URGENT: My '57 GE Combination -- Is it Done For?

[rp2813]

I've noticed a buzzing sound from what I presume is the compressor on the subject fridge.  It's been about two weeks and over the past few days it has gotten louder.

 

Just now I went to check on it because I haven't heard it running.  While standing at it, I heard a click and a brief sort of hollow growling noise --maybe a second or two long -- then another click, and silence.

 

I have a feeling the compressor has given up.

 

Any thoughts?

 

I've been scanning CL for a potential replacement in case this buzzing sound was going to become terminal, which I think it where things are at now, but so far there's nothing interesting to replace it with.

 

[turquoisedude]

Ralph, it could be a bad relay but the 'combination' designation has me wondering if yours is a model with a resistor like the wall refrigerator combinations had. The symptoms you are describing sounds a lot like my LW-11 sounded like when the resistor failed... The problem got resolved with a 9-ohm 130-volt resistor.

 

[rp2813]

Paul, the condesner fan tries to turn as the relay or whatever makes the click-groan-click sounds.  I'm hoping it's just a component like a resistor or relay, but would those cause the buzzing sound the fridge has been making lately?

 

It appears that the compressor itself jitters a bit when the clicking happens, but it won't kick in. 

 

I'll post a picture of what I can see through the small access opening on the back.

 

[turquoisedude]

I can't be sure but I think mine buzzed a bit before the resistor failed...

It may also be the condensor fan motor; I know there is a way to replace the 2-phase model fan with a regular 110v one. I don't have a lot of service literature on these fridges, though.

 

[rp2813]

I'm noticing that the fan tries to ramp up to full speed but quits.  This seems to happen even in between the clicking sounds, as the blades were trying to turn while I was vacuuming before taking the attached picture. 

 

Would the fan's failure to run prevent the compressor from kicking in?  I tend to think not, but have no idea of how the wiring sequence is configured on these systems.

 

I'm hoping that you can identify the resistor in the attached picture.  Also, the cardboard cover for the connections on top of the compressor had fallen off, if that may indicate any issues.

 

 

[turquoisedude]

Ralph from what I can see, you don't have a resistor on yours. That's a good thing because the fan motor, should it need replacing, can be replaced with a modern 120v fan.

It's possible it's the relay - the clicking you describe could be the relay trying to kick the start winding into operation to get the compressor motor running. In the meantime, the fan and compressor will try to run, then the overload protector is likely kicking in.

I am not that well-versed in relays alas, and I've probably condemned at least a couple of vintage fridges that had bad relays...

 

[rp2813]

Thanks Paul.  It sounds like an old monitor top when it tries to kick in, with a sort of gravelly solenoid sound.

 

I don't know if that connection block on top of the compressor is the relay or where else it might be located.  It's not easy to access any of this stuff through that little opening.  I'll see if ephemera has any helpful material.

 

I've posted on the monitor top forum as well since they have a section for other types of refrigerators, and I've contacted Travis directly.

 

I hope it's an easy fix.  Craigslist has been barren lately and I'd hate to have to replace this nice old fridge with something modern that has stationary shelving.  I've been spoiled!

 

[rp2813]

Travis thinks it's the relay.  The compressor has four terminals on it.  He suggests finding the OEM part rather than trying to figure out a Supco.  I don't know if the connections on the existing relay are even marked, so may be opening up a can of worms with anything but OEM.

 

Any chance there's a commonly known part number for it?

 

[turquoisedude]

I'm not sure at all... Can you post the model number? Maybe someone here has a parts list for your fridge.

 

[rp2813]

Managed to get the relay dismounted.  I don't know how they even got it in there, since it's held with a hex head screw and not enough room to get a nut driver around it.  I finally got it to move, but am going to replace that screw with a slotted hex head.

 

PN is WR7X32.  Wires are brittle, particularly the three-conductor cord that appears to go from relay to fan.  No way I can even plug this fridge in again until that section of cord is replaced.  How I even access the fan, I don't know.  There's no room to get at much of anything from the opening in the back.

 

[swestoyz]

I would have said that the Supco RO-81 would have worked fine (white-start / blue-run) until I saw the extra "green" wire. I have no idea what that does and it looks like the relay is playing around with the voltage upon start - maybe it acts as an internal heater once there's enough current against the start winding? Hopefully someone with more knowledge on the 3-wire GE set up will chime in (John).

Here's the wiring diagrams from the service manual.

https://www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?75200

Ben

EDIT - on a side note, GE's connection diagram is so easy to follow! LOL

 

[turquoisedude]

Well, how about that! The relay is the same as in my '56 Wall Fridge! So, if that's a three-conductor cord, that's the oddball 2-phase motor. The wires on mine were disintegrated, too; I found an older gent who once had a motor repair shop and he replaced the wiring.

