if you can possibly save your Miele do it! I have the same w1986 and I absolutely love it. I dread the day it dies...but I still have my Asko too.
Suggested replacement for Miele W1986?
- Thread starter scottsb
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scottsb
Member
Here are photos of the other side of the motor.
I'm wondering if this dishwasher pump would fit. I don't have dimensions unfortunately, but just visually it looks very similar:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/185289031741
That's an eBay listing, but it actually appears to be available new too (cheaper somehow):
https://www.mieleusa.com/e/-drain-pump-be20b2-068-120v-60hz-4229915-p
I'm wondering if this dishwasher pump would fit. I don't have dimensions unfortunately, but just visually it looks very similar:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/185289031741
That's an eBay listing, but it actually appears to be available new too (cheaper somehow):
https://www.mieleusa.com/e/-drain-pump-be20b2-068-120v-60hz-4229915-p
As an eBay Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.
the wattage and impeller are different but it might work. The DW impeller might get linted up more easily.
richnz
Well-known member
Your old pump
Does it turn freely?
It can be taken apart by pulling off the fan part (Not the impeller end).
There are two long screws that hold it together that can be undone with pliers.
Does it turn freely?
It can be taken apart by pulling off the fan part (Not the impeller end).
There are two long screws that hold it together that can be undone with pliers.
launderess
Well-known member
"Interesting that this is a 90w pump."
Back in day Miele washer pumps ranged from 80w to 100w. Go figure...
Back in day Miele washer pumps ranged from 80w to 100w. Go figure...
scottsb
Member
richnz
Well-known member
Same problem, Miele W1986 drain pump.
I bought my W1986 in summer of 1997.
It uses the same pump, 4251170 120V/60Hz 90W.
The washer has had very light use and is in near perfect condition.
I can't believe a simple drain pump is going to obsolete a machine that is in otherwise perfect condition. Shame on you Miele.
The problem is that the bushing around the impeller shaft that seals to the bottom of the impeller housing and cleanout is very loose and leaks water around the shaft when it drains, soaking the floor. The seal between the bushing and the pump housing is fine. It's just very loose and floppy on the shaft, like a rubber grommet or o ring blew out. I've gently tried to take the impeller off the shaft, but that doesn't seem removeable and I was afraid of breaking it.
So, now I'm looking to build a Franken-pump. I want to cobble together some kind of pump from commonly available parts that will be around for years.
At this point I don't care how pretty it looks, so I'll probably cut some access panels in the sides so I don't have to flip it to work on it in the future.
I've also considered cannibalizing it for parts and selling them on e-bay. Miele lists the drain-pump on their website as selling for $238 (the very fine gray print says discontinued that you don't see until after you try to purchase it in the shopping cart.)
Such a shame. It's a beautiful piece of well engineered equipment. But the service and parts availability really stink. I'm so soured by this, I don't think I'll ever buy a Miele product again.
Has anyone else figured out how to retrofit another responsible brands pump to this washer?
I've considered finding a pump/impeller/motor that fits in to the housing and 3D printing an adapter. Anyone done this?
I bought my W1986 in summer of 1997.
It uses the same pump, 4251170 120V/60Hz 90W.
The washer has had very light use and is in near perfect condition.
I can't believe a simple drain pump is going to obsolete a machine that is in otherwise perfect condition. Shame on you Miele.
The problem is that the bushing around the impeller shaft that seals to the bottom of the impeller housing and cleanout is very loose and leaks water around the shaft when it drains, soaking the floor. The seal between the bushing and the pump housing is fine. It's just very loose and floppy on the shaft, like a rubber grommet or o ring blew out. I've gently tried to take the impeller off the shaft, but that doesn't seem removeable and I was afraid of breaking it.
So, now I'm looking to build a Franken-pump. I want to cobble together some kind of pump from commonly available parts that will be around for years.
At this point I don't care how pretty it looks, so I'll probably cut some access panels in the sides so I don't have to flip it to work on it in the future.
