this is why folks are concerned about the health bill
- Thread starter hunter
- Start date
Help Support :
My condolences, Lee
I did not see the post about her passing. I am sorry for your loss. It is hard for us who only see the death of the body and cannot see the radiance of the soul's new home. I hope that your grief can be lightened by knowing she is beyond pain and anything negative and you will get to be with her again in that wonderful place. You were a fierce advocate for her. She knows that and everyone else who matters knows that.
I did not see the post about her passing. I am sorry for your loss. It is hard for us who only see the death of the body and cannot see the radiance of the soul's new home. I hope that your grief can be lightened by knowing she is beyond pain and anything negative and you will get to be with her again in that wonderful place. You were a fierce advocate for her. She knows that and everyone else who matters knows that.
Lee, I'm so sorry to hear this. I can tell you cared deeply for her. You are in my thoughts....
randycmaynard
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2009
- Messages
- 655
Lee......
Sorry to hear of your loss. Went through similar in 2004/2005.
Started Jan 04 with my wife's mother, March 04 - my mother, June 04 - very, very close friend and fellow organist, Oct 04 my wife's oldest sister's husband, Jan 05 oldest sister's oldest son then about a year later her youngest son.
It was about the most tragic couple of years of loss that I can remember - there was no end of things during that time.
Sending prayers and thoughts during this time.... it's never easy but, you're among friends here.
Sorry to hear of your loss. Went through similar in 2004/2005.
Started Jan 04 with my wife's mother, March 04 - my mother, June 04 - very, very close friend and fellow organist, Oct 04 my wife's oldest sister's husband, Jan 05 oldest sister's oldest son then about a year later her youngest son.
It was about the most tragic couple of years of loss that I can remember - there was no end of things during that time.
Sending prayers and thoughts during this time.... it's never easy but, you're among friends here.
"In the case of car insurance, Washington state, where I live, requires you to buy auto insurance liability coverage. However, I do not HAVE to drive a car. Driving is a choice. I don't HAVE to open up a business. There is a huge, huge difference here. This health bill is essentially requiring you to buy insurance or pay a fine just for being alive! Free country my ass! What next? Are people willing to let Uncle Sam make all their decisions for them?"
A Proposal:
You only have to buy auto insurance if you wish to operate a car. If you don't insure a car you own, and you get into an accident, you are liable for damages, right?
Since you will always have to operate a human body, the solution is simple - you don't get any healthcare you can't personally afford. I think this make a lot of sense. This way, you don't HAVE to contribute to the overall good. If you want to protect your constitutional right to NOT protect yourself, thats perfectly fine - You just won't be getting any free care on the insured public's dime. Of course, since a lot of health issues are going to be cumulative over time, once you chose to opt out, you should NEVER be allowed back into the pool. You could always go for a private health insurance at some point in the future. Or you could just hope you live to be 100 years old and never have any issues.
Sound fair?
A Proposal:
You only have to buy auto insurance if you wish to operate a car. If you don't insure a car you own, and you get into an accident, you are liable for damages, right?
Since you will always have to operate a human body, the solution is simple - you don't get any healthcare you can't personally afford. I think this make a lot of sense. This way, you don't HAVE to contribute to the overall good. If you want to protect your constitutional right to NOT protect yourself, thats perfectly fine - You just won't be getting any free care on the insured public's dime. Of course, since a lot of health issues are going to be cumulative over time, once you chose to opt out, you should NEVER be allowed back into the pool. You could always go for a private health insurance at some point in the future. Or you could just hope you live to be 100 years old and never have any issues.
Sound fair?
Lee, I'm very sorry to hear about your Aunt. It's a shame she was treated in such a shabby manner in her last days.
Lee,
My posting wasn't about your loss. I'm very sorry to hear about that. I was responding to the original thread title and to something specifically said by another member. It wasn't meant to be directed at you. I'm sorry if it seemed hurtful.
My posting wasn't about your loss. I'm very sorry to hear about that. I was responding to the original thread title and to something specifically said by another member. It wasn't meant to be directed at you. I'm sorry if it seemed hurtful.
whitekingd
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2008
- Messages
- 484
Partisan politics, and a misinformed public.
Would you be so excited about this if George W. Bush was pushing this? I doubt it. And, I never mentioned anything about parties. It's just wrong to require people to buy a commodity.
Would you be so excited about this if George W. Bush was pushing this? I doubt it. And, I never mentioned anything about parties. It's just wrong to require people to buy a commodity.
This should not be a partisan issue . . .
Intriguingly, it’s been mentioned that the new health care bill is in many ways similar to the one championed by none other then Mitt Romney in Massachusetts. There aren’t but two ways to ensure people have health care: either to require them to have insurance, or for the government to provide and run a healthcare system and as such obviate the need for insurance. It was the Republicans who objected most strenuously to the latter possibility, so we can thank them for having the former as this was the only way possible to get their support. In the end they didn’t give any support, but many accommodations were made for them along the way.
