norgeway
Well-known member
If this was closer I would RUN to get it, you could use this 50 more years! A Mueller Climatrol from the mid 50s, I bet it weighs 500 pounds!
Speaking of OLD furnaces
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norgeway
Well-known member
There were
A few of these in my hometown, I used to service one that was in a cabinet shop, it had been in a house for many years, then moved to the cabinet shop, it was a really fine product, QUIET!!!! every piece was quality, if I had time and money to drive that far I would grab that thing in a heartbeat, all these lies being told by HVAC contractors about how inefficient the old furnaces were are just that,,LIES!..when you factor in how much longer the old furnaces last and how much more expensive it is to fix the new stuff,you can see how much you REALLY spend...true, some of the new furnaces use less oil, but if cleaned and properly adjusted,the old ones will consistently give 80 percent efficiency ratings.I know because I have a Bacharach built Texaco Fuel Chief oil burner test kit, the readings don't lie,
A few of these in my hometown, I used to service one that was in a cabinet shop, it had been in a house for many years, then moved to the cabinet shop, it was a really fine product, QUIET!!!! every piece was quality, if I had time and money to drive that far I would grab that thing in a heartbeat, all these lies being told by HVAC contractors about how inefficient the old furnaces were are just that,,LIES!..when you factor in how much longer the old furnaces last and how much more expensive it is to fix the new stuff,you can see how much you REALLY spend...true, some of the new furnaces use less oil, but if cleaned and properly adjusted,the old ones will consistently give 80 percent efficiency ratings.I know because I have a Bacharach built Texaco Fuel Chief oil burner test kit, the readings don't lie,
My home has a 35 year old gas forced air furnace (circa 1980) in the crawl. Still going strong. No CO leaks.
My parents house in Eagle Rock has the original natural gas forced air furnace sitting in its basement and they still use it every winter. I recall once when I was a kid some part of the control started acting up and my dad had a tech out to have a look. The guy told him the furnace was too old and not worth fixing, so my dad thanked him for his time and showed him out. Then he fixed it himself and it's been working trouble free ever since. Still, due to its age they keep carbon monoxide detectors in the house just in case.
norgeway
Well-known member
As far as
The burners themselves, the Beckett is by far the most popular, the new thing is the Reillo, it is, according to everything I have read, the cleanest burning unit out there, I have no personal experience with one though, I worked on Becketts in the 89s and 90s when they were the latest things, they are all ok, same goes for a Wayne or Carlin, but personally I still would rather have a old unit, mainly because of the quieter operation, the old burners ran at 1725 rpm, the new ones at 3450 rpm,of course the manufacturers claim all sorts of savings by changing to one of the so called "Flame Retention" burners,which all the new ones are, basically flame retention is the design of the nose cone, which is the front of the burner where the nozzle is, and where the flame burns, the nose cone on them is designed with smaller slots to increase the velocity and turbulence of the combustion air in such a way that the flame burns in a smaller area at a hotter temperature, I personally think it was to make smaller combustion chambers practical as the more compact flame pattern is great for this...this means less metal can be used in the furnace, also , a pump and motor running at about twice the speed will of course wear out faster and that means more money for the manufacturer...as far as hot air furnaces go, their is not but 2 on the market I would consider, and they are OLD OLD OLD designs that have not been cheapened, first choice would be a Thermo Pride, second a Hallmark, basically ,other than the burners and combustion chamber, they are the same exact furnace that they made 50 years ago, identical heat exchanger, cabinet etc, and the main thing is you can order whichever burner you want on the Thermo Pride, AND you can still get a belt drive blower which to me is still the best way to go, I despise a direct drive blower, they are noisy and much harder to clean..as for boilers..your guess is as good as mine..I will say I want to see a Reillo burner, they really look interesting, but down here no one knows anything about them, so it would not be advisable to get one unless you had a good dealer service network.
