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A Train Thread
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OK, let's try bumping this back to the top with another question.
I have a copy of Highball a Pageant of Trains by Lucius Beebe and in the back there is an index of train whistle signals. This book was published in the 1940's and I'm wondering if these same signals are all still in use today or if maybe certain ones are now obsolete.
I live a few blocks away from the LA-Seattle line which also carries the Capitol Corridor and CalTrain commuter lines. In fact, here's a bit of trivia about the College Park Caltrain stop by me. It was referenced by Jack London in The Call of the Wild. They tried to close it a couple of years ago but one of the premiere all boys prep schools in the Bay Area protested, as a significant number of their students used the adjacent CP station twice a day. Caltrain reversed their decision and instead cut service to one train a day in each direction before and after school. So College Park continues to be a functioning stop on the Peninsula line.
OK so reeling it back in here, let's just say I hear a lot of train sounds since besides that one stop by me, there is another one less than a mile north and the main downtown station where everybody stops less than a mile south. I don't think what I see in the index always translates correctly. So have some of the signals changed been reassigned or what? Anybody know?
I have a copy of Highball a Pageant of Trains by Lucius Beebe and in the back there is an index of train whistle signals. This book was published in the 1940's and I'm wondering if these same signals are all still in use today or if maybe certain ones are now obsolete.
I live a few blocks away from the LA-Seattle line which also carries the Capitol Corridor and CalTrain commuter lines. In fact, here's a bit of trivia about the College Park Caltrain stop by me. It was referenced by Jack London in The Call of the Wild. They tried to close it a couple of years ago but one of the premiere all boys prep schools in the Bay Area protested, as a significant number of their students used the adjacent CP station twice a day. Caltrain reversed their decision and instead cut service to one train a day in each direction before and after school. So College Park continues to be a functioning stop on the Peninsula line.
OK so reeling it back in here, let's just say I hear a lot of train sounds since besides that one stop by me, there is another one less than a mile north and the main downtown station where everybody stops less than a mile south. I don't think what I see in the index always translates correctly. So have some of the signals changed been reassigned or what? Anybody know?
matchboxpaul
Well-known member
A bit of an update on 'TORNADO'
Just thought you may like a bit of an update on the UK's new steam locomotive!
The new Class A1 Pacific locomotive 60163, yet to be named TORNADO, last night underwent its first high speed trials on the 'Racing Stretch' of the East Coast Main Line, between York and Newcastle.
The line speed here is 125mph but is used as a test area where trains, under test conditions, have been tested upto 162mph (obviously she wont be going that fast).
Officially, for the time being, the locomotive is being tested upto a maximum of 75mph. Unofficially she is being tested at upto 90mph which, the A1 Locomotive Society, will become her official permissable speed whilst hauling passengers.
Here are a few youtube vids of her under test. Unfortunately, in order to ensure she doesnt inconvenience 'normal' passenger services, all testing has been done at night.
Enjoy
Paul
p.s the class 67 diesel on the rear is in case of failure and is also being used to add 'Dead Weight' to the train
Just thought you may like a bit of an update on the UK's new steam locomotive!
The new Class A1 Pacific locomotive 60163, yet to be named TORNADO, last night underwent its first high speed trials on the 'Racing Stretch' of the East Coast Main Line, between York and Newcastle.
The line speed here is 125mph but is used as a test area where trains, under test conditions, have been tested upto 162mph (obviously she wont be going that fast).
Officially, for the time being, the locomotive is being tested upto a maximum of 75mph. Unofficially she is being tested at upto 90mph which, the A1 Locomotive Society, will become her official permissable speed whilst hauling passengers.
Here are a few youtube vids of her under test. Unfortunately, in order to ensure she doesnt inconvenience 'normal' passenger services, all testing has been done at night.
Enjoy
Paul
p.s the class 67 diesel on the rear is in case of failure and is also being used to add 'Dead Weight' to the train
matchboxpaul
Well-known member
and another
matchboxpaul
Well-known member
Thirsk Station is actually on the stretch of line where 160mph is possible.
matchboxpaul
Well-known member
and finally, passing Northallerton.
If you want to see more, just do a search for '60163' - new vids being added by people daily.
