ARE YOU SERIOUS PANASONIC???????

[henene4]

Well, as thet title says, we (my family and I), are a bit unpleasant talking about Panasonic. Well, a bit unpleasant means we just hate them!

So, we have our NA148VG4WDE. May last year, it broke the first time. The service guy came here and said as he started to take the washer apart that he is new at Panasonic. OK, nice to hear. As things happend, he damaged the doorlock during this repair. Searching for the fault, he took out the controlboard, looked at it and placed it again in there. Finaly, replaced the doorlock, went off.

Friday, the 15.03.2014: Grandma wants to wash.
Loads her AEG, starts it.
Loads the Panasonic, presses on.
What now happend is the main fault.
In fact, it is just minnor.
Not even mentionable.
Nothing at all.
Nothing.
Literally nothing.
The washer did nothing.
It just did not turn on.
So, as we know the procedure (we had this kind fault several times on multiple things), we called the service and knew he would have to replace probably the main controlboard.

Monday, he comes in. Nice to know they are that fast. I have not been at home so I just know what my granny and my brother told me. As I have been told, he walks in the basement, detaches the 3 screws holding the top in place and asks my brother to help him leaning the machine forward to remove the top. After that he has been alone for about 15 minutes. As my grandma comes down, he's about to replace the top again and tells her that there is a "major thing" wrong with it. He would phone back on wednesday, maybe thursday.

Friday, he still did not phone back. As my ma calls, she gets the good service as usual. But is she told there: "Oh yeah, I know about that case. We suspect that you opend up the machine and tried to repai it your self. We informed our headquarter in Hamburg and we will not repair your washer! The service guy took pictures as a proof."

So, now, after lots of talking with MediaMarkt (we got a 5 year appliance insurance with our washer that is just about 1,5 years old), they say as long as Panasonic says we did that, they won't pay, and Panasonic says you did that, even though we don't know what. My mum send a letter to the headquarter last week and we still wait for a replay.

In the end, we sit here with a 699€ washer thats broken, a manufacturer that says we would have tried to cheat on him, a seller which says "I say what the manufacturer says" and the incertitude of what exactly has happend.

Last words on that: You build good washers, Panasonic, but you are just a big pile of "not nice people" (to be nice...)

 

[nrones]

whaaaat?

Oh my god!!! There's gotta be something to be done! It's a fraud! Ask them to post those pictures as proof - you can check with us how to defend yourself if their explanation is irrelevant and idiotoc.

Sue them! Bloody uncultured bastards, arghhh, I hate this unjustice

You're having my support

Dex

 

[mielerod69]

Just get a Miele!

I tend to shy away from these companies as they don't have a very good reputation when it comes to after sales service. I would not have spent that money on a Panasonic, rather I would've bought a Siemens, Bosch or at a stretch Miele.
Miele have the new 7 kg in the classic design at 849 euros. Solid machine with no fancy bells and whistles.

http://www.miele.de/haushalt/waschmaschine-1566.htm?mat=09793200&name=WDA110_WCS

 

[arbilab]

I would have expected better of Panasonic.....

......but that was the OLD Panasonic, like prior to 2000.

Seems they have lately taken a page from the Dell Computer warranty playbook. Here's a sample:

Your laptop quits in warranty. You mail it in to the depot, a contract repairer out for their own profit. The message comes back that "you spilled water in it so there is no warranty" when you know perfectly well that you did NOT. The repairer simply wants to charge you retail for a warranty repair.

I run a Dell complaint website. We hear this story (and several others) not just once but over and over. If you wouldn't like Panasonic doing this to you, don't buy Dell buy Lenovo.

 

[whirlcool]

I had a laptop come in for repairs a few years ago where THREE different repair centers told the customer that they found water in the laptop so they needed to buy a new laptop. It was a Dell of course. The laptop was only 18 mos old at the time.
I fixed it. The problem was it needed a new hard disk. Less than $100 to repair it.
And I found no evidence of water inside, either.

 

[kitty]

WOW...

I've never heard of such a problematic. We have a microwave by them that's 28 years old and the only thing that has broken on it was the lightbulb!!! It still has good cooking power too!!!