Health care isn’t a normal commodity like buying a car. Having some form of insurance should be considered a responsibility for all adults, as it’s the only way to ensure that you won’t become a burden on others in the event of an illness or accident. Whiteking, how would you feel if I were uninsured and came to visit your city and then suffered a catastrophic accident? I could end out costing King County and Washington State literally hundreds of thousands of dollars in tax money for my care, even though I don’t live there. I should note that I pay thousands of dollars each year for my insurance, and believe me I could use that money in many, many more pleasurable ways. However, it's my responsibility to take care of myself.
Having large numbers of uninsured people is just bad all the way around, and wastes a lot of tax money too.
Intriguingly, it’s been mentioned that the new health care bill is in many ways similar to the one championed by none other then Mitt Romney in Massachusetts. There aren’t but two ways to ensure people have health care: either to require them to have insurance, or for the government to provide and run a healthcare system and as such obviate the need for insurance. It was the Republicans who objected most strenuously to the latter possibility, so we can thank them for having the former as this was the only way possible to get their support. In the end they didn’t give any support, but many accommodations were made for them along the way.
Health care isn’t a normal commodity like buying a car. Having some form of insurance should be considered a responsibility for all adults, as it’s the only way to ensure that you won’t become a burden on others in the event of an illness or accident. Whiteking, how would you feel if I were uninsured and came to visit your city and then suffered a catastrophic accident? I could end out costing King County and Washington State literally hundreds of thousands of dollars in tax money for my care, even though I don’t live there. I should note that I pay thousands of dollars each year for my insurance, and believe me I could use that money in many, many more pleasurable ways. However, it's my responsibility to take care of myself.
Having large numbers of uninsured people is just bad all the way around, and wastes a lot of tax money too.
70series
Well-known member
Sudsman:
I'm so sorry to hear of your loss, and the anguish that you have had to undergo. You are in my prayers, and may your Aunt rest in peace.
God Bless,
James
I'm so sorry to hear of your loss, and the anguish that you have had to undergo. You are in my prayers, and may your Aunt rest in peace.
God Bless,
James
whitekingd
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2008
- Messages
- 484
However, it's my responsibility to take care of myself.
That is exactly what I am talking about. It is YOUR responsibility, NOT the governments!
That is exactly what I am talking about. It is YOUR responsibility, NOT the governments!
It is YOUR responsibility, NOT the governments!
A government's responsibility is good governance. This is usually achieved by formulating and implementing policies that lessen social and economic disparities, create opportunities, empower the individual and provide the basis for social and economic opportunity and justice. Such policies represent an investment in the biggest resource any country has; its people. This means getting real bang for your tax bucks.
How can anyone be responsible for their own health care when the private health insurance sector has proven itself irresponsible and the ability of assuming this responsibility is beyond the financial capacity of tens of millions of American citizens?
If you don't want good governance (but you will still have to pay taxes), you can move to any country south or your border. Or try the Philippines, China, Afghanistan, Uganda, Zimbabwe, Sudan et al; there are hundreds of countries where the prevailing attitude is 'every man, woman and child' for themselves. There you can bribe your way to good health care outcomes, regular mail deliveries, garbage collection, employment, a roof over your head, you name it, there is an appropriate bribe for every mood and occasion.
My business partner's mother contracted Leptospirosis during sever flooding in Manila last year. She was in a private hospital for three months, due to complications, at a cost of US$1000 a day. There was no insurance or government assistance to pay for it. The family paid for everything out of their own pockets, including the ongoing full-time care she now requires at home. Is that the kind of system that you want America to emulate?
Perhaps you are financially independent enough that paying $10,000 or more for health insurance every year doesn't bother you. Or, perhaps, you can afford to pay for all of your treatments with your Platinum Amex card. Good luck to you if that is the case, but that doesn't help anyone else.
A government's responsibility is good governance. This is usually achieved by formulating and implementing policies that lessen social and economic disparities, create opportunities, empower the individual and provide the basis for social and economic opportunity and justice. Such policies represent an investment in the biggest resource any country has; its people. This means getting real bang for your tax bucks.
How can anyone be responsible for their own health care when the private health insurance sector has proven itself irresponsible and the ability of assuming this responsibility is beyond the financial capacity of tens of millions of American citizens?
If you don't want good governance (but you will still have to pay taxes), you can move to any country south or your border. Or try the Philippines, China, Afghanistan, Uganda, Zimbabwe, Sudan et al; there are hundreds of countries where the prevailing attitude is 'every man, woman and child' for themselves. There you can bribe your way to good health care outcomes, regular mail deliveries, garbage collection, employment, a roof over your head, you name it, there is an appropriate bribe for every mood and occasion.
