brettsomers
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 30, 2005
- Messages
- 1,993
Why has GE used curved-vane or straight-vane agitators in their machines? which worked better? why did they flip-flop between the two? thanks
Agitators in classic GEs
- Thread starter brettsomers
- Start date
Help Support :
IMO that "straight-vane" agitator (the one introduced about 1965) was nearly useless,very poor roll-over, except for the poor clothes near the bottom of the tub that were thrashed relentlessly.( and reappeared, no doubt, in a very altered state, in the filter pan!)
Now the "ramped" Activator was great! Like most of the agitators in machines back when that agitator was introduced, it was very aggressive. Roll over was very good, etc.
I never understood what they were thinking with that "straight-vane", but then they did not ask my opinion! The only thing I can think of is some "dreamer" thought the American public would actually use the exact rated capacity of the machine with every load and NEVER overload it! Yeah, right. But even lightly loaded with plenty of water the roll over I have seen is poor.
MTC
Now the "ramped" Activator was great! Like most of the agitators in machines back when that agitator was introduced, it was very aggressive. Roll over was very good, etc.
I never understood what they were thinking with that "straight-vane", but then they did not ask my opinion! The only thing I can think of is some "dreamer" thought the American public would actually use the exact rated capacity of the machine with every load and NEVER overload it! Yeah, right. But even lightly loaded with plenty of water the roll over I have seen is poor.
MTC
Probably more than you ever wanted to know
One of the biggest improvements that GE made in its washer line came in 1961 when it introduced the V-12 models with the larger perforated tub (and the mini-basket a year later). These models were beautiful and effective works of industrial art. This was the introduction of the trefoil-helix (curved) agitator. This design increased "rollover" and made their machines some of the most effective (albeit noisy) at cleaning. The first helix agitators, or "activators", were black, with a black cap. A few years later when the GE color scheme incorporated a light bluish-green, they agitator cap became that green.
GE is one of the most profit-driven companies out there. They also seem to knee jerk with whatever prevailing consumer wind is blowing. In response to Consumers Union's carping and probably incessant 'bean counter' pressure, the design of the agitator changed back to straight vane in the late sixties with disastrous results to both clothing and the machines. Initially, these activators on their V-14 line were black with green caps; later they became solid green. Incredibly, the activator design used 4 large vanes towards the top of the unit (probably to support and increase movement in the mini-basket)and 8 slight vanes at the bottom. This design did nothing for the efficiency of the wash; clothing in the washtub simply sloshed, noisily, back and forth with little or no rollover movement. In 1969 GE introduced larger tub 18-lb capacity machines with a straight-vaned blue agitator. This design was modified later in the seventies when some smart engineer figured out you could still support the mini-basket, but increase the size of the lower activator paddles for more water movement. This design still fell far short of the efficiency and grace of the helix activator. The company finally returned to their successful helix design in the eighties with a white activator just as Whirlpool/Sears started to introduce their white racheting corkscrew agitator ( which garnered a Consumer Reports rave) and "rollover" became the hot issue again.
Sadly, in the late nineties, the worms at GE killed their washer division off and adopted the Sears/Whirlpool design.
View attachment 3-22-2006-07-16-10--Bajaespuma.jpg
One of the biggest improvements that GE made in its washer line came in 1961 when it introduced the V-12 models with the larger perforated tub (and the mini-basket a year later). These models were beautiful and effective works of industrial art. This was the introduction of the trefoil-helix (curved) agitator. This design increased "rollover" and made their machines some of the most effective (albeit noisy) at cleaning. The first helix agitators, or "activators", were black, with a black cap. A few years later when the GE color scheme incorporated a light bluish-green, they agitator cap became that green.
GE is one of the most profit-driven companies out there. They also seem to knee jerk with whatever prevailing consumer wind is blowing. In response to Consumers Union's carping and probably incessant 'bean counter' pressure, the design of the agitator changed back to straight vane in the late sixties with disastrous results to both clothing and the machines. Initially, these activators on their V-14 line were black with green caps; later they became solid green. Incredibly, the activator design used 4 large vanes towards the top of the unit (probably to support and increase movement in the mini-basket)and 8 slight vanes at the bottom. This design did nothing for the efficiency of the wash; clothing in the washtub simply sloshed, noisily, back and forth with little or no rollover movement. In 1969 GE introduced larger tub 18-lb capacity machines with a straight-vaned blue agitator. This design was modified later in the seventies when some smart engineer figured out you could still support the mini-basket, but increase the size of the lower activator paddles for more water movement. This design still fell far short of the efficiency and grace of the helix activator. The company finally returned to their successful helix design in the eighties with a white activator just as Whirlpool/Sears started to introduce their white racheting corkscrew agitator ( which garnered a Consumer Reports rave) and "rollover" became the hot issue again.
Sadly, in the late nineties, the worms at GE killed their washer division off and adopted the Sears/Whirlpool design.
