The British Are Coming! No, Wait . . .
- Thread starter rp2813
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The best thing about this commercial is its use of the song Children Of The Revolution by T.Rex, my favorite band of all time. Americans will be more familiar with their 1971 hit bang A Gong (Get It On).
dj-gabriele
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- Jun 24, 2007
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Why isn't FIAT just as creative here when it comes at advertising?!
The best we get over here is Uma Thurman driving an Alfa Romeo Giulietta... which is quite sad, for Uma, not the car (which I'd but in a second!)
The best we get over here is Uma Thurman driving an Alfa Romeo Giulietta... which is quite sad, for Uma, not the car (which I'd but in a second!)
I'd love one of the two door Fiats, the four door doesn't do much for me. We had a 1959 Fiat 500 with the suicide doors. Fun car! And it's surprising the current ad running here is actually better than any in Italy. It's usually the other way around.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
I recently spotted the 500L at the local Costco. It's a LOT bigger than the 500. Not just longer, but taller and perhaps wider as well. It comes standard with the 1.4 Multiair turbo engine, I think, which is a good thing, since the stock motor probably wouldn't be able to propel that much more car as well as the smaller 500.
It's not a bad looking ride, but I think the 500, especially in sage green, is much cuter.
Haven't seen any road test reviews of the 500L as yet.
And yes, the commercials are good. I noticed the longer version has one of the women saying something "this is going to be a lot more fun than the tea party". When the commercial was shortened and that line omitted, I wondered if it was do to the possible political implications. But it's still a good line. Another good moment is when the Paul Revere character sullenly collapses his spy glass as he is holding it at waist level and the women get into the car... without him... lol...
I was at the Good Guys last weekend and saw the predecessor of the 500L. It was called a 600 Multipla. In fine fully restored condition. Apparently quite rare. I spoke with the owners who said that Fiat invited them to show it at Pebble Beach (quite an honor) but they couldn't get a hotel room for less than $500/night with only 3 months' notice, so they turned it down.
It's not a bad looking ride, but I think the 500, especially in sage green, is much cuter.
Haven't seen any road test reviews of the 500L as yet.
And yes, the commercials are good. I noticed the longer version has one of the women saying something "this is going to be a lot more fun than the tea party". When the commercial was shortened and that line omitted, I wondered if it was do to the possible political implications. But it's still a good line. Another good moment is when the Paul Revere character sullenly collapses his spy glass as he is holding it at waist level and the women get into the car... without him... lol...
I was at the Good Guys last weekend and saw the predecessor of the 500L. It was called a 600 Multipla. In fine fully restored condition. Apparently quite rare. I spoke with the owners who said that Fiat invited them to show it at Pebble Beach (quite an honor) but they couldn't get a hotel room for less than $500/night with only 3 months' notice, so they turned it down.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Here's photo of the Multipla I found on the web. It may very well be the same one I saw at Pleasanton. I'll have to check my cell phone photos I took of it...
http://www.sportscarshop.com/1959-fiat-multipla/
http://www.sportscarshop.com/1959-fiat-multipla/
Great photo, but needless to say the wheels on that Multipla are not original. A buddy of mine who is a true Fiat lover has a very nice and clean Multipla, along with several other old Fiats, Abarths and a Moretti. Unfortunately, the front headroom in the Multipla is really limited. I've spent well over 200,000 miles in X1/9s and never had a problem with room but the Multipla is just too small for me.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Here's the one I saw at Good Guys last Saturday... it appears to have original wheels...
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Side view - note stock looking wheels. From what the owner said, this one appears to be a faithful "original" restoration. The other one in the first photo was upgraded in various ways so it's not as original (bigger motor, improved suspension, rims as noted, etc).
haxisfan
Well-known member
Sorry Fiat... but that's just plain ugly!
Don't get me wrong, I generally like Fiats and I'm actually driving one myself (which I love to bits)... but IMHO the 600 multipla looks, sounds and feels like... something's gone wrong!
