Bad Vintage dishwasher week around my house...

[chachp]

 

<span style="font-family: 'courier new', courier; color: #800080;">So the other night my KDS-17A was washing away and all of a sudden stopped.  I noticed it had tripped the GCFI plug it was plugged into.  I reset the plug, closed the latch, pressed the button and shortly after the motor started circulating water it tripped again.   So, I plugged it into a regular outlet and it finished just fine. I've run a full cycle on the 15 a couple of times on that same GCFI plug since then with no problem so I don't think there is an issue with the plug itself.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: 'courier new', courier; color: #800080;">Then last night I fired up the 15 (haven't had time to deal with the 17) with an especially dirty load of dishes and as soon as it started the first wash I noticed a couple drops of water.  As I got closer I felt that little "I need a new shaft seal mist" coming from below.  So there I was moving all these dirty dishes to my workhorse 20 which cleaned them up in no time at all.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: 'courier new', courier; color: #800080;">I can handle the Shaft Seal on the 15 as I have a couple of them in my stash and I have done a few of them.  No problem.  However, I haven't a clue how to begin to troubleshoot the issue with the 17 tripping the plug.  I am a complete novice when it comes to anything related to power.  I read some of these posts about meters and ohms in awe as I feel like it makes my eyes roll into the back of my head.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: 'courier new', courier; color: #800080;">Can anyone give me some advise on how to begin to troubleshoot this issue?  And I don't mean this to sound the wrong way because I value all of your advice very much, but in English please.  I really don't understand all the technical jargon and if I need to understand it I'll have to take it in small chunks.  I'd like to learn but power and plumbing scare me so I generally leave those to the professionals.  I have one of those meters but haven't a clue how to use it.</span>

 

[turquoisedude]

Hmmmm,  I'm not any kind of expert, but I had issues with my beloved '56 GE pull-out dishwasher tripping the breaker on the GFI outlet it was connected to after about a year and half of loyal service.  I also found that by plugging the machine into a regular outlet the dishwasher would run fine and get through a complete cycle.  I was advised to change the GFI outlet (thanks to Combo52 for that advice!!) so I did and all has been fine since then.  

 

[stevet]

Do like the man says!

Ralph,
You can go chasing ghosts with a GFCI that trips like that. It happens to commercial machines that work fine for years and all of a sudden start tripping GFCI's. It does appear that they do not last forever and can change in their sensitivity to what sets them off. For what they cost to replace it is not worth the bother.

Replace it and you should not have a problem but if you do, then, Yes, we need to yank the 17 and check it out. Sometimes a loose wire can set it off or maybe even one of the neon lights in the indicator package.

Don't worry, you still have many more loads left in that classic. Do you have the touch/clear gauge for the shaft seal on the 15-17 series? I can send it to you to use and maybe duplicate.

Let me know.

 

[chachp]

I will replace it.

 

[COLOR=#993366; font-family: courier new,courier]I will replace the plug and can go from there.  I do not have the gauge.  The last time I replaced one on the 17 I used the same spacers as were there before and lucked out.  I'd gladly take you up on that offer.[/COLOR]

 

[COLOR=#993366; font-family: courier new,courier]Thank you Paul and Steve.[/COLOR]

 

[combo52]

DWs And GFIs

GFIs are not needed on ANY appliance that is properly grounded and used indoors, save your self the trouble and ditch the GFI outlet.

 

Older appliances are especially badly suited for use with GFIs AND NEVER put any refrigerator or freezer on a GFI unless you check it to see if it has not tripped every two hours day and night, in other words DON'T do it, LOL.

 

[chachp]

I had no idea.

 

[COLOR=#800080; font-family: courier new,courier]I will use another plug that's close by and leave it at that.  I had to have that plug replaced a few years ago and the electrician recommended the GFI so that's what I did.  Doing nothing with the plug is certainly an easy fix!!!  Thanks John.[/COLOR]

 

[chachp]

I had no idea.

 

[COLOR=#800080; font-family: courier new,courier]I will use another plug that's close by and leave it at that.  I had to have that plug replaced a few years ago and the electrician recommended the GFI so that's what I did.  Doing nothing with the plug is certainly an easy fix!!!  Thanks John.[/COLOR]

 

[akronman]

GFCI

I have them in both bathrooms, all over the kitchen and basement and throughout the laundry room----BUT I have 2 different GE wash machines that both tripped the GFCI about 1/4 of the time, at the same spot in only one cycle. Time after time. I switched the GE outlet back to non-GFCI and they run through the entire cycle ever since. They are grounded to a copper pipe and have never caused another problem, it's probably been 3 years or more. I believe in GFCI's, but many of our collector's vintage machine were built before they were in household use.

 

[travis]

GFCI's are a pain.  I had a problem with a GFCI breaker controlling my garage last year.  I finally swapped the breaker for a standard breaker.  No more problems and the garage hasn't burned down yet!

 

 

 

[kb0nes]

Remember that a Ground Fault outlet or breaker is just a device that is looking for any current leakage to ground. The current they trip at is around .005 amps (5 milliamps) which is a tiny amount of current. A shorting resistance of 24,000 ohms to ground will trip a GFCI.

Vintage appliances have lots of windings in them for the motors or solenoids. Old lacquered wire windings could easily have developed a little resistance to ground with age. When the cycle hits that solenoid, click the GFCI is done.

GFCI's were developed to protect people from electric shock. The old, oops I dropped the hair drier in the tub scenario. The circuit is interrupted fast enough to prevent electrocution. A fixed appliance that is properly grounded isn't a shock hazard so a GFCI serves no purpose. The fact that the machine is grounded just serves to open a current path to ground making the GFCI trip happy. GFCI's should only be used on circuits where portable equipment is used especially in damp areas, bathrooms, all outdoor outlets etc.

 

[askolover]

Not a dishwasher but...my old hairdryer has a trip built into the plug.  I will hear a click in the house sometimes and not really think about it until I go to use it and find it has tripped itself for no reason as in no one was using it.  Replaced the dryer and it doesn't do it.  I thought our neighborhood ghost was playing tricks on us again.

 

[chachp]

Scary about that hair dryer!!

 

<span style="font-family: 'courier new', courier; color: #800080;">Interesting information about GCFI plugs.  I had it installed because the Electrician said I need one to comply with code.  Luckily there is one close by that is a regular outlet.  I'll just start using that one instead.  </span>

 

<span style="font-family: 'courier new', courier; color: #800080;">Thanks all. </span>