View attachment 3-22-2006-07-16-10--Bajaespuma.jpg
rinso
Well-known member
I still remember the sound of the curved-vane GE agitators, sort of a "glortchata glortchata glortchata" noise. They seemed much more effective at rollover than the straight vaned ones and also created a nice pulsing action that got clothes really clean without beating the fibers out of them.
filterflo
New member
Actually GE did make a ramp vane agitator in the 60's. Mike in Long Beach has a 1964 GE V14 with the ramp agitator in black, and I have a 1968 GE Programmed Washer pictured here with the curved vane agitator. Both worked well, but I feel you can load more in a curved vane and still get a better turnover rate. They do tend to oversuds more tho it seems.........
filterflo
New member
GE called their agitator the Super V 14.........ACTIVATOR!!
filterflo
New member
Here is the Aqua Mini Basket that would go with this agitator. They made the Mini Baskets in BOTH Aqua and in White. The earlier ones were in white and I think they went to the Aqua color sometime in 1966. Some people have claimed that the aqua ones were just discolored, but that just aint so!
filterflo
New member
Although I dont have a srt8 vane agitator in black, I do have this dealer poster that shows a picture of one...........
filterflo
New member
Cutaway of how the GE wash system operated!............
filterflo
New member
GE Washer features..........With Green Dot Dependability
bobbyderegis
Well-known member
Here's my 2 cents. My Gram had a 1978 Large cap Filter-flo, straight vane aqua activator with mini-basket and large diam. filter pan. The "rollover" was very fast, even with a very full load. Being a nerdy washer freak, I had to get a three vaned "ramp" agitator just because it was different. What I found was that you lost some of the tub capacity because of the bulkiness of the ramps, the rollover was still good, but not as fast as the straight 4 vane activator. There was much more "rotation" of the clothes as they went under with the ramp agitator. Which one cleaned better? I could never decide.
Bobby in Boston
Bobby in Boston
I think the way agitators work, that rollover is accomplished with a straight vane model. The way it works, is that the vanes are larger diameter at the bottom of the agitator. This, combined with the radial arrangement of the vanes, forces water from the center of the tub to the outside of the tub. The water has no place to go but up. So the flow is up at the sides of the tub, and down at the center of the tub around the agitator column.
The problem with screw type agitators is that they only work in one direction. They may "look" like they provide better turnover, but I really wonder if they do. I also wonder if they result in more tangling than a straight vane agitator.
The problem with screw type agitators is that they only work in one direction. They may "look" like they provide better turnover, but I really wonder if they do. I also wonder if they result in more tangling than a straight vane agitator.
bobbyderegis
Well-known member
Interesting how in many, many years Maytag always used the same, straight vaned agitator. It seemed to work well for them. Incidentally, Gram's GE filter flo became second in line to a rebuilt Maytag A606.
Bobby in Boston
Bobby in Boston
westytoploader
Well-known member
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2004
- Messages
- 4,485
I've been following this thread for a while, and having used both the straight-vane and spiral-ramp GE Activators (in the large-capacity Dispensall) thought I'd add my $0.02.
The 18-pound straight-vane Activator shown below, even with those tall vanes at the base, has surprisingly good turnover with that fast 100 OPM stroke, but isn't effective at getting rid of air bubbles, especially on items like sheets. So while the wash cycle circulates evenly, the air-laden load just thrashes around at the top when it's rinsing. I haven't had a standard-capacity machine yet to try the 3-vane version (I have that one in Turquoise, with the rubber filter mount), so I'm not sure how well it works. Steve, interesting that the rollover would be poor even with a light load and high water level; perhaps it has something to do with the vanes being too wide, especially when you consider the size of the (standard) tub and the agitation speed!!
For me, the 18-pound Ramp Activator wins hands down. It greatly increases the working capacity of the tub (I believe it was Greg who mentioned on the phone that GE machines were one of the few that could actually wash their claimed capacity); I can wash a big Bob-load using that agitator that I wouldn't even think about stuffing in with the straight-vane!! Then there's the additional fun factor for anyone "rollover-minded" like me...I love that slurping sound it makes on a small load, and I refer to the pulsing action that Gene described as the "dip-roll" motion. You can see the load "dip" up and down and travel further down the centerpost with each stroke.
I'd be interested to see how the blue 8-vane 18-pound Activator like the one in Matt's machine works; I'm guessing that with lower base vanes it would have better turnover. I think that if GE made an agitator without those extra-large post vanes it would work much better, though probably not as good as the tried-and-true Ramp Activator!!
My question is: Did they produce ramp and straight-vane equipped machines at the same time, or alternate between the years?
--Austin
The 18-pound straight-vane Activator shown below, even with those tall vanes at the base, has surprisingly good turnover with that fast 100 OPM stroke, but isn't effective at getting rid of air bubbles, especially on items like sheets. So while the wash cycle circulates evenly, the air-laden load just thrashes around at the top when it's rinsing. I haven't had a standard-capacity machine yet to try the 3-vane version (I have that one in Turquoise, with the rubber filter mount), so I'm not sure how well it works. Steve, interesting that the rollover would be poor even with a light load and high water level; perhaps it has something to do with the vanes being too wide, especially when you consider the size of the (standard) tub and the agitation speed!!
