CR: New SQ Front-Loader Leaps Up Ratings List

[launderess]

It really does depend on one's habits

If you have a large household and or need to do more than say two loads per day every day, then you probably are better off with a quasi-commercial machine like SQ or some sort of OPL machine. That or go for a Miele.

Every single front loading washing machine is designed for a certain duty cycle. That is total number of cycles within a determined useful lifespan. Miele and other European machines at one time and or even now determined this to be fifteen to twenty years.

When you consider so many domestic washers sold today are not designed to be repaired there is that as well.

 

[frigilux]

Number of Cycles in Lifespan: I wonder if the total number of cycles run to date is hidden somewhere in new machines. I'd love to know how many cycles have been run when the first repair is needed, for instance. Given the $$ put forth for the Maytag 8100's, I'm betting they will be the first laundry pair I keep until it's no longer possible to fix them.

Miele-- Don't they recommend no more than 2 loads per day? Thought I read that in a post somewhere here at AW.

SQ-- I think they made great strides to provide the durability of a commercial machine along with the cycle flexibility and other features in washers made by other manufacturers. I really wish they'd add a water heater, as that seems to be the deal-breaker for those of us used to boosting wash temps.

 

[mr_b]

Just a Thought.

How hot does an internal water heater heat the water? For a few hundred dollars one could add a small external water heater just for laundry that is set to the desired temperature. The cost savings of buying an LG, Samsung, etc. without the water heater option plus the cost of the external water heater may make the total cost close to buying a washer with this option built in. And you have the added bonus of saving time not waiting for the washer to heat the water. Just a thought.

 

[launderess]

@Friglux:

Have to find the bookmarked site that gave Miele's lifespan for washers. In the meanwhile this is a start.

http://www.ukwhitegoods.co.uk/help/...8-how-long-should-a-washing-machine-last.html

It does seem more than two or three loads per day each week ranks as "high" usage for a domestic front loader.

@Mr.B

Washing machines with internal water heaters use an immersion method. That is some sort of pipe or immersion heater (former usually heated with steam and the latter by electric) that will raise water temperature until a thermostat is satisfied. Not that much different from the open heating elements found at bottom of many American dishwashers.

Historically one of the arguments against washing machines heating their own water was the time spent doing so. Unless you are using a good amount of steam (which offers one of the best thermal transfers), a large fire, very powerful electric elements or whatever it is going to take time to heat water. How much time is an easy sum to figure. See: http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/heat-work-energy-d_292.html

 

[logixx]

Miele claims that their washers are made to last 20 years, which they say is the equivalent to 10,000 operating hours.

 

[whirlykenmore78]

A booster heater:

Such as those used to reach required rinse temps on commercial dishwashers would overcome the no heater issue. Only instead of the 185-190 temp set it to 165 or so. As the booster sits right next to the machine it supplies you would get instant hot water into the machine that should warm things up quite nicely.
WK78

 

[appnut]

There are significant benefits to have water heated gradually to very hot.  Deals with all types of stains in one go.  Why I say European approach to laundry is far more civilized.  I never want to go back to the days when I had to look at every garment contained in a load to see if it had a stain I had to keep an eye out to make sure it was washed out.  I spent as much, if more time having (and manipulating) the Lady Shredmore go through a cycle with extra rinse because of its poor rinsing looking through the entire next load.  And by the time the wash & extra rinse was done, it was time to load the next load and start the process all over again.  Laundry day wore me out.  Not with my front loader.  I push buttons and let the machine do its thing while I'm either entertained watching it run through the cycle or go do cooking or house cleaning.  My water bill is significantly lower in the winter, my clothes are guilt-free stain free, I'm not tired, and can multitask.  I did 10 loads this past weekend and wasn't as tired as the old days with the Lady Shredmore.

 

[launderess]

Using a booster heater

Only thing would be to consider the washer's hoses and valves. One or both are usually rated for a max hot water temperature.

 

[mrboilwash]

Wouldn`t a booster heater just set protein based stains instead of improving stain removal like an internal heater does ?

 

[askolover]

Yes Launderess:

"Only thing would be to consider the washer's hoses and valves. One or both are usually rated for a max hot water temperature."

 

My Miele W1986 says max hot water supply temp 140F.  Not sure if the Asko has a max temp listed, I'll have to look for the owner's manual (if I can find it, haven't seen it since we moved here in 1998).  I replaced the hot valve on the Asko just this year. 

 

[launderess]

Wouldn`t a booster heater just set protein based stains ...

Yes, protein is basically cooked or "clumped" together when exposed to high temperatures.

Again this is why Mother and professionals new best; laundry is or was pre-washed or soaked in cool or even warmish water before washing in hot or boiled. This is the same idea behind dishwashers that begin with a cold or warmish pre-wash before the main event; to remove protein soils like egg, milk, etc... before the high heat gets to them.

OTOH chlorine bleach denatures and destroys proteins. This is why you cannot use the stuff on wool or silk, but it makes a great additive to laundry wash or automatic dishwashing. Most automatic dishwasher detergents today however have gone over to enzymes, at least the top shelf ones.

 

[suburbanmd]

Booster heater has to be paired with...

a washer that won't temper the very hot water with cold.

 

[jerrod6]

Agree with suburbanmd about washers that won't temper hot water.  This seems to be the way He washers in the US control energy usage, buy mixing cold with hot water, so the booster may not work with that unless you can manually pour hot water into the machine or do one of those y connector things mentioned in another thread.

 

The heater on my W1986 tends to cycle on and off for the 105F and 120F washes, more so in the winter since my machine is in an unheated basement.   For the 140F and 190F washes it will take hot water in and sometimes mix it with cold.   After a few minutes of tumbling you can hear the heater circuit clunk on.  It will continue to clunk on and off until about halfway into the wash and then the heater will remain on and turn off some minutes before the cool down water runs in.  The tumbling continues with the cooled water for a minute or so and then the wash water is pumped out.   It is at the end stages of the 190F wash when you will hear the water fizzling during the pauses.

 

In the winter the heater comes on when doing a cold wash right at the beginning  but only once, so it isn't used throughout the entire wash.

 

If I shine a flashlight through the holes in the bottom of the tub I can see the heaters sitting below the tub; there are two of them.  On the door label it says Heaters:  2 X 1300Watt so I guess that is their rating.

 

For the normal wash cycles it takes about 41 minutes at temps of 105F and 120F, about 48 minutes at 140F, and 51 minutes at 190F.  The Extended option increases the time for everything; wash, rinses, and spins.  Normal works for most loads, Extended with cold water prewash for heavily soiled whites. 

 

[launderess]

Tempering Hot Water

Commercial washers seem to do it as well. At least for laundromats every washer one has used in such places mixes cold water with hot when "Hot" is chosen. Once enquired of the attendant why this was so and was told "the hot water comes from the (residential) building's boilers and would shrink your clothes if not cooled". Whatever.....

 

[askolover]

The last

few times I've gone to the laundromat I've used hot water...and it costs a few cents more too....but it wasn't hot!  Used to, that same place had very hot water...but those were different machines back then.  It's a SpeedQueen laundromat with all new washers. 

Jerrod, I noticed those two heaters also when I replaced the door boot on my Miele, I was impressed.