is in contact with your hair.  I kneel and rest my upper chest on the bath tub.  With your head over the tub simply (DO NOT get your hair wet first) pour bits at a time onto your dry hair and beard.  Pour with the right hand and rub in with the left, or vice versa until everything is saturated.  The solution will be gritty and kind of feel like sand, but it will be warm.  If it gets in your eyes it won't sting, but it will be a typical annoying. 

 

If your going to take a shower, I simply stand and get in the shower, not rinsing your hair until after you've cleaned your body.

 

If you're only washing your hair, just set there for a few minutes, with the weight of your upper body on the side of the tub.  This is when the solution is doing its thing.  You don't need to rub it around or anything.  Then simply rinse. 

Turn off the water, take the Apple vinegar in spray bottle and thoroughly spray your hair, rub it in a bit, and rinse.  Comb the water out, and dry.

 

Now, when I was using shampoo (Paul Mitchel Awapuhi), I would have to wash my hair everyday.  The process of sleeping would make my hair squished and matted.

NOW, when I get up, my hair is lighter, sometimes all I need to do is comb it and it falls in place.

 

For body wash-   (I am very conscious of water usage and only turn water on in shower to rinse off)

You can make a milder solution, similar to the hair where the baking soda DOES dilute.  With that you would NOT get wet FIRST, simply pour the solution all over your body, rub it in, use a wet wash cloth (I run it under hot water) and gentle go over your skin.  Rinse.  FYI- baking soda on skin can be abrasive. I don't use that every day.  I usually use oatmeal soap.

 

I use the apple vinegar spray on my body in key areas, after the first rinse.   under arms, body hair, groin, lower back side, toes, ears, etc.  Finish with a nice, slow flow, warm water rinse. 

 

I always used baking soda before but not as much as I do now. 

I no longer buy laundry detergent, shampoo, body wash, tooth paste, deodorant (allergic), spray cleaners, or fabric softener. 

Instead I buy 16 oz boxes of Baking soda, usually a dozen at a time, large bottles of white and Apple Vinegar.

A dozen boxes  and the bottles of vinegar last about a month.

 

 

Pic- container for baking soda, funnel on wall, spray bottle for white vinegar ( I have several, also have one in the shower for Apple vinegar), old plastic bottle for mixing hair solution.

 

[this post was last edited: 11/15/2013-00:40]

rustyspaatz++11-15-2013-00-04-7.jpg
 
Shocking

What ?!

"Many people in my neighborhood and at work are getting cancer. Why is this? Absorbtion of chemicals thru the skin and lungs."

 

Yes, When you are putting petro chemicals in your clothing during wash, when ever you wear those clothes, your wearing and absorbing the chemicals.  Even if you sleep naked, like I do, your sleeping on sheets that have been washed in?

 

Like I said, my Rosacea went away after I ditched the shampoo.  That was awesome.  My nose and forehead was always red and peeling.

 

 

I'm not joking sel8207 (if that's your real name), like what? You just stand around the water cooler talking about all the people who have got cancer?

 

Like its the latest trend?  "Oh yeah, I got an Iphone, new toaster, and CANCER, how about you?"

 

If you know that many people who have issues.... It kind of reminds me of the Love Canal in the late 1970s.  (video fast forward 8:40) After one of the residents started talking to her neighbors, she found that almost ALL of them had suffered chronic health issues. 

Something was certainly up.

 

FYI- Using Baking soda is recommended by the U.S. Department of Defense for people who have been exposed to radiation.  Leaving the Baking soda solution on your skin for XXX amount of time helps to neutralize the effects of radiation. 

 

I feel good about that as the health affects of the Fukushima disaster are only starting.  And what disaster will be coming next?

We have one Nuclear power plant left in California, none in Oregon, so that's good.  Not all people are as fortunate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
An alkalai like sodium bicarbonate can indeed saponify body fat soils, turn them into a crude soap and thus rinse them away. But as a cosmetic chemist (that's what the "arbilab" was originally, years before it was a screenname) I must tell you that the saponification reaction is pretty fussy. It wants one molecular hook of alkalai for every molecular hook of fat, and a specific temperature at which to bind them. This can be calculated for triethanolamine stearate, but NOT for body soil in a laundry load. Oh, the temperature is in the neighborhood of 160F. If you're under that, "soda" washing hasn't a chance of working.
 
Baking soda/Sodium Bicarbonate

Residue is actually the purpose of using laundry sours (an acid) in the final rinse. When washing soda is used as a builder for washing IIRC it breaks down into baking soda, that is what causes all sorts of problems including hard and scratchy laundry. If you do washing with liquid detergents you notice things feel softer even without fabric conditioners, that is because liquid detergents do not use washing soda or other alkalis in large amounts as builders. Some do contain borax and maybe soap but in low amounts and the overall product is still rather mild.

Before the Solvay process was invented to produce soda ash cheaply and in mass amounts, ashes from wood and plants were used for laundry as well as for soap making. Housewives and others would save the ashes from wood fires used for cooking and heating.

The traditional French method for laundry would be to first place the washing in a type of tub or barrel. Then ashes would be placed on top and water slowly poured over. As the water passed down the washing the alkaline substances from ashes would go to work. The water was then collected/drained from the bottom and the whole process repeated for a period of time. This "pre-soaking" while often destructive to textiles in the long run, was much less so than the harsh beating or whatever treatment otherwise employed to loosen soils and oils from fabrics.

As stated previously by another poster, all alkalis combined with fats produce a type of soap. That is how washing soda, baking soda, TSP and other alkaline substances clean. When use lye to open drains clogged with grease/fats again it is the same reaction.

Once soda ash came along persons could stop the drenching with ashes and simply soak washing in solutions containing the stuff. This would "break" fats/soils from textiles

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en.wikipedia.org
 
arbilab

"but NOT for body soil in a laundry load. Oh, the temperature is in the neighborhood of 160F. If you're under that, "soda" washing hasn't a chance of working. "

It DOES work...
and my water heater is around 130.
What's interesting too, is that stains that weren't coming out, that I thought were permanent, with the old oily detergents, came out with the baking soda.
 
Germs in the machine

My old frogeye set from 1955,Iwash with 180 degrees,but it doesnt have a warm water rinse,or hot.The machines both have ultra-violet lights in them.I figure if that and reg tide and a small scoop of Oxy-clean doesnt do the job,then the germs or mold which I have never had a problem with are alien and I better look behind the garage for a flying saucer.I wash the dogs towels and bedding with Dreft,and he seems fine,so I must be doing something right! My laundry never smells sour or whatever.I do always leave the lid up on the washer for a couple of hours after my wash is done,I also think thats one of the keys to having no problems with mold.I doubt many folks do this especially with front-loaders.I also after every wash wipe the machine down inside to dry what I can see and the lip of the top and lid.Doesnt take but a minute.I lok at some of the machines at thrift shops and the Restore store,they are so nasty!!!!!! It wouldnt take anytime to wipe them down with 409 or clorox and people buy them like that. Bobby
 
retromania-

"Absolutely no comment! "

Can you comment on your overt expression of your intent not to comment?
 

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