48 meets mid-20's

[jeffg]

This afternoon I stopped by one of our local markets to pick up a few groceries. One of the checkers there is unbelievably hot (like a young Tom Cruise, only taller and a bit more muscular) and he started chatting me up, and before I knew what was happening he asked if I'd have dinner with him. Without even thinking about it I said sure.

It was the first time in 20+ years that I felt my stomach jump up into my throat. I've been with the same great partner for 22 years now, in a monogamous relationship, but I don't know if I should (or even can) deny this opportunity. Call it middle age crazies, but something is telling me this is my last chance to do something like this. I also don't know if I should tell my partner about it.

Any opinions or advice are greatly appreciated. Thanks.

 

[jeffg]

Rich, where the heck did that come from? I appreciate your advice in this thread, as I do everyone else's. I've also admitted that the label of monogamy for what my partner and I have amounts to mutual denial, even though, honestly, our track record is better than any other couple we know -- even better than my own parents! So what are you upset about?

Look, one (or two, or heavens forbid, as in the case of my partner, several) brief and meaningless affairs in 22 years doesn't mean a person "has no clue what monogamy is". If you believe it does mean that, all I can say is, I spent 20+ years living under the same delusion, having the same absurd and selfish expectations from my partners and putting them through living hell because of it. I grew out of it eventually.

 

[jeffg]

Shane, in addition to posting here, I've been talking to my best friend about it and his advice matches some of what was given in this thread: he pointed out the fact there's a major difference between meaningless flings, and true violations of the commitment that I and my partner have -- as life partners. That second category is what can evolve into actual threats to a relationship, and as I said, I don't see any possibility for that to happen with this guy. He's just too young, too inexperienced, and it's highly likely that "dinner will just be dinner".

 

[Hometechdoc]

stomach in the throat should tell you something

I say go for it. Of course I have been in a relationship for eleven years but it has never been monogomous. Those times when you meet someone and you have that special feeling. I have always felt it was good to act upon it.

If you relationship at home is good, you will figure it out.

 

[perc-o-prince]

Oh god, Jeff

If you truly love and respect your partner then I would hope that your need to feel attractive and needed (very understandable) would take backstage to how your partner will feel when he finds out that he, alone, may not be good enough for you.

PLEASE think about this VERY carefully as your one night of fun could destroy 22 years of love, respect and honesty (provided this is what your relationship is based on). 22 years is an investment of time.

You are a smart, good looking guy who shouldn't have any trouble getting a date any time but the price may be a bit too dear as the loss could be great!

I hope that you don't think that I'm passing any judgement. I'm not. I have just seen too many good, long term relationships destroyed by just this sort of situation. Perhaps you should sit down and have a discussion with your partner. Maybe you're feeling a bit in a rut. It has happened to Chuck and I. We sat down and talked it out only to find out that the problem was that we both were so comfortable that we took each other for granted. Complacency <sp> can cause this. Communication cured it

If you want to talk about this more I would be happy to email my phone # and I will be happy to chat with you.

My best,
Rich

 

[pumper]

Sure, go for it.......

....if you're prepared to throw away 22 years with a great guy. Or you may get lucky and just suffer in silence with the guilt that should eat away at you if you have any conscience. Think of what it will do to your partner when he finds out....and we always find out.

 

[perc-o-prince]

Oh, I forgot...

I was in the position of being the one who was cheated on. It was miserable. After years together, paying for most of his schooling and a car (he was just kicked out of his home when we met) he decided that I wasn't good enough for him but didn't have the balls enough to tell me. He took up with a married man. Set up an apartment with him to have a little afternoon delight then came home to sleep with me! This went on for about a year before I suspected anything was wrong. I have forgiven him but I will never forget the pain he caused.

It boils down to respect! For yourself and your partner

Rich

 

[danemodsandy]

If You...

...Have a stable, monogamous relationship with someone around your age, I'd think long and seriously about messing with it. There is always the possibility that the "fling" could turn serious, and relationships with an age difference have their own set of problems, not least of which is what happens when one person gets old, and the other is still in reasonably early middle age. My own relationship began as one of those "May-December" things, when I was twenty, and my other half was forty. We are now fifty-six and seventy-six, and so I spend much of my time physically caring for someone with end-stage heart disease. That's good for him, but it does limit my options, to say the least. Fortunately, I have never been inclined towards a roving eye, but I know of cases where other older men have been abandoned by younger partners over advancing age and health problems. Don't let it happen to you. If this is a fling, and if your partner's okay with that, and if you play safe, then it might be all right (there is, of course, the Department of Unintended Consequences to consider). But don't get serious about someone if there's much of an age difference - for the younger partner, there comes a point where it's not an adventure, it's a job.

