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Tide plus Bleach left side......Tide Professional right side

Sodium Sulfate............................Sodium Sulfate
Sodium Carbonate........................................Sodium Carbonate
Sodium C10-16 Alkylbenzenesulfonate.......Sodium C10-16 Alkylbenzenesulfonate
Sodium Carbonate Peroxide.........................Sodium Carbonate Peroxide
Sodium Silicate..............................................Sodium Silikate
TAED..............................................................TAED
Zeolite (Sodium Silicoaluminate)................Zeolite
Water.............................................................(not listed)
C10-16 Pareth..............................................C10-16 Alketh
Sodium Polyacrylate.................................Sodium Polyacrylate
Fragrance...................................................Cellulose Gum
Cellulose Gum.............................................Fragrance
C16-18 Fatty Acids Sodium Salt...............Flourescent Brightener 71
Fluorescent Brightener 71.......................C16-18 Fatty Acid Sodium Salts
Anionic Modified Polyester.....................(not listed)
Disodium Distyrylbiphenyl Disulfonate...Disodium Distyrylbiphenyl Disulfonate
Organosilicone Copolymer......................Subtilisin
Subtilisin.................................................Organosilicone Copolymer
Amylase Enzyme...................................Amylase Enzyme
PIGMENT BLUE 15..............................Pigment Blue 15

Not that much of a difference apart from the box it seems
I am a bit puzzeled about the 3 miracle chemicals, can`t see anything extraordinary neither in the Tide with Bleach nor in Tide Professional. Both seem to be decent formulars though.

https://smartlabel.pg.com/en-us/00037000849988.html

https://pgpro.com/en-us/brands/tide-professional/powder-detergent
 
Yes it`s a powder just like Tide Professional is.

On the left side I have listed the Tide plus Bleach ingredients and on the right side are Tide Professional`s ingredients (except for the fragrance chemicals, I left those out)

What I mean? Both detergents are nearly identical.
 
Mr Boilwash

I may have not been clear earlier but I was comparing TIDE PRO LIQUID to TIDE PRO POWDER.

2 different animals entirely.

The chemicals I have been tracking that P&G has been developing and testing for colder temperatures are:
C10-16 Alketh
THe Polyacrylates
c16-18 Fatty Acids ( long chain )
And
Distyryibiphenyl Disulfonate

jetcone-2024041813364300397_1.png
 
Jon I can check the temp anytime whether there's water in the tub or not. I got curious during winter months what the temp of the machine structure was during winter. In mild Texas this year 21C to 23C. I can also watch rpm speed as spin is ramping up or down.
 
Sorry Jon, I must have missed that you were comparing Tide Pro Liquid to Tide Pro Powder.
I assumed we were only discussing the powder product pictured in your first post.
Bob mentioned he`s still working through a big box of Tide with Bleach powder so I compared the ingredients of both.
I did this because in Germany P&G and Henkel are also known to sell the same products in different boxes as Professional and as well as regular consumer products.
And big surprise, it looks like it`s the same route in the US.

Don`t want to start a dispute but I don`t think there`s anything special about those cold water chemicals you`re referring.

A nonionic sufactant, a polymere, soap and an OBA, those are usually found in any detergent, aren`t they?

But I`m glad it works so well for you even in cold. Enjoy it!
 
Fill temps:

With top loaders, the temperature differential between the fill flume and a full tub is not as radical as a front loader.

Years ago, I did some temperatures tests on fill flume tests vs. a full tub on the Maytags and found about 0-2F difference in 85F (cold), around 3-4F for 120F (warm) and 6-7F for 162F (hot). Nothing radical like a 15-20F+ drop. Helical Maytags have a lot of metal in their design (225 pounds) so they hold temps better than others.

When I first got my tempering valve, I fooled around with cold temps and found bleeding to occur with OLD dark clothes in high 80F/low 90F temps. I would not recommend using temps higher than 87-88F in a top load washer with colors you want to preserve. The 90F recommendation is really pushing the limits and I guarantee you WILL see color bleeding in the water at and above that temp. Been there, done that....bled some coloring out of the t-shirt(s).

Water temps are also dependent on placement. My main washer has always been inside the house so ambient temps are in the mid 60's through 70's. Major adjustments would need to be considered when placed in a garage of a residence in the northern part of the US during winter.
 
Jon, coming from the land of the cold wash, we know that detergent can remove visible staining, but it generally always ends up with a dirty machine or funky smelling towels over time. I’d be interested for you to try with towels and see over 4-6weeks whether they still smell fresh after a few days use.

If you keep on this dark pathway, you’ll have to download an F&P manual so you can learn how to remove the scrud from the bendix
 
Brisnat81

HAhahahaahahahahah

yes I will apply myself now. A 4-6 test sounds good !

