Suds saver question

[lordkenmore]

One of my washer dreams is to have suds saver. This might be my Inner Cheapskate. Or this might just be memories of my grandmother's suds saver. Her washer intrigued me--maybe my Inner Cheapskate got an early start.

Grandma's washer intrigued me enough to ask my mother why we didn't have that on our Kenmore. My mother patiently explained that we didn't have a wash tub to store wash water when the machine was bought. Furthermore, she found the concept of saving wash water revolting.

Recently, I've been wondering how valid my mother's view is. Part of me thinks that yes, there could be germs or something would get saved and cycled through the next load. Another part of me thinks there is probably no real issue, at least with most loads. After all, people used suds saver systems (and wringer systems) for years, with no apparent trouble I've heard about.

I'm wondering what view others take here about saving/reusing wash water: Perfectly Fine? Or Perfectly Revolting?

 

[launderess]

Yes, one reason for the demise of wringers, twin tubs,

Along with sud saving machines was the "ewwwwww" factor of reusing wash water.

Once most every home had indoor plumbing especially of hot water the need to reuse wash water to "save" (energy and or time) was lessened to nil. Then you had fully automatic washers coming down in price points or failing that there was always credit or second hand.

Many automatic washer makers touted in their adverts that their machines (without suds savers obviously) washed one's laundry in *fresh* clean water.

The other factor even with fully automatic suds savers was more and more homes going with drain pipes instead of sinks for washing machines. Some of this came from the movement to get laundries out of basements or other out of the way areas of the house. Think Carol Brady's laundry room off the kitchen which IIRC didn't have a sink.

 

[arbilab]

I suds save with my twinnie, just like Grandma did with her Easy. Ya just wash the least groady stuff first and the most groady last and replace the suds when they show groad clog.

But you have to like, pay attention and think. Far fewer householders are able/willing to do those these days. How the marketers figure to get them sorting all that newfangled computer mumbojumbo, I'll never know.

What again is the distinction among steam/boil/sanitize? OCD about washing as I am, I just couldn't be bothered. Some evidence suggests most users deploy only 2 out of 2 dozen cycles. Roughly the same proportion of cable channels you get to those you watch.

 

[tomturbomatic]

Suds saving devices were an appeal to the thriftiness of wringer washer users who were used to doing a washday's worth of laundry in one tub of water. Often the water for washing in a wringer was heated separately from the domestic hot water supply which was often marginal and not really up to the demands of an automatic washer so sudssavers helped make possible ownership of an automatic without revamping the hot water supply in a house. You might remember that some early dishwashers heated their own water for this reason. Sudssavers continued to appeal to owners of electric water heaters as a cost saving measure. As younger people moved into the ranks of owners of automatic washers, the memory of using the wringer washer and conserving water with a sudssaver faded except among those with wells or expensive water heating and the demand diminished.

As for the ickiness factor, there did not seem to be one when the washing was started with near boiling water for the whites and kitchen linens. The water was still good and hot by the time underwear and towels were washed and about a half cup of detergent was added with each additional load to keep soil in suspension. Diapers were washed separately.

One way to save suds without a tub is to just have another automatic and drain the suds into the second machine. Actually, Sears used to sell portable laundry tubs, probably mostly for wringer washers, but my parents bought one when we moved to Georgia with our Kenmore sudsaver. The square tub had a cover and was on wheels. It had a drain valve on the bottom for emptying if you forgot and let the last load's wash water drain into the tub. That was not so much of a problem with machines like Maytags and GEs that allowed the user to select whether to save or drain the wash water.

One other thing about using a washer with a sudsaver was that it was similar to using a wringer washer in that it sort of depended on most, if not all, of the laundry being done in one operation over a few hours, like the traditional laundry day. With the advent of automatic washers and dryers, laundry could be done when it was convenient, a load here and a load there. Washing did not have to depend on a day with sunshine for hanging laundry outside to dry so loads were washed when it was convenient and not all at once.

 

[e2l-arry]

Septic systems were also a reason for suds savers. You put far less wash water in them preventing puddles of water from an overfilled septic tank in your yard.

Both of my Mom's automatics, a 1952 Kenmore and a 1965 Maytag Highlander had suds returns. They can be very practical if used with common sense. Of course you had to wash in order of the soil level of the clothes.

For almost 3 years now I've been using a Maytag E2LP wringer and wash 3 to maybe 5 loads with the same wash water. Sheets, whites, towels, jeans and so on. I like to think I'm using the same amount of water, or less, than my Sears Kenmore front loader. And yes, I can do a week's worth of laundry in about 1 hour as a bonus!