 

[perc-o-prince]

Sandy, I didn't even think of your situation...

I was thinking more about Allen's advice "I say go for it. Of course I have been in a relationship for eleven years but it has never been monogomous." and how alone he probably will be when he gets too old to "bring to the party" what seems to be needed in the gay scene. As it was once said to me by an older gay gentleman..."First you sell it then you give it away and finally you have to buy it! Sad commentary but that seems to sum up the promiscuous lifestyle! Not for me. I'll invest my time and energy in someone who will love me in sickness and in health. I've put that to the test, last year, in my battle with cancer. I don't know how I could have made it without Chuck by my side!!! I know I could have but I wouldn't have wanted to. I feel like the richest man alive

R

 

[~sudsshane]

Exercise some self control~

I had a somewhat similar situation recently happen to me. I was dealing with a client over the phone, and there was a huge issue with some merchandise he had purchased from me. He was the high maintenence type, and I knew he was just the kind of person to call corporate to complain if he didn't receive a quick resolution to this problem. Rather than take a chance, I knew I was heading over to Daytona Beach anyway for an afternoon of antique shopping. I agreed to stop by his salon/day spa to try and rectify the problem with his purchase. I arrive, and walk in, and there he was..Drop dead hot!
Mid 40's, about 6'4, with Blonde hair/big blue eyes. His attitude was totally different in person, and he was very humble and thankful. After we shook hands, he offered me a free service in his spa. Now, while I am a sucker for spa services, I politely declined. Then he said well can I at least buy you lunch for the trouble of you traveling all the way over here. Again, I said no thank you. At that moment, I totally knew I was being hit on.. I then gave him my business card and told him I was sorry for the confusion, and if I could be of any help in the future to please call.

I walked out of the salon thinking, man what a stud. totally my type physically if I was single. I also couldn't help but think what a player this guy probably is, and for all I know, he was just looking for sex. What is also disturbing is I wear a wedding band on my left hand, and that didn't seem to make any difference to him.

Now, back to your situation. I must say, I find interesting that you didn't mention whether or not you are happy and fulfilled in your relationship when you posted your thread. That is an important question you should be asking yourself.

While it is totally normal to notice an attractive man, I believe
you crossed the line when you agreed to go out with him.
You need to ask yourself what could be lacking in your relationship to cause you to do this. Are you still in love with your partner? If not, you have a big decision to make.

Personally, if this happened to me, I would feel the need to tell my partner about it. Trust and honesty are fundamental to any successful, good relationship. Your partner may be hurt, but hopefully he would respect you for speaking up and coming clean. Communicate,Communicate,Communicate.... is key!

I can understand that at 48, you may not feel as desirable as you felt at 25, but think of the long term effects a decision such as this would/could create in your personal life and not for nothing, the odds of anything coming of this other than sex are stacked against you.
If you are not happy in your relationship, and can't exercise some self control, be a man and tell your partner and let him find someone else. If you cannot do that, and you decide to stray, and live a lie,then you then reap what you sow.

Good Luck

 

[jeffg]

Thanks everyone for the great advice.

Shane, the answer to your question is yes, I do still love him. Our relationship has evolved over the years to something that's practically non-sexual, but much deeper in more important respects (if that makes any sense). We've become more life partners than sexual partners, and judging from his porn habit he's at least as unsatisfied in this regard as I am. But I don't think either of us could imagine going through life without each other.

Also, I should have noted he's had several flings over the last 22 years, while I've also had one. But these encounters were just us getting our rocks off with other people, and the underlying "life partner" relationship has never been threatened. Likewise I think this current offer would not pose any serious threat. I mean this guy is at least three steps out of my league, and I don't think there's a possibility of it becoming anything more than sex. I've been there before, as a much younger man (i.e. having Top Gun as a lover), and I have no desire to go back to that kind of situation.

As for telling him about it, I definitely will once it's over with. Psychologically we've learned it's much easier to handle "I've done this" compared to "I'm doing this".

Anyway thanks again to everyone.

 

[panthera]

Jeff,

Since you asked, my two Eurocents, for what they're worth.

There are only a few make it-break it conditions which a couple has to mutually be 100% in agreement on in their relationship.

1) How to deal with the mother-in-laws. It may be 2009 and we may all laugh about how str8s marry their mommies, but fifty years on this earth have shown me, a man's a man fo' aw of that...