Of course, it wasn't meant to be like that... it's a back formation vehicle from the Fiat 600 which is identical to that horror but with a more sedan-like front... and it wouldn't look back to front like the Multipla. I'm not a fan of the 600 in any shape or form though, but we're all different and some people might actually like that.
Don't get me wrong, I generally like Fiats and I'm actually driving one myself (which I love to bits)... but IMHO the 600 multipla looks, sounds and feels like... something's gone wrong!
Of course, it wasn't meant to be like that... it's a back formation vehicle from the Fiat 600 which is identical to that horror but with a more sedan-like front... and it wouldn't look back to front like the Multipla. I'm not a fan of the 600 in any shape or form though, but we're all different and some people might actually like that.
600 . . .
Introduced in '55, the 600 was actually a very clever little car though no beauty in stock form. Dante Giacosa, director of engineering at Fiat, had been experimenting with front wheel drive designs in the early '50s but it was cheaper to produce a rear engined car so that was the direction chosen by the company. Most small rear engined cars of the day had really nasty swing axle rear suspensions that led to odd and unpredictable handling, with the VW Beetle and Renault 4CV/Dauphine being prime examples. Giacosa refused to allow this and thus the 600 had a semi-trailing arm rear suspension that cost more to build but endowed it with better roadholding and safer handling. He had previously developed a semi-trailing arm rear end for the 8V (aka Otto Vu) sports car produced by Fiat in the early '50s. That car featured a small V8 engine, hence the name, and was often used in competition against Ferraris, Maseratis and Alfa Romeos. Only a little over 100 were made but it gave Fiat great experience at building a semi-trailing arm rear end and that was put to good use.
The 600 became the basis for many other cars and was built in several countries by Fiat and its subsidiaries. Carlo Abarth used both the 600 and various bits from it for years in his successful and prestigious sports cars. Some Abarths were basically hotted up 600s, while others were purpose built sports cars but underneath there were usually lots of 600-based parts. In '64 Fiat introduced the 850, a new small car based heavily on the 600 but with a larger engine and more modern body. The 850 also spawned a very attractive little GT from Fiat and the elegant Bertone bodied 850 Spider. As with the 600, all were generally praised for good dynamics and economy combined with easy maintenance and reliability.
Fiat 600 and 850 engines are all water cooled, iron block overhead valve inline fours. Although the wedge combustion chamber design would seem pretty plebian, they are well designed and capable of good breathing at higher revs than a 600 or 850 driver would normally ever use. My buddy with the Multipla and 850s says an otherwise stock 600 or 850 engine with a hot cam will happily rev to 8000 without ill effects, a big plus for cars that all had four speed transaxles. Given this ability, good chassis design, inexpensive cost and long production life - 850 based cars were built well into the '70s - it is no surprise that the 600 and 850 were much loved by enthusiasts.
Introduced in '55, the 600 was actually a very clever little car though no beauty in stock form. Dante Giacosa, director of engineering at Fiat, had been experimenting with front wheel drive designs in the early '50s but it was cheaper to produce a rear engined car so that was the direction chosen by the company. Most small rear engined cars of the day had really nasty swing axle rear suspensions that led to odd and unpredictable handling, with the VW Beetle and Renault 4CV/Dauphine being prime examples. Giacosa refused to allow this and thus the 600 had a semi-trailing arm rear suspension that cost more to build but endowed it with better roadholding and safer handling. He had previously developed a semi-trailing arm rear end for the 8V (aka Otto Vu) sports car produced by Fiat in the early '50s. That car featured a small V8 engine, hence the name, and was often used in competition against Ferraris, Maseratis and Alfa Romeos. Only a little over 100 were made but it gave Fiat great experience at building a semi-trailing arm rear end and that was put to good use.
