Frigidaire 5-heat Radiantube wattage & wiring

[tomturbomatic]

I have two Westinghouse ranges with the Super Corox. On the back panel there are instructions for changing it to a simple 6 inch unit by moving or removing a wire. That was done to save the control and element. My 1960 turquoise 40" Custom Imperial has both the Heat Minder and the Speed Heat units and both work but Jeff told me a method that a customer told him about how she kept her Speed Heat working for decades in her Flair range: You only start it at Warm, until you hear it click out of 240 volt operation within about 5 seconds, then turn it up to the heat you want. Since I only use it for making candy, I don't heed high settings or speed.

Both Westinghouse and Frigidaire came out with their "flasher" units while they still had 5 heat click position controls. It was the only infinite switch for their surface units back then.

 

[bryan]

radiantube frigidaire gm 1960's

I need a replacement radiantube frigidaire gm "custom imperial"
early 1960's electric stove burner.

It also says "speed heat"; it is the front left burner. The surface
element doesn't seem to have continuity. It only has two wires and
had 242v across the terminals when I turned on the switch. Don't know
its history but it definitely doesn't heat and it is getting voltage.

Can you help me? Or, point me in the right direction?

 

[norgeway]

Re Speed Heat...

Many manufacturers had these, My Norge does...and has the original switch and unit, and it still works, of course I usually start it on warm then turn it up, but if im in a hurry, it sure does work!, it has a Chromalox unit.

 

[tomturbomatic]

Good to see people cooking with electricity in Califormia

It sounds like you need a switch and the element. The Speed Heat feature consists of a 120 volt element and a special switch that pulsed 240 across the 120 unit to make it hot fast because when the voltage is doubled, the wattage is quadrupled. The process was very hard on both the unit and the switch. I think what is mostly done now since neither part is available any longer is to get a two wire 240 volt element and a 240 volt infinite switch. If you can find the Frigidaire infinite switch for a regular 6 inch surface unit, so much the better, but you can use a generic infinite switch for a 6 inch unit as long as it has the extra terminal for energizing the light that lights up when a surface unit is switched on.

What is the model # of your range? It should be on an oval metal plate over the left oven cavity when you open the door. The year will be after the RCI in the model number.

 

[combo52]

6" Frigidaire Speed Heat Element

I have good used elements for this range if you need one one, John.

 

[bryan]

1960's custom imperial stove top

The unit is a drop-in stove top on a built-in island cabinet. No oven. I think that it was similarly available as a pull-out drawer style unit. "Custom Imperial" Frigidaire/GM.

A switch that pulses 240v and then drops to 120v seems pretty advanced for 1960.

I carefully took out the surface unit assembly and could access the 2 bare wires/connectors and got no continuity with the switch off. I got 242v (!) when I turned the switch to "low."

I stopped troubleshooting at that point. I do side-jobs as a handyman and I am trying to fix the burner for one of my customers. It is unlike any other common surface element I've encountered.

The metal and fasteners located in the drip pan looked about like I expected... the part with the wires was much more shiny clean which made me wonder if the burner and switch had been replaced at some point. My customer inherited the house and that was about 7 years ago.

John, I would be very interested in your burner element. I thought that the mac.com email service was long gone.

Please advise.

 

[arbilab]

If you only have 2 wires/contacts the burner is intended for an 'infinite' or duty-cycle control. It will read mains voltage between phases, or zero. Must be best, it's what everybody eventually settled on.

They can still go wrong however. I've seen them fail to cycle and run at 'hi' setting regardless where the knob is. Bloody mess at best if you don't catch it, fire hazard at worst. Everybody breaks the rule "never leave cooking equipment unattended" and only get bit that one time in a buncha thousand.

Realizing this doesn't tell you what either Frigidaire is doing, but early GE/Hotpoint controls were:

HI--240V parallel both elements
MH--240V inner element only
M---240V series both elements
ML--120V parallel both elements
L---120V inner element only
SIM-120V series both elements

On HI both elements were equally red, but may still have been different resistances and lengths. I only have the single-coil/infinite model to look at now.

Nifty compact spaceheater below is 120V only, does the parallel/series thing for hi and lo, 1500/1200W. The 'nifty' parts are, it's barely bigger than your hand, and it's 25 years old and works like new. The company however, went out of business so you can't buy anything like it today. Note that the series is 20% below the parallel. But again, the coils are not necessarily equal resistance. They look different lengths and gauges.

 

[sudsmaster]

Fascinating discussion. I've got a Frigidaire Compact 30 with one of the large burners that only works on high. I've tried replacing it with the same results. I'm guessing there's a broken connection somewhere, maybe in the control. Not sure at the moment what year the thing is, but it seems to me the dials are not spring loaded - there are detents at the various settings but I think the other burners will operate at "infinite" levels. Been a while since I used it.

Please carry on.

 

[combo52]

6" Frigidaire Speed Heat Elements

Byran, you will get 240 volts to this element when it is first turned on, this surge of 240 volts lasts for 10-60 seconds then the control starts cycling the element @ 120 volts and never applies 240 again until the Sw is turned off and back on.