For me, the 18-pound Ramp Activator wins hands down. It greatly increases the working capacity of the tub (I believe it was Greg who mentioned on the phone that GE machines were one of the few that could actually wash their claimed capacity); I can wash a big Bob-load using that agitator that I wouldn't even think about stuffing in with the straight-vane!! Then there's the additional fun factor for anyone "rollover-minded" like me...I love that slurping sound it makes on a small load, and I refer to the pulsing action that Gene described as the "dip-roll" motion. You can see the load "dip" up and down and travel further down the centerpost with each stroke.
I'd be interested to see how the blue 8-vane 18-pound Activator like the one in Matt's machine works; I'm guessing that with lower base vanes it would have better turnover. I think that if GE made an agitator without those extra-large post vanes it would work much better, though probably not as good as the tried-and-true Ramp Activator!!
My question is: Did they produce ramp and straight-vane equipped machines at the same time, or alternate between the years?
--Austin
Austin----
I should have clarified my experience with those straight-vane activators-------- was only on the standard tub machines.
I think maybe GE did sell machines with both types of agitators at the same time.
I should have clarified my experience with those straight-vane activators-------- was only on the standard tub machines.
I think maybe GE did sell machines with both types of agitators at the same time.
I owned an 18# GE machine with the straight 8 vane agitator--for 25 years. I liked its capacity, it had good turnover and it cleaned well. That being said, it was rough on the clothes and I had to refrain from using longer cycle times. Compared to most other washers, it was also a pretty good rinser.
My girlfriend has the Hotpoint version with the ramp agitator. I am none too impressed with ramp agitation. It doesn't seem to have as much capacity and turnover isn't great. (Not to mention it is noisy; not a desirable trait IMO.)
As I mentioned in another thread, Consumers' Reports had an "agitator comparison" that I once read in a mid or late '60's issue, probably at the peak of the agitator wars. I do remember that the [fixed] straight vane units were generally judged better. Maybe someone can find this article and do a book report.
The later flex-vanes that are common today were touted for better turnover and they probably are about the best for heavy to overloaded machines. If you think about it, they flex into nothing more than a quasi-ramp anyway.
FWIW: The GE 18# tub has a volume of 2.5 ft^3 (cubic feet) when filled to the bottom of the balance rim (before the tub narrows). And it is about 2.8 ft^3 at the top, where the clothes guard is, based on my actual measurments.
My girlfriend has the Hotpoint version with the ramp agitator. I am none too impressed with ramp agitation. It doesn't seem to have as much capacity and turnover isn't great. (Not to mention it is noisy; not a desirable trait IMO.)
As I mentioned in another thread, Consumers' Reports had an "agitator comparison" that I once read in a mid or late '60's issue, probably at the peak of the agitator wars. I do remember that the [fixed] straight vane units were generally judged better. Maybe someone can find this article and do a book report.
The later flex-vanes that are common today were touted for better turnover and they probably are about the best for heavy to overloaded machines. If you think about it, they flex into nothing more than a quasi-ramp anyway.
FWIW: The GE 18# tub has a volume of 2.5 ft^3 (cubic feet) when filled to the bottom of the balance rim (before the tub narrows). And it is about 2.8 ft^3 at the top, where the clothes guard is, based on my actual measurments.
geextrarinse
Well-known member
My Straight Vaned Activator
I want to say that I agree with the fans of the ramp activator and I like the "schlump schlump" noise it makes but i LOVE my straight 8 vaned Activator in my 70's GE - It does a great job and even on a full if not overloaded machine. It sits next to my moms Maytag with the straight turq. agitator. There is simply no comparrison. She even likes my machine better for exactly that - the ability to move the clothes better than hers. She doesn't know much about the machines other than what i've told her and now I catch her watching the filter flo and doing mini basket washes! The 8 vanes Activator is a great design and I was more than impressed by it. I actually tried to get one for you Austin - but I was almost arrested - we'll leave it at that...
I also have the standard capacity activator on the 70's model - it is also straight vaned and works very well. Ultimately -I am a fan.
I want to say that I agree with the fans of the ramp activator and I like the "schlump schlump" noise it makes but i LOVE my straight 8 vaned Activator in my 70's GE - It does a great job and even on a full if not overloaded machine. It sits next to my moms Maytag with the straight turq. agitator. There is simply no comparrison. She even likes my machine better for exactly that - the ability to move the clothes better than hers. She doesn't know much about the machines other than what i've told her and now I catch her watching the filter flo and doing mini basket washes! The 8 vanes Activator is a great design and I was more than impressed by it. I actually tried to get one for you Austin - but I was almost arrested - we'll leave it at that...
I also have the standard capacity activator on the 70's model - it is also straight vaned and works very well. Ultimately -I am a fan.
Similar threads
