laundromat
Well-known member
It's now 11:07AM CT and the stocks are down 500 points!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dow Jones Industrial
- Thread starter laundromat
- Start date
Down nearly 700 points. This is just horrible, so much for retirement, at least I'll be able to take in laundry!
This is only the beginning...
The stock market is mostly just "noise" at this point. Pay attention to the health of global credit markets and banking. It doesn't look good.
The stock market is mostly just "noise" at this point. Pay attention to the health of global credit markets and banking. It doesn't look good.
peterh770
Well-known member
I can hear the printing presses printing dollar bills and the govt sucking more money out of the taxpayers...
Bush has finally attained his goal to be a dictator, and now gets to decide who on Main Street lives and who dies. If you want to know which corporations are being included in that first category, simply refer to a list of major donors to the Republican Party.
Between Dick Cheney's "energy policy", Bush's collusion with OPEC and oil prices since he took office, their war crimes in Iraq, and on and on, this is absolute despotism on a scale never seen before in America. Even including Richard Nixon.
Between Dick Cheney's "energy policy", Bush's collusion with OPEC and oil prices since he took office, their war crimes in Iraq, and on and on, this is absolute despotism on a scale never seen before in America. Even including Richard Nixon.
Exactly. The stock market is mainly noise...
and the current losses are a long overdue adjustment. Value hasn't actually been lost since it was never really there in the first place.
The bailout should never go ahead. It is an obscene waste of money ill-spent on an industry that must accept responsibility for its own actions. I look at it as the catharsis that preceeds the much-needed change in finance sector practices. As with politics, the financial sector is run by very clever people, who understand and know how to manipulate the system, but most of whom lack the education and ability to manage it responsibly.
The government now needs to invest money in the community. The financial and economic fall-out is temporary and nothing in comparison to the long-term social damage that this is causing accross the country.
It is incredible that there is virtually no analysis and discourse about the social cost this is exacting on America. The focus is only on and about business. How very sad and myopic is that?
rapunzel
and the current losses are a long overdue adjustment. Value hasn't actually been lost since it was never really there in the first place.
The bailout should never go ahead. It is an obscene waste of money ill-spent on an industry that must accept responsibility for its own actions. I look at it as the catharsis that preceeds the much-needed change in finance sector practices. As with politics, the financial sector is run by very clever people, who understand and know how to manipulate the system, but most of whom lack the education and ability to manage it responsibly.
The government now needs to invest money in the community. The financial and economic fall-out is temporary and nothing in comparison to the long-term social damage that this is causing accross the country.
It is incredible that there is virtually no analysis and discourse about the social cost this is exacting on America. The focus is only on and about business. How very sad and myopic is that?
rapunzel
andrewinorlando
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Really? And how does one draw this conclusion?
andrewinorlando
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"and the current losses are a long overdue adjustment".
Really? And how does one draw that conclusion?
Really? And how does one draw that conclusion?
djmjlcst
Well-known member
Here it is folks....the Recession
After seeing that Dow Jones take a nosedive today I agree totally with Robert. "So much for retirement...." I saw a chunk of my savings in TIAA-CREF just disappear after building up a nice tidy sum of money for retirement in the 20 years of my employment!
As far as the social thing goes, maybe we'll see an increase in crime too! This is just like a festering boil.
The trouble is it's not going away anytime soon.
Enough rant, time to finish the laundry!
Mike
After seeing that Dow Jones take a nosedive today I agree totally with Robert. "So much for retirement...." I saw a chunk of my savings in TIAA-CREF just disappear after building up a nice tidy sum of money for retirement in the 20 years of my employment!
As far as the social thing goes, maybe we'll see an increase in crime too! This is just like a festering boil.
The trouble is it's not going away anytime soon.
Enough rant, time to finish the laundry!
Mike
Really? And how does one draw that conclusion?
The simple fact that 1.2 trillion dollars were lost in a matter of minutes during last week's trading indicates very clearly that this money never represented real, but only speculative value. You probably know that the level of interest investors express in shares determines their worth in the market place. A high or low share price isn't always representative of the net value that a company adds to the economy in real terms.