Cheers
Paul
If you want to see more, just do a search for '60163' - new vids being added by people daily.
Cheers
Paul
sudsmaster
Well-known member
It's good that UP is doing things to clean up diesel emissions.
About a year or two ago I was on the hunt for vintage phono radio consoles. One of them was in West Oakland downwind from the railyards and the port. I was appalled at how bad the air was compared to my home's location, which was only about 10 miles away. I figure a lot of the pollution is from the trains as well as from trucks idling as they wait to pickup containers etc. Maybe some from the ships as well.
On another train related note, I understand that Santa Clara County voters have very narrowly approved the latest funding measure to ensure that BART is extended into San Jose. This is an important milestone; I commuted from the East Bay down to Milpitas/San Jose for eight years and it became a real horror story trying to fight traffic. Some Fridays after work it would take me 2 hours to go 25 miles. I finally started riding my bicycle five miles to the Hayward Capitol Corridor station, and then another three miles from the Great America station to my workplace, just to avoid the commute drive. Great exercise, 16 miles a day, but not exactly the safest (along expressways, etc, and at one point I would have to carry the bike along a dirt path under an overpass by the Guadalupe). The biggest problems were the late CC trains, overcrowded cars, no place to put the bikes, and surly conductors. The last BART stop in Fremont was too far away to make a bike commute feasable, and after I got laid off in 2002 I refused to look for work in the area, but I would consider working down there again if BART ran into downtown San Jose.
About a year or two ago I was on the hunt for vintage phono radio consoles. One of them was in West Oakland downwind from the railyards and the port. I was appalled at how bad the air was compared to my home's location, which was only about 10 miles away. I figure a lot of the pollution is from the trains as well as from trucks idling as they wait to pickup containers etc. Maybe some from the ships as well.
On another train related note, I understand that Santa Clara County voters have very narrowly approved the latest funding measure to ensure that BART is extended into San Jose. This is an important milestone; I commuted from the East Bay down to Milpitas/San Jose for eight years and it became a real horror story trying to fight traffic. Some Fridays after work it would take me 2 hours to go 25 miles. I finally started riding my bicycle five miles to the Hayward Capitol Corridor station, and then another three miles from the Great America station to my workplace, just to avoid the commute drive. Great exercise, 16 miles a day, but not exactly the safest (along expressways, etc, and at one point I would have to carry the bike along a dirt path under an overpass by the Guadalupe). The biggest problems were the late CC trains, overcrowded cars, no place to put the bikes, and surly conductors. The last BART stop in Fremont was too far away to make a bike commute feasable, and after I got laid off in 2002 I refused to look for work in the area, but I would consider working down there again if BART ran into downtown San Jose.
Whistle Codes
Thanks for the link Kevin. The codes in my book are more or less identical except for slight differences in wording. My book also provides a list of conductor's whistle codes. I'll be listening a little closer to what happens along the tracks near me. Just realized the other day that the only crossing arms I used to be able to hear are defunct. The grade crossing by the previously mentioned College Park stop was closed a couple of years ago, and that was the only place within earshot that had crossing arms.
Rich, it does appear that Measure B is going to pass but the opposition is mulling over paying for a re-count. I voted for both Measure B and for the high speed rail. The longer we wait, the more it's going to cost. Voters in this county had the opportunity to connect with BART back in the late 60's and they chose not to. It wasn't until the 90's that it was clear we needed a solution to the transit issues here, and finally got a 73% yes vote on extending BART. This latest measure was asking for 1/8% sales tax increase to cover the lost tax revenues that resulted from the economic downturn that started back in 2001. I won't feel that increase much and we need to get the job done, even though my level of confidence in the local transit authority who will see the project through is minimal. I'll likely be retirement age before I can hop on BART without having to drive 20 miles, but there's no question we need to get going on this, like yesterday!
Ralph
Thanks for the link Kevin. The codes in my book are more or less identical except for slight differences in wording. My book also provides a list of conductor's whistle codes. I'll be listening a little closer to what happens along the tracks near me. Just realized the other day that the only crossing arms I used to be able to hear are defunct. The grade crossing by the previously mentioned College Park stop was closed a couple of years ago, and that was the only place within earshot that had crossing arms.
