Time to buy a new car....suggestions??

[washerboy]

volvo's

I noticed not much has been said about Volvo...I'm looking to buy something new or new/used after Christmas..my 10 year old turck is pushing 170k..my other half insist I should get a Volvo for safty sake..but it seems like he's always taking his S60 to repari shop...and the expense is..well.. in my book a lot. Anyone have any thoughts on Volvo's..yes..no..maybe?

 

[zipdang]

Volvo

From what I've read about them and what I've been told by friends who own them, Volvo has improved their reliability in recent years. I don't think they're on par with Toyota or Lexus (which typically top the charts in most quality assessment ratings), but are at least about average. I really like the upcoming 2008 V70 wagon, which will supposedly go on sale in North America in February, and am considering that for my next car, depending on the final fuel efficiency numbers. The new XC70 is already available, but is rated at only 15 mpg city. The V70 will get a few mpg better since it's lighter without the AWD hardware, but still, we get around 20 mpg city with our Saab and BMW and don't wish to take a step backwards with fuel efficiency.

 

[hydralique]

For the last thirty-five or so years, Volvo has spent a lot of money publicizing their commitment to safety. I believe it's real and they're unlikley to make an unsafe car, but it doesn't mean that other manufacturers don't make safe cars. Some of the new smaller Volvos share platforms with Ford and Mazda too, which may mean better safety for those makes or worse for Volvo, depending on how things shake out. I'd look at some crash test results (both American and European) for anything I was interested in and base my decision on that.

Right after Christmas is traditionally a great time to buy, especially if you can get it before Jam. 1. Most people are too wrapped up in the holidays to car shop or don't want to spend for a big-ticket item then, and car salesmen see their incomes drop right when their holiday expenses hit. It's a great incentive for good deals.

 

[andrewinorlando]

Shane - how about a nice Yugo?????

 

[volvoguy87]

Volvos

IF Volvo still made the 240, I would buy one without so much as a test-drive. In my own head, the 240 is the perfect car. Reliable, easy to maintain, comfortable, and good-handling. Sadly, they stopped making the 240 in 1993 and nothing else has come close. Volvo has fallen a long way from its high 20 years ago. They are now much more trouble-prone, complicated, and expensive to repair. I don't trust most domestic cars based upon personal experience, and since Volvo was bought by Ford, it seems that many of them are suffering from terminal cases of Blue Oval Syndrome.
I think that Honda has the market cornered now for reasonably simple, very reliable, and pleasnt vehicles. The Element is my pick because of its flexability and comfort, plus its fuel economy is on par with that of the Volvo 240.
I am not a fan of any hybrids, however. Ask yourself how much gas you would have to save over how long a period of time to make up the cost difference, also figure in additional maintainance and repair costs. Although the hybrids do get excelent fuel economy, how much more energy and resources are used to make them in the first place, when compared to a conventional car? Also, what do we do with the batteries when they wear out? Batteries aren't cheap and a rechargable battery goes bad after a period of time and use. Battery replacement is very expensive, likely as expensive as an engine or a transmission (which the hybrids also have). When the hybrid is 7 years old, it may be worth replacing the batteries, but when its 14, or 21, the car will likely be worth so little that the repair is not cost-effective. I think that the additional electrical and mechanical complexity of the hybrid puts it at a distinct disadvantage when compared to conventional cars, both in therms of reliability and long-term durability.

Sorry for the rant, but I just don't think hybrids are the answer,
Dave

 

[liberator1509]

Buy a Subaru

Forget the Saab and get a Subaru- try an Outback or the new revised Tribeca. I had a Saab and it was the worst car I have ever encountered - poor handling and unreliable - I've returned to the Outback and can't understand why I ever changed from Subaru - I've had four and love them.

Over here the Outback and Legacy wagons are the vehicle-of-choice for the landed gentry when pootling around their estates...someone told me that the Outback is America's second-favourite gay car after the Jeep Wrangler - which is cool and in my case rather appropriate too!! In his Sunday Times article last weekend, the BBC's main car-reviewer, Jeremy Clarkson said of the brand new Volvo XC70 'I'd save myself £14,000 and buy a Subaru Outback instead..."