The burners themselves, the Beckett is by far the most popular, the new thing is the Reillo, it is, according to everything I have read, the cleanest burning unit out there, I have no personal experience with one though, I worked on Becketts in the 89s and 90s when they were the latest things, they are all ok, same goes for a Wayne or Carlin, but personally I still would rather have a old unit, mainly because of the quieter operation, the old burners ran at 1725 rpm, the new ones at 3450 rpm,of course the manufacturers claim all sorts of savings by changing to one of the so called "Flame Retention" burners,which all the new ones are, basically flame retention is the design of the nose cone, which is the front of the burner where the nozzle is, and where the flame burns, the nose cone on them is designed with smaller slots to increase the velocity and turbulence of the combustion air in such a way that the flame burns in a smaller area at a hotter temperature, I personally think it was to make smaller combustion chambers practical as the more compact flame pattern is great for this...this means less metal can be used in the furnace, also , a pump and motor running at about twice the speed will of course wear out faster and that means more money for the manufacturer...as far as hot air furnaces go, their is not but 2 on the market I would consider, and they are OLD OLD OLD designs that have not been cheapened, first choice would be a Thermo Pride, second a Hallmark, basically ,other than the burners and combustion chamber, they are the same exact furnace that they made 50 years ago, identical heat exchanger, cabinet etc, and the main thing is you can order whichever burner you want on the Thermo Pride, AND you can still get a belt drive blower which to me is still the best way to go, I despise a direct drive blower, they are noisy and much harder to clean..as for boilers..your guess is as good as mine..I will say I want to see a Reillo burner, they really look interesting, but down here no one knows anything about them, so it would not be advisable to get one unless you had a good dealer service network.
firedome
Well-known member
as far as a Nat Gas furnace goes...
I have no complaints about the 60 yr old Williamson hot air natural gas unit that is original to our 1955 house that still looks like new and works perfectly! We bought a 3 yr old Sears Hi-Efficiency Condensing furnace from a guy converting to oil (!) about 10 yrs ago thinking that old Willie would need replacing soon, but so far it's proved us wrong, and now I'm inclined to just repair it when it needs it!
One pet peeve in newer installations is the crappy cheap "aluminum foil" so called ductwork being used these days, our old furnace delivers its hot air through large and heavy gauge galvanized custom-made ductwork made to last forever, and easily cleaned out when required. Just one more example of Old is Better!
I have no complaints about the 60 yr old Williamson hot air natural gas unit that is original to our 1955 house that still looks like new and works perfectly! We bought a 3 yr old Sears Hi-Efficiency Condensing furnace from a guy converting to oil (!) about 10 yrs ago thinking that old Willie would need replacing soon, but so far it's proved us wrong, and now I'm inclined to just repair it when it needs it!
One pet peeve in newer installations is the crappy cheap "aluminum foil" so called ductwork being used these days, our old furnace delivers its hot air through large and heavy gauge galvanized custom-made ductwork made to last forever, and easily cleaned out when required. Just one more example of Old is Better!
Does anyone remember the GE oil furnaces that were sort of gently oval or round and had, I think, a gray steel cabinet with a red stripe or maybe it was just the red GE badge on the front? I remember a couple of homes in Decatur with oil heat that had one of these, but I was very young when I saw them so I don't know much about them except that I thought they were beautiful. I understand that the burner fired down into the combustion chamber. I don't know if these were boilers for hydronic heating or if they were for forced air.
My next door neighbors growing up had one of those GE oil furnaces. They had radiators, so I believe it was a hot water system although I never saw inside the outside cabinet. I never recall seeing a service truck in their driveway other than for the once a year maintainance.
lordkenmore
Well-known member
I despise a direct drive blower, they are noisy
"He may be right," Lord Kenmore thinks, as he listens what is either a jackhammer running in his hall, or else the is furnace running...
"He may be right," Lord Kenmore thinks, as he listens what is either a jackhammer running in his hall, or else the is furnace running...
lordkenmore
Well-known member
I've been wondering something about oil furnaces...
Do oil furnaces start up like a gas furnace does: lighting the burner, and letting the heat exchanger warm up before starting the blower? Or does the blower start when the furnace is cold?
Do oil furnaces start up like a gas furnace does: lighting the burner, and letting the heat exchanger warm up before starting the blower? Or does the blower start when the furnace is cold?
lordkenmore
Well-known member
And now Lord Kenmore bows his head in mourning...
for a furnace he once knew is now apparently a Toyota or something.
Recently, I've been wondering about the house I grew up in. I took a quick look at the county records web site. As suspected, the info isn't there--probably too old--but I was interested and saddened to see one permit for a new heat pump installation. So Ye Olde Faithful Wesco electric is presumably No More.
