verizonbear
Well-known member
Just curious, I wonder what year all manufacturers went to either the stainless or plastic tube models. I had an 18 inch Frigidaire that cleaned well and had a porcelain interior I brought in about 1993 or so
Year when US manufacturers stopped using porcelain interiors on dishwashers?
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To answer your question, we would have to look at each manufacturer separately, as this didn't happen all at once.
I know that GE was making their Permatuf interior on some Potscrubbers as early as 1977 (as we bought one with our new home that year) but I think they had come onto the market even earlier. I also know that some GE produced low-end Hotpoints still had procelain tubs in the late 80s, maybe longer. Hotpoint had a couple portables with them, maybe undercounter models as well.
With that said, what applies to D&M, Whirlpool, etc. would be better represented by other who know better than I, but this switch certainly was not done all at the same time.
Gordon
I know that GE was making their Permatuf interior on some Potscrubbers as early as 1977 (as we bought one with our new home that year) but I think they had come onto the market even earlier. I also know that some GE produced low-end Hotpoints still had procelain tubs in the late 80s, maybe longer. Hotpoint had a couple portables with them, maybe undercounter models as well.
With that said, what applies to D&M, Whirlpool, etc. would be better represented by other who know better than I, but this switch certainly was not done all at the same time.
Gordon
Don't Believe It Was An Absolute Change Over
Rather a gradual shift began by one or more manufacturers that soon spread market wide.
Baked porcelain enamel on steel is expensive to do (when done well that is), and while long lasting can chip and or become damaged over time. If the damage is not repaired such a chip, the exposed metal will begin to rust and sooner or later the entire tub has to go. Being as thay may have seen early KA dishwashers with porcelian liners that survived decades if not generations of use without damage.
As the cost of making appliances such as dishwashers and washing machines increased versus what consumers were willing to spend, something had to give. Plastics replaced porcelain and or enamel steel on low and some middle range models, whilst SS became the standard for high end versions.
Over time as the cost of SS has dropped you now see it used for tub liners in even MOL and BOL machines.
In some ways SS makes a better liner material as it is not harmed by acids, won't discolor, durable, and holds heat quite well.
Rather a gradual shift began by one or more manufacturers that soon spread market wide.
Baked porcelain enamel on steel is expensive to do (when done well that is), and while long lasting can chip and or become damaged over time. If the damage is not repaired such a chip, the exposed metal will begin to rust and sooner or later the entire tub has to go. Being as thay may have seen early KA dishwashers with porcelian liners that survived decades if not generations of use without damage.
As the cost of making appliances such as dishwashers and washing machines increased versus what consumers were willing to spend, something had to give. Plastics replaced porcelain and or enamel steel on low and some middle range models, whilst SS became the standard for high end versions.
Over time as the cost of SS has dropped you now see it used for tub liners in even MOL and BOL machines.
In some ways SS makes a better liner material as it is not harmed by acids, won't discolor, durable, and holds heat quite well.
It may also be many manufacturers had supplies of porcelian tubs produced laying about, thus once that supply was exhausted the switch was made to either plastic or SS. IIRC, one could purchase new porcelian tubs from various supply sources long after they were discontinued from general use.
From what one remembers reading the process of making porcelian or enamel on steel tub liners was not the most environmentally friendly. This could have been another reason many got shot of them.
From what one remembers reading the process of making porcelian or enamel on steel tub liners was not the most environmentally friendly. This could have been another reason many got shot of them.
cphifer5115
Well-known member
I know for the Maytag Corp. (since I used to work for Maytag in their dishwasher division in Jackson, TN) when they moved their dishwasher manfacturering from Newton, Iowa to Jackson, TN in 1992 is when Maytag started makeing plastic tub dishwashers. It wasn't until late 1999 when they made their first stainless steal tub dishwasher. and in 2002 maytag went to making tall tub in plastic and in 03 tall tub stainless steal. in 06 maytag started producing the dish drawer dishwasher under the Kenmore name. eventually a maytag model and a kitchenaid model did follow. it was also 06 when the Whrilpool Corp. bought out the Maytag Corp. and in Aug of 2009 Whirlpool shut down the dishwasher faclity in Jackson, TN to move all dishwasher production to their plant in Findlay, OH.