My business partner's mother contracted Leptospirosis during sever flooding in Manila last year. She was in a private hospital for three months, due to complications, at a cost of US$1000 a day. There was no insurance or government assistance to pay for it. The family paid for everything out of their own pockets, including the ongoing full-time care she now requires at home. Is that the kind of system that you want America to emulate?
Perhaps you are financially independent enough that paying $10,000 or more for health insurance every year doesn't bother you. Or, perhaps, you can afford to pay for all of your treatments with your Platinum Amex card. Good luck to you if that is the case, but that doesn't help anyone else.
whitekingd
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2008
- Messages
- 484
I personally don't have a Platinum Amex card. But since having a high credit score is "good for you", maybe the government should require every citizen to have one! Why stop there! Let's turn ALL insurance over to the federal government. They can handle auto, homeowner's, renter's and all the rest. Why not let them tell us what food to buy. After all, if the government can get everyone to eat healthy it will lessen the load on the taxpayers! Why not? BECAUSE WE LIVE IN A DEMOCRACY! The government does not have the right to tell it's citizens what to buy and what not to buy.
andrewinorlando
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2004
- Messages
- 1,392
That's right...it's YOUR responsibility. But it's governments responsibility to make sure all CITIZENS have equal access to health care. And right now, that is not the case in this country because access is controlled by a private industry whose main objective is profit in most cases. An industry that routinely denies coverage based on medical condition or coverage that is priced out of the reach of the CITIZENS it is supposed to protect. That's what should make people angry. So those who fall into that class who need care either don't get it, get it at great cost to the health provider because they're unable to afford to pay for it, or depending on their income levels, wind up on medicaid, which we all get to pay for.
So, yeah, everyone should have coverage, and the private insurance industry that provides this coverage is not going to make that possible on their own. We either go this route, or, dare I say it - we regulate the insurance industry at the federal level. And that's a less palatable option.
It's funny...governments tells us we have to have auto insurance, your bank that holds your mortgage, with approval from your state's department of insurance, tells you that you must have homeowner's insurance, and business owners who employ individuals must have worker's comp insurance and pay unemployment insurance. Yet no one argues that those are policies designed to protect individuals or their employers from potentially catastrophic harm. So what is wrong with having to have health insurance coverage? I would never dream of getting in my car without auto insurance, why wouldn't I want to protect my most valuable asset - my health or my family's health? I guess it's all according to what's really important to you.
So, yeah, everyone should have coverage, and the private insurance industry that provides this coverage is not going to make that possible on their own. We either go this route, or, dare I say it - we regulate the insurance industry at the federal level. And that's a less palatable option.
It's funny...governments tells us we have to have auto insurance, your bank that holds your mortgage, with approval from your state's department of insurance, tells you that you must have homeowner's insurance, and business owners who employ individuals must have worker's comp insurance and pay unemployment insurance. Yet no one argues that those are policies designed to protect individuals or their employers from potentially catastrophic harm. So what is wrong with having to have health insurance coverage? I would never dream of getting in my car without auto insurance, why wouldn't I want to protect my most valuable asset - my health or my family's health? I guess it's all according to what's really important to you.
business owners who employ individuals must have worker'
No So Business in many states DO NOT have to have workmans comp.. Texas is one of them.. many business here have nothing at all. A lot of fast food places have you sign a form upon employment stating you understand they offer NO workmans comp. Only about 50 % of the business in Texas offer it. Lower in some other states. Some states it is mandatory.
No So Business in many states DO NOT have to have workmans comp.. Texas is one of them.. many business here have nothing at all. A lot of fast food places have you sign a form upon employment stating you understand they offer NO workmans comp. Only about 50 % of the business in Texas offer it. Lower in some other states. Some states it is mandatory.
So, if business are not required to cover their workers
who ends up paying the successful compensation claims? Could it be the taxpayers?
As far as this health insurance bill is concerned, it has passed and is now law. There is no point in pursuing circular arguments anymore. Whatever will happen in three years is anyone's guess. But, whether it's the ass or the elephant in the Whitehouse, it will not go back to what it was.
Hopefully this new system will serve as a foundation to something that may one day become the envy of the world. Who knows?
Good health to all.
Olav
who ends up paying the successful compensation claims? Could it be the taxpayers?
As far as this health insurance bill is concerned, it has passed and is now law. There is no point in pursuing circular arguments anymore. Whatever will happen in three years is anyone's guess. But, whether it's the ass or the elephant in the Whitehouse, it will not go back to what it was.
Hopefully this new system will serve as a foundation to something that may one day become the envy of the world. Who knows?
Good health to all.
Olav