 

[yogitunes]

we visit 'back home' where my parents are from, South West Pennsylvania......and even today, the standard is a wringer washer in many of the older generation homes....if the home setup was a bit modern, you would see a sudssaver in use....there could be a wringer, yet an automatic dryer....

this is daily life for them, I had a blast visiting, like a step back in time, daily chores of weeding the vegetable garden, collecting eggs, milking the cows, banking the coal furnace.....

if anything, this was down home cooking at its best....

my only issue for sudssaving by an automatic was the water cooling down before the next load, while waiting for the rinse and spins to complete.....the advantage, yet labor involved, was with a wringer, you could wash load after load quickly....

interesting to watch people in their own methods for washing clothes.......

we have members who use wringers or twintubs as daily drivers.....and we have all played with them at one point or time, just to get a feel of what it would have been like........but what you can't imagine is throwing yourself back in time....we have the mentality to play with this, knowing we can go back to our automatic lives....but if you had only a wringer to wash clothes, heating the water on stoves, carrying buckets of water, plus hanging clothes on a line, and then iron on top of all of that......if you had no choice, outside of pounding clothes on a rock....that Ewwwwww! factor would be thrown out the window....

but all in all......there are times, it seems a waste to heat all that water, detergent and bleach.....for a one use 12 minute wash, and then throw it all away......how brilliant are we?.....when our grandmothers would wash clothes, that waste water would wash down the back porch, and the rinse water would water the garden.....makes you think doesn't it?....sometimes I would like to go back to a simpler way of life....

sorry for the long post....but interesting, you hear of water restrictions, and people re-using their dishwater or shower water to water their lawns and such......given a no win option, people will reserve to suds saving....

odd that these are not still on the market, curious to see how many people would still use them if given a chance.....almost any automatic can be a sudssaver.....but it may require some user input....

I rather re-use hot wash water than wash a single load in COLD water only by an automatic......talk about an EWWWWW factor!

the biggest thing talked about today is grey water re-use/repurpose......just another form of suds saving...

people are even setting up huge barrels under their downspouts to repurpose rain water....

 

[frigilux]

I grew up with a suds-saving 1960 Kenmore (Model 80) so reusing wash water seems perfectly normal to me. Obviously one wouldn't reuse water from a load of diapers or filthy household rugs. As noted by others, my mom would also wash the first load in hot water. As most of our laundry was lightly soiled, she'd sometimes do three loads with the same wash water. We were never sick and clothes were very clean.

Suds-savers made washers HE decades before the term came into general use.

 

[arbilab]

HE decades before the term.......

Also meant Hardly Effective.

Even Grandma (SW PA) eventually scrapped the Easy for a full auto. By then it was down to only her and in her 70s deserved to have things easier, short of having someone come in and do it.

I'm almost her age now. But the twinnie is still practical for me. Yeh it takes a 3-hour committment every couple weeks. But to get the job done right in the coinops downstairs would take the same time and cost much more, running 2 or more cycles each. Then paying double for the dryer, as coinop Maytags don't spin worth flop.

 

[yogitunes]

theres a bunch of variables, and areas of concern for many people of how they would save resources....and an automatic washer is a big one.....its just a matter of people's perspectives...

from the amount of water, to heating it, to disposing of it......

many times, these factors can change your whole perspective of considering a sudssaver machine, or a HE version.....

there are people who have no choice, but to use what is given them, or their options......

and I don't want to leave it just to homeowners, renters too, any extra cost is figured into your rent.......but if you had to pay for water, or sewer seperately.....you would be looking for ways to conserve as much as possible.....

its Summer, does your A/C recirculate interior air?, or pull in fresh from outside, cool it, blow it through the house, and then exhaust it back outside.....funny how people will consider one thing, but not another....

I know when we rented, if your water consumption went over the allotted amount, you were charged more for it.....people tend to think if its part of the rent, they abuse the heck out of it, mind you, that is factored in.....

any time you have your septic pumped out, the guy always ask if you have an automatic washer?, and is it directed someplace else?.....automatics, especially traditional TLers, will kill a septic tank....and cause you to have it pumped more frequently.....but its your money, spend it like there is no tomorrow...

I learned long ago from JohnL, to line up three machines, having one pump into the other.....start out with lights, darks, and then dogs blankets or rags.....you pay a lot for that water and heating it, make it work for you!

compare it to your car, and gas mileage....getting the most mileage from one gallon.......so, get the most mileage/use from a gallon of water!....

 

[yogitunes]

This is a great thread, by the way......

how many people here, suds save?......one way or another.....by machine?, or wringer/twintub?.....manual or automatic?

ps....coin laundries are based on 'time and money'.....you wont always get the same results as a home machine.....shorter cycles and cooler temps, and especially short final spins....yeah, their not the greatest, just something you would use while on vacation or if your machine is broken....but as daily drivers, don't see that happening, not to mention what was washed in it before you!

 

[twintubber]

My 2 cents worth.....

although I haven't used my twintubs for quite a while now, I'm planning to get back into it this very weekend.
As I showed in my videos of the twin tubs in action, here's what I do to find that "middle-ground" of fresh vs. reused water.
When I transfer the load to the spinner, I don't drain the used water back into the wash tub. I just drain it down the sink as waste water.
I then "top-up" the wash/rinse water with fresh water and some additional detergent/softener.
I figure, the water that was displaced by the clothes load is the water I DON'T want back. And topping up allows me to both freshen the water as well as reusing as much as I can.
Also, as mentioned, you do the whites and lightest soiled loads first and work your way to the darks and dirtiest in that order. Seems like common sense, but then again.....???
And like many others, I sure didn't get sick or ill or any kind of 'ewwwww factor' from my Mother reusing all that water with her Hoover twintub when I was growing up.