The 600 became the basis for many other cars and was built in several countries by Fiat and its subsidiaries. Carlo Abarth used both the 600 and various bits from it for years in his successful and prestigious sports cars. Some Abarths were basically hotted up 600s, while others were purpose built sports cars but underneath there were usually lots of 600-based parts. In '64 Fiat introduced the 850, a new small car based heavily on the 600 but with a larger engine and more modern body. The 850 also spawned a very attractive little GT from Fiat and the elegant Bertone bodied 850 Spider. As with the 600, all were generally praised for good dynamics and economy combined with easy maintenance and reliability.
Fiat 600 and 850 engines are all water cooled, iron block overhead valve inline fours. Although the wedge combustion chamber design would seem pretty plebian, they are well designed and capable of good breathing at higher revs than a 600 or 850 driver would normally ever use. My buddy with the Multipla and 850s says an otherwise stock 600 or 850 engine with a hot cam will happily rev to 8000 without ill effects, a big plus for cars that all had four speed transaxles. Given this ability, good chassis design, inexpensive cost and long production life - 850 based cars were built well into the '70s - it is no surprise that the 600 and 850 were much loved by enthusiasts.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Just to be clear, the 600 was a front engine, rear drive vehicle, while the 600 Multipla was a rear engine, rear drive vehicle. As such I'm not sure why the front engine 600 would need the traling arm suspension of the Multipla, but perhaps it gave better handling than the usual solid rear axle of the day.
The Multipla is cuter in person than the second photo might suggest. Aerodynamically, as Chrysler engineers found out in the 1930's, a car with a blunt nose and a sloped rear end slips through the air more easily than the other way round. Has to do with wake turbulence, I suppose. You can see that concept on most prop driven old airplanes, as well. Blunt nose and tapering tail.
The owners of the car at Good Guys said it had a top speed of about 40 mph, and leaned a lot in the corners. The web site for the other car (first pictured in this thread) says they did a fair amount of suspension work, and added (or upgraded) shock absorbers that resulted in better handling. From what I gather, the Multipla was a hit for small businesses in Italy that needed a delivery van type of car, and the six passenger version was also popular with big Italian families that could fit everyone in albeit with a further speed penalty.
The forward control nature of the Multipla isn't much different than that of the VW microbus or the later first and second generation Chevy vans. One definitely doesn't want to be in a head-on collision in any of these vehicles. I have a '67 Chevy Van that I love, but I do exercise extra caution in traffic or on roads where obstructions (deer, motorcyclists, etc) might pop up at any moment. Of course one can't anticipate every hazard but that's life isn't it?
The Multipla is cuter in person than the second photo might suggest. Aerodynamically, as Chrysler engineers found out in the 1930's, a car with a blunt nose and a sloped rear end slips through the air more easily than the other way round. Has to do with wake turbulence, I suppose. You can see that concept on most prop driven old airplanes, as well. Blunt nose and tapering tail.
The owners of the car at Good Guys said it had a top speed of about 40 mph, and leaned a lot in the corners. The web site for the other car (first pictured in this thread) says they did a fair amount of suspension work, and added (or upgraded) shock absorbers that resulted in better handling. From what I gather, the Multipla was a hit for small businesses in Italy that needed a delivery van type of car, and the six passenger version was also popular with big Italian families that could fit everyone in albeit with a further speed penalty.
The forward control nature of the Multipla isn't much different than that of the VW microbus or the later first and second generation Chevy vans. One definitely doesn't want to be in a head-on collision in any of these vehicles. I have a '67 Chevy Van that I love, but I do exercise extra caution in traffic or on roads where obstructions (deer, motorcyclists, etc) might pop up at any moment. Of course one can't anticipate every hazard but that's life isn't it?
ronhic
Well-known member
Rich
I'm sorry, but you're wrong. The 600 was rear engined/rear wheel drive.
High powered versions did have the addition of a front radiator to supplement the one at the rear.
http://www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au/car_info_fiat_600.htm
I'm sorry, but you're wrong. The 600 was rear engined/rear wheel drive.
High powered versions did have the addition of a front radiator to supplement the one at the rear.
http://www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au/car_info_fiat_600.htm
All 600s are rear engined . . .