I've also considered cannibalizing it for parts and selling them on e-bay. Miele lists the drain-pump on their website as selling for $238 (the very fine gray print says discontinued that you don't see until after you try to purchase it in the shopping cart.)
Such a shame. It's a beautiful piece of well engineered equipment. But the service and parts availability really stink. I'm so soured by this, I don't think I'll ever buy a Miele product again.
Has anyone else figured out how to retrofit another responsible brands pump to this washer?
I've considered finding a pump/impeller/motor that fits in to the housing and 3D printing an adapter. Anyone done this?
I am curious too as I have the same washer but not the problem. I don't know what I will do when it decides to die because I love it and the fact it's a 240v machine.
launderess
Well-known member
"I can't believe a simple drain pump is going to obsolete a machine that is in otherwise perfect condition. Shame on you Miele."
As one who owns a Miele washer of older vintage than yours (and as a consequence also long deemed obsolete by Miele), can understand your feelings.
That being said leave us not be to hasty in vilifying Miele.
Production of W 1986 (and W 1926 as well IIRC) began in 08/2002 and ended in 10/2004.
Miele promises to stock parts for fifteen (15) years after an appliance model has been discontinued. That is quite impressive and almost unheard of then and certainly now in appliance industry.
By 2019 Miele was at end of 15 year period for now obsolete W 1986 thus as with rest of 19xx series no further parts would come from Germany. If one is in Europe there likely may have been various stashes of parts in warehouses, repair supply places, techs (both Miele and third party), but on this side of pond not so much.
Making matters worse for W 1986 and W1926 is Miele only produced those larger capacity washers for North American market. Thus parts may not be easily if at all found in Europe.
All of us who have older Miele washers or other appliances declared "obsolete" by Miele are in same position. Was lucky to find a spare timer for my "obsolete" Miele W 1070 to keep the old girl going. Don't know what am going to do when pump and solenoid valves go because they are all long since NLA.
As one who owns a Miele washer of older vintage than yours (and as a consequence also long deemed obsolete by Miele), can understand your feelings.
That being said leave us not be to hasty in vilifying Miele.
Production of W 1986 (and W 1926 as well IIRC) began in 08/2002 and ended in 10/2004.
Miele promises to stock parts for fifteen (15) years after an appliance model has been discontinued. That is quite impressive and almost unheard of then and certainly now in appliance industry.
By 2019 Miele was at end of 15 year period for now obsolete W 1986 thus as with rest of 19xx series no further parts would come from Germany. If one is in Europe there likely may have been various stashes of parts in warehouses, repair supply places, techs (both Miele and third party), but on this side of pond not so much.
Making matters worse for W 1986 and W1926 is Miele only produced those larger capacity washers for North American market. Thus parts may not be easily if at all found in Europe.
All of us who have older Miele washers or other appliances declared "obsolete" by Miele are in same position. Was lucky to find a spare timer for my "obsolete" Miele W 1070 to keep the old girl going. Don't know what am going to do when pump and solenoid valves go because they are all long since NLA.
The drain pump is another case I think like the timer motor on your 1070.
Fact is that the US is 60Hz vs 50Hz here. Such small synchronous motors depend their speed (and power usage) on frequency. Thus it isn't unlikely that such parts are US specific.
That goes further down the line with parts running on 120V etc.
If one was just looking for a heater or a valve (and isn't afraid of sone wire re-termination) you could with all likelihood just use any EU part. These parts only really care about voltage - and 240V and 230V are close enough to be compatible.
I think getting replacement parts for W9XX machines for such run of the mill components hasn't yet dried up over here.
Fact is that the US is 60Hz vs 50Hz here. Such small synchronous motors depend their speed (and power usage) on frequency. Thus it isn't unlikely that such parts are US specific.
That goes further down the line with parts running on 120V etc.
If one was just looking for a heater or a valve (and isn't afraid of sone wire re-termination) you could with all likelihood just use any EU part. These parts only really care about voltage - and 240V and 230V are close enough to be compatible.