FROM PORCELAIN TO SS AND PLASTIC
The 1990s were the decade of change for manufactories getting away from porcelain on steel DW tanks. WP and D&M on 24" machines stopped around 1990, MT as mentioned around 1992. KA stopped with the interduction of the 24 series around 1998, they have made nothing but SS tanks since [ except the useless dish-drawer models which are plastic tanked]. GE didn't have a porcelain tanked machine since the late 1950s, but thier sister div Hotpoint was probably the last full sized machine to sell porcelain tank machines going into the mid 1990s I believe.
Porcelain tanks were not that expensive to make but the problems of shipping damage made it very expensive to keep selling. I remember seeing up to 50 brand-new KA KD 21 and 22 machines being scrapped at one time at various distributers because of shipping damage to the tanks and doors. GE knew what they were doing when they used the crappy Plastisol coating on thier tanks as they saved a small fortune on damage complaints. We threw away so many GE DWs that were working fine that the sump or inner door panel had rusted out on. I used to love to get ahold of the KAs that were being scrapped and we would strip them for the racks and pump and motors, timers etc.
The 1990s were the decade of change for manufactories getting away from porcelain on steel DW tanks. WP and D&M on 24" machines stopped around 1990, MT as mentioned around 1992. KA stopped with the interduction of the 24 series around 1998, they have made nothing but SS tanks since [ except the useless dish-drawer models which are plastic tanked]. GE didn't have a porcelain tanked machine since the late 1950s, but thier sister div Hotpoint was probably the last full sized machine to sell porcelain tank machines going into the mid 1990s I believe.
Porcelain tanks were not that expensive to make but the problems of shipping damage made it very expensive to keep selling. I remember seeing up to 50 brand-new KA KD 21 and 22 machines being scrapped at one time at various distributers because of shipping damage to the tanks and doors. GE knew what they were doing when they used the crappy Plastisol coating on thier tanks as they saved a small fortune on damage complaints. We threw away so many GE DWs that were working fine that the sump or inner door panel had rusted out on. I used to love to get ahold of the KAs that were being scrapped and we would strip them for the racks and pump and motors, timers etc.
I beg to differ
<a name="start_35011.524081"><strong>GE knew what they were doing when they used the crappy Plastisol coating on thier tanks</a></strong>
<strong>I have and have seen GE dw's built-ins and portables with plastisol tanks that have lasted well beyond 50 years. Seems to me if the user of the machine was reasonably careful not to put deep gashes through the plastisol coating (probably from careless loading of silverware and sharp utensils), those things had about the same lifespan as porcelain on steel tanks. Whatever company manufactured that Plastisol coating ( I saw an ad for the company recently and, drat, I didn't get it--I'll try to remember it, it wasn't DuPont) they did their job well; it was as durable a finish as you could hope for. </strong>
<strong>Also, I remember someone telling me in the early 70's that right before a workers' strike it wasn't too uncommon for somebody to "accidentally" throw some sugar into the Plastisol vat. Serves GE right. The majority of dishwashers with rotting plastisol tanks that I've witnessed were the newer green ones from the early 70's.
</strong>
<a name="start_35011.524081"><strong>GE knew what they were doing when they used the crappy Plastisol coating on thier tanks</a></strong>
<strong>I have and have seen GE dw's built-ins and portables with plastisol tanks that have lasted well beyond 50 years. Seems to me if the user of the machine was reasonably careful not to put deep gashes through the plastisol coating (probably from careless loading of silverware and sharp utensils), those things had about the same lifespan as porcelain on steel tanks. Whatever company manufactured that Plastisol coating ( I saw an ad for the company recently and, drat, I didn't get it--I'll try to remember it, it wasn't DuPont) they did their job well; it was as durable a finish as you could hope for. </strong>
<strong>Also, I remember someone telling me in the early 70's that right before a workers' strike it wasn't too uncommon for somebody to "accidentally" throw some sugar into the Plastisol vat. Serves GE right. The majority of dishwashers with rotting plastisol tanks that I've witnessed were the newer green ones from the early 70's.