 

[petek]

Dave I'm with you on the old Volvo 240's. I drove an 82 240GL for about 12 years since new and it barely cost me a dime in maintenance. Had over 200k miles on it when I sold it to my niece and they drove it for a few more years and regreted having sold it. Amazing cars, they could almost literally turn on a dime (tighter than a Honda Civic I'm told) and could leave most cars behind on the hairpin curves out in the rockies. The other thing, after all those years the cloth seats still looked like they had just come out of the factory, not a sign of wear anywhere on the drivers seat, nothing. I don't know what kind of material they used but it was indestructible.

 

[perc-o-prince]

but my partner is insisting I buy import

But who's car is it and who will be driving it the most? No disrespect intended to your partner, but if I ever insisted that Rich buy this or that, he'd surely have something to say to me... and rightly so!

Cudos to you for remaining loyal to American brands when possible, even when part or all of it may not be American. But, if you come across an import that you like and it serves you well, go for it. It doesn't sound like you're likely to get caught up in a "status" buy ('Oh, muffy, I couldn't possibly drive anything less than a Beemer...') so that's a good start for you. Weigh out what you're looking for in style, mileage, space, etc., and get out there and test a few!

I, too, have the "hauler" in the family, or I probably wouldn't have bought the Pontiac Trans Sport (LOVED IT to 150+K miles) then the Pontiac Aztek. But, we need one car that has room for traveling and buying up so much crap.... I mean goodies!!! ;-)

Best of luck,
Chuck

 

[~sudsshane]

Thanks Chuck...

and tell Rich I said hi...

as far as my partner insisting, maybe I should rephrase that. His main concern is I get the most for our money. He is of the mindset that American cars have a lower resale value than imports and aren't as well made. Not sure if I agree with him totally, but given his track record with being right, I am cautious to doubt him LOL.. I am the more sponatenous,fly by the seat of my pants type.He is the more grounded,think things through totally type. He keep me grounded and I keep his life exciting! LOL =)

 

[pturo]

Suds, that Nissan Mirano is sexy and efficient!

 

[petek]

Chuck, an Aztek preceded by a Transport. Was there ever a Gremlin in your past LOL

 

[perc-o-prince]

An AMC product in my yard???

I don't think so!

-1973 Pinto (families second car that I drove underage when 'rents were out)
-1974 Nova
-1981 Monte Carlo
-1978 Honda 750cc 4 cyl
-2 "disposable" cars that I don't remember the makes of (bought from local garage mechanic for $500 each back in about 1987-90)
-1987 Camaro (150+K miles)
-1995 Trans Sport (150+K miles)
-2004 Aztek (33k and counting)

Actually, Rich picked out the last two. I didn't care too much! Never thought of a minivan and was set on buying a small pickup like an S-10. Rich saw the TS and suggested it. Lots of room and I bought it at the end of the model year with incentives on top of GM employee family pricing!

When it came time, he suggested the Aztek after enduring car shopping w/ me again! He though it looked cool... not like everything else. Found one at the same dealership w/ lots of extras ($1200 wheels, 6-CD changer, steering wheel radio controls, auto headlights, slide out rear platform and more). Again, end of model year! Got the GM pricing again and about $6K in rebates on top. The day I signed, there was an additional $1k rebate that started that day, so I got that too! Didn't really want white again, but, after all, it's just a car!

If I had it to do over, I would probably check out the Montana as there was more room for the aforementioned junk.... goodies... in the TS! But, I'm happy! And, if I had to give up either the steering wheel controls or the auto headlamps, I'd have a tough time choosing!!!!

Oh, yeah, no Gremlin!Could have kept your Pacer company!

Chuck

 

[whirlcool]

We own a Mazda Tribute. We've had it for a few years. It's a great car. We feel that we got a LOT for the money. Ours is the ES model, fully loaded. It now has 70K miles on it with no trouble at all. It gives us about 23 miles to the gallon. One of the best things I like about the Tribute is that it has very stable handling characteristics, unlike a lot of SUV's out there. And with 205 horses under the hood, acceleration is quite lively.