2) You have a firm rule on sex outside of your relationship. I don't think it matters so much what the rule is as that there is one and you both adhere to it utterly.

The worst situation of all, in my experience, is when a gay man takes a bi-sexual as his partner. Never seen that one cause anything but disaster - for the gay man.

The next worse is the situation I found my self in not once, but twice - HE can (and frequently does) but YOU are to be chaste as the temple virgin...while he is out giving Messalina a run for her money. Number one insisted we have an open relationship. By that he meant, I was to be open to his playing around. Number two was insanely jealous, questioned my every move...and while I was NOT sitting under the apple tree with anyone else, he was gathering flowers where 'er he might...

Personally, I am monogamous and can't see my life any other way. Now that we have hard statistical data that, in fact, roughtly 17% of all men (gay and str8) are built this way, we no longer have to put up with the bullshit which was dumped on us by so much of the gay community for so long. It's how we're built. Time to end the moral judgments on both sides. Is you is or is you ain't...once you know, choose your partner accordingly.

The pain it would cause my partner (who is also built monogamous) far exceeds any pleasure I might get. Or worse, be giving. But, again, I'm built that way.

So, my advice to you - stick to the rules you two have. Twenty-two years together means you must be doing a lot right. Personally, from the sound of it, you two need to discuss the rules again and maybe either make some changes (I've been in long term relationships where the sex was still great after 15 years) or maybe not.

Whatever, busy little bees that we are, we're always happy to tell you what to do (and no fear, the queens who take notes to narc to the FBI and people's employers are, this instant minute figuring out how to let your partner know everything...)

But the guy you really need to be asking is your partner. Maybe he will say "Oh, her, been there, done that". Have fun, be sure to wear condoms, you won't need lube, maybe just a rope to find your way out again.
Or he might offer a ménage à trois.
Or he might rethink why you two aren't having fun in bed.

But he won't throw away your life and love for talking to him.

He knows what's up at some level, anyway -

Good luck, Jeff, whatever you do. It is nice to have a young guy look at you and see him drool. Of course, while you're thinking firm young thighs to plunge into, he may be thinking, "Daddy!". Er, um, ick.

 

[nmaineman36]

I was thinking the same thing...the guy is looking for a Daddy. Something that these youngins are doing these days. Why I dunno but I know for myself I wouldnt want someone thats still teething if you know what I mean. And besides I cant keep up with someone half my age in bed anymore.
Our tenant is seeing someone who is 20..he just turned 20 apparently he was 19 but she couldnt see dating a 19 year old so she waited til he turned 20 to make it seem better...go figure. Anyways she is 47...old enough to be his father. Now she is dye-ing her hair and goatee to make it seem that she isnt that old. She is a he if you cant follow. And she cant keep up with the young one. Plus on top of that she likes them young since she finds them so interesting...trouble is when they figure her out they run for the hills.
So think twice before taking the plunge with this guy Jeff because a whole lotta heartache might be attached to this young one and you might look back and think to yourself was it worth all this grief. And one tidbit...they always find out and even if you think that your being sneaky and cover every base and there is always someone to call your partner and say to him...Girl I am not one to gossip but you wont believe who I saw with this young guy out to dinner and this fancy restuarant and Girl it wasnt a McDonalds Happy Meal either......you know the rest...

 

[jamiel]

We have a slightly different rule...not around home...which works for us. Haven't had much opportunity to exercise the rule, but did have a very nice encounter out in Palm Springs in February which culminated in a delightful tangle at the Horizon resort (the really stark contemporary resort between PSP and Cathedral City) into which we both entered with both eyes open and mutual agreement.

We'd had a rather frustrating trip to a bear run in Indianapolis in December while we were working out the "not around home" rule...I was hot to trot but B. wasn't, so I really held myself back. I chose my words carefully as we drove home...I felt distanced from him which I didn't like. Much better energy around the trip to Palm Springs a couple months later...moral of the story is communication, and that you, your partner's, and your collective needs can evolve over time. We hadn't realized until we tried it how cool it was to OBSERVE the other getting pleasure

 

[jeffg]

Keven, on many occasions we have discussed the terms of our relationship, and we've reached a mutual agreement:

-- We love each other and we're both committed to living the rest of our lives together.

-- Both of us realize the 'sex thing' wore off a long time ago, as it does with many (or probably most) couples.

-- We both acknowledge that while we tend toward monogamy, neither of us are natural-born celibates.

-- Both of us want to keep a premise of monogamy, even while accomodating (occasionally, mind you) our basic human need to bust a nut once in a while.