We've had significant and unprecedented global growth over the last 20 years, which has buoyed share market investor optimism to levels never before experienced. The share market has opened up to ordinary investors. Margin lending has allowed regular folk to speculate on the share market to catch that quick (usually elusive) profit. Now people will learn again that there is no such thing as easy money. It's a bit like the high tech bubble. Everyone thought that these new companies were going to re-define the economy with a potential for unprecedented earnings. The overwhelming interest people expressed in high tech shares drove their values to stratospheric levels. When people suddenly realized that their optimism far outweighed economic reality, everyone came back to earth with a loud thud.
Now that cheap money looks like its drying up, everyone is getting spooked. Those who borrowed money to buy shares are finding themselves in trouble and many others are panicking. Panic always makes people act irrationally, as evidenced by the bail-out. Politicians and even most of our finance gurus are clueless and we will have to ride this one out. The way we do money needs to change.
Anyway, all I am saying is that share prices are pulling back to more realistic values. The bear/bull cycles that everyone talks about are necesssary corrections that ultimately allow us to reflect on the real state that our economies are in. Amongst all the current gloom and doom there is opportunity. I look at this as an opportunity for re-distributing capital and giving someone else a leg up.
rapunzel
The simple fact that 1.2 trillion dollars were lost in a matter of minutes during last week's trading indicates very clearly that this money never represented real, but only speculative value. You probably know that the level of interest investors express in shares determines their worth in the market place. A high or low share price isn't always representative of the net value that a company adds to the economy in real terms.
We've had significant and unprecedented global growth over the last 20 years, which has buoyed share market investor optimism to levels never before experienced. The share market has opened up to ordinary investors. Margin lending has allowed regular folk to speculate on the share market to catch that quick (usually elusive) profit. Now people will learn again that there is no such thing as easy money. It's a bit like the high tech bubble. Everyone thought that these new companies were going to re-define the economy with a potential for unprecedented earnings. The overwhelming interest people expressed in high tech shares drove their values to stratospheric levels. When people suddenly realized that their optimism far outweighed economic reality, everyone came back to earth with a loud thud.
Now that cheap money looks like its drying up, everyone is getting spooked. Those who borrowed money to buy shares are finding themselves in trouble and many others are panicking. Panic always makes people act irrationally, as evidenced by the bail-out. Politicians and even most of our finance gurus are clueless and we will have to ride this one out. The way we do money needs to change.
Anyway, all I am saying is that share prices are pulling back to more realistic values. The bear/bull cycles that everyone talks about are necesssary corrections that ultimately allow us to reflect on the real state that our economies are in. Amongst all the current gloom and doom there is opportunity. I look at this as an opportunity for re-distributing capital and giving someone else a leg up.
rapunzel
andrewinorlando
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The market isn't pulling back to "realistic" values, but retreating as credit tightens more and more. The market was not overvalued, per se, but it will continue to contract as long as investors fear business will falter as banks tighten the credit flow to the very businesses your investment dollars fund. As credit loosens, the market will slowly start to rebound as investors gain confidence in the "normality" of business operations. It's more a chain reaction affect. After all, would you want to invest money in a company if you had doubts that the company could fund its operations? Hell no, I wouldn't! But the reality right now is that businesses are still functioning in most cases, just as before, especially small businesses. That market psychology will artificailly inflate/deflate share prices despite the performance of the companies involved.
whirlcool
Well-known member
Well, now that the market is down to right after 911 values, all gains since then have been lost. My retirement fund is down at least $100K. And I held only blue chip type stocks.
Last week I got my individual investment account converted to cash. That little action saved me at least $25K.
I was walking thru the living room this morning and Karen was watching "The View" on TV. Whoppi Goldberg had a copy of a bill from the St. Regis resort where some of the top managers of AIG went to when the AIG failure was announced. Here are some of the charges to a bill for ONE PERSON for 1 week:
Room Charge: $139,000.000
Spa Charges: $23,600.00
Golf Fees: $6,300.00
Unbelievable! Whoppi suggested that they should have gone to jail rather than sitting in a high priced spa.
How many Wall Streeters will be set up with Golden Parachutes when their company receives their bail out money? What gets me are the huge bonuses(usually in the millions) that executives take for getting their business through the bankruptcy process. Then they usually leave and leave others holding the bag.
Last week I got my individual investment account converted to cash. That little action saved me at least $25K.