Rich, it does appear that Measure B is going to pass but the opposition is mulling over paying for a re-count. I voted for both Measure B and for the high speed rail. The longer we wait, the more it's going to cost. Voters in this county had the opportunity to connect with BART back in the late 60's and they chose not to. It wasn't until the 90's that it was clear we needed a solution to the transit issues here, and finally got a 73% yes vote on extending BART. This latest measure was asking for 1/8% sales tax increase to cover the lost tax revenues that resulted from the economic downturn that started back in 2001. I won't feel that increase much and we need to get the job done, even though my level of confidence in the local transit authority who will see the project through is minimal. I'll likely be retirement age before I can hop on BART without having to drive 20 miles, but there's no question we need to get going on this, like yesterday!
Ralph
filter-flo_rob
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 7, 2008
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- 184
"Tornado"
Thanks, Paul for posting those links. That train is a great site to behold!
Ralph, regarding whistle signals, like most lighted signals, they are very similar across the country. There are slight variations which are listed in the train manuals for a particular line.
For example, some lines use a flashing yellow meaning to await orders, while others don't have this option at all -- and I'm not even going to get into the different types of signals. Unfortunately all the semaphores are gone and the single targets are rapidly disappearing, in the northeast, that is. Same with interlocking systems (in favour of autoblock)
I've got a few trainman's books from the teens (Boston and Albany) to some in the mid-40s. They are a great treat to read.
Rob.
Thanks, Paul for posting those links. That train is a great site to behold!
Ralph, regarding whistle signals, like most lighted signals, they are very similar across the country. There are slight variations which are listed in the train manuals for a particular line.
For example, some lines use a flashing yellow meaning to await orders, while others don't have this option at all -- and I'm not even going to get into the different types of signals. Unfortunately all the semaphores are gone and the single targets are rapidly disappearing, in the northeast, that is. Same with interlocking systems (in favour of autoblock)
I've got a few trainman's books from the teens (Boston and Albany) to some in the mid-40s. They are a great treat to read.
Rob.
filter-flo_rob
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 7, 2008
- Messages
- 184
Great Central Railway Autumn Gala 2008
WOW, WOW, WOW ,WOW ... this is an awsome youtube clip.
I did make an observation from the first scene: the semaphore signal. In this area, the signal is placed before the approaching block, most of the time, a few car lengths away. The engineer can see the approaching block as clear, but If I'm sitting in the last car of a 6 car commuter rail train, on the right hand side, I can see the signal turn from green to red. In this pix it was much longer; longer than the length of the train; more like 6 or 7 lengths.
Are there any UK trainmen on this site?
Rob.
WOW, WOW, WOW ,WOW ... this is an awsome youtube clip.
I did make an observation from the first scene: the semaphore signal. In this area, the signal is placed before the approaching block, most of the time, a few car lengths away. The engineer can see the approaching block as clear, but If I'm sitting in the last car of a 6 car commuter rail train, on the right hand side, I can see the signal turn from green to red. In this pix it was much longer; longer than the length of the train; more like 6 or 7 lengths.
Are there any UK trainmen on this site?
Rob.
Yeah Rob, when we were on that detour excursion over Labor Day weekend it was a little disappointing to hear that the navigation was all happening in Omaha for trains east of Colfax, CA. But still there's a lot of old school technology that survives. Not many successful large business operations you can say that about these days.
Ralph
Ralph
It's Official
The high speed rail project between the Bay Area and L.A. can now proceed and we've got BART heading into San Jose. Per the local paper this week, the downtown San Jose train station is poised to become the Grand Central of the west coast (yeah right) with Cal Train, ACE, Amtrak California, Amtrak's Coast Starlight, High Speed Rail, BART and the local trolley system all converging there. I just hope they don't blow up the vintage 1935 Southern Pacific station as part of the expansion project that will be necessary.
The high speed rail project between the Bay Area and L.A. can now proceed and we've got BART heading into San Jose. Per the local paper this week, the downtown San Jose train station is poised to become the Grand Central of the west coast (yeah right) with Cal Train, ACE, Amtrak California, Amtrak's Coast Starlight, High Speed Rail, BART and the local trolley system all converging there. I just hope they don't blow up the vintage 1935 Southern Pacific station as part of the expansion project that will be necessary.