I think getting replacement parts for W9XX machines for such run of the mill components hasn't yet dried up over here.
120V components in a 240 V machine
Nothing unusual about this in the US that’s one of the beauties of our power supply, most US electric ranges,my old combination, washer dryers and just about any 240 V clothes dryer in the United States have a 240 V heating elements and 120 V motors.
Typical electric range runs its clock and controls on 120 V right down to the oven lightbulb.
Electric dryers always have a 120 V motor motor, etc.
We have also fixed Miele Front load washers that had a 240 V pump by putting a 120 V pump or inlet valve in the machine when we couldn’t find it 240 V one and just rewiring and grounding the one side of the item to the neutral.
I wouldn’t get too hung up on finding a drain pump with the exact same wattage the fact that it’s a 90 W motor does not mean it’s necessarily that much stronger it might just be less efficient often times 50 or 60 W motor will do the same job it’s a matter of getting something to fit properly That I would worry about.
John
Nothing unusual about this in the US that’s one of the beauties of our power supply, most US electric ranges,my old combination, washer dryers and just about any 240 V clothes dryer in the United States have a 240 V heating elements and 120 V motors.
Typical electric range runs its clock and controls on 120 V right down to the oven lightbulb.
Electric dryers always have a 120 V motor motor, etc.
We have also fixed Miele Front load washers that had a 240 V pump by putting a 120 V pump or inlet valve in the machine when we couldn’t find it 240 V one and just rewiring and grounding the one side of the item to the neutral.
I wouldn’t get too hung up on finding a drain pump with the exact same wattage the fact that it’s a 90 W motor does not mean it’s necessarily that much stronger it might just be less efficient often times 50 or 60 W motor will do the same job it’s a matter of getting something to fit properly That I would worry about.
John
Miele 1986 drain pump solution.
Miele 1986 drain pump solution. The Miele pump is 120V. And is no longer available.
I took the pump apart and found the worn rubber seal that was leaking and made a new seal with rubber washers and superglue, and that worked for a while, except I had to take off the plastic impeller from the motor shaft to replace the seal, and it didn't want to stay on (A knurled shaft) so it would work its way loose after a few weeks washing and need to be re super glued.
So, on amazon I purchased two new pumps, one was a Miele that looked similar and the website said 120V, but when I got the part I noticed that it was 240V, but I thought I'd give it a try anyway. It fit very nicely into pump housing giving me high hopes. But, it didn't work, the motor just chattered. The new motors are NOT shaded pole (which might have worked but ran slightly higher speed at 60Hz rather than 50Hz AC.) The new motors have magnets in them, you can see it when you turn the impeller by hand and it, bumps around between positions, and I believe they are tied to 50Hz. So, don't bother trying to get them to work. And they're expensive at nearly $100 ea. (with shipping incl.)
So, I tried my backup plan. I jerry fitted an
Electrolux 137221600 Washer Drain Pump Kit by Seentech
Compatible for KENMORE Frigidaire Washer - Replaces 137108100 AP5684706 134051200 134740500 134740800 137108100 137151800
$22 with free Amazon shipping. A us part, 120V 60Hz.
The pump input is smaller than the Meile and includes it's own smaller pump housing. I cobbled together an adapter with rubber plumbing parts that snugly fit the Seentech part input and slipped on o-rings over the rubber sleeve to make up the difference. (A 1.25" mission fitting with the clamps removed and trimmed down in length to fit the Seentech.) Added little super glue to the o-rings to hold them in place. I put a little clear silicon grease on the o-rings to ease them in.
Next, the exit port of the Seentech is much bigger and longer than the Miele so I used a 1.25" mission fitting and used a 1.25" to 3/4" copper reducer (sweat) and used clear flexible nylon tubing to run it over to the where the Miele exit port is on the inside back (replacing the Miele internal hose to the back) (be sure to run it low out of the drum or better yet, up on the left side where the old hose runs, but that's tricky, there's a dampening absorber in the way).
