applianceguy47
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2012
- Messages
- 590
1980 Fall Winter
check out the computer on the TOL, at that time. A short lived model.
check out the computer on the TOL, at that time. A short lived model.
1986 very late model Lady Kenmore belt-drive washer
- Thread starter kenmoreguy64
- Start date
Help Support :
applianceguy47
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2012
- Messages
- 590
1983 Fall Winter
Still with the wood grain top. I like the 1983 line up best. I think it is the script they used.
Still with the wood grain top. I like the 1983 line up best. I think it is the script they used.
applianceguy47
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2012
- Messages
- 590
1983 fw
stats
stats
Erik -
THANKS for the ultra-cool catalog scans.
The models in the Spring/Summer 1981 catalog are actually 1980 models. In my reply #25 above, my washer is actually 1980 stock number 20821 which you can see in your reply and picture, #28. The 1980 models all hung around until summer 1981, when the redesigned fonts came out for 1981 (AND when Whirlpool at the same time redesigned the baseplate of all 29-inch belt-drive machines and made them slightly more energy efficient overall). The Fall/Winter 1981 catalog debuted this new console styling for Kenmore.
In your 1983 Fall/Winter scan, reply # 31, Sears was still selling some of the 1981 models along with some revised 1982 units, this one being the 21831, which may be one of the most interesting to me of all the 1980s belt drives. It was still available in Fall 1983, so it was available for more than 2 years. Sears wanted a King's ransom for the machine, and sales were lousy in general at this time due to the 1981-1983 recession, so we see very few of this model.
(Interestingly, the brown panel machine in the little photo inset is a 2-speed, 1982 three cycle machine. Not really all that different than the 21831, but close to half the price at $299!! These sold better for obvious reasons, and their only draw back vs. more expensive machines was a total lack of a lint filter).
The 1983 line didn't show up in catalogs until Spring/Summer 1984, and the 80-series using this awesome console was never in a catalog that I've ever seen.
Thank you again for the neat photos.
Gordon[this post was last edited: 3/26/2012-17:26]
THANKS for the ultra-cool catalog scans.
The models in the Spring/Summer 1981 catalog are actually 1980 models. In my reply #25 above, my washer is actually 1980 stock number 20821 which you can see in your reply and picture, #28. The 1980 models all hung around until summer 1981, when the redesigned fonts came out for 1981 (AND when Whirlpool at the same time redesigned the baseplate of all 29-inch belt-drive machines and made them slightly more energy efficient overall). The Fall/Winter 1981 catalog debuted this new console styling for Kenmore.
In your 1983 Fall/Winter scan, reply # 31, Sears was still selling some of the 1981 models along with some revised 1982 units, this one being the 21831, which may be one of the most interesting to me of all the 1980s belt drives. It was still available in Fall 1983, so it was available for more than 2 years. Sears wanted a King's ransom for the machine, and sales were lousy in general at this time due to the 1981-1983 recession, so we see very few of this model.
(Interestingly, the brown panel machine in the little photo inset is a 2-speed, 1982 three cycle machine. Not really all that different than the 21831, but close to half the price at $299!! These sold better for obvious reasons, and their only draw back vs. more expensive machines was a total lack of a lint filter).
The 1983 line didn't show up in catalogs until Spring/Summer 1984, and the 80-series using this awesome console was never in a catalog that I've ever seen.
Thank you again for the neat photos.
Gordon[this post was last edited: 3/26/2012-17:26]
applianceguy47
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2012
- Messages
- 590
"only draw back vs. more expensive machines was a total lack of a lint filter"
Do you mean an operating lint filter?
When did they start with the, round "comb" style lint filter at the base of the wash tubs?
Do you mean an operating lint filter?
When did they start with the, round "comb" style lint filter at the base of the wash tubs?
Erik -
The basket mounted lint filter debuted in 1982, I am not certain exactly when that year, but I think about mid-year. Carryover 1981 models, all of which started with the tub mounted self-cleaning filter, were changed to have the basket mount filter if they were still in production by summer 1982. This represented a fairly sizeable substitution of parts, including the outer tub, the basket, the pump, filter assemblies and internal plumbing. The 1981 80-series mentioned above is one of the models to see the changes.
The machine I mentioned as not having a filter had no filter at all, not recirulating, not basket mounted, nothing.
Gordon
The basket mounted lint filter debuted in 1982, I am not certain exactly when that year, but I think about mid-year. Carryover 1981 models, all of which started with the tub mounted self-cleaning filter, were changed to have the basket mount filter if they were still in production by summer 1982. This represented a fairly sizeable substitution of parts, including the outer tub, the basket, the pump, filter assemblies and internal plumbing. The 1981 80-series mentioned above is one of the models to see the changes.