Oh, and Yogitunes:
"I rather re-use hot wash water than wash a single load in COLD water only by an automatic......talk about an EWWWWW factor!"

I couldn't agree with you more on that. Can't understand the North American obsession with using cold water to actually WASH clothes-YUCK!!!

 

[akronman]

Suds are great

I am a devotee of saving suds. Not for anything the dog was on, not for infant/diaper issues, but for nearly everything else, it's fine and does a great clean job.
I have 3 suds machines, I start with totally hot water and sheets/socks/undies in the Kenmore. When it discharges very hot sudsy water, I immediately suck it into the Maytag and do pants, jeans, heavy shirts, towels. When that discharges, I suck it into the GE Filter Flo and do a gentle cycle on dress shirts and work shirts, since by then the water is down to warm. EAch time I add a 1/3 dose more soap, eveything comes out wonderfully clean. With all the spray rinsing and deep rinsing, I do not feel there is an EWW ICK factor at all.

If you only have one machine and the sudsy hot water sits in the draintub for around 20 minutes until the first load is rinsed and spun, it is a different story. Now your suds are around medium warm, maybe should only be used for the second load, no further. OR how much heat and cleanliness does a small throw rug or two need? Those don't exactly get the ultimate care at my house, just run 'em thru the laundry with any old soapy water around and throw them back on the floor.

I almost never do a load of clothes without a second or third batch ready to go. But when I work on the car, and have greasy rags and clothes, when I spend half a day trying to get dog hair and dog bedding cleaned up around the house, that's a different story. Then EWW ICK for sure. GE Filter FLo, top speed, lots of soap, 15 minute wash, no saving those suds for anything.

When I roll our the Easy SPin-Drier or Hoover Twinnie, I treat it the same way. Tons of normal clothing in the same water with some soap added when needed, then the LAST things that go in are the throw rugs or dog stuff.

Very good thread, but there are folks who've never saved suds and just never will.

 

[iheartmaytag]

Several decades back

The magazine "Mother Earth News" had a DIY "water saver" you do to convert your washer.

What this system did was save the rinse water from the last load and re-use it as the wash water for the next load. When the wash drained a diverter would send the water to the drain and the rinse water would be diverted to a standing barrel for that purpose. They suggested instead of having the last water left standing after a "days wash" to use the saved water to water plants, thus preventing the water from becoming stagnant until the next wash day.

I always wanted a system like this just to divert the rinse water for plant usage during the summer months, much like one would use a rain barrel.

 

[ovrphil]

We had a suds saver once. I think my mom used the suds for other than white and delicates, but I'm truly at a loss to remember that long ago those details. But I just wanted to mention, suds savers in the 50's and early 60's in our neighborhood weren't uncommon.

If you can make it work for you, as some of the posters here (Akronman, for example, you do well), then
more power to you. We don't have a suds saver - no sink here, so I'd need another washer. Oh-oh. I might
need to reconfigure the laundry room. No. No more projects right now.

Good thread!

 

[slowspin66]

The UK washer with a suds saver

Here in the UK we are very well versed in saving hot water for re-use. The wringer and twin tub washers were the norm in the 1960s-1980s !!!!! A couple of years ago i was very very lucky to find a semi automatic top loader with a suds saving feature. The parnall spin washer is a rare find today not sure why. However this machine has a suds saving tank in the lower part of the machine along with a heater which you can re heat the water if its dropped the temperature. The Spin washer is semi automatic so you remain in control of the wash rinse and spin time. Really nice little machine and great fun. . Darren

 

[launderess]

Random findings from a Web search on "suds saving" washing machines:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=7-AFAAAAIBAJ&pg=1460,5687677&hl=en

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...nt/0905130583_1_thermostat-washing-water-leak

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20091008115855AAjeX0h

http://www.ibiblio.org/london/alternative-energy/homepower-magazine/archives/23/hp23p61.txt

 

[launderess]

Reusing Rinse Water

IIRC there are commercial washing machines that will reuse the last rinse water for the first wash. Tunnel washing machines come to mind.

 

[yogitunes]

this guy has a cool idea.....and can give you some ideas, yet stay on this same principle....

machine pumps water up, and gravity feed it back to your washer....of course may have to be monitored if you just want the wash water only saved.....but its still a good concept

and depending on your setup, this could be placed on the machine, or a stand next to it......basically its something you could do with your own ideas.....a raised laundry tub would work as well.....add in a few hoses, and maybe an overflow for safety....and your set...

 

[tomturbomatic]

During some severe droughts in years past when I was using toploaders, I used a submersible pump in a 30 gallon trash container to pump rinse water out through an unused dryer vent and onto various places in the yard.