I also capped off the old Miele exit ports on the Miele pump housing using small lengths of the same nylon tubing and 3/4" copper end caps. Used real hose clamps to tighten everything back up.
I had originally thought of just cutting a hole in the side of the cabinet and running the drain line directly out. But I think Miele primes the pump with water when it starts a wash cycle by back feeding the pump on the fill.
One final thing. The Seentech pump is a little heaver and longer and so it puts pressure on the Miele leveraged plastic pump housing part. So I used a coat hanger on the front to provide extra support for the added weight.
I spent about $300 in parts, but it would have been less than $100 if I had known exactly what to buy (bought lots of stuff to try).
Long story short, it works like a champ!
I'll post pictures when I'm back in my home state and have some time. I'll post the other part numbers too.
Miele 1986 drain pump solution. The Miele pump is 120V. And is no longer available.
I took the pump apart and found the worn rubber seal that was leaking and made a new seal with rubber washers and superglue, and that worked for a while, except I had to take off the plastic impeller from the motor shaft to replace the seal, and it didn't want to stay on (A knurled shaft) so it would work its way loose after a few weeks washing and need to be re super glued.
So, on amazon I purchased two new pumps, one was a Miele that looked similar and the website said 120V, but when I got the part I noticed that it was 240V, but I thought I'd give it a try anyway. It fit very nicely into pump housing giving me high hopes. But, it didn't work, the motor just chattered. The new motors are NOT shaded pole (which might have worked but ran slightly higher speed at 60Hz rather than 50Hz AC.) The new motors have magnets in them, you can see it when you turn the impeller by hand and it, bumps around between positions, and I believe they are tied to 50Hz. So, don't bother trying to get them to work. And they're expensive at nearly $100 ea. (with shipping incl.)
So, I tried my backup plan. I jerry fitted an
Electrolux 137221600 Washer Drain Pump Kit by Seentech
Compatible for KENMORE Frigidaire Washer - Replaces 137108100 AP5684706 134051200 134740500 134740800 137108100 137151800
$22 with free Amazon shipping. A us part, 120V 60Hz.
The pump input is smaller than the Meile and includes it's own smaller pump housing. I cobbled together an adapter with rubber plumbing parts that snugly fit the Seentech part input and slipped on o-rings over the rubber sleeve to make up the difference. (A 1.25" mission fitting with the clamps removed and trimmed down in length to fit the Seentech.) Added little super glue to the o-rings to hold them in place. I put a little clear silicon grease on the o-rings to ease them in.
Next, the exit port of the Seentech is much bigger and longer than the Miele so I used a 1.25" mission fitting and used a 1.25" to 3/4" copper reducer (sweat) and used clear flexible nylon tubing to run it over to the where the Miele exit port is on the inside back (replacing the Miele internal hose to the back) (be sure to run it low out of the drum or better yet, up on the left side where the old hose runs, but that's tricky, there's a dampening absorber in the way).
I also capped off the old Miele exit ports on the Miele pump housing using small lengths of the same nylon tubing and 3/4" copper end caps. Used real hose clamps to tighten everything back up.
I had originally thought of just cutting a hole in the side of the cabinet and running the drain line directly out. But I think Miele primes the pump with water when it starts a wash cycle by back feeding the pump on the fill.
One final thing. The Seentech pump is a little heaver and longer and so it puts pressure on the Miele leveraged plastic pump housing part. So I used a coat hanger on the front to provide extra support for the added weight.
I spent about $300 in parts, but it would have been less than $100 if I had known exactly what to buy (bought lots of stuff to try).
Long story short, it works like a champ!
I'll post pictures when I'm back in my home state and have some time. I'll post the other part numbers too.
launderess
Well-known member
Congrats!
Yes I want to see those pics. my 1986 is trucking along but as you know that can change in an instant.
Hello all!
I've been spending most of the day trying to find a drain pump for a w1986 that I plan on buying. Even with my two electrolux sets, I still miss my Miele laundry.
