A different KM BD issue.

[volvoguy87]

I took the 3-day weekend off and went out of town to help out a friend. I went to Davenport, IA to mend a very grumpy 1981 Kenmore 20 series washer.

I arrived to find it with a broken belt (joy of joys I thought). The pump and all pulleys were free so I got out my book, tools, and a new belt and commenced its installation. It wasn't fun, but it was better than I thought.

Upon getting it all back together, it was sluggish to spin. I loosened the transmission, moved it up and down, and put it all back together again, tightening the bolts a little at a time, in a pattern so as not to draw it up at an angle. I eventually got it to spin okay empty. With a full load, however, it will only spin at about 60 RPM.

There isn't excessive drag on the belt, the motor is adjusted for proper belt tension and the basket drive yoke spring is attached. I can hear the clutch slipping as it tries to spin and it will pump out water. It agitates just fine, it just won't come up to speed on spin.

I'm going back over July 4th weekend to have a 2nd go at the repair. What did I do wrong?

Dave

 

[combo52]

POOR SPINNING KM BD WASHER

Dave I can think of several things that might have gone wrong during the belt replacement or may otherwise be wrong. It is very hard to fix this type of thing over the internet when you are not even with the machine. You have my PH # and you may have Gordon's # as well, yours friends machine would probably be running now if you just called and you would have learned even more about fixing BD WPs than you now know..

 

[volvoguy87]

Communication.

Unfortunately, the machine in question is 3 states away and I left my phone list in Cincinnati. I don't have the opportunity to go there often, but I plan on going back July 4th weekend. I'm working on a much more difficult KM BD teardown and rebuild here in Cincinnati where I have the time, parts, and tools to deal with it. The one in Cincinnati is a better learning experience. The one in Iowa that isn't spinning well was described to me by its owner as having a siezed pump, which I can handle pretty well. I did not go there expecting a belt replacement, although I brought a spare belt just in case.

I am trying to learn more BD repair methods, (hense the BD in pieces in my basement) but this one just fell out of the sky and needed immediate attention. Fortunately, the poorly-spinning machine's owner has access to another washer, for now, until his BD is back up and running properly. This particular washer looked to be in very good shape. There was NO rust anywhere under the washer and no sign of any leaks. The transmission is origninal, but still has its oil (and it's clean) and is not full of water. The top is painted but there is almost no rust on it (top or bottom). I have a spare porcelain top I may put on it when I go out there next, just to spruce it up a little and get a large part out of my basement.

If challenges like this come in threes, I'm fearing what #3 is going to be!
Dave

 

[kenmoreguy64]

Dave -

I tend to agree with John. There isn't a way to ascertain what's going on without asking you a bunch of questions, then based on your answers, we can formulate at least a hypothesis. The more efficient thing to do is to ask and answer the questions as this is happening, then if you want to make a post about it here, you can do it after the fact.

Some questions I would ask are:

1) Did the machine exhibit any signs of this behavior or anything odd at all before the belt broke?

2) When you re-tightened the gearcase, was the machine laying flat?

3) Was the belt on the pulleys in even a loose manner when you secured everything?

My hunch is that if you've been able to improve spin by using the procedures we've outlined to get rid of spin-tube bind, then you probably still have a bind, just not as bad. If the spin tube has worn grooves in it (you can't tell that without removing it), it may be very fickle in lining up properly.

Gordon

 

[kenmoreguy64]

Porcelain top....

Dave -

You describe the 1981 machine as a 20 or 200 series. If so, it has a plastic control panel, is that right?

There are very few porcelain tops that will actually properly fit this machine. There is a large anchoring stud in the center of the plastic panel, which accepts a large wide-threaded screw from underneath the top. There is no hole there in most porcelain tops, nor are there holes properly centered and drilled in the back to hold the backside of the plastic panel. I learned this the hard way years ago when trying to spruce up a plastic top machine that had a rusty top. Generally speaking, if your porcelain top had been used by a black panel era machine, the only panels that can be put on it without a lot of modification is another black panel or brushed aluminum top type panel.

There were however two or so 1976 era plastic top machines that had porcelain tops. If you have one of those, GREAT!

I would be interested in the old top if you make a swap work. I have a 1980 200 series that has an absolutely ugly top panel, so short of repainting it, which will be work to get rid of the rust, anything would be better....

Gordon

 

[kenmoreman]

Silly Question

Dave,
Did you by any chance loosen the transmission bolts and maybe lower the tranny a bit during the belt change? Kenmoreman

 

[kenmoreman]

Solution

I think I may know why you have this problem. Kenmoreman

 

[volvoguy87]

Lower the transmission.

Yup, I lowered the transmission. I tightened the bolts sequentially so as to avoid it binding and keep it as straight as possible. I tried it flat as well as inclined and still no luck. It spun, although acceleration was sluggish) up to full speed while empty, but it barely made 70 RPM when loaded and fully drained.

Out of curiosity, what might have caused the belt to break? This isn't one of my machines so I was unable to observe it prior to the belt breaking. When I pulled out the old belt the end looked a little melted, but all the pulleys were free.

Dave

 

[kenmoreman]

usually when a machine gets older the belt stretches to the point that the motor pulley spins free and the friction literally burns the belt off. You can usually tell by the angle of the bend where the belt broke. If you loosened the bolts to the transmission and let the tranny drop then you could have lost the ball bearing that holds up the T bearing on the clutch. If it falls out then the T bearing will sit in the top of the transmission case and the clutch will not engage tightly enough to have the friction to spin the machine. This is not a terribly hard thing to correct. If you look aroung you usually can find the fallen ball bearing. Otherwise you can but a new T bearing and it will include a new ball bearing. I hope this helps. Gordon can weigh in on this. Regards Kenmoreman

 

[volvoguy87]

Checked it.

The T bearing and ball are in place. Good thought, though.

What is the purpose of the T bearing anyway?
Dave

 

[kenmoreman]

T bearing

The T bearing is what supports the clutch from the transmission assembly. In the past it was supported by two clips that were locked together and a brass T bearing rode on top. Later the ball bearing supported it. have you taken the basket out and inspected the tub? Replacing the belt should not have caused this problem. Wish you the best. Kemnoreman