All Fiat 600 and 850 cars are rear engined, as are the Abarth derivatives. The Multipla is nothing more than a stretched 600 with a van body; mechanically they are very close. It was Fiat's first rear engined car, predating the Nuova 500 by two years. I found the pic below on the web, but I've hung around a lot of these cars for years and it is a pretty typical example of a modified 600 today, with a smaller waterpump and electric radiator fan in place of the original water pump that hangs out on a bracket to locate the fan behind the radiator. It also has an alternator in place of the original generator. One of the disadvantages of a water cooled rear engined car is pulling enough air through the rear compartment. It works OK with a largely stock car, but for a highly modified one a front radiator is usually used.
All Fiat 600 and 850 cars are rear engined, as are the Abarth derivatives. The Multipla is nothing more than a stretched 600 with a van body; mechanically they are very close. It was Fiat's first rear engined car, predating the Nuova 500 by two years. I found the pic below on the web, but I've hung around a lot of these cars for years and it is a pretty typical example of a modified 600 today, with a smaller waterpump and electric radiator fan in place of the original water pump that hangs out on a bracket to locate the fan behind the radiator. It also has an alternator in place of the original generator. One of the disadvantages of a water cooled rear engined car is pulling enough air through the rear compartment. It works OK with a largely stock car, but for a highly modified one a front radiator is usually used.
Pic below is a 600 sedan, the tail is louvered to assist airflow through the engine bay.
ronhic
Well-known member
I'm assuming that the fan 'pulls' air through the same as in a DS, rather than pushes it forward.
I think that's true, but the DS still benefits from the high pressure area just underneath the nose of the car. Pic below shows a lovely 600 based Abarth Allemano bodied spider from about 1960; the engine lid has been propped open at the front to increase airflow through the engine compartment although I think this car now runs a front radiator. The maroon car beyond with old CA yellow on black license plates is my buddy's Moretti Sportiva from the late '60s. It's based on the 850 but this one now runs a one liter engine. The one liter is derived from the 850/600 family but was only used in later front drive Autobianchi cars and is thus rare, especially in the US as none were sold here. The Moretti's owner absolutely did not want to cut a grille into the front, so it still runs the rear radiator but it took some time to make it work with the one liter due to airflow problems. Both the Moretti and Allemano car are deceiving in photos, so perfectly proportioned that they don't look as tiny as they are. Note that the roof of the Moretti is virtually at waist height!
ronhic
Well-known member
That high pressure zone may help getting the air into a DS engine bay, but getting it out of the engine bay of a DS23 injection isn't easy....talk about a hot car to drive in anything warmer than cool/mild weather!
Ronhic . . .
OK, so make me jealous once again by reminding me about your five speed DS23! We never got the five speed in the D, the 2.3 engine or the injection here in the US
I assume your car has the big crossflow radiator with the auxiliary electric fan mounted right behind the engine driven fan? What type of a/c condenser do you have, regular radiator mount or fender vent?
OK, so make me jealous once again by reminding me about your five speed DS23! We never got the five speed in the D, the 2.3 engine or the injection here in the US
I assume your car has the big crossflow radiator with the auxiliary electric fan mounted right behind the engine driven fan? What type of a/c condenser do you have, regular radiator mount or fender vent?
ronhic
Well-known member
Sorry, not my intention. If you ever head to the land of Oz, you know you'll be expected to take June for a good drive 
Yes and yes. Mine doesn't have air-conditioning - probably a good thing knowing that they run even hotter!
They were poisonously expensive cars here in the mid 1970's, attracting 57.5% import duty alone. The air-conditioning (and radio) was an option on top of the already AUD$10,000 list price.
For context, that was USD$13,500 before sales tax!
Yes and yes. Mine doesn't have air-conditioning - probably a good thing knowing that they run even hotter!
They were poisonously expensive cars here in the mid 1970's, attracting 57.5% import duty alone. The air-conditioning (and radio) was an option on top of the already AUD$10,000 list price.
For context, that was USD$13,500 before sales tax!