I've been digging though technical documentation for several models trying to find pumps. I don't get why they only did this model run for two years and had no superseeded pumps after the model discontinued. What is stupid is on the newer models, the pumps are listed as 240v... On 120v machines.
Anyways, I guess at this point, this post is aimed at viosca:
The more I looked at the drawings, I got to thinking what if I just found an alternate housing and just put a different 120v pump in.
What are your thoughts on this speed queen pump/housing?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AJHZXP...9JYOIJSZ&psc=1&ref_=list_c_wl_lv_ov_lig_dp_it
Also, I've attached a few pics of part numbers.
I've been spending most of the day trying to find a drain pump for a w1986 that I plan on buying. Even with my two electrolux sets, I still miss my Miele laundry.
I've been digging though technical documentation for several models trying to find pumps. I don't get why they only did this model run for two years and had no superseeded pumps after the model discontinued. What is stupid is on the newer models, the pumps are listed as 240v... On 120v machines.
Anyways, I guess at this point, this post is aimed at viosca:
The more I looked at the drawings, I got to thinking what if I just found an alternate housing and just put a different 120v pump in.
What are your thoughts on this speed queen pump/housing?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01AJHZXP...9JYOIJSZ&psc=1&ref_=list_c_wl_lv_ov_lig_dp_it
Also, I've attached a few pics of part numbers.
As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.
Wait
I am almost 100% the W1986 is 240V and so is the drain pump...
I am almost 100% the W1986 is 240V and so is the drain pump...
Henene4,
The w1986 IS 240v, but Miele, in their infinite wisdom, used a 120v Hanning pump in it.
The w1986 IS 240v, but Miele, in their infinite wisdom, used a 120v Hanning pump in it.
controls
Are the controls dials, buttons, or touch screens? I don't like touch screens because they're inaccessible.
Are the controls dials, buttons, or touch screens? I don't like touch screens because they're inaccessible.
launderess
Well-known member
"I am almost 100% the W1986 is 240V....."
Miele used typical North American dryer electrical connections for their "240v" washers of old. That is 120v/240v power connection, but very little inside washer requires 240v.
IIRC most of what was 240v inside W19xx, 12xx and other models was heater. Pumps, timer and many other bits were pure 120v.
This has proven a huge headache for those trying to source parts for such machines. Spares for their European cousins are often plentiful enough or found, but are 208v-240v (not to mention 50hz).
Some thought they could run a Miele 19XX series washer using a voltage converter (stepping 120v up to 240v), that couldn't happen either as machine needed the "120v" leg.
Ironically early Miele washers imported to USA such as W1065 could be run purely on 120v by changing power connection. Sadly again (as one knows far too well) spares for those series from Europe are 240v so that's that.
Miele swore for years they would never have a pure 120v washer in USA. That went by wayside and IIRC 12XX series was last of 120v/240v washers. The W30XX and (IIRC) 48XX series were 120v as have been every washer since.
IIRC for bits that required 240v in say W30XX series Miele simply built in a small converter/transformer to swap voltage.
Miele used typical North American dryer electrical connections for their "240v" washers of old. That is 120v/240v power connection, but very little inside washer requires 240v.
IIRC most of what was 240v inside W19xx, 12xx and other models was heater. Pumps, timer and many other bits were pure 120v.
This has proven a huge headache for those trying to source parts for such machines. Spares for their European cousins are often plentiful enough or found, but are 208v-240v (not to mention 50hz).
Some thought they could run a Miele 19XX series washer using a voltage converter (stepping 120v up to 240v), that couldn't happen either as machine needed the "120v" leg.
Ironically early Miele washers imported to USA such as W1065 could be run purely on 120v by changing power connection. Sadly again (as one knows far too well) spares for those series from Europe are 240v so that's that.
Miele swore for years they would never have a pure 120v washer in USA. That went by wayside and IIRC 12XX series was last of 120v/240v washers. The W30XX and (IIRC) 48XX series were 120v as have been every washer since.
IIRC for bits that required 240v in say W30XX series Miele simply built in a small converter/transformer to swap voltage.
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