I was walking thru the living room this morning and Karen was watching "The View" on TV. Whoppi Goldberg had a copy of a bill from the St. Regis resort where some of the top managers of AIG went to when the AIG failure was announced. Here are some of the charges to a bill for ONE PERSON for 1 week:
Room Charge: $139,000.000
Spa Charges: $23,600.00
Golf Fees: $6,300.00
Unbelievable! Whoppi suggested that they should have gone to jail rather than sitting in a high priced spa.
How many Wall Streeters will be set up with Golden Parachutes when their company receives their bail out money? What gets me are the huge bonuses(usually in the millions) that executives take for getting their business through the bankruptcy process. Then they usually leave and leave others holding the bag.
toggleswitch2
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FEAR AND GREED are tremendous motivators.
Didn't Obabma mention prosecuting such things (during the debate last night) if done with bail-out money? OR, maybe he said the Gov't should demand a refund.
If EVERYONE behaved normally there would not BE a financial crisis (of this magnitude).
Didn't Obabma mention prosecuting such things (during the debate last night) if done with bail-out money? OR, maybe he said the Gov't should demand a refund.
If EVERYONE behaved normally there would not BE a financial crisis (of this magnitude).
I checked my retirement accounts a few days ago. We are currently in the year 2008 and my accounts are now where they were in 1997. Well I guess I never could imagine myself not working, keeps you young and informed. Now this is apparently going to happen. Oh well we can always depend on our SS checks coming in. HA HA HA HA HA HA NOT
Jon
Jon
toggleswitch2
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I already have my trailer park and trailer picked out in Arizona.
...and I am NOT kidding (much).
...and I am NOT kidding (much).
oldhouseman
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Toggle you will
probably find a cheaper trailer somewhere in the South. We had a "crime wave" recently that I laughed my ass off about. Since scrap metal is fetching high prices these days people are coming home to find the metal siding stolen off their trailer!
probably find a cheaper trailer somewhere in the South. We had a "crime wave" recently that I laughed my ass off about. Since scrap metal is fetching high prices these days people are coming home to find the metal siding stolen off their trailer!
If the trailer is bouncin' -- it must be washday!
You probably won't want a Frigidaire pulsator washer in your trailer, Toggs, they make a terrible racket and will shake the glasses out of the cabinets.
You probably won't want a Frigidaire pulsator washer in your trailer, Toggs, they make a terrible racket and will shake the glasses out of the cabinets.
toggleswitch2
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*LOL*
I can take the heat. But NOT the humidity..............
Listen, my ethnic group ALREADY eats dandelions, so believe me I can squeak by on a low budget.
Palmer Amaranth (Greek vlita) Ah so desu-ka!
That is what those are called in English. Grows like wild-fire.
http://greekfood.about.com/od/soupsstews/r/horta.htm
I can take the heat. But NOT the humidity..............
Listen, my ethnic group ALREADY eats dandelions, so believe me I can squeak by on a low budget.
Palmer Amaranth (Greek vlita) Ah so desu-ka!
That is what those are called in English. Grows like wild-fire.
http://greekfood.about.com/od/soupsstews/r/horta.htm
toggleswitch2
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oooh a new thread idea. Inexpensive, healthy "peasant food". My "Enter" finger has been posting too much. Who wants to do the honors? *LOL*
toggleswitch2
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Palmer Amaranth (Greek vlita).
LOL ROFL LMAO.
That's a weed?
It's dinner to me.
I can't say it looks familiar...........
http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/amapa.htm
LOL ROFL LMAO.
That's a weed?
It's dinner to me.
I can't say it looks familiar...........
http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/amapa.htm
whirlcool
Well-known member
Oh, and I forgot
to add, let the finger pointing begin, which is so fashionable in corporate circles these days.
to add, let the finger pointing begin, which is so fashionable in corporate circles these days.
toggleswitch2
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AIG thing-
Allan, that was not for one person. Room rate was about $1000 per night, so it must have been a group. Whoppie's comment was that the spa charge is about what they charge per person at that resort, I guess she would know.
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/Story?id=5973452&page=1
Allan, that was not for one person. Room rate was about $1000 per night, so it must have been a group. Whoppie's comment was that the spa charge is about what they charge per person at that resort, I guess she would know.
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/Story?id=5973452&page=1
whirlcool
Well-known member
Thanks for the correction, that's what I get for looking at the television while going through a room without really watching.
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