For 2008 they gussied up the interior quite a bit and changed the styling a bit. I think it's the best version of the Escape/Mariner/Tribute models. Plus most of them are made in America. For some reason, ours was made in Canada.

 

[DADoES]

I'm not much about cars, but I can say that my Mazda was the best car I've owned, altho that was a 1993 model that may not reflect the current offerings. My 2001 Infiniti is nice, but in the end it hasn't impressed me all that much. Repairs seem high in cost, particularly compared to the Mazda because it had none, LOL. It's unlikely I'd do Infiniti again.

 

[toggleswitch]

Does Mazda still offer a rotary engine?

Heard those lasted forever with little maintenance and no pistons to pop!

 

[westie2]

Rotary Engine

The only rotary Mazda is the RX8 all the others are regular engines.

 

[davy1063]

Well, if you want inexpensive and reliable, there is only on

Gotta find yourself one of these, like I did. This is the most reliable, fuel efficient and friendly little car I ever owned. My 2000 Audi A4 1.8T Quattro runs a close second.

 

[davy1063]

Interior shot...

 

[hydralique]

Mazda is the only company ever to make the rotary engine work successfully on a long-term basis. Seals have always been an issue with rotaries, and that's what usually wears out first. Overheating can kill them too. Rotaries are conceptually very interesting because they are small, light, and very smooth. Unfortunately, they also tend to have poor fuel consumption which is why Mazda has pretty much relegated them to the RX-8. Rotaries have long, thin combustion chambers which have lots of surface area compared to a conventional piston engine, and this design results in greater heat loss from the combustion process and the correspondingly poor economy.

I think a rotary RX-5 Miata would be ever so cool, but I'm sure Mazda will never make one.

 

[nurdlinger]

Interior shot...

Wow the memories come flooding back. It's hard to believe that such a plain design was so successful. Or that you could ever feel safe again riding along with your face that close to the front window.

 

[foraloysius]

Volkswagen is going to release a new 4 wheel drive, smaller than the Touareg, the Tiguan. I don't know if and when it's going to appear on the market in the USA. I sure think it's a goodlooking car.

 

[hydralique]

Tiguan . . .

It would be nice if VW would put the TDI diesel engine in the Tiguan, but they've pretty much lost interest in diesels. Supposedly the TDI will be back in a few models in '08, but I'll believe it when I see it. They also need to fix the reliability issues with turbos and timing belts - it's not much good building a fine diesel that will last nearly forever if it gets killed by turbo or timing belt failure. With those issues solved a TDI Tiguan might be capable of decent mileage and good reliability.

 

[sikiguya]

TDI VW

We have a 2006 TDI Jetta that we absolutely love. We got it about 1 month ago (used with 47,000 miles on it) and it gets 48MPG. My husband loves it since he drives approx 70 miles to work and another 70 home again until we get to move.
Very nice on the inside too, leather heated seats, XM radio, etc. I like it but have only driven it once!

 

[foraloysius]

In Europe the Tiguan is available with a 1.4 TSI engine (petrol) and a 2.0 TDI one.

 

[hydralique]

Sikiguya - I think the '06s were the last TDIs to be sold in the US, but they weren't available in all states. The last new TDIs sold here in CA were the '03 models. My '02 Golf has seen 48 mpg on the highway, and usually gets 35 or so in town depending on the season (better in winter due to less a/c useage). I think I got 40 on my last highway trip, but that included going through Santa Barbara on Sunday afternoon which means sitting on the freeway for over an hour in first gear due to traffic.

You should check out tdiclub.com. This is a tremedous resource and can save you vast amounts of money. Be careful with the '06 to use only the proper oil, as that engine (the PD or Pump Jet) is particular about the oil and it isn't always easy to get here in the US. Some dealers will pour just about anything in. I believe the correct VW standard is 505.1.

 

[sikiguya]

Thanks!