Is the old element open shorted to ground? what is the resistance you measured across the two terminals ?. Frigidaire either had a 20 amp fuse in the element circuit or a fuseable link on the back of the infinite control to protect the element from failure if the sw stayed in the 240 mode to long.

Hi Rich, your FD Compact 30 should have all infinite type switches, if it has one that has detents someone installed an older type sw.

 

[sudsmaster]

Combo,

Yes, I checked it out last night. It's an RBE-533, made about 1963 (I think). It has infinite controls. The left front burner is an 8 inch, and it has a problem heating the intermediate settings. It will go full blast on high, but will cool off on medium setting. So my conclusion is that the infinite control switch has an internal failure.

My challenge is that I can't quite figure out how to get at the controls. They are under a side stainless piece at the front of the unit. The top of the range does not seem to lift up. There are two big Philips flat heat screws under the stainless front, visible if the oven door is opened. After I shut off the circuit breaker I'll see if those allow the control panel to be lifted or removed.

The other problem is that so far I can't find a replacement for the infinite control.

 

[hooverwheelaway]

I thought that the mac.com email service was long gone.

"@mac.com" email addresses are still valid, I've had mine for about 10 years now.

 

[sudsmaster]

Viola

Sorry didn't mean to hijack this thread for an infinite control issue....

But... I was able to find a replacement infinite control for this range online. PC Appliance Repair had it for only about $25. Ordered one just now.

Getting at this was a bit involved. First, tripped circuit breaker to range. Removed three big flat head screws under the control panel with oven door opened. Then removed all burner trays, supports, and trim rings, and burner/oven knobs. Unscrewed the screws holding the top down. These were in each burner hole in the top. Some had more than one. Then, removed two screws from the oven control and two from the right rear burner control - these were holding the brushed chrome cover over the control modules and wiring in place. Removed chrome control cover. Labeled all the wires to the left front 8" burner control. Pulled these wires from control. Also pulled two wires leading to the "Surface" pilot light, and four wires leading to the Oven/Lock pilot lights.

Apparently there's been some water damage/rusting issues with the control. Probably because it's closest to the front burners. The oven control also shows some rust issues, at least on the attachment screws, but I'm not too concerned about that just yet (never have used that oven).

I'll probably wind up spritizing the defective control with Electromotive cleaner and re-installing it to see if that freed up whatever might be stuck inside. I have to put it all back together anyway... because oddly the electric cooktop in the main house kitchen is on the same 50 amp 220 volt circuit. Yes, I replaced that cooktop with a gas unit, but it's using one of the legs of the 220 for a 110 volt outlet to power the burner igniters. I suppose I could run an extension cord to it but I'd rather not. Plus I'm curious to see if the cleaner works.

Should have the replacement part in a week or so.

PS-Cleaning and blowing out the control didn't work. Burner works ok on High and medium, but not on simmer to lo. So it must have some sort of internal broken connection. Easier just to replace it at this point. Other burners work fine.

[this post was last edited: 11/26/2013-21:54]

 

[bryan]

radiantube

I didn't measure the resistance. I was looking for continuity or no continuity in the burner element.

I assumed that I'd isolated the problem when there was voltage available to the burner and zero continuity with the switch off.

I saw nothing that looked like a fuse or fusible link when I withdrew the fold-up burner assembly. I would think that if there was a short to ground that a breaker would have tripped. I think what I need to do is locate a good replacement burner.

If anybody has a spare radiantube burner that they are willing to part with I have a lady who could use it.

thanks

 

[bryan]

John's Radiantube for sale

Hey, John... I've phoned and written. I want to buy that Radiantube element.

You have my VISA and billing & shipping info.
I know you're busy. Let's do this transaction. Thanks

 

[brutus83]

Frigidaire radiantubes

Hello. For 1958 (could be 1957, but much more likely 1958) Frigidaire Fold-Back Surface Unit, model RBZ-84, consisting of models RBZ-81 and RBZ-82, I want to repair or replace, if possible, Std. 6- and 8- inch Radiantubes in RBZ-81, and 6-inch Speed-Heat Unit and 8-inch Heat-Minder Unit in RBZ-82. Does anyone have wiring diagrams, parts, suggestions? Thank you.

 

[philr]

Hi Dan, 

 

Welcome here. 

 

Here's a link to a high quality scan of the service manual that's available here. There's a small download fee but it might be useful for you to get it!

http://www.automatice.org/cgi-bin/index.cgi?showdoc~1195~Frigidaire~

 

[brutus83]

Frigidaire radiantubes

Thank you very much for the link, Phil. I've downloaded the relevant Frigidaire Service Tech-Talk document. Dan.

 

[philr]

You're welcome!

 

Keep us informed of if you find what's wrong with the help of this document.

 

You can probably convert these elements so they work like those in your RBZ-81 as parts for them are easier to find. And it's never too late to go back to the original Heat Minder and Speed Heat if you find the correct replacement parts later!