The machine I mentioned as not having a filter had no filter at all, not recirulating, not basket mounted, nothing.
Gordon
When did they start with the, round "comb" style lin
If I'm correct, it was when the DAA was introduced. I know it was used on the plastic control panel with the Penta-Vane installed so that makes it in the 1975-1976 but looking through the Sears catalogs 1980, this machine was suppose to have a manual filter but there one none from my memory when my parents had the washer.
If I'm correct, it was when the DAA was introduced. I know it was used on the plastic control panel with the Penta-Vane installed so that makes it in the 1975-1976 but looking through the Sears catalogs 1980, this machine was suppose to have a manual filter but there one none from my memory when my parents had the washer.
Cleanteam -
The round, disk shaped self cleaning comb filters which were mounted to the underside of the wash baskets are a 1980s design.
The machine in your picture is either a 1979 Kenmore 500 series standard capacity machine (I have one in my collection which can be seen in my photo album) or a 1980 Kenmore 500 large capacity machine with the Penta-Vane agitator. You are correct, both have the manual filter. I like this machine very much and use it often. There was one 1980 model, a 400 series, which did not have a filter, but it also didn't have an adjustable water level, and temperatures were set on the timer dial. It otherwise looked identical to these models. These are somewhat unusual in that the standard and large capacity variants look absolutely identical. Few Kenmore models were ever this similar side by side.
Gordon
The round, disk shaped self cleaning comb filters which were mounted to the underside of the wash baskets are a 1980s design.
The machine in your picture is either a 1979 Kenmore 500 series standard capacity machine (I have one in my collection which can be seen in my photo album) or a 1980 Kenmore 500 large capacity machine with the Penta-Vane agitator. You are correct, both have the manual filter. I like this machine very much and use it often. There was one 1980 model, a 400 series, which did not have a filter, but it also didn't have an adjustable water level, and temperatures were set on the timer dial. It otherwise looked identical to these models. These are somewhat unusual in that the standard and large capacity variants look absolutely identical. Few Kenmore models were ever this similar side by side.
Gordon
Belt Drive washers with Self-Cleaning Filters
I am pretty sure that my black 1985 Kenmore Limited Edition BD washer still has the better plumbed in tub mounted Self-Cleaning filter, and it is not a Suds-Saver machine.
I am pretty sure that my black 1985 Kenmore Limited Edition BD washer still has the better plumbed in tub mounted Self-Cleaning filter, and it is not a Suds-Saver machine.
Very nice washer, Gordon. There was one of these (and dryer) at an estate sale a couple of years ago in MINT! condition but I had-have too many already so passed them up. IIRC that washer was not the LK but a step down with the flip-open detergent dispenser, I always wanted that as a kid. I did buy a perfectly mint Ironrite from that house and later, a friend of mine bought the house but the Kenmores were long gone.
My Mark series touch-pad Whirlpool (late belt-drive) has the comb-type filter under the basket - you can see the clips for it
My Mark series touch-pad Whirlpool (late belt-drive) has the comb-type filter under the basket - you can see the clips for it
John,
The Limited Edition and even the Lady K washer which is the subject of this thread still had the tub-mounted filter. These machines required the four-port pump to support the triple dispenser, but the disk basket mounted filters were never used with any pump but the newer style two and three port. For reasons which I have never been told, Whirlpool did not ever equip a model with the old style two-port or four-port pump AND the disk filter. I think this was because the old pumps were more prone to lint build-up inside, as lint globs from the disc filter actually travel through the pump, which it doesn't do in the plumbed versions (such as the tub-mounted filter) which are powered by the older pumps.
The suds versions of all the models which had basket mounted disk filters all had the tub mounted, plumbed filter and the old two-port pump. The suds feature requires either the old two-port or the four-port as these pumps reverse flow, which is necessary to return suds water to the machine. The newer two-port and three-port do not reverse so they won't work in a suds version. Once again, the suds models all reverted to the older style lint filters, likely because the combination of the basket filter and the old pumps was not something that Whirlpool was willing to produce.
Gordon
The Limited Edition and even the Lady K washer which is the subject of this thread still had the tub-mounted filter. These machines required the four-port pump to support the triple dispenser, but the disk basket mounted filters were never used with any pump but the newer style two and three port. For reasons which I have never been told, Whirlpool did not ever equip a model with the old style two-port or four-port pump AND the disk filter. I think this was because the old pumps were more prone to lint build-up inside, as lint globs from the disc filter actually travel through the pump, which it doesn't do in the plumbed versions (such as the tub-mounted filter) which are powered by the older pumps.
