bpetersxx
Well-known member
does anyone do it this way anymore
vintage telephones on moderm line
- Thread starter bpetersxx
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Yes, I have several, some hooked up with the loud bell you can hear outside. You need a phone line to the house first, then a filter between the jack on the wall and the actual phone and it works and internet works when plugged directly , I used to work for the phone company and I hooked a lot of my old phones with a jack in every room with that filter. Even rotary dials will work.
Filter?
What do you mean by a filter on the line? I have an old 70's Western Electric in my basement. Probably from when the house was built (1975). It works fine on an internet phone line, no filter used. What does the filter do?
Hardly ever use a phone in the basement, so I just left it there by the washer. in case the phone rings when I'm in the basement. Wireless phones upstairs. Just fed the line from my modem to the wall jack, and all jacks work.
What do you mean by a filter on the line? I have an old 70's Western Electric in my basement. Probably from when the house was built (1975). It works fine on an internet phone line, no filter used. What does the filter do?
Hardly ever use a phone in the basement, so I just left it there by the washer. in case the phone rings when I'm in the basement. Wireless phones upstairs. Just fed the line from my modem to the wall jack, and all jacks work.
The filter on an ADSL or VDSL is to help improve the voice quality, by filtering out the frequencies used by the digital Internet service and vice versa
If you have a fully digital Internet service over coax/cable or fibre, your modem may not generate enough current to support an old telephone. You also need to account for the newer service not supporting pulse dialing.
https://www.accesscomms.com.au/what-does-an-adsl-filter-do/
If you have a fully digital Internet service over coax/cable or fibre, your modem may not generate enough current to support an old telephone. You also need to account for the newer service not supporting pulse dialing.
https://www.accesscomms.com.au/what-does-an-adsl-filter-do/
Anyone who still has an active POTS line into their homes shouldn't have a problem with "old" landline rotary or touch tone phones I shouldn't wonder.
OTOH as mentioned if landline service has been disconnected or otherwise not live fiber or cable service likely won't do it.
As with so much else nowadays some clever chops have come up with work around devices to get POTS phones to work with VOIP.
Then you have this:
Memories:
[this post was last edited: 4/23/2025-16:14]
OTOH as mentioned if landline service has been disconnected or otherwise not live fiber or cable service likely won't do it.
As with so much else nowadays some clever chops have come up with work around devices to get POTS phones to work with VOIP.
Then you have this:
Memories:
[this post was last edited: 4/23/2025-16:14]
I'm seriously considering the abandonment of switched network telephony which has become ridiculously expensive through AT&T -- like ten times the price for flat rate service when I started working for Pacific Bell in 1991. So much for any rate increase denials from the CPUC since the arrogant cowboys from SBC took over . . . But, I much prefer talking on a real, ergonomically designed handset like the G1 type on my 1950 Western Electric 500 model desk phone than a flat hunk of glass that's quirky, infinitely less reliable and IMO a triggering nuisance, not to mention a menace to societies the world over.
Currently I have fiber service, but the dial tone still comes from the same central office as copper service. The problem is that it passes through the wireless gateway for my AT&T internet, so if there's a power failure, the phone fails too. I know this sounds like VOIP, but it isn't. I can't stress this enough -- dial tone comes from the switching office, it is not fabricated in some ISP's overheated data center. The only similarity to VOIP is that it relies on household power rather than CO battery, which basically never fails.
So, given that the worst trait of VOIP applies to my land line, it doesn't make economic sense to pay for telephone service that isn't any more reliable than VOIP. I need to make sure my rotary dial phones will work over VOIP and that like Tim, my wake-the-dead subset ringer will still work as well. I know there's a "Rota-Tone" device that will convert pulse dialing to tone, but since so many ARU menus now recognize pulse dialing, I'm wondering if the same applies to VOIP service.
Tim, can you expand on the system you have rigged up if it's something other than a "Rota-Tone" device? I haven't bothered to visit the Classic Rotary Phones forum yet, as I'm still mulling over making the switch. I have my family's same (originally alpha-numeric) phone number that's been sitting in the same switching office since 1960, and that legacy is making it difficult but the monthly cost makes it hard to justify maintaining that anymore.