 

[whirlykenmore78]

Your best bet would be.

To report them to the German version of the Better Business Bureau. If such thing exists. Otherwise turn them in to every consumer watchdog group in the EU!
WK78

 

[henene4]

Uhh, what a miracle...

... Panasonic did NOT answer on our letter. so, after 2 weeks, a friend of us (electrician) came over and had a look at it. Actually, the serviceguy obviously tried to repair it, but did not have any luck with it (it was definetivley worked on that bord, i can tell that and I'm not a professional...). But anyway, he repaired the actually broken resistor and hadn't any luck with it either. So he searched, found some wrong cabling and worked on it for half an hour, but the fault was not on the top of the bord. And now, one of the most stupid things I have ever seen: Panasonic builds these things in the most stupid way you can think of.
1. Intead of using eneglish, ANY part is labeld in chinese. I don't mean the metaphoricly, LITERLY CHINESE!!! You can't tell what the part's specific datas are, they are CHINESE!!!
2. Most stupid thing ever: I told you ones the bord was embeded in a kind of gelatinish stuff? Panasonic designed the bord to be completly unremoveable out of its black plastic mounting box so you can't se what is underneath the bord AND to prove you don't even try, the goo-stuff is used to seal it in there. I mean, it is nice to protect everything, but you could not even change a simple fuse (and there are simple burn-through-fuses on that bord) because you can't get to the points to get them out because they are on the underside of that bord and even if, the gelantin would keep them glued to the bord. A part (approx. 400 €) that is not even anyhow rescuable.
So, anyway, it is dead and we will get a new, cheap machine. And I say cheap. Gorenje, Bauknecht, Bomann or a simple BOL AEG. But first, we will check where to get it (preferable a local dealer if they give us an excapltable price) and during that, we get to tthe fun part:
My dad, my brother and I will just take the darn thing apart and sell whatever is possible. I mean, we have the inverter motor still working (approx. 250€ new), the heater, drum, pumps etc. So, let's see what this will bring. And because we are still payig for this washer (MediaMarkt had a 0% financing at the time we bought it and as the washer wasn't exactly cheap and we just bought a 900€ Miele just 2 1/2 years befor this machine, my mom got this...) we may have some luck with that.

 

[logixx]

Bummer about the Panasonic

Why not get a Beko (Blomberg or Grundig)?

 

[henene4]

One criteria...

.. even though it is stupid, is that the washer has to have a) a curtain cycle with prewash (AEG) or b) a delicates cycle with prewash adable (all the others)...

 

[foraloysius]

Isn't the retailer responsible? He sold you a product that doesn't live up to its expectations, especially for that kind of money.

Not all Bauknecht models have the option of a prewash on the delicate cycle. I would avoid Bauknecht anyway, always trouble with them.

 

[henene4]

I know...

... And MediaMarkt redirects us to Panasonic, Panasonic says "Yes, its our business" and MediaMarkt says "As long as Panasonic says that we say that to".
And I know the problematic of Bauknecht"

 

[henene4]

Back to my PC...

... as my phone doesn't handle this site verry well :/
So, I searched further and foud 5 machines that I'll probably show my mum (remember, I can just help her picking the right one...) and I'll post the here in the order (from best to not-that-good-ish):

1: Gorneje WA8440P (http://www.gorenje.de/waschepflege/waschmaschinen?c=417345):
This washer is a perfectly matching for the least money. It has the prewash on it's delicate cycle, further, it has a big drum (8kg, 64l), dosn't take too long, spins at 1400rpm reaching 44% residual moisture, has water plus, 2 custom cycles and an easy to read interface (perfect for my grandma).

2. Bomann WA5814 (http://www.bomann.de/products/de/El...und-Trockengeraete/WA-5814-Waschmaschine.html):
Actually more expensive, spins not as good and has not that many features though I like the soak option. Note: Same machine by Exqusit is avaible even cheaper but I'm not sure if it got the clear text labeling as the Bomann or just symbols as the Exquisit-page shows. Further, if we gonny buy a washer at a local retailer, I doubt we'll get this one as I know them only to be sold in large quatities.