I agree. That is a gorgeous little station, Ralph. There should be a way to preserve its character.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
Ralph,
Doesn't Capitol Corridor also use the San Jose train station?
I can't recall ever being inside the San Jose train station, but as I recall I've driven past it more than a few times. Hopefully they will preserve it in some way shape or form.
Anyway, very good news about BART to San Jose. Now I'm wondering how many years it will take.
I just got back from visiting with some friends in Modesto for Tday dinner this afternoon. The traffic on 580 from the 680 interchange all the way out to 205 through Tracy was horrendous. I finally took a detour to catch 580 southe east to intersect with 132 to get into Modesto from the southern side. I know people who commute from places like Manteca and Tracy to get to the East Bay for their jobs. I can't imagine doing it on a daily basis, but somehow they manage. I guess I'm a bit shell shocked from my Nimitz commute to San Jose during the dot com boom. I like cars and I enjoy driving, but not in gridlock. BART to San Jose will go a long way towards fixing what's wrong with the Bay "Area. But I think they also need to run it all the way to Tracy and maybe even Sacramento. A friend who works for BART in the train maintenance department says the rolling stock isn't capable of such long distances, but I really wonder if that's the reason why the system hasn't been expanded more than it is. But perhaps the Nixon era train design cut as many corners as the Space Shuttle.
Doesn't Capitol Corridor also use the San Jose train station?
I can't recall ever being inside the San Jose train station, but as I recall I've driven past it more than a few times. Hopefully they will preserve it in some way shape or form.
Anyway, very good news about BART to San Jose. Now I'm wondering how many years it will take.
I just got back from visiting with some friends in Modesto for Tday dinner this afternoon. The traffic on 580 from the 680 interchange all the way out to 205 through Tracy was horrendous. I finally took a detour to catch 580 southe east to intersect with 132 to get into Modesto from the southern side. I know people who commute from places like Manteca and Tracy to get to the East Bay for their jobs. I can't imagine doing it on a daily basis, but somehow they manage. I guess I'm a bit shell shocked from my Nimitz commute to San Jose during the dot com boom. I like cars and I enjoy driving, but not in gridlock. BART to San Jose will go a long way towards fixing what's wrong with the Bay "Area. But I think they also need to run it all the way to Tracy and maybe even Sacramento. A friend who works for BART in the train maintenance department says the rolling stock isn't capable of such long distances, but I really wonder if that's the reason why the system hasn't been expanded more than it is. But perhaps the Nixon era train design cut as many corners as the Space Shuttle.
Rich, yes, I was referring to the Capitol Corridor when I mentioned Amtrak California.
But today's paper reports that the "No on B" faction is going to court for a re-count. Shortly before the election there were some changes made to the requirements for a re-count and since Measure B needed a 2/3 super majority to pass, these new requirements may make the case for a re-count baseless. Since the measure passed by 2,000 votes it's not really that close. We'll have to wait and see if the court will even agree to hear the argument for a re-count. Geez, it should be clear what the electorate wants if the measure won by a 67% to 33% margin.
It will likely be a long time before we see an attempt to extend BART to the Big Valley. They can't even manage to get it out to Livermore. Since they have the ACE trains running between San Jose and Stockton and they are usually packed, it could make more sense financially to add more runs to that line than extend BART.
But today's paper reports that the "No on B" faction is going to court for a re-count. Shortly before the election there were some changes made to the requirements for a re-count and since Measure B needed a 2/3 super majority to pass, these new requirements may make the case for a re-count baseless. Since the measure passed by 2,000 votes it's not really that close. We'll have to wait and see if the court will even agree to hear the argument for a re-count. Geez, it should be clear what the electorate wants if the measure won by a 67% to 33% margin.
It will likely be a long time before we see an attempt to extend BART to the Big Valley. They can't even manage to get it out to Livermore. Since they have the ACE trains running between San Jose and Stockton and they are usually packed, it could make more sense financially to add more runs to that line than extend BART.
sudsmaster
Well-known member
ACE trains seem to be better run than Capitol Corridor trains.