Currently I have fiber service, but the dial tone still comes from the same central office as copper service. The problem is that it passes through the wireless gateway for my AT&T internet, so if there's a power failure, the phone fails too. I know this sounds like VOIP, but it isn't. I can't stress this enough -- dial tone comes from the switching office, it is not fabricated in some ISP's overheated data center. The only similarity to VOIP is that it relies on household power rather than CO battery, which basically never fails.
So, given that the worst trait of VOIP applies to my land line, it doesn't make economic sense to pay for telephone service that isn't any more reliable than VOIP. I need to make sure my rotary dial phones will work over VOIP and that like Tim, my wake-the-dead subset ringer will still work as well. I know there's a "Rota-Tone" device that will convert pulse dialing to tone, but since so many ARU menus now recognize pulse dialing, I'm wondering if the same applies to VOIP service.
Tim, can you expand on the system you have rigged up if it's something other than a "Rota-Tone" device? I haven't bothered to visit the Classic Rotary Phones forum yet, as I'm still mulling over making the switch. I have my family's same (originally alpha-numeric) phone number that's been sitting in the same switching office since 1960, and that legacy is making it difficult but the monthly cost makes it hard to justify maintaining that anymore.
I still have the old copper lines to my house and my calls pass thru 3 more switching stations before going to the main one about 12 miles away. I did have to have them come in and replace my modem the first of the year and the tech said they will be replacing all the lines to fiber in the near future but he said my setup will still work fine.
Reply #3
Thanks, I was fully aware of ADSL filters, but DSL wasn't mentioned in the OP, and he stated modern line, which I assumed to mean VOIP with an internet provider. DSL is no longer "modern". And it will work without one, just may have noise on the line.
Cable Internet/phone modems put out 48 volts, just like standard pots lines did. The phone will still ring fine. Mine is an old touch tone, but my neighbor has an old rotary in his basement, it works too.
Thanks, I was fully aware of ADSL filters, but DSL wasn't mentioned in the OP, and he stated modern line, which I assumed to mean VOIP with an internet provider. DSL is no longer "modern". And it will work without one, just may have noise on the line.
Cable Internet/phone modems put out 48 volts, just like standard pots lines did. The phone will still ring fine. Mine is an old touch tone, but my neighbor has an old rotary in his basement, it works too.
We got rid of At&T POTS over 10 years ago. I did the installation and back fed the VOIP thru the wall jack for the POTS jack near the gateway and disconnected the POTS line in the At&T service box on the outside of the house. This worked great until about six years ago and then the phones stopped working for some reason. So I got a cordless set with three additional handsets and plugged the main base into the gateway.
I can plug one of the old receiver phones directly into the gateway and it will work, but in order to have an extension in every room I had to go with cordless because none of the three original wall jacks will transmit the VOIP signal anymore. I’ve gotten used to it and it’s all good.
I’ll NEVER go back to AT&T again! The last three years we had them the DSL was terrible! I had to buy a new line filter for the DSL every 6 months, they charged for EVERY LD call and the internet was slower than the second coming of Christ.
Eddie[this post was last edited: 4/23/2025-18:57]
I can plug one of the old receiver phones directly into the gateway and it will work, but in order to have an extension in every room I had to go with cordless because none of the three original wall jacks will transmit the VOIP signal anymore. I’ve gotten used to it and it’s all good.
I’ll NEVER go back to AT&T again! The last three years we had them the DSL was terrible! I had to buy a new line filter for the DSL every 6 months, they charged for EVERY LD call and the internet was slower than the second coming of Christ.
Eddie[this post was last edited: 4/23/2025-18:57]
In the last 20 years, POTS lines slowly transitioned to VOIP at local cabinets (without advertising as such), but still had the benefit of battery backup. So you had some recourse from cell phone tower lockup during emergencies up until the batteries expired. In the last 12 months, Verizon has been on a tear to remove the remaining copper infrastructure, so even this is in jeopardy.
Unfortunately, this "POTS" service was aimed at folks who really only wanted their 1990's cordless phones to keep on working, so it was a 50/50 gamble on if pulse dialing would work in your area, or if ringing voltage was significant enough to drive mechanical ringers.
We had OOMA for years, which is a VOIP solution that plugs into your existing home phone network, mostly just for fun with the old phone collection. A Panasonic 308 PBX takes care of pulse to DTMF conversion, has plenty of ringer voltage, and also allows for station-to-station calls within the house. These pop up on ebay occasionally.