This may sound like mutual denial, and it probably is, but it's the best arrangement we've been able to come up with. Even though he's tricked out on me more than vice-versa, I'm certain he feels as bad about his trysts as I do about mine. And we agree the alternatives (either to break off the relationship entirely, or declare it officially "open") are infinitely worse. Not succombing to either of those alternatives is the only reason both of us are still alive and HIV negative.

 

[panthera]

Mike

That is so true. Especially in the Bay area.

I was married (Celtic handfasting) to a wonderful man back in the early '80s.

One evening I was out on the town with a college friend who was in San Francisco for a few days. Built, hung, hunk, gorgeous. Also a Catholic priest, and not of the pedophile variety, but the real thing. We went to two museums, Colt Tower, the usual.

I didn't see anyone I knew. By the time I got home, my late husband had a detailed listing of every place we'd been, including the double-chocolates at Ghirardelli Square, the Italian sodas on the Pier, the ice cream waiting in line for Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, which records we'd bought at Tower records...

And each and every single charming soul had begun their report with "I'm sure it was just innocent, but...

Nothing on this planet is worse than an aging, unfcuked queen. Nothing. All she has to occupy her time is to make life miserable for everyone else. Her name is legion and she is standing right over there, yes, her - using her cell phone to snap that shot of you and your 'friend from the office, has three kids for christ's sake' trying on cologne on each others' wrists.

Of course, there is also the risk which a neighbor (not a friend) of mine gambled and lost a few years back. Married to a nice woman in their early '40s, couple kids, solid jobs, nice big Condo, etc. He fell 'in real love' with a stunning young blond. No hu-hu his wife (who is a good friend) says. Within 48 hours, she had moved into a new flat (only a German can appreciate that time frame), left the keys to their condo on the table, the keys to their station wagon, filed for divorce...and, told the kids that they were going to be living with papa from now on.

C'est la vie say some. Her motto was: C'est la guerre.

 

[dogboy44]

It's really flattering

I have had a couple of those kind of encounters, I come home, tell my partner, we laugh. We have been together 26 years.

 

[panthera]

Jeff,

sounds reasonable to me. I think just about anything works (except the bi-thingy),as long as both partners are in agreement.
Sex should last a lifetime. When it cools, it is time to work on it, in my opinion.

I got through the sexual revolution HIV- by sheer luck, nothing else. Hate, just hate those preechy folks who think people get what they deserve. Nobody deserves Aids, not even the nastiest queens.

I am really lucky - HIV- and the most wonderful man in the world.

 

[panthera]

Before

some bitch runs with that, I mean I have found the most wonderful man in the world.

 

[ptcruiser51]

Ten Years

That Mike and I were together seemed like a heartbeat when I lost him to cancer. He was an accountant for his company and travelled extensively to do audits. Always to places where you would never, ever meet another gay person. Like: San Francisco, Houston, Los Angeles, Phoenix, Chicago, Fort Lauderdale...

He would be gone for often two weeks at a time. Having travelled for business myself, I know that nothing is more boring than a motel room. Mike used his Bob Damron's to find places to go, and would often meet people. He was always an interesting person to talk to, very friendly. I have no idea if he did/didn't do anything, but the fact we always talked about his experiences I guess says something.

Sometimes "dinner" is just dinner.

 

[danemodsandy]

A Wise Friend...

...Used to get gossipy "reports" like the ones Panthera mentions - or perhaps I should say people tried to give him such reports.

He always stopped them, telling them in no uncertain terms that he not only did not want to listen to it, he was not going to listen to it.

One of the gossipy ones tried to take a swipe at him by telling him that he was the Mary Haines type.

To which he replied: "But you're wrong - there's a difference. You see, I listened to my wise old mother."

 

[animasinsulinpu]

Tell your partner

Jeff. My Ex. did this to me too. If your relationship is so good then tell him and if he dosen't mind, then no one will get hurt. But if you lie, Karma WILL get you. It's best not to keep secrets. Best of luck!!!!.....Bill in Az....

 

[rp2813]

Jeff, this is very simple. If you are comfortable with the situation and any circumstances that may present themselves as a result, then go for it. My partner and I have been together for almost 24 years. We still have regular sex--at least once a week--but also enjoy playing with new meat, usually with the knowledge or in the presence of each other, but not always. We're going on a bear cruise next month and I guarantee you that we will both be on the prowl and are anticipating going our separate ways at least some of the time.