It would be interesting to find out if there was any thought of using oil. The house was heated with oil originally, and the original furnace was still in place when we sold the house. The buyer commented it would never be run again, because it was too hard to get to for servicing. That said, I know I'd be tempted to consider bringing it back to life, vs. coughing up thousands and thousands for a heat pump that might last ten years if you're lucky.
for a furnace he once knew is now apparently a Toyota or something.
Recently, I've been wondering about the house I grew up in. I took a quick look at the county records web site. As suspected, the info isn't there--probably too old--but I was interested and saddened to see one permit for a new heat pump installation. So Ye Olde Faithful Wesco electric is presumably No More.
It would be interesting to find out if there was any thought of using oil. The house was heated with oil originally, and the original furnace was still in place when we sold the house. The buyer commented it would never be run again, because it was too hard to get to for servicing. That said, I know I'd be tempted to consider bringing it back to life, vs. coughing up thousands and thousands for a heat pump that might last ten years if you're lucky.
Yes, oil hot air furnaces cycle the same way. Burner comes on, when temperature in heat exchanger is right, blower cycles on. Burner cycles off when high limit signals it to and blower continues to circulate warm air, shuts off and the whole cycle starts over again when thermostat calls for more heat.
norgeway
Well-known member
GE Oil Furnace
That was the most technologically advanced system ever ,it was a high efficiency unit before anyone knew what it was!!Theit had oil burner was a low pressure burner, I would have to write a book to explain it, but it was completely different from all other burners, the burner did fire downward, and the flue pipe came out at the floor level.and it burned with a quiet very clean fire, almost silent running.
That was the most technologically advanced system ever ,it was a high efficiency unit before anyone knew what it was!!Theit had oil burner was a low pressure burner, I would have to write a book to explain it, but it was completely different from all other burners, the burner did fire downward, and the flue pipe came out at the floor level.and it burned with a quiet very clean fire, almost silent running.
The oil furnace in my childhood home was a gravity flow. No forced air fan in the works. So it was very quiet, and sometimes the only clue that it came on would be a slight whiff of heating oil in the house (after which my Dad would be down in the basement cleaning out the burner area). As I recall, the furnace was big, green, and intimidating, as was the huge (to a 10 year old) black oil tank nearby it.
And not all central gas furnace systems are forced air, either. My sister used to live in a flat in SF that had a passive gas fired system. The mice loved it.
And not all central gas furnace systems are forced air, either. My sister used to live in a flat in SF that had a passive gas fired system. The mice loved it.
Thanks for the answers
Would the GE design work with gas or was it strictly for oil? Were they post-war models or older than that? Thinking back, I guess I did not see duct-work coming out of them so they had to be hydronic. Did they also run a coil to heat water or did GE want people to use an electric water heater? They had such a clean, modern look, it was hard to believe that they were not brand new in the mid to late 50s.
Would the GE design work with gas or was it strictly for oil? Were they post-war models or older than that? Thinking back, I guess I did not see duct-work coming out of them so they had to be hydronic. Did they also run a coil to heat water or did GE want people to use an electric water heater? They had such a clean, modern look, it was hard to believe that they were not brand new in the mid to late 50s.
GE HVAC equipment
See below for catalog of GE products from 1948.
Archive.org has lots of info on HVAC equipment from the 30's thru 60's. And yes, central air conditioning (heating & cooling) was available by the mid 30's.
See below for catalog of GE products from 1948.
Archive.org has lots of info on HVAC equipment from the 30's thru 60's. And yes, central air conditioning (heating & cooling) was available by the mid 30's.
Hans,
Any opinion on the best new gas fired units for baseboard hot water heating?
The oil fired Thatcher in my Mom's house is great but if they ever extend the gas lines up the road I would convert simply to eliminate the in-ground oil tank liability issues and the high cost of fuel oil.
Even with crude oil prices down 50% fuel oil is still up around $2.55 gal in N.J. albeit down from $3.50+ last winter. It would be cheaper to heat the house with gasoline at $2.03 gal.
Any opinion on the best new gas fired units for baseboard hot water heating?
The oil fired Thatcher in my Mom's house is great but if they ever extend the gas lines up the road I would convert simply to eliminate the in-ground oil tank liability issues and the high cost of fuel oil.
Even with crude oil prices down 50% fuel oil is still up around $2.55 gal in N.J. albeit down from $3.50+ last winter. It would be cheaper to heat the house with gasoline at $2.03 gal.