</strong>
D&M, eased the public into the use of plastic, first it was door liners that were plastic, many Kenmore models had a plastic door liner and porcelain tank. It was marketed to the public IIRC, as providing noise reduction and rust resistance on the door liner. They had to have been late 1980's to early or mid 90's. I will have to check some of the old Sears catalogues in the attic this fall. alr2903
gmmcnair
Well-known member
My old Kenmore (D&M design) has a plastic door liner and porcelain tub. I bought it new in late 1989. It's still in service at my mom's house. My 18 inch was all plastic, as is my new GE portable. I was pretty careful not to chip the interior and it hasn't had a rust problem to date. Neither did my grandmother's 1977 D&M model...I liked hers because all the spray arms except the topmost were metal.
DW INTERIOR MATERIALS
D&M eased use into plastic tub DWs.
Actually Frigidare started using solid plastic inner door panels on thier built in DWs in the early 1970s. WP fowled suit in 1977 on all thier BI DWs then WW and D&M in the 1980s.
Plastisol coated steel DW tanks had cheap start up costs and and good ability to avoid shipping damage, but were by far the crappyest finish ever used on the inside of a DW and everybody in the sales and repair industry knew it. GE had the greatest problems with the pink and then blue coatings. By the time they started using the green stuff in the 1970s the main rust out area was the sump and they came out with a kit to fix that. We must have installed at least a hundred of the kits mostly in the Space Maker under sink models because they were so expensive to replace. On the regular built ins we just sold them a good WP or KA DW. GE also had a SS bottom that they sold for the top loading BIs and TL portables that could be installed in the field when the machine bottom rusted out, even the dry heater would cause the Plastisol finish to fail in the heater area.
To GEs credit they were the first to make the all plastic tub and door liner machines and they had the greatest incentive to do so as they couldn't make a dent in the higher end of the DW market with a crappy plastisol DW. Ken no GE plastisol DW ever lasted 50 years of regular use as defined by AHAM which they classify as running a full cycle every day. In fact very few GE DWs even lasted much over 20 years of daily use without serious rust issuers.
D&M eased use into plastic tub DWs.
Actually Frigidare started using solid plastic inner door panels on thier built in DWs in the early 1970s. WP fowled suit in 1977 on all thier BI DWs then WW and D&M in the 1980s.
Plastisol coated steel DW tanks had cheap start up costs and and good ability to avoid shipping damage, but were by far the crappyest finish ever used on the inside of a DW and everybody in the sales and repair industry knew it. GE had the greatest problems with the pink and then blue coatings. By the time they started using the green stuff in the 1970s the main rust out area was the sump and they came out with a kit to fix that. We must have installed at least a hundred of the kits mostly in the Space Maker under sink models because they were so expensive to replace. On the regular built ins we just sold them a good WP or KA DW. GE also had a SS bottom that they sold for the top loading BIs and TL portables that could be installed in the field when the machine bottom rusted out, even the dry heater would cause the Plastisol finish to fail in the heater area.
To GEs credit they were the first to make the all plastic tub and door liner machines and they had the greatest incentive to do so as they couldn't make a dent in the higher end of the DW market with a crappy plastisol DW. Ken no GE plastisol DW ever lasted 50 years of regular use as defined by AHAM which they classify as running a full cycle every day. In fact very few GE DWs even lasted much over 20 years of daily use without serious rust issuers.
Hotpoint porcelain
Didn't Hotpoint/GE stop making porcelain tubs when the Milwaukee plant closed down? Id imagine a mid 90s porcelain tank would have been sitting in stock for a few years.
Personally while I miss porcelain, plastic has out down itself in every possible way and then some. Even SS can not compare imo. I once heard from an appliance tech that he has seen a few stainless steel machines break at the seems or something like that. The testimate to plastic are 30 year old machines where everything has failed, even the racks but the tub still going strong.
Didn't Hotpoint/GE stop making porcelain tubs when the Milwaukee plant closed down? Id imagine a mid 90s porcelain tank would have been sitting in stock for a few years.
Personally while I miss porcelain, plastic has out down itself in every possible way and then some. Even SS can not compare imo. I once heard from an appliance tech that he has seen a few stainless steel machines break at the seems or something like that. The testimate to plastic are 30 year old machines where everything has failed, even the racks but the tub still going strong.