It doesn't sound to me like you're looking to bail out of your LTR. This is more like, don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Just keep in mind that while this guy may get your adrenaline going, there's still the chance that he could disappoint in bed--especially considering his age, which for me translates into lack of grounding and experience. But there's only one way to find out. And if you manage to bust a nut doing so, more power to you. You'll know if you want to see the guy again, and if it's not harmful to your relationship and the guy knows you're not looking for anything more than some physical fun between a couple of mutually attracted men, the potential is there for an outlet you no longer have at home. A dinner date is perfect. You'll know by the time dinner is over--if not sooner--whether you still want to take things further.

Let me be the first to share my opinion that within reason, vital and capable men should not be denying themselves the physical pleasure, fulfillment and celebration of masculinity that they are hard wired to pursue and enjoy. As long as your relationship won't be compromised, this seems like an easy decision. If it becomes a one-nighter situation, then it's no big deal. You had some fun, you achieved a release, and that's that.

P.S.

If you go for it with him, don't forget to e-mail me directly with details . . .

Ralph

 

[maytagbear]

The single guy.......

My longest relationship lasted a year and a half. It was mostly good, and I'd like to have one again, perhaps.

I think Ralph's idea of dinner first is a Very Good Idea. You can enjoy the guy's company, and decide.

I am much more about EMOTIONAL monogamy than physical monogamy.
I told the guy I was with that as long as he played safely, and came back, everything was cool, but when he chose not to come back, it was over. He agreed. And then he met a woman.

I wished them well, and I hear that they are still together, and by all appearances as happy as can be.

Lawrence/Maytagbear

 

[peterh770]

If you are in a monogamous relationship, nothing is going to happen.

But why tempt fate? Go out to dinner with him and bring your partner.

 

[mikepaquette]

A broken Heart

Think how you would feel if the tables were turned. I have a fragile heart. Bad carma is bad carma. Good luck with your discision. Mike

 

[jeffg]

Well the tables have been turned before, several times. As a younger man I was horribly insecure, a real jealous wreck. Good grief, some of the things I put my first lover through... I cringe now just thinking about it. But most people grow up and grow out of this insecurity, and today it's to the point where I find the thought of my partner with someone else not at all threatening, in fact kind of sexy, and I'm pretty sure the same is true for him. What we do still fear is that the other one will fall in love with someone else, but that possibility just comes with the territory.

 

[perc-o-prince]

Jeff,

I don't get you. You start off like this innocent middle age man, who's in a good/monogamous relationship, who has this chance encounter and you just don't know what to do. Should you tell your partner?

Give me a break!!!! You know all along what you are doing, You knew that you were going to tell your partner AFTER it was over as you wrote "As for telling him about it, I definitely will once it's over with. Psychologically we've learned it's much easier to handle "I've done this" compared to "I'm doing this". " And the idea of monogamous???? I'm not sure that you have the faintest clue as to what monogamy is. It is being with ONE person at a time. I frankly don't care if you both sleep with 50 other people a week. None of my business and I hope you have fun but please DON'T CALL YOU RELATIONSHIP MONOGAMOUS! You're trying to change rules to suite your own needs. Do what you want but don't define your relationship with the same term that I define mine and others, here, who are with just one partner in a monogamous relationship.

If I sound angry then I have done a good job as I was suckered into thinking that you were a good guy who was about to make a bad decision. I reached out to help (just my nature) the only way I know how. Others reached out to you, too, only to find out that this is not a new thing.

I feel foolish, duped. I fell for it. I took the bait when all along I think you just wanted us all to know that you could still attract a 20something year old. You just didn't want to boast about it so perhaps by asking for advice you reached your goal. I hope all of this helped your ego.

I hope that no one thinks that I'm passing any type of judgement about open relationships. I think that what you do in private is your own business and if it works for you...GREAT! BUT don't piss on my shoe and tell me it's raining

End of rant

Rich

 

[~sudsshane]

"Shane, the answer to your question is yes, I do still love him"

Loving someone and being "in love" are two different things Jeff. My personal belief is that when you are truly in love with someone, they fulfill your every need, in and out of bed.
I have a couple of friends that have an open relationship, and if that floats their boat, fine. I don't think any less of them as a person and besides, who am I to judge. I can honestly say though that I don't understand it.

To me a true committment is not an open relationship.

Just my opinion, and Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[rp2813]

Yeah, I thought the personal attacks were over around here since the election came and went.

Jeff, you are absolutely seeing the situations clearly, both what you have as a relationship with your partner and what this adventure with the grocery store guy could amount to. You really don't need our advice. Sheesh--you're 48 and are on top of your situation. If you end up on top in some other context, then good for you.

Ralph