However, I am pretty sure that if you replaced the fan motor with a new 120v one, you can connect just the black and white wires from the fan to the black and white terminals on the relay. I'm not sure what the right relay would be to replace this.

If can get a better look inside, you may still have a resistor - look for something like the ones in these pictures below. First picture is the original one that went ZOT on me, second is the replacement that the appliance gods allowed me to find on eBay.

Last picture is Rotom fan motor that I bought to replace the 2-phase one.

 

[rp2813]

I wonder if that extra green wire has any relation to the fourth terminal on the compressor. 

 

I'd like to find something that's not too expensive for a replacement and besides, a search for the PN I posted above returned nothing.

 

Meanwhile, I need to transfer freezer and fridge contents into the big basement freezer and an ice chest.

 

[wiskybill]

Hey Ralph

I looked for your WR7x32 on a couple sites, Partselect and Easy Appliance Parts, and both cross reference this to WR7x57.

There are two on Ebay. Maybe someone with more knowledge can verify.

Hope this helps.

Bill

 

[rp2813]

WR7X57

Thanks Bill.  I think I saw that other PN referenced as well, but couldn't confirm it as a viable substitute or not.  The number is certainly in the same neighborhood, although that may not mean much.  I'll look into this.

 

Paul, I'll try to determine whether that green wire on my relay goes to the compressor or a resistor somewhere.  Or do I have the resistor's purpose mixed up now?

 

Meanwhile, I borrowed a nice cooler on a rolling stand from a friend.  It's keeping the important things like beer cold.  The Penncrest freezer in the basement had plenty of room for the Combo's freezer contents.

 

[rp2813]

While researching the WR7X57, I came across a Supco R041, which claims to be equivalent to the WR7X57.

 

The thread Ben linked to above deals with the Supco R081, so I'm wondering if the R041 might work.

 

The link has more pictures, but the instructions only reference compressors with three terminals.  I can't find a good enough image of the WR7X57 to see if it will accommodate all of the wires currently connected to the WR7X32.

 

RO41 : Supco RO41 Refrigerator Relay & Overload

www.appliancepartshq.ca

 

[swestoyz]

Ralph - per the service lit (page 40), the green wire from the aux winding in the compressor activates what GE is calling an "electromagnetic coil" within the relay, that then causes the contacts to open and switch the relay/compressor from start to run. No resistor here.

I'm glad Bill found the cross reference to the WR7X57. I noticed that one as well on ebay, as it had the same 3ARR5xxxx number the lit refers to as being an A series relays - not interchangeable with previous types (M and R). Guessing either the M or R is the resistor type, and the other is the traditional two wire?

EDIT - just saw your post about the RO-41. Makes sense as the service manual calls out the fridge to be a 1/4 HP - RO-41 is rated for 1/4 to 1/3 & the RO-81 is 1/12 to 1/5. I'm wondering if the green wire from the aux winding isn't used on the solid state relay, but what I'm not sure about is how you'd wire the solid state relay in place with the guardette still wired as-is from the factory.

Maybe the grey going from the cold control to the guardette is re-wired to the black power lead on the RO-41, the red from the solid state relay to the grey going to the compressor for run, and white from the relay to the white/start on the compressor, and the blue between the guardette and the old relay is left disconnected? Curious what others thoughts might be.

Ben[this post was last edited: 2/22/2019-20:21]

 

[rp2813]

Thanks Ben, that's promising.

 

Additional searching seems to indicate that WR7X57, 29, 41 and 64 are all interchangeable.  Not a thing comes up for PN ending in 34 <span style="color: #000000;">other than the x-ref to <span style="color: #ff0000;">57</span></span>.  I'll take a closer look at the ebay item.  It seems like the most likely to have all of the connection points that I would need to make this a fairly simple replacement.  Partselect and Easy Appliance both show the PN ending it 57 as discontinued/NLA even under their own PNs.

 

I'm thinking the ebay item may be worth the gamble.  I've attached a picture of the ebay relay and one of my relay for comparison.  The ebay part seems to have the right number of terminals but I have no idea about what goes where. 

 

I did find the 3AAR5 and D1A4 designations on my relay.  I also found it dated 4/20/57, so I can't complain about it finally failing after almost 62 years.

 

One thing I'm really concerned about is the three-conductor cord from the fan to the relay.  It's super crispy and I can't see any way to get at the fan from behind the fridge or underneath it.

 

 

[this post was last edited: 2/22/2019-20:52]

 

[swestoyz]

If you have time to wait I'd totally go with the ebay relay. I ran into similar issues with the wiring on the '51. Totally crispy and I replaced what I could reach, within reason. If you're able to swap in the NOS relay without disturbing the fan motor wiring I'd say you're probably good.