Funny... Front Loaders are Junk

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This TL v FL argument will rumble on for ever and ever and from the many hundreds of post on here about it I hazard a guess that the manufacturers of FL machines for the USA market have a few things to learn before they are going to win over some people.

However, I am totally baffled by the issue with mould and bad odours from USA FL machines. Like many in the UK and Europe, in all the 30+ years I have been using/coming in contact with them, I have NEVER come across this problem nor met or heard of anyone who has. I can't begin to think why it is a problem and as that dreadful woman in the video pointed out, she has to buy another product to keep the machine clean!!
 
Hoovermatic

I think part of the problem is the majority of US detergents do not contain oxygen bleach, plus people in the US tend to have a laundry day, so if they close the door on the machine it may be sitting for several days before the next load is ran. My M.I.L uses Liquid detergent and shuts the door between washes and the boot on her machine is black with mold.
 
Re "However, I am totally baffled by the issue with mould and bad odours from USA FL machines"

Here as an American too I am baffled too; since both out 1947 and 1976 Front loaders never had these issues at all.

The Mold issue is really NEW to American front loaders, since the FL machines have been used here about 70 years now.

Mold and bad smells with American Front loaders is a new thing with American Front Loaders, on some models after the mid 1990's. ie when the Average Joe really started to use them a lot more.

Thus from say 1940 to 1995; ie over 1/2 century we had ZERO mold and bad smells on our FL washers. New FL machines came out in the 1990's, then newbies blamed everything known to man except the darn new washers.

Most Americans really never used a FL washer before 1995; thus naturally newcomers blame detergents, cold washing, versus a design issue.

One has a complex set of reasons,

new washers leave water still in the tub. The smelly washer site says 1 to 2 gallons. An American front loader from 50 years ago leaves a few cups.

Old washers had porcelain tubs and spin baskets; new uses plastic, stainless and aluminum.

One has Top Load folks who are use to using gobs of soap

A neighbors 1990's Maytag Neptune FL washer stunk so bad "one had to hold ones hose to walk through the laundry room" or "it smells like an open sewer"

Newcomers to FL washers here in the USA cannot accept that us older FL users have older FL machines with no smell issues, even with cold water and liquids.

Thus the poor less robust new FL designs are defended; and the blame is placed on the water and soaps, NOT the washer.

Here I never heard of smells and mold from a FL washer until a Neighbor had the smelly Maytag Neptune, ie 50 years after our first 1947 FL washer. At first I thought is was a JOKE, ie like smelly car bumper, or smelly iron board iron.

Besides mold and smells; one has in the USA Aluminum spider failures with modern FL washers. That half corroded Aluminum spider has crud growing in it.
 
me i have a front loader that dates from 2004 and never had mold or bad smell issues because when i wash in cold water or warm water i use least detergent than what is recommended on the detergent liquid bottle instruction and at least half a month or before the month ends i use afresh washer cleaner when recommended and when not needed i start the washer and let it run a full cycle with no clothes in it and leave the door open or half open and always open the detergent dispenser drawer to see if there is exess water if so i open and close the dispenser witch gets rid of the extra water or empty it by hand.
 
over 1/2 century we had ZERO mold and bad smells on our FL w

Well, that's not true, as people have reported on here memories of vintage machines that smelt due to misuse.

It's interesting how most of the machines I have access to (aside from my parent's Miele) have plastic outer tubs, aluminium spiders and use very little water, yet none of them have ever had even the slightest hint of smells, residues, build ups or mould, have only ever known of a drum spider failing on one machine, and that was a machine that never saw hot water, was only used with liquid detergent (i.e. no oxygen bleach) and was always left with the door shut.

Perhaps the issue is that U.S. detergents (be it powder or liquid) rarely contain oxygen bleach, and it seems to me, do not contain zeolites or phosphonates (which are the reason our detergents clean just as well without phosphates as they did before they were removed). If people do not add seperate bleach (be it oxygen or chlorine based) and live in hard water areas but do not have a mechanical water softner, the machine is going to be a haven for bacteria, full of soils deposited from the wash and mineral scale.

Perhaps a machine with less plastic parts and a better designed wash profile OR raised water levels will be less prone to these issues, but when used CORRECTLY, a cheaper modern front loader will not suffer these issues either.

It's not what you've got it's how you use it afterall :-)

Matt
 
foul odors...

myself,i have only delt with two washers that reeked;my F/L maytag neptune
when i first got it,and a very grubby 24"DD top load kenmore-i was able to
get the odors out of both quite easily.
 
I've had front-loading washers since 1986, and have never had an odor problem. The new Frigidaire 4474 is the first machine I've owned with a CLEAN WASHER cycle, which prompts me to do so every 50 cycles. I sometimes put off using that cycle for an extra 10-20 loads, but I eventually run it. It fills and tumbles with the cleaner (Tide Washing Machine Cleaner, as that's what's available; the manual suggests a massive dose of chlorine bleach). The CLEAN WASHER cycle uses about 7 gallons of water (two fills) and takes 41 minutes.

I use liquid chlorine bleach in 2-3 loads per week. A couple of years ago, I washed exclusively in cold water for about 10 months (but still used LCB on whites) and had no problems.

I always pat the boot dry, wipe down the glass in the door, and empty any standing water from the dispenser drawer---which also stays open between washings.
 