Hehe, you know I love hearing about your DS, it is the ultimate, most powerful and fastest D ever, not cheap in any market and thus rare even in Europe. I am surprised that anyone forking out that much for a car didn't want the a/c in a hot climate; perhaps they lived on the coast and never went inland.
Many years ago a friend of mine had a nice '71 DS21 daily driver. It was an early '71 and didn't get the fender vent a/c though he said the original front bumper did have the vents, presumably Coolaire hadn't gotten the condensers into production when the car arrived in Texas. The owner was an engineer and long-time DS guy, but did not like being hot. He kept the radiator mounted condenser but added a second electric fan in front of it, used in conjunction with the factory electric and mechanical fans behind the radiator. Since pancake fan motors were rare then he used a normal 12v motor and had to modify the shroud and relocate the spare tire to the rear. A bit Rube Goldberg, but it worked and kept him cool in Dallas traffic for many, many years.
I've always wondered if both the D and SM would benefit from some small vents in the front fenders to let air out. The SM does not appear to have any more air exits than the D, but the twin fans move a lot of air, particularly the '73 fans with the big motors. I'm not sure if those were installed across the board for '73 or only on three liter cars. One funny factoid about the SM is that there is a hydraulically operated switch to turn off the fans once you hit 30 mph or so when there is enough airflow to make them redundant. It is operated by a high pressure line from the steering speed governor on the nose of the gearbox.
At least with no a/c you don't have to worry about premature timing chain wear from the compressor. Modern Sankyo-Sanden types aren't too bad, but the York type universally fitted in the US or OEM Italian York clone on the SM have high cyclical loads that the timing chains don't like. The D is significantly less sensitive to this than the SM however.
Many years ago a friend of mine had a nice '71 DS21 daily driver. It was an early '71 and didn't get the fender vent a/c though he said the original front bumper did have the vents, presumably Coolaire hadn't gotten the condensers into production when the car arrived in Texas. The owner was an engineer and long-time DS guy, but did not like being hot. He kept the radiator mounted condenser but added a second electric fan in front of it, used in conjunction with the factory electric and mechanical fans behind the radiator. Since pancake fan motors were rare then he used a normal 12v motor and had to modify the shroud and relocate the spare tire to the rear. A bit Rube Goldberg, but it worked and kept him cool in Dallas traffic for many, many years.
I've always wondered if both the D and SM would benefit from some small vents in the front fenders to let air out. The SM does not appear to have any more air exits than the D, but the twin fans move a lot of air, particularly the '73 fans with the big motors. I'm not sure if those were installed across the board for '73 or only on three liter cars. One funny factoid about the SM is that there is a hydraulically operated switch to turn off the fans once you hit 30 mph or so when there is enough airflow to make them redundant. It is operated by a high pressure line from the steering speed governor on the nose of the gearbox.
At least with no a/c you don't have to worry about premature timing chain wear from the compressor. Modern Sankyo-Sanden types aren't too bad, but the York type universally fitted in the US or OEM Italian York clone on the SM have high cyclical loads that the timing chains don't like. The D is significantly less sensitive to this than the SM however.
ronhic
Well-known member
June was originally a Sydney car. Summer time temperatures of around 35c during the day are pretty much the norm, but Sydney traffic in the 1970's and early 1980's wasn't as stupid as it is now - it moved. It's changed dramatically in the last 15 or so years since I lived there and wouldn't consider using June in Sydney as a daily driver these days.
There are some DS here with mudguard vents to help direct hot air out from under the bonnet. Some are mount on top and others are mounted aft of the front wheels. I'm not sure how effective they are, but given that I know of one club member who has even resorted to cutting the rubber seal at the base of the windscreen to help airflow, they would have to do something!
One thing is certain, you do need to have a radiator in top condition or she'll overheat faster than you can imagine....sustained high speed (135-145kph) running on a 30c day also leads to increased temperatures that only airflow can mitigate.
A friend of ours has an SM that he recently bought as a companion for his DS23 Safari. She does get warm, but no more so than my injected DS23.