But there is no cold washing in the Bendix,hot is HOT and MED is HOT !LOL

Mr Boilwash I understand now why you were discussing Tide with bleach. They are all similar formulas. The chemicals I mentioned were engineered to wash in cooler temperatures, yes they are similar names but the structure of a surfactant affects its cleaning power and 3 of those , (As i have read, I didn't do the lab work) they have been made to have much longer chains that what was used several years ago. Evidently longer chain surfactant the cooler you can clean.

But even in my research P&G has stated ( and I know this well) you can't just come up with a working formula because there is a synergy between chemicals so there is still a lot of guess in new formulations.. sorry to drag on but its HOT ( no pun intended ) on my mind right now. As we are working right now to reintroduce Rosalie's. I have to keep up with the market.
 
Stefan, I apologize for causing any confusion for you. The only reason I mentionned the current powders I am using is because it's going to be quite a while before I invest in this Professional powder because because I still have quite a bit of powder in both boxes. The Tide with bleach powder was delivered November 4 2021. Stated number of loads on box is 89. The previous box was ordered September 4 2017.

The most recent order for Tide Original Powder was March 25 2022. And stated load quantity on the box is 102 loads.

The new LG washer was delivered November 11 2021. Prior to the LG replacing the Duet, I had begun using the auto dispensing liquid detergent feature for the Duet for about a year or two before the Duet needed to be replaced. the majority of the 10 years I had the Duet, I had been using powdeers. But Frigilux was the one to convinece me to begin using liquids and using the auto dose liquid dispeneser in the Duet because he had been using the auto dose feature in the comparable Maytag he had in his house prior to him selling his house and that Maytag pair was included with the sale of the house.

My volume of laundry reduced significantly once I retired in May 2020. I also find I need to use less detergent with the LG turbowash than I needed with the Duet.
 
“I can resist everything except temptation.” (Oscar Wilde)

Yep. Even though I have enough powdered detergent to last years, I had to order a box of the new Tide Professional. I really want to give it the purposely stained kitchen towel test.

Bob- And from liquids to pods and back to liquids, I’ve circled back around to the old school: powdered detergent. That self-dosing system on the 2015 Maytag front-loader was awesome.

I ordered it from Staples online, as did Jetcone, because I wasn’t sure the seller on Amazon had the latest version of the product. It’s supposed to arrive April 22nd. Looking forward to trying yet another detergent that’s new to me. For all the Tide products I’ve used over the years, I’ve never tried the Professional line.
 
"But one of the world`s largest detergent manufacturers offering a product to wash hospitality laundry in cold water is beyond gross in my opinion."

Tide Professional powdered detergent in common with Ariel, Persil and other such being flogged for "cold water washing" contain healthy amounts of sodium percarbonate and oxygen bleach activator. That combination produces in situ peracetic acid, a powerful sanitizer even in cold or cool water.

As noted in previous post this is why powdered detergents deliver better overall results in cool or cold water than liquids. Powders that contain activated oxygen bleaching systems have been made to work not just in moderately to hot or warm water, but cold.

Above has long been known as Persil and other European powder detergents with activated bleaching systems long warned against frequent washing of dark or richly coloured laundry in their products. Fading, loss of colour and other side effects from bleaching are bound to happen sooner or later.

https://www.lenntech.com/processes/disinfection/chemical/disinfectants-peracetic-acid.htm

"I`ll never understand how some first world countries like Spain or the USA seem to have zero regulation on how shared laundry has to be treated."

In many regulations or recommendations largely speak to healthcare laundry for a host of obvious reasons.

https://www.cdc.gov/infectioncontro...rine bleach assures an extra margin of safety.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6600116/

Germany has the compulsory dictates of Koch Institute, but again this applies only to hospital/healthcare laundry.

https://hospitalhealthcare.com/news/hygiene-monitoring-systems-for-hospital-textile-laundering/

What you also have are private groups that have various certification schemes.

https://www.waeschereien.de/fileadm...tezeichen/GG_Imagebroschure_RAL-GZ_992_EN.pdf

https://www.innovationintextiles.com/hygiene-and-safety-with-ral-quality-certification-marks/

https://www.hohenstein.us/en-us/textile-testing/textile-care/hohenstein-hygienically-clean

https://cleanroomtechnology.com/hygiene-certificate-checks-disinfection-in-laundries-64362
 
Launderess, sorry if I wasn`t clear enough. I didn`t have healthcare laundry in mind, I meant hygiene regulations like they exist for hotels, barbershops, catering and so on. From what I gather regulations for those types of buisinesses in Germany seem to be applied locally and individually from the States not nationally like for healthcare. But at least there are regulations.

