Vexing Dishwasher

[trish]

Hello! I'm at my wit's end and am seeking guidance.
We have an 8 year old Kitchenaid dishwasher.
Very often it has water in the bottom when done, sometimes soapy.
Sometimes the cycle seems to finish in no time.
Sometimes it seems to languish a long time.
Sometimes it seems to run fine!
Yesterday the "clean" light would not stop blinking.
The heat "lock" light does not go on.Dishes are never piping hot.
We have reset the computer and in the past also took apart and cleaned.
Any thoughts or advice appreciated!

 

[appnut]

It would be of tremendous help if you would provide us with the model number.  

 

[appnut]

I'm guessing your heating element is not working.  

 

[trish]

)))

Wowza Appnut!
You are awesome.
This diagnosis resonates & fits the puzzle,as I just thought of some minor things I didn't mention....like the dishes are often wet, they are never real hot at finish, and if I use dishwasher tabs in plastic there is often a clump of "gummy" at the bottom..
Now, my Model# is KUDL03FVSSO.
Is this a costly repair?
Can we tackle it ourselves?

 

[DADoES]

 
Look up your model number to get parts listings and/or diagrams at an online parts source such as AppliancePartsPros.com or RepairClinic.com.  Identify the part needed, then do a search for more sources of that part if you want to shop price.  YouTube or some of the parts sources may have how-to videos for doing the procedure.

The DW likely will have to be uninstalled for access to replace the heating element, being that the wires and anchor nuts are under the bottom of the tub.

I'd also advise making sure the element is the only problem.  You mention water sometimes remaining but whether that indicates a problem depends how much water.  Some small amount of water left down in the pump is normal but shouldn't be enough to openly see.

BTW, the last character is a zero, not a letter O.

 

[arbilab]

once heater is fixed...

Results and speed improve if you purge the hot water line before starting.  Also helps to leave the hot faucet on a slow dribble, but of course there's a cost involved.  

 

[petek]

Would a faulty heating element cause noticable and soapy water to remain in the bottom or a blinking clean light.

 

[trish]

Thanks...

Thanks to all for your input.
We've been hitting the cancel button to drain the residual water, when it's there.
In retrospect, I suspect the heating element isn't getting very hot. Now that's it's in my viewfinder, I am going to focus on that when I do a load today---and feel it when the cycle's done. From the websites DADoes recommended, the repair looks doable & the heating element is affordable. We are also going to clean the area with the "chopper" as it's been awhile. But the last time (when we found glass & lemon pits), I remember wondering if my husband replaced the little black rubber flapper piece correctly (forgive me, I don't know the proper name)--what is it responsible for? Could it cause havoc if it isn't positioned right?

 

[DADoES]

 
The Clean light may blink if the target temperature isn't reached for a hi-temp or sanitary rinse option.

Heating element failure of course won't directly cause remaining water in the tub but the user could find water if the controller pauses or aborts the cycle on a heating fault.  That's probably not what normally would happen but these electronic-control machines may be unpredictable on behavior ... the designing engineers probably don't know for sure how the various subroutines can interact.

 

[coldspot66]

Most times it is the heater, but sometimes it's the electronic control heater relay. Also if water circulation is weak from a lot of junk at the inlet where the chopper assembly is, that can cause a blinking clean light. You did say that the d/w was not drying at all, so most likely, it is the heater. Dishwasher has to pulled out fully in order to replace the heater.

 

[combo52]

Blinking Clean Light

7 blinks and a pause is a heating problem, I have changed at least 100+ heaters on these DWs without ever pulling one out by reaching under the machine [ I do have long thin arms ] many may find it easier to remove machine, WP suggests just lifting the pump assembly out of the machine and just reaching through the opening in the bottom of the tank to reach the heater nuts.

 

John L.

 

[sugarshock]

Proper drain problems can also be caused by not having a high enough loop on the drain hose if you don't have an air gap at the kitchen sink.

 

[48bencix]

Also check

I would also check to see if there are clogs where the drain hose enters the garbage disposal. This happened to my dishwasher. Just remove the clamp and look in the drain hose.

 

[trish]

update......

OK--we are back to vexing stage ;(
Here is an update...
BTW--we don't have a garbage disposal.

I checked the heater element last week while the cycle was in process and the water was hot and the heating element was blazing hot (just ask my finger!) compared to the time before when both the water & the element were cold....
It gave us pause before buying a new element...so we decided to do the "clean-out".
There was gunky food stuff under spinner area and also stuck in the uppermost ceiling spinner arm. The chopper looked okay but the check valve was waffled--so we bought a new one, cleaned that out, got everything back in order~with fingers crossed.
Then tried to do a control reset and nothing was happening, initially. Finally, it went through the green light runs.
We ran a load last night and voila---upon finish, we open to find....soapy water in the bottom. The dishes looked clean and were dry. But, maybe that was an illusion.
So, my question before we continue or heave it, is, can the heater element still get hot, yet be faulty?

 

[combo52]

Hi Trish, If the machine is foaming a lot in the wash cycle the foam will not be pumped down the drain and after the cycle ends you are left with standing water after the foam finally turns back into water, [ open the DW door in the main wash after the Det dispenser has opened and check for foaming, then check again before the main wash goes to drain ]

 

Excess foaming can be caused by many different things

 

Pre rinsing or pre washing dishes before loading the DW,Washing sponges in the DW that have been used for cleaning, Using Detergent pods again with clean dishes, Rinse agent in the RA dispenser, A bad drain check valve allowing air to be sucked back into the DW while it is running, soft water, incoming too hot.

 

Combinations of these things can case foaming, many users do not realize that DWs are NOT designed to wash CLEAN dishes and trying to do so can cause all sorts of interesting service problems.

 

John L.

 

[trish]

continues

Hi John!
Thanks so much for your input.
So,the check valve is new.
I have tried both powders & pods.
Ran the water very hot prior to start...
When there is soapy water remaining, I hit cancel& it drains.
Then,I just run a plain rinse, just to be sure there isn't soap residue.
After that, I have "clean" standing water remaining ;(
Which, I then hit cancel to drain.
My husband basically suggested rinsing off every piece I put in.
I don't put in dishes loaded with food...;(
One other thing happened, which you might edify me on--
The dishwasher sounded "loud"--so I opened to take a peek.
There was no water in the bottom and the heater element was HOT.
Is that normal?

 

[trish]

PS

This fell out while we were replacing the check valve.
It's wafer thin and I can't find it anywhere in parts references.
Don't know if it is relevant in this matter.

 

[trish]

...More forensics if anyone is still out there ;-)

Hello Again....
Wanted to ask again if a "bad" heater element will still get hot? It does get hot, but not all the time--I admit I don't know the sequence of cycles though. Would consider replacing--but don't want to make the SO move it if not necessary.

Since this has been going on for about 1 1/2 months I noticed and reset for the "7 blinking clean light" only twice.

Am seriously thinking of just getting KDTM354DSS (it matches my other appliances)and even though it is apparently d/c--some places still have it. Opinions on this model pro/con?

Don't want to spend a lot on this 9yo, especially if this is a control panel problem.

Here is some forensic evidence of :
1) How it looked on "clean"
2) How it looked after I did "rinse only".

My previous post included pix of a strip that fell off when we were working on the new check valve. Wondering what it is and if it's relevant to the issue?

The DW still has a cabbage like odor, even though we cleaned it out ;(

Any opinions appreciated!