Ah, the problems we have with aged cars....
http://assets.hemmings.com/story_image/43842-500-0.jpg?rev=1
There are some DS here with mudguard vents to help direct hot air out from under the bonnet. Some are mount on top and others are mounted aft of the front wheels. I'm not sure how effective they are, but given that I know of one club member who has even resorted to cutting the rubber seal at the base of the windscreen to help airflow, they would have to do something!
One thing is certain, you do need to have a radiator in top condition or she'll overheat faster than you can imagine....sustained high speed (135-145kph) running on a 30c day also leads to increased temperatures that only airflow can mitigate.
A friend of ours has an SM that he recently bought as a companion for his DS23 Safari. She does get warm, but no more so than my injected DS23.
Ah, the problems we have with aged cars....
http://assets.hemmings.com/story_image/43842-500-0.jpg?rev=1
Ah, the problems we have with aged cars....
<a name="start_48296.700287">Indeed! At least the D and SM aren't hopeless, something I can't say for my sister's old 4.2 Series I E-Type. I left the Lucas fan behind the radiator and installed a front fan from a 3.8 Buick Regal with a/c (none on the Jag) and figured it would stay cool but run the battery down. I was so wrong: the Lucas alternator (first year for that - '65) took it all in stride but it still overheated in traffic so badly that the hot air coming out the hood louvers would warp your vision at stoplights! She gave up trying to use the Jag in anything but cool weather and got a '66 Corvette. It was unrestored, but even at thirty years of age it never overheated and always, always got you where you wanted to go so long as you satisfied its 11 mpg thirst. Needless to say, it is no longer in regular use with today's gas prices!</a>
<a name="start_48296.700287">BTW, those fender vents were OEM on '61 and '62 DS19s. I had one as akid, though not a runner. They disappeared in '63 when Citroen cleaned up the aero with the 2nd generation nose. </a>
<a name="start_48296.700287">Indeed! At least the D and SM aren't hopeless, something I can't say for my sister's old 4.2 Series I E-Type. I left the Lucas fan behind the radiator and installed a front fan from a 3.8 Buick Regal with a/c (none on the Jag) and figured it would stay cool but run the battery down. I was so wrong: the Lucas alternator (first year for that - '65) took it all in stride but it still overheated in traffic so badly that the hot air coming out the hood louvers would warp your vision at stoplights! She gave up trying to use the Jag in anything but cool weather and got a '66 Corvette. It was unrestored, but even at thirty years of age it never overheated and always, always got you where you wanted to go so long as you satisfied its 11 mpg thirst. Needless to say, it is no longer in regular use with today's gas prices!</a>
<a name="start_48296.700287">BTW, those fender vents were OEM on '61 and '62 DS19s. I had one as akid, though not a runner. They disappeared in '63 when Citroen cleaned up the aero with the 2nd generation nose. </a>
ronhic
Well-known member
Guard vents
Were often retro-fitted here long after the early 1960's. I think you could get them installed on Heidelberg made cars right up until production ceased in 1966. Additionally, some dealers here fitted them in the 1970's, though they do tend to detract from the lines of the car and I wouldn't be surprised if they encourage even more rust into the car!
Were often retro-fitted here long after the early 1960's. I think you could get them installed on Heidelberg made cars right up until production ceased in 1966. Additionally, some dealers here fitted them in the 1970's, though they do tend to detract from the lines of the car and I wouldn't be surprised if they encourage even more rust into the car!
sudsmaster
Well-known member
OK, I got confused... the Fiat 500 "Topolino" was a front engine rwd car. I had assumed the 600 was a variant on that, but I guess not.
Thanks for the correction!
Thanks for the correction!
500 . . .