The suds versions of all the models which had basket mounted disk filters all had the tub mounted, plumbed filter and the old two-port pump. The suds feature requires either the old two-port or the four-port as these pumps reverse flow, which is necessary to return suds water to the machine. The newer two-port and three-port do not reverse so they won't work in a suds version. Once again, the suds models all reverted to the older style lint filters, likely because the combination of the basket filter and the old pumps was not something that Whirlpool was willing to produce.
Gordon
You must use a 285317 3 port pump when replacing a 2 port original pump on the basket-mounted filter models. A 350365 is not meant to pump lint laden water through it. Just block off the narrow third port that normally would go to the manual recirculating maze type filter. This is stated in the service manual.
applianceguy47
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2012
- Messages
- 590
Idea
I'm wondering....
Yah know,
as much as I love these triple dispenser washers,
the problem was they used recirculating water... which contained lint.
They learned that lesson and with the DD models,
they changed and used fresh water to dispense fluids.
I'm wondering on these BD machines,
has anyone ever re-piped the fresh water from the clothes retainer ring,
to the dispenser? Simple enough.
I always loved the water-fall.
Not only that, one could switch to a two port pump and get rid of the lower electric gate valve. If I'm not mistaken, it might require an additional cold water inlet (dishwasher/ice maker valve) valve for dispensing the bleach.
I'm wondering....
Yah know,
as much as I love these triple dispenser washers,
the problem was they used recirculating water... which contained lint.
They learned that lesson and with the DD models,
they changed and used fresh water to dispense fluids.
I'm wondering on these BD machines,
has anyone ever re-piped the fresh water from the clothes retainer ring,
to the dispenser? Simple enough.
I always loved the water-fall.
Not only that, one could switch to a two port pump and get rid of the lower electric gate valve. If I'm not mistaken, it might require an additional cold water inlet (dishwasher/ice maker valve) valve for dispensing the bleach.
Erik -
No, I have never tried or even thought about that. So far I've never seen any sign of lint build-up in these dispensers, but have seen a lot of minerals. One I cleaned-up recently was so clogged with minerals that if you squeezed the hose between the detergent and softener sections, you could hear the crunching of the deposits.
I would think that if you used fresh water, the mineral problem might worsen without detergent and other laundry additives which would soften the water.
Overall, these triple dispensers are cool, but I think they're a perfect example of what people were thinking about when they would say that high-end appliances should be avoided because they had more stuff to break. I have worked on three machines with these dispensers in the last year or two. The first had a cracked dispenser body which then leaked/dripped. The second has a blocked open solenoid on the softener side, which dumps your stored softener in the wash water, and the third has a weak gate valve, thus curtailing water to the whole system to just a trickle. All this so the machine can dump in detergent and additives. I don't find scooping or pouring detergent all that troublesome. I do like the waterfall though!
Gordon
No, I have never tried or even thought about that. So far I've never seen any sign of lint build-up in these dispensers, but have seen a lot of minerals. One I cleaned-up recently was so clogged with minerals that if you squeezed the hose between the detergent and softener sections, you could hear the crunching of the deposits.
I would think that if you used fresh water, the mineral problem might worsen without detergent and other laundry additives which would soften the water.
Overall, these triple dispensers are cool, but I think they're a perfect example of what people were thinking about when they would say that high-end appliances should be avoided because they had more stuff to break. I have worked on three machines with these dispensers in the last year or two. The first had a cracked dispenser body which then leaked/dripped. The second has a blocked open solenoid on the softener side, which dumps your stored softener in the wash water, and the third has a weak gate valve, thus curtailing water to the whole system to just a trickle. All this so the machine can dump in detergent and additives. I don't find scooping or pouring detergent all that troublesome. I do like the waterfall though!
Gordon
applianceguy47
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2012
- Messages
- 590
I hear what your saying about the mineral build up in the recirculating hoses.
My Aunt had a 1972 Lady K, with sudsaver. She replaced it in 1986. The dispenser had, a couple years earlier, become non-functioning. The dispenser had cracked and the bleach would drip out onto the floor. Also, it had a build up of lint and eventually, the valve near the pump, became clogged and non-functioning.
It was a fun machine. I inherited it when she replaced it with another MOL KM. Her machine was so rusted at that point, though still functioning.
At that time Avacado appliances were no longer sellable, and I didn't bother to fix it.
My Aunt had a 1972 Lady K, with sudsaver. She replaced it in 1986. The dispenser had, a couple years earlier, become non-functioning. The dispenser had cracked and the bleach would drip out onto the floor. Also, it had a build up of lint and eventually, the valve near the pump, became clogged and non-functioning.
It was a fun machine. I inherited it when she replaced it with another MOL KM. Her machine was so rusted at that point, though still functioning.