With monthly surcharges and taxes mounting with OOMA, I'm thinking about jumping to Asterisk.
https://www.asterisk.org/
Unfortunately, this "POTS" service was aimed at folks who really only wanted their 1990's cordless phones to keep on working, so it was a 50/50 gamble on if pulse dialing would work in your area, or if ringing voltage was significant enough to drive mechanical ringers.
We had OOMA for years, which is a VOIP solution that plugs into your existing home phone network, mostly just for fun with the old phone collection. A Panasonic 308 PBX takes care of pulse to DTMF conversion, has plenty of ringer voltage, and also allows for station-to-station calls within the house. These pop up on ebay occasionally.
With monthly surcharges and taxes mounting with OOMA, I'm thinking about jumping to Asterisk.
https://www.asterisk.org/
I've been using voip.ms for well over a decade, great affordable service. Ported my number - that we've had since the 60's - use a Panasonic cordless system with 5 handsets plus a couple of hardwired handsets all connected to my Cisco PAP2T voip adapter. Lots of customization over the years, the Pap2t has lots of options. Just copied all my settings to an identical setup for my brother. One if the things I really like is NOT dialing an area code for local calls.
Fortunately we still have a POTS line. I have a combo of several rotary and touch tone phones from my collection in use. I have one of those cell 2 jack boxes from when we lived in our old home but didn't really like it. i'm holding on to our POTS line as long as i can due to cell service goes in and out here.
"area code for local calls" is less a VoIP issue than a mandate as they increase use of non x11 numbers for short code dialing (988 for suicide prevention...for example). They are moving to mandatory 10 digit dialing everywhere (landline, POTS, etc) to accommodate these hotlines.
We’ve had mandatory 10 digit dialing here for two or more years now. When I first moved to Petaluma, Calif. in 1970 all the prefixes in Petaluma were either 762 or 763 for the old POrter exchange. To make a local call then you only had to dial the last 5 digit's. So if I was calling the number of where I worked at the time which was 763-3344, I only needed to dial 3-3344. It was so simple.
Eddie
Eddie
Up until about ten years ago, we didn't ever have to dial 1 -- even for long distance. Before that, we didn't even have to dial all ten digits for adjacent area codes. Then the overlay area code went live and the permissive dialing period ended and we didn't just have to start dialing 1 -- we had to dial a full ten digits just to call next door. Our area code was apparently the last in the nation to get the mandatory 1+ dialing. I still take down phone numbers with only 7 digits. I can count on one hand how many numbers I've dialed with the overlaid area code.
Ralph,
As long as we’ve had area codes we’ve had to dial the area code to direct dial a number in another area code. My area code is 707, if you wanted to make a call to say Marin County which is area code 415 you’ve always had to dial at least the 415 area code first. The need to dial “1” before the area code has been required here as long as we’ve had direct dialed LD for as long as I can recall for direct dialed LD calls.
Once we went to 10 digit dialing over two years ago it hasn’t been necessary to dial 1 and then the area code as long and the call was to a number in the 707 area code. Calls to another area code have always required dialing 1 first then the area code.
I don’t understand how a call made from the 408 area code for San Jose to say area code 415 for San Francisco could have been made without dialing at least the 415 area code?
Eddie
As long as we’ve had area codes we’ve had to dial the area code to direct dial a number in another area code. My area code is 707, if you wanted to make a call to say Marin County which is area code 415 you’ve always had to dial at least the 415 area code first. The need to dial “1” before the area code has been required here as long as we’ve had direct dialed LD for as long as I can recall for direct dialed LD calls.
Once we went to 10 digit dialing over two years ago it hasn’t been necessary to dial 1 and then the area code as long and the call was to a number in the 707 area code. Calls to another area code have always required dialing 1 first then the area code.
I don’t understand how a call made from the 408 area code for San Jose to say area code 415 for San Francisco could have been made without dialing at least the 415 area code?
Eddie
Eddie, I know -- but when my sister lived in Berkeley, which was still a 415 area code back then (510 went live in late 1991 IIRC) I would always dial ten digits, but then our next door neighbor told me she just dialed the 7-digit number to Berkeley so I started doing the same thing and calls went right through. I started doing this for all calls to 415 numbers. I think it was because there were few enough phone lines back when we only had three area codes within the entire LATA, AKA Local Access Transport Area, and I presume there weren't any duplicated prefixes across those three area codes. I think this pre-dated electronic switching equipment, which could have had something to do with it, at least on the originating end of the call.
