Waiting on the Prop. 8 decision

[panthera]

I thought it might be good to gather thoughts and feelings today - and to start before we know for sure.

Personally - I am furious. Why on earth should the civil rights of gays be subject to mob rule?

Who appointed the christianists the gate keepers to human status?

The only other modern culture I can think of which acts this way is Iran.

Not that I feel strongly about it, or anything.

How do you feel?

 

[kenmoreforever]

Obama is "ghettonizing" america as we once knew it. I am a straight married man but if gay people want to marry, let them and stop playing ring around the rosey with their lives.

 

[danemodsandy]

Result Is In...

...And it's not good.

Essentially, the court upheld Prop. 8, although the 18,000 or so marriages that have already taken place are to be considered valid.

I guess I've been to California for the last time; I cannot in good conscience spend my money in a state that would do such a thing.

This "will of the people" horsetwaddle is getting out of hand. I remind anyone who believes that the will of voters should serve as a final authority on anyone's civil rights that the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was designed to correct decades of injustice created by the "will" of white voters.

Bad day. For us, for California, for America, and for the law.

 

[~sudsshane]

Is anyone really surprised?

I don't see how they can ban gay marriage, yet allow the 18,000 or so marriages taken place before the ban to remain valid.
This is going to be a MAJOR mess, that will wind up in the U.S. Supreme Court.
N.Y. is our next best hope, and I feel confident we will prevail.

 

[panthera]

I look at it this way

We got arrogant. We gave the christianists a chance.
We blew it.

Now, our fellow gays and lesbians in California are paying the price.

On the bright side, by permitting the 18,000 marriages to stand, the court has made very clear that the situation is untenable.

Remind me again why a gay man or woman would want to be a Republican or support the christianists?

 

[~sudsshane]

Ain't taking the bait...

Have a nice Day! =)

 

[panthera]

Shane,

I am not sure I want this before the Supreme Court in its current composition.

Roberts lied through his teeth, at least two other Supremes made clear that we are sub-human in the Lawrence-Texas ruling...

You're right, if NY and New Hampshire (despite that gay Republican, quod erat demonstrandum) and a few others now really stick it to the christianists and grant us human status, this might just help congress grow some balls.

Actually, next up is the Washington DC recognition of marriages performed outside of the District act, no?

 

[~sudsshane]

Washington D.C

The D.C city council has already voted to legalize gay marriages conducted in other states.
Because Washington D.C is not a state, Congress must approve it before it can become law.

What is taking them so long?

 

[twintubdexter]

Equality California

How well I remember the Prop 8 television ad campaign. The sad Equality California spot with the kindly old couple sitting on their livingroom sofa behaving like Mr & Mrs Milktoast reminiscing about their honey-sweet gay daughter. Then the many many spots with little Suzy-Q awash in tears from her teacher's mention of a gay couple all the while with her fine Christian mother in the backround behaving like Pitty Pat Hamilton in Gone With The Wind after she discovered Yankees in Atlanta. And the Kenneth Star/Princeton ad where he told of horror stories of priests being forced to marry gays. You saw these lie-filled pro Prop 8 ads over and over again. Oh, there were two decent Equality California spots, one with Diane Fienstien and another with Ellen, but those were rarely seen and appeared much too late.

Today I received a request for another donation from Equality California, and frankly I'd rather flush my money down the toilet. As far as I'm concerned EC was responsible for the passage of Prop 8, and unless they are going to show a little backbone in the future, we might as well all become Mormons.

 

[panthera]

Shane,

That's not quite right. Congress need only act if the want to strip citizens of DC of rights or overturn a law.

In fact, Congress almost never intervenes except when DC grants Negroes or gays full human status. Right now, a christianist (Republican, of course) is trying to get support to overturn their extension of human status to us within the deadline, but is not getting much support within the legislative body.

 

[rp2813]

I am not surprised by the court's decision. In the early going there were comments made by some of the justices indicating that they couldn't see any reason or avenue for overturning Prop 8. The vote was 6-1, so at least somebody on the court understands that the initiative process is no longer any way to govern. That's how Gray Davis was recalled--by big money, in this case Darryl Issa, financing the movement to boot Gray and install Arnold. Lots of good that did. As far as I'm concerned, considering the abuse of the initiative system that we have been witnessing for quite some time now, it's time to start requiring a 2/3 majority for any initiative to pass.

I can tell you right now, the christianists already have their plans laid out for yet another lawsuit to rescind the marriages that were performed before Prop 8 passed. This hateful mob simply won't rest until they have pushed every last gay person back into the closet thrown away the key. They are no different from the Taliban with their complete lack of reason and faith-induced blindness toward any sort of lifestyle and belief system than their own. These are the same people who feel ownership of assault weapons should remain legal. There is no reasoning with Ruby Ridge renegades or Waco whackos.

Meanwhile, we are seeing the East Coast and even the Midwest take the lead on this issue. California is way behind the trend and it's shameful.

Ralph

 

[maytagbear]

Not really surprised,

but it's still unpleasant unto painful.

Lawrence/Maytagbear

 

[golittlesport]

It's a sad day in sunny CA

 

[peterh770]

Read the decision. The CA SC ruled that Prop 8 was constitutionally passed. Not that it was wrong or that it was right. The SC followed the law, and Prop 8 was voted on by the people of CA and it will stand. Now it is time for the people of CA to use legislation, not the courts, to properly pass it, as it was done successfully in other states. The only thing is that in CA, they leave about everything up to the masses to pass. Therefore, it is time for the community out there to reach out and have meaningful discussions to educate and persuade so that when this comes up for a vote again, it will pass by the people as so dictated by their Constitution.

 

[panthera]

Peter,

You're right - and that is why it hurts.

 

[~sudsshane]

Let's not give up .........

"The lone, but brave, Justice Carlos Moreno said it well", Prop 8 "violates the essence of the equal protection clause of the California Constitution and fundamentally alters its scope and meaning".
"We will join with his voice, and bring equality BACK to all our CA brothers and sisters, as well as further equality in the rest of the nation".

"Hope lives on through our action".

Quoting my friend, gay activist Stuart Milk, in an email sent to me today.

Trust me, with people like Stuart Milk on our side fighting, this ban won't stand. He is every bit as tenatious as his Uncle Harvey was.

 

[andrewinorlando]

We need New York, New Jersey and Rhode Island to wrap up the whole Northeast corridor, where one of the largest populations lives.

California is a disappointment, no dount. But let's remember, this was started by one Mormon asshole, and it can be overturned. All the court did was to say that proper procedure was followed to get the Amendment 8 approved, not that it's right.

Please support the work of the Human Rights Campaign, they are leading a major charge against California, and will need all the help they can get!!!

 

[rp2813]

This state is just plain schitzo. Nobody had an issue with Prop 215, which passed easily, and quite some time ago. Good thing, as there are plenty of people needing extra doses of their medication today.

 

[pturo]

It will go to the Supremes. The mere fact that those who got in before prop 8 are legally married and those that married after are not recognized violates equal protection and creates a class that is seperate, but equal, like Plessy vs Furgeson. Blacks are equal, but cannot go to school with whites. Seperate but equal was overturned based on Brown v the Board of Education. You cannot create a class of people defined by the law, then deny them equal rights. California recognizes gay marraige in part, by those who got in before Prop 8. How can that be? A constitutional right that has a time limit? Absurd.