Thanks for the great info. I will pass it along to my husband. He said that he joined the TDI group but hasn't gotten around to looking around too much there. He does have an oil change on Monday at the dealership so I hope all will go well.

 

[hydralique]

PD Oil

Using the wrong oil won't cause the engine to quit, but it can greatly increase wear on the camshaft where it actuates the fuel injectors. It's an unusual arrangement pretty much unique to certain 2004-2006 VW diesels. Using the wrong oil can also invalidate your warranty, not something you want to happen on a VW.

You husband should first check the owners manual for the correct VW specification and then ask the dealership what oil they're using and make sure it says on the bottle that it meets the spec. One big problem that the TDIs have is dealers sold so few that many are pretty ignorant of how to correctly service them. When I bought my car lots of dealers had no TDIs at all because they just didn't care to order them, and others only had a couple.

 

[sudsmaster]

As I understand it, the Tiguan will be offered in the US, first with the gas engine, and the diesel will follow later.

I'm wondering just what oil VW insists upon for its TDI motors. Coincidentally, I've switched all my gas motors (except for the yard machines) over to 15w40 Delo 400 diesel oil. It's a high quality oil, compatible with gas motors, with higher amounts of detergent that seems to do wonders for older motors that might have some sludge build-up. Even my motorcycle runs just fine on Delo 400 (except it's been parked for over a year now). The diesel motor oil is more expensive than regular gas motor oil, but about 1/3 the price of synthetic oil.

 

[hydralique]

TDI oil requirements vary according to what kind of fuel injection system is used, although all of it must be high-grade synthetic. The older cars with rotary pumps are the least critical. I use Mobil Delvac-1 (5w40) in mine. It's Mobil's best diesel oil, and costs me a little over $100 for a four gallon box. With a 10,000 mile change interval that isn't too bad. People who analyze their used oils have found that Delvac-1 is often good for significantly more than 10,000 miles in a TDI, but I do mainly urban driving so I stick with VW's recommendation there.

The PD engines are pickier because in place of the rotary pump they have unit injectors for each cylinder. Each injector has both a pump and nozzle, and is located below the camshaft. A special lobe on the cam actuates the pump. The loading on that cam lobe is evidently much greater than for a valve, hence the special oil requirements. There have been some instances of cam and lifter damage in PD cars run on poor quality oils. Castrol and Elf both make products which are certified to meet the VW 505.1 or better spec (they're up to 507.1 now I think), but in the US Castrol sells theirs mainly to VW dealers, and Elf is hard to find outside of mail order. VW is now abandoning the PD technology and going with common rail injection systems, which should be easier on oil than the PDs but they aren't reducing the standards. Other complexities are the variable service intervals on some newer cars, where the car's computer calculates when an oil change is required, and the search for better mileage. This has resulted in the newer oils being lighter, like 0w30. These oils should work just fine in my engine too, but I can get the Delvac-1 from a local oil distributor and it has been proven for years in all kinds of rotary-pump engines.

The main differences between diesel and gas-engine oils is that the diesel oils hold soot in suspension better, because diesels make more soot, but they may not deal with acids as well since gas engines make more acidic by-products which wash down the cylinder walls and into the oil.

 

[sudsmaster]

Chevron Delo 400 Multigrade SAE 15W-40. Heavy duty motor oil. Exceeds warranty requirements for all gasoline, diesel, and turbocharged engines specifying this SAE grade and API service classification. Maximizes engine and filter life.

API Service classifications: CI-4 Plus, CI-4, CH-4, CG-4, CF/SL, SJ.

Recommended for applications requiring: Caterpillar ECF-1, JASO DH1, DDC/MTU Type 1.2, MB 228.3, 228.1, Renault RLD, Cummins CES 20078, 20077, 20076, 20071, Mack EO-N Prem. Plus 03, EO-M Pollus, EO-M, DDC Power Guard 93K214, Volvo VDS, VDS02, VDS03, EMA LRG01, ACEA E5, E3, E2, MAN 271 & 3275.

Note: API SJ is the latest (or one of the latest) API classifications for gasoline engines.