There are at least eight area codes within our LATA now, and for sure there are duplicated prefixes among them, so 1+ dialing is required. Since 707 has no overlay, it makes sense that dialing 1 wouldn't be required for calls to other 707 numbers. The same may be true of 415, 510, 650, 925, and 831, but since 408 shares the same boundary as 669, 1+ area code is required for all local calls including to other 408 numbers. I'm certain the technology exists to eliminate 1+ ten digit dialing for calls originating and terminating within 408, but Ma Bell sees no reason to offer it. Only the older generation cares, and Big Telco is all about eliminating land lines rather than investing another dime into their continued use and maintenance.
I had a friend who lived in Napa and he said they still had to dial Operator to place long distance calls until 1979. I highly doubt that 707 is that far behind the times anymore, but it does make sense that calling within your own area code would only require seven digits. I've never been in favor of overlay area codes, but in the age of cell phones, the term "area code" has lost all meaning. That's a term that Ma Bell came up with to introduce the new North American (direct) Dialing System to subscribers. There is no such thing as an area code in telco lingo. It's known as the NPA -- Number Planning Area -- which is more applicable in this day and age. And since nobody memorizes telephone numbers anymore (except me, it seems) and just taps a name on a screen, the number of digits required to dial doesn't even matter.
There are at least eight area codes within our LATA now, and for sure there are duplicated prefixes among them, so 1+ dialing is required. Since 707 has no overlay, it makes sense that dialing 1 wouldn't be required for calls to other 707 numbers. The same may be true of 415, 510, 650, 925, and 831, but since 408 shares the same boundary as 669, 1+ area code is required for all local calls including to other 408 numbers. I'm certain the technology exists to eliminate 1+ ten digit dialing for calls originating and terminating within 408, but Ma Bell sees no reason to offer it. Only the older generation cares, and Big Telco is all about eliminating land lines rather than investing another dime into their continued use and maintenance.
I had a friend who lived in Napa and he said they still had to dial Operator to place long distance calls until 1979. I highly doubt that 707 is that far behind the times anymore, but it does make sense that calling within your own area code would only require seven digits. I've never been in favor of overlay area codes, but in the age of cell phones, the term "area code" has lost all meaning. That's a term that Ma Bell came up with to introduce the new North American (direct) Dialing System to subscribers. There is no such thing as an area code in telco lingo. It's known as the NPA -- Number Planning Area -- which is more applicable in this day and age. And since nobody memorizes telephone numbers anymore (except me, it seems) and just taps a name on a screen, the number of digits required to dial doesn't even matter.
Not dialing the area code is nor really a voip function but how my PAP2T adapter is programmed. It's not really a big deal but for me it's a "nice" feature I like.
If you are not familiar with the Cisco/Linksys PAP2 adapters they are highly customizable. You can change the dial tone, and the ring cadence among dozens and dozens of settings. It's a shame the product was discontinued, but readily available on ebay.
If you are not familiar with the Cisco/Linksys PAP2 adapters they are highly customizable. You can change the dial tone, and the ring cadence among dozens and dozens of settings. It's a shame the product was discontinued, but readily available on ebay.
Until recently, the Cincinnati area had three area codes. 513 for OH, 859 for KY, and 812 for IN. For example, a subscriber in the Cincinnati exchange can call certain northern Kentucky and some nearby Indiana exchanges, most other 513, and selected 937 area code numbers, as a local call. When overlay area code were introduced, it became necessary to dial the applicable area code in addition to the seven digit number. Sometime in the mid 1990s, 513 was split, with Hamilton County, parts of Clermont, Butler, and Warren counties retaining the original area code, and the northern and eastern sections changed to 937, which includes the Dayton area. Previous to 1998, it was long distance to call from my immediate area (served by GTE) to any of the Cincinnati Bell (now AltaFiber) exchanges. We currently have local service to several of their exchanges. GTE became Verizon, then was sold off to Frontier. At the present time, AltaFiber is in the process of installing their lines in my area. I plan to be connected to them as soon as they begin offering service. Local calling is included to all other AltaFiber customers anywhere in the Cincinnati area. I don't know if Frontier will have enough customers to continue offering service here. I've heard they may sell their franchise to AltaFiber when that system is completed.