I remember having read in an article that even with a TAED activated bleaching system 30°C is not enough to prevent a buildup of germs in towels in the long run and even in a domestic setting where you wash only your own towels the combination of a bleach containing powder with a minimum of 40°C is strongly recommended.
Unfortunately I cannot find the link anymore and I`m not even sure who provided this information, but I`m sure it was a reliable source like Henkel, Warentest, Robert Koch or similar.
This information applied to normal "Universal" powders not to disinfecting powders which may only be sold to commercial applications and thus cannot be easily purchased by the average consumer.

Also keep in mind that liquid Tide Professional does not contain a bleaching system . I wonder if P&G recommends this for washing hospitality laundry in cold water too?
 
For comparison

Ingredient list for SanOmat hygiene waschpulver:

Sodium Sulfate

Sodium Carbonate

Sodium Percarbonate

Zeolite

TAED White

Sodium Silicate

Water

Sodium Alkyl Benzene Sulfonate

Alcohol Ethoxylate

Sodium Soap

Polycarboxylate

Phosphonate

Polydimethylsiloxane /Siliconoil

Optical brightener

Perfume
 
You mention the....

....scent, being almost "60's" -ish.

60's-ish Tide? Or 60's-ish, in general?

I guess the biggest question here, is does it smell like the Tide powder currently available (which is sickeningly sweet), or is it a more tolerable scent?
 
Water temps in the Kenmore combo

I learned early on that the drying heat could be channeled to the next load and not wasted. If I had a load of whites that needed really hot water, I would shorten the drying cool down and start the next load so that the hot drum and tank served to add heat to the hot fill instead of having a the cool down sent the heat into the exhaust air resulting in a cooler drum and tank robbing the water of its heat. Similarly, this could be done to heat a warm fill to medium or a cold fill to warm.

While it was not necessary to worry about water temperatures with the Bendix Duomatic, I learned about reusing the drying heat for the next washing when I first got it in 1968.
 
Hi Steve!

I got a strong scent today of TIDE PRO, my sense of smell is coming back ! Ive been a flu victim lately!
It was in my 1961 GE top loader and suddenly I remembered Blue Cheer from the 60s.

This TIDE to my head is not sweet its on the chemical side which I prefer.

The only regulation in the US I am aware of is for hospital linens, they must be washed at a PH of 11.5 or more. And thats pretty darn high.

I wonder what the German regulations are?? Ill look up your link Launderess !

Well that link is behind a paywall . Next.
 
@ Jetcone

Jon -

Interesting! As soon as Mrs. V and I finish our Indian Tide and Ariel liquids, I'll have to give it a shot. Apparently, there's also a "Professional" line of the Tide liquid and pods. I wonder what they smell like.

Your comment about finding the pro-powder on Quill sent me down the rabbit hole when I should have been working. Came across the "Professional" version of Downy earlier. According to the lone review posted, the scent is described as "fresh" and "clean", without that nasty sickly sweet scent that P&G has been loading into its products (perhaps due to the service industry it is catering to?). Anyway...as we are running low on fabric softener, I ordered it. It should be here Monday. Let's see if it's any better (both fragrance and softening power) than what is currently on store shelves.

https://www.staples.com/downy-profe...nt-190-loads-140-fl-oz-14052/product_24591355
 
" I am aware of is for hospital linens, they must be washed at a PH of 11.5 or more"

Relative high pH is more function of having proper range for either chlorine or oxygen bleaching systems.

CDC, Joint Commission on Accreditation have guidelines that call for healthcare/hospital linen to be laundered at 160°F (71°C) and held for 25 minutes.

https://info.jcrinc.com/rs/494-MTZ-...2SzhWWHpUWEdJeHJRM3hjREJ1OW9zZlNrQkNXNjEwPSJ9

https://www.cdc.gov/infectioncontro...rine bleach assures an extra margin of safety.

Not to drag this out with endless amounts of palaver; but healthcare/hospital laundry is a process with multiple parts. Rarely relying upon high wash temperatures alone.

https://www.directsupply.com/blog/healthcare-laundry-guidelines-avoid-these-4-mistakes/

First and foremost in USA and elsewhere chlorine bleach pretty much has gone by wayside for healthcare/hospital laundry. Switch to chlorhexidine as topical antiseptic prompted this move.

Chlorhexidine forms nasty brown stains on textiles if it comes into contact with chlorine bleach. Thus laundry must be well washed and rinsed and even then stains often will happen.

Enter peracetic acid. https://www.europeancleaningjournal... leaving,highly effective at low temperatures.

Hospital/healthcare laundry goes through many changes of water for just pre-wash and wash cycles alone. There will then be a bleach cycle, followed by several rinses including sour and or fabric conditioner baths.

Intense cycles, high water temperatures, and many changes of water explain why grossly contaminated hospital/healthcare linen can be loaded into washers and emerge hygienically clean.