At that time Avacado appliances were no longer sellable, and I didn't bother to fix it.
Greg -
Do you use your electronic machine often? I don't think I have seen but one or two electronic WPs in person. They seem more rare than the KMs. One thing I would LOVE to find yet is a NIB or unused belt-drive like yours was.
Erik -
What machine is that in your pic? You've got the rare liquid detergent accessory in the dispenser center compartment.
Gordon
Do you use your electronic machine often? I don't think I have seen but one or two electronic WPs in person. They seem more rare than the KMs. One thing I would LOVE to find yet is a NIB or unused belt-drive like yours was.
Erik -
What machine is that in your pic? You've got the rare liquid detergent accessory in the dispenser center compartment.
Gordon
Weekend Update:
I did some work on washers this weekend, including the 1986 Lady.
Knowing that most of the leakage was from the pump, AND that the problem with the triple dispenser trickling vs. flowing was probably valve related, I got under the machine and replaced both.
First was the detergent valve. I had noticed that for a second or two AFTER the valve was activated, there was normal water flow through the dispenser, but only for a second. I suspected a weak valve. These are NLA, but I found one recently and thought I'd need it.
I changed the pump next. The original pump had dripped a little bit during agitation, but literally sprayed water during drain. I had two 350367 pumps on the shelf, and I used them both this weekend.
The water test yielded three very interesting results. First, no drips at all during agitation or drain. Woohoo! Also, the weak detergent valve suspicion was correct, and the machine now has much better flow through the dispener. Yay!
But, just before I was about to get excited that I had a new washer to use and play with, I noticed water on the floor coming from the back of the machine. I hadn't even been looking there.
Well, upon close examination, I found a detergent trail on the baseplate, and a lot of water coming from under the outer tub. It's either a hole in the tub, OR the centerpost grommet. This machine is three weeks newer than my 1986 70, and it needed a new center grommet in 1994, so if this one is original, it owes the machine nothing.
My next step is thus to pull the outer tub and examine it. Hopefully we have just grommet leak. That's for next weekend, or one night this week if I get really industrious.
But, at least a couple issues have been fixed! I presume the machine leaked from the center last time, but the pump was so bad all the water mixed up and I never noticed.
Gordon
I did some work on washers this weekend, including the 1986 Lady.
Knowing that most of the leakage was from the pump, AND that the problem with the triple dispenser trickling vs. flowing was probably valve related, I got under the machine and replaced both.
First was the detergent valve. I had noticed that for a second or two AFTER the valve was activated, there was normal water flow through the dispenser, but only for a second. I suspected a weak valve. These are NLA, but I found one recently and thought I'd need it.
I changed the pump next. The original pump had dripped a little bit during agitation, but literally sprayed water during drain. I had two 350367 pumps on the shelf, and I used them both this weekend.
The water test yielded three very interesting results. First, no drips at all during agitation or drain. Woohoo! Also, the weak detergent valve suspicion was correct, and the machine now has much better flow through the dispener. Yay!
But, just before I was about to get excited that I had a new washer to use and play with, I noticed water on the floor coming from the back of the machine. I hadn't even been looking there.
Well, upon close examination, I found a detergent trail on the baseplate, and a lot of water coming from under the outer tub. It's either a hole in the tub, OR the centerpost grommet. This machine is three weeks newer than my 1986 70, and it needed a new center grommet in 1994, so if this one is original, it owes the machine nothing.
My next step is thus to pull the outer tub and examine it. Hopefully we have just grommet leak. That's for next weekend, or one night this week if I get really industrious.
But, at least a couple issues have been fixed! I presume the machine leaked from the center last time, but the pump was so bad all the water mixed up and I never noticed.
Gordon
Gordon, I don't have the WP hooked up right now, it got a reprieve for the winter. It's a great washer - largest usable capacity of all the top-loaders I have except maybe the Wards-Norge...
Gordon -
I don't envy you to have gone to all that work and now have to disassemble the machine completely to get to the leak in the outer tub. Of course, if anyone can do it you can and with ease I might add!
Glad to hear the dispenser is flowing smoothly now. Spare parts are so nice to have around. Good luck with the leak and hope it's something simple.
Patrick
I don't envy you to have gone to all that work and now have to disassemble the machine completely to get to the leak in the outer tub. Of course, if anyone can do it you can and with ease I might add!
Glad to hear the dispenser is flowing smoothly now. Spare parts are so nice to have around. Good luck with the leak and hope it's something simple.
Patrick
Greg -
Nice shot of your WP washer. It looks pristine.
Patrick
Nice shot of your WP washer. It looks pristine.
Patrick
Similar threads
Latest posts
-
-
-
-
Window Air Conditioner Advice/Suggestions- Latest: phillymatt53