Like Ford, Fiat has used the "500" name for lots of cars and it gets confusing! The 500 "Topolino" is indeed a front engine, rear drive car with an inline four cylinder engine. Topolino means "little mouse" in Italian, and the car is just that: a small and economical city car. It was built from '37 to '55. In '55 the all new 600 nominally replaced it, but in '57 they introduced the Nuova 500 that was closer to the original 500 in spirit in that it was a truly minimal car. Both the 600 and Nuova 500 are rear engined, but the Nuova 500 has a tiny air-cooled inline twin rather than the 600's water cooled four. The Nuova 500 was produced through '75, but was replaced by the 126 in '72. That car, produced through 2000, also has an air cooled inline twin.
The 500 Topolino, 600/850 and Nuova 500/126 families are completely different designs with little commonality aside from the manufacturer. All were also well accepted and much loved; Fiat's skill and expertise at small car design goes back a long way.
Like Ford, Fiat has used the "500" name for lots of cars and it gets confusing! The 500 "Topolino" is indeed a front engine, rear drive car with an inline four cylinder engine. Topolino means "little mouse" in Italian, and the car is just that: a small and economical city car. It was built from '37 to '55. In '55 the all new 600 nominally replaced it, but in '57 they introduced the Nuova 500 that was closer to the original 500 in spirit in that it was a truly minimal car. Both the 600 and Nuova 500 are rear engined, but the Nuova 500 has a tiny air-cooled inline twin rather than the 600's water cooled four. The Nuova 500 was produced through '75, but was replaced by the 126 in '72. That car, produced through 2000, also has an air cooled inline twin.
The 500 Topolino, 600/850 and Nuova 500/126 families are completely different designs with little commonality aside from the manufacturer. All were also well accepted and much loved; Fiat's skill and expertise at small car design goes back a long way.
I am a bit surprised...
I would have not expected that these old Fiat cars were so well known in USA, where they have never been sold, as far as I know (by the way: my mother had a Topolino, the "C" version to be precise: how on earth do you know that old car, sudmaster?).
Is it because your personal interest in old cars or there is any other reason?[this post was last edited: 9/1/2013-03:26]
I would have not expected that these old Fiat cars were so well known in USA, where they have never been sold, as far as I know (by the way: my mother had a Topolino, the "C" version to be precise: how on earth do you know that old car, sudmaster?).
Is it because your personal interest in old cars or there is any other reason?[this post was last edited: 9/1/2013-03:26]
ronhic
Well-known member
The last of the Fiat 126p, the 'Bis' was actually a water cooled 704cc 2 cyl with the engine laying on its side under the boot floor and the car finally getting the hatch it deserved.
Oops, forgot about the water cooled twin in the Polish built Bis, thanks for the reminder! The 126 was never sold in the US although there was one around here some years ago with the air-cooled engine. Of all the rear engined Fiats, the only ones that were sold here in any number were the 850 Coupe and Spider, and the X1/9.
There was an American version of the Nuova 500 with larger headlights that made it look rather bug-eyed, but to my knowledge it was pretty much a special order thing; back then many Americans didn't get four cylinder cars, let alone two cylinder ones! Citroen found that out when they briefly tried to sell the Ami 6 here. The 600 was a regular item in the late '50s/early '60s but it wasn't a big seller, nor was the 850 sedan that replaced it. By the late '60s Fiat sales here pretty much centered around sports cars and the front engined sedans. In '83 they left the country until the recent return with the new 500, with the only exceptions being a small number of 124 Spiders and X1/9s sold under the Pininfarina and Bertone names for a few years after the '83 pullout.
There was an American version of the Nuova 500 with larger headlights that made it look rather bug-eyed, but to my knowledge it was pretty much a special order thing; back then many Americans didn't get four cylinder cars, let alone two cylinder ones! Citroen found that out when they briefly tried to sell the Ami 6 here. The 600 was a regular item in the late '50s/early '60s but it wasn't a big seller, nor was the 850 sedan that replaced it. By the late '60s Fiat sales here pretty much centered around sports cars and the front engined sedans. In '83 they left the country until the recent return with the new 500, with the only exceptions being a small number of 124 Spiders and X1/9s sold under the Pininfarina and Bertone names for a few years after the '83 pullout.
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