When I rode CC, it was chronically late. I would say late about 75% of the time by as much as 15 minutes. Then about 25% of the time late by more than 1/2 hour. And late by more than an hour - or no service at all - about 5% of the time. When you depend on a transit system to get you to work on time, and the scheduled trains are about 1 hour apart, this kind of performance is really not acceptable.
CC was put in for one main purpose - to get Sacramento politicians and staff to their jobs in the Capitol from the SF Bay Area. It was later extended down to San Jose with schedule additions. But it's never been really well planned or executed, at least not when I rode it up to 2002.
I think it's sort of a waste of energy and money to use a heavy locomotive to pull a three or four car passenger train on an intercity commute of less than 100 miles. That is what BART was designed to do, on dedicated tracks and with trains specifically made to run on electricity and carry only passengers. BART has had more than its share of teething problems - most traceable to political interference during its design phase - but most of these issues have been resolved and outside of inertia and funding I don't know of any reason why BART couldn't replace CC and Cal Train in the Bay Area. Someday it will eventually be extended from SF down to San Jose, and from Fremont to San Jose. Marin County probably will never see BART, which is a pity since the GG Bridge is chronically overloaded and the ferries are an inefficient way to move people. When the next Big One collapses the Doyle Drive approaches on the SF side, maybe we'll see some movement towards light rail to Marin, but I suspect the anti-development forces up there will oppose any sort of public transit advancement.
When I rode CC, it was chronically late. I would say late about 75% of the time by as much as 15 minutes. Then about 25% of the time late by more than 1/2 hour. And late by more than an hour - or no service at all - about 5% of the time. When you depend on a transit system to get you to work on time, and the scheduled trains are about 1 hour apart, this kind of performance is really not acceptable.
CC was put in for one main purpose - to get Sacramento politicians and staff to their jobs in the Capitol from the SF Bay Area. It was later extended down to San Jose with schedule additions. But it's never been really well planned or executed, at least not when I rode it up to 2002.
I think it's sort of a waste of energy and money to use a heavy locomotive to pull a three or four car passenger train on an intercity commute of less than 100 miles. That is what BART was designed to do, on dedicated tracks and with trains specifically made to run on electricity and carry only passengers. BART has had more than its share of teething problems - most traceable to political interference during its design phase - but most of these issues have been resolved and outside of inertia and funding I don't know of any reason why BART couldn't replace CC and Cal Train in the Bay Area. Someday it will eventually be extended from SF down to San Jose, and from Fremont to San Jose. Marin County probably will never see BART, which is a pity since the GG Bridge is chronically overloaded and the ferries are an inefficient way to move people. When the next Big One collapses the Doyle Drive approaches on the SF side, maybe we'll see some movement towards light rail to Marin, but I suspect the anti-development forces up there will oppose any sort of public transit advancement.
Re: Marin County and points north, I believe with this last election they approved commuter rail between Cloverdale and somewhere like San Rafael or some Marin town with a GG Ferry connection. I hope people in all parts of the Bay Area realize that we need to have alternative transportation on a regional level and will support financially sound rail transit solutions.
It's my understanding that the CC trains have been a huge success and that (funding permitted) they would like to add more runs. I rode the first early morning train out of SJ to Sacramento a couple of years ago and it was empty. It seemed like a huge waste of taxpayer dollars. Yet I was told that later trains are packed. I wonder how true that is. I agree that giant locomotives aren't as efficient as BART. Hauling freight is where they are at their most efficient. I guess they will have to serve as an interim solution until BART one day a few lifetimes from now circles the bay and has spokes running to the exurban communities past the Diablo range.
It's my understanding that the CC trains have been a huge success and that (funding permitted) they would like to add more runs. I rode the first early morning train out of SJ to Sacramento a couple of years ago and it was empty. It seemed like a huge waste of taxpayer dollars. Yet I was told that later trains are packed. I wonder how true that is. I agree that giant locomotives aren't as efficient as BART. Hauling freight is where they are at their most efficient. I guess they will have to serve as an interim solution until BART one day a few lifetimes from now circles the bay and has spokes running to the exurban communities past the Diablo range.
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