Don't try this at home ladies and gentlemen:

 
Cold water and bacterial counts.

https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour...g-in-laundry/E7BE45B78E0A2C2110A79140CB602873

https://www.medicolinen.com/how-hot-does-water-have-to-be-to-kill-bacteria/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4229498/

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._hygiene_effectiveness_of_domestic_laundering

Very long story short to get at any significant decontamination of laundry via temperature alone you'll need water temps starting at 150F with 160F being better and held for twenty or so minutes.

Wash temps of 140F will reduce bacteria counts but not much as many would imagine.

Addition of bleach (oxygen, AOB or chlorine) enhances decontamination, especially for wash done at lower temperatures (30F to 140F).

Tumble drying at hot temperatures and or ironing subsequent to laundering will further decrease bacterial count.

Issue domestic users will face in decontaminating laundry is home washing machines simply are not designed for serious germ killing.

Everything from having door boots to a drain pump mean even if laundry is decontaminated in a cycle, new bacteria are soon reintroduced.

Each time one drags laundry across door boot when wash cycle is completed (same boot that is contaminated with bacteria from laundry being dragged across it when loading), wash is infected again.

Sort of same argument against "sanitize" cycles of dishwashers. Even if things were largely free of germs at end of cycle, soon as they were touched for unloading bacteria are reintroduced. That and simply sitting in cabinets of whatever does same.

@jetcone,

Here is a handy chart if you're looking for where to begin research.

https://www.thepearcefoundation.org...editation-and-Certification-crosswalk-HHM.pdf
 
Launderess

Thanks for the link !!! Will do 


BUT Launderess there were live turds in that video !! LIVE !!!
smiley-yell.gif


 

Oh deer gawd I can't unsee it now....

 

 

And I'll say it here, I'll never believed Mike Rowe is STR8 !!!
 
Love my 162F washes and I soak for 3 hours using oxygen bleach on top the oxygen bleach in the detergent (powdered Tide w/ bleach). No door boot on the Maytag but rising steam should help kill some bacteria around the opening. I do use a folded towel placed around the lid to prevent steam/heat from escaping and prevent the console and inner workings from moisture and deterioration. I'll start wiping down the opening from here on out with the solution in the tub. It's already there and only takes a few seconds.

I find it odd the people get icky about fecal matter. We all (hopefully) do it everyday, it's a part of life. I find it even stranger that a gay man is weirded out by it. Don't you guys basically play in the sewer for fun?
 
Smearing traces of fecal matter and who knows what else from not properly washed hotel towels in one`s face and all over your body which could be from anybody is a whole different matter to me than voluntarily exchanging all kinds of germs and stuff with someone I find hot enough to have sex with.
 
Regarding Reply #54: "Playing in the sewer"? One of the most inappropriate, unnecessary, irresponsible and insulting comments I have seen anywhere in a long time. "All of us guys" don't necessarily "do" anything and I don't recall seeing anything in our charter or by-laws that mandates this as a required practice. Further, your assumption just shows your ignorance. While I understand the first part of the comment about "fecal matter being part of life", I don't see the relevance to comment on assumed sexual practices by all gay men - especially in this forum. It was completely off topic and I think you owe everyone here an apology. However, if you are so concerned about/interested in this - then why don't you privately ask someone you know is gay? And keep your BS where it belongs - - in your head, and not in this forum.

Sorry if I offended anyone with my post, but seriously????
 
Can`t we even take a joke anymore these days without getting offended?
Dan you get a "like" for making me lough out loud when I read your post.
As a gay man I`m not that easily offended anymore and as a formerly (at young age) bicurious man I can tell you what you breeders play for fun in can be way more filthy than what you think of what we play in.
Just saying...
 
@jetcone

One of many ways true industrial washer/extractor differ from domestic machines is their ability to perform "sluice" cycles. That is remove bulk soils and foul matter from laundry.

Industrial or commercial diaper services either for infants and or increasingly being offered for adults do not "flush" or rinse soiled linen. Everything is bunged into washer where one or more flush cycles will send solid matter down drains.

Such washer/extractor have larger diameter holes in tub (better to allow foul matter to exit) and of course have dump valves, not pumps. This reduces chances of foul matter being carried over to subsequent loads.

Domestic washing machines cannot handle sort this sort of laundry, at least not returning consistent hygienic results.



Old school wash cycle for diapers at commercial laundry:

(1) Five-minute cold rinse;

(2) 10-minute soak in hot suds;

(3) 10-minute soak in hot suds;

(4) 10-minute soak in hot suds, with bleach;

(5) five hot rinses with live steam;

(6) six cold rinses, and a germicide solution is used in the third cold rinse;

(7) water is extracted; (8) dried in tumblers under 125 pounds of live steam;

(9) ready for folding and packing.

After all that all fecal matter is *gone*.

OTOH it explains why cloth diapers have (or had) such short useable lifespans.
 

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