3. Samsung WF10824 (http://www.samsung.com/de/consumer/home-appliances/laundry/washing-machines/WF10824Z8V/XEG)
This modell shot up in my ranking as I saw it at Otto (a big mail order house my mum orders at since more than 20 years) for only 399€ plus a 5% discount for us as we are long term customers. It is quite good in its data (pretty simular to the Gorenje about size, spin speed, energy usage etc.) and on top of the gorenje it has a brushless motor (and I love brushless motors). Further, I know these do spinwashes as a part of the EcoBubble-cycling and I saw what this means on our Panasonic (may she burn in hell). I know about the reputation of Samsung, but in this price area, more than 3 years of service would be surprising...

4. AEG L60668 FL (http://www.electrolux-ui.com/2011/132/937081DE.pdf ; just the manual PDF as it is no longer listed and only abaible at one retailer)
Actually, a 1600rpm machine. Has some pararlels with our L71670, even the drum is the same (just labeld 1kg less AFAIK). Curtain-cycle, Extra Rinse, Time saver and easy to use. Just place 4 because it is what it is: A cheaper version of our already not-that-good L71670 , just using more water (45l for 6kg means 7,5l each kg, the L71670 uses 49l for 7 kg, means 7l each kg).

5. Bauknecht Super Eco 6414 (https://www.otto.de/p/bauknecht-was...0-touren-390664276/#variationId=390667553-M48 ; this time the actual Otto site)
If purchased online, this would probably be mums favorite. It has just the "worst" data: Loud, small, bad reputation, bad quality, not really good performance. But you get 4 years warranty with it.

So, please tell me, which one would you choose or which would you recomend. If you found machines matching my criteria (under 400€, prewash on delicates or curtains cycle, 1400rpm, as big as possible), tell me! Would be much appreciated!

 

[dj-gabriele]

Go for the Gorenje!

Among those you selected is the one with the best quality and fantastic performances too!

Samsung is pure crap, no other words to describe it, the Bomann seems just one of the many chines/turkish machine you find for next to nothing, Bauknecht is just a troublesome Whirlpool in disguise and finally AEG that might be nice but overrated since the disastrous Electrolux take over.

At least this is my opinion, I'd take the WA8440P in a blink!

 

[dj-gabriele]

On second thought... checking again the BOMANN machine:

I just noticed it's an Evolution 3 clone coming from the ItWash factories in Acerra, near Naples.

Have a look on the website I attached.
Over here they gained a very good reputation as they are very cheap and perform well, you decide if it fits the bill.
Also they're the very last company still making washing machine with a mechanical timer in Europe as far as I know.

Sangiorgio Elettrodomestici

www.itwash.it

 

[henene4]

Wyss-Mirella uses an elctro-mechincal main-system either. And as I said, these 2 were my most favorite machines...
Just have to find a dealer first and my mum has to decide what she wants to have and so this will take time...

 

[lavamat_jon]

How about Beko?  Good value for money and offer large capacities as well as delicate cycles with prewash options.

 

[henene4]

Which model ?

I looked through all Beko manuals on their german web-page and non of them had the prewash set-able on the delicate cycle. Do you know one for sure that offers that?

 

[foraloysius]

Gorenje has a few very cheaply made models. A while ago I was in an appliance store in Germany and knocked on one of those. It sounded very hollow, no insulation at all. And the metal seemed very thin, thinner than a cooky sheet. Don't know the model you are looking at is the same, but check it before you buy a Gorenje.

It's good to avoid Bauknecht like the plague. Too many people complain about these machines, a repeat of the Panasonic drama might be in your future with a Bauknecht.

Samsung gets very high ratings here in the Netherlands. I think it is impressive to get an 8.7 out of 561 reviews for a machine under €415.-

http://www.kieskeurig.nl/wasmachine/samsung/wf70f5e0q4wen/1156407

I know a guy who repairs machines like Bomann and Exquisit. He does it to earn some extra money, but he shakes his head when you talk about the quality of these machines. A lot of them get tossed out on an early age.

AEG is not a bad machine. Perhaps not the same quality anymore than it used to be, but they are not bad machines. A good alternative are cheaper machines from Electrolux like Zanussi.