Matt;

my take is that old American FL washers never had any mold issues; and the new 1990's American FL washers were built by engineers really with zero experience in Front Loaders.

The 1976 FL westy's mechanism design about from 1955, the pump from the 1940's. The spin basket and tub from about 1962 to 1988 was about the same. The 1988 to 1993 units just added a German torquer motor with the 1960's parts.

When a new design say the American FL of the mid 1990's is reborn, about all the old farts who sweated subtle details were retired or long dead. Thus to me it is not really surprising that early Maytag Neptune FL washers DID have design issues that caused mold.

In Europe, I am not sure if there ever was a giant ramp up of Front loaders when before few used them.

Look at the USA's problems with front wheel drive cars, we did not get these right with our first models either.

Frigilux;

RE "I use liquid chlorine bleach in 2-3 loads per week. "

Here I only wash about 2-3 loads per week. I have never used any chlorine bleach in my new LG FL I got last November.

When I ran the 1976 FL Westy from 2006 to 2010, I only used chlorine bleach a few times a year. I used it mosty after Katrina. Even before Katrina the machine from 1976 to 2005 was not used much with chlorine bleach at all. I might buy a gallon jug every year and more than half would be used for non laundry stuff. The point I am trying to make is with older FL machines that had no mold issues, many of us used liquid detergents and little chlorine bleach.
 
Our beloved center timer tags were prone to trampoline on  a weak wooden floor, i remember posts from years ago were folks who had  Whirlpool or Kenmore machines were very upset when they changed over to a Maytag. No intent to hijack the thread but this is not a new phenomenon. alr2903
 
RE

"Is why the Plant Based Fabric Conditioners and lack of a hot fill seems a most likely scenario !!! "

But that conflicts with some of us who really about never use hot washes or fabric softeners at all. I personally have never bought a bottle of fabric softener in the last 20 years; and really bought a couple before this when I lived in California.

Here the water is so soft that I have only used fabric softener maybe once in the last decade, typically with some new sheets or some odd thing. My moms couple bottles of its still are in the laundry room from cicra 1990. With my current LG I washed once since November with hot as just an experiment, mostly I use Cold and a few times warm. I probably use a hot wash in about 1 out of 50 to 100 washes, probably a fabric conditioner once a leap year.

Here most of my washing is with liquid detergents and cold water. Fabric softener really has no purpose for me, the couple bottles here from 1990 will last me another 100 years.

That ladies FL LG is actually a variant that works better on a 2nd Floor than the lower LG models. It has a better balancing scheme. It is the same as my machine,and the same one placed in a 2nd story here locally for a friend.
 
Re "are you saying "You are getting mold" ??? "

I am saying I DO NO GET MOLD; and I use all the things folks on this website preach as the reasons, ie cold water and liquids.

Here I know folks with newer FL washers who are fabric conditioner addicts and liquids that have no mold issues; and some too that do not use fabric conditioners but use powders and have molds; thus the causes seem to be not so black and white.
 
me i use liquid detergent and when needed bleach and i never had mold or bad smells in my washer and on occasion i also use liquid fabric sofner and i mostly wash in cold water and warm water only time i use hot water is for bed sheets and to show i am posting my wash pattern here

Light colors clothe the temp i use is warm water

Dark colors clothes the temp i use is cold water

hand wash fabrics cold water wash

bleachable T-Shirts and rags hot water wash

bedsheets no bleach hot water wash

and Please note that for most canadians or us that have know top loaders most of there life are not use to front loaders and have to adjust and for us and canadian front loaders the detergent use must be he high efficency or say on the bottle made for all machines and he machines as well. ok that was my 2 cent here
 
The USA has had long sagas of folks with Front Load mold problems and smells ever since "America rediscovered the front loader in 1995"

Here is an old Aug 2008 Consumer Reports link and many comments by folks with front load mold problems.

Some comments are funny in an odd way:

Posted by: H-Stillwater | Sep 2, 2008 3:46:50 PM

"I can't in the absolute least understand what you people are complaining about! I have had my fl washer for one year now and it is absolutely the best thing ever! I love it.

I love saving electricity and water!

Update, well its 1.5 years now, and my washer works well. I have noticed the electricity and water bills have been a bit less. Yay!
I clean the gasket and leave the door open after each wash. This is just great.

Update: 4 years.

I hate this washer. The money I have spent on cleaning it, running empty wash cycles with affresh and hot water! My water and electricity bills are back where they used to be. My husband couldn't stand the smell of his shirts any more and took the machine apart. Every piece of the machine that carried water is covered in black gunk and/or mold. It stinks so bad!

I did everything I was suppose to as I loved my machine... and it reeks! It is a stinking moldy disgusting-ness piece of crap.

I have spent more than 500.00 in cleaning aids, maintenance/repair technicians, and affresh tablets.

We are throwing it out. Today I went to find a top loader at the store. This poor lady was looking at buying a FL. I told her to research it, and google "smelly front loader" before she bought.

Ha! Maybe I saved her some pain... I sure hope so. "

 
thank you for the link from what i read in your post and this is just my tough i think that some us or canadian are just not ready yet for front loaders sure i have one now as a daily driver and like it but for me du to my size and having to sit down to load unload the washer is an inconviniance but i respect those that have a front load washer so i think that top load or front load the choice is personel and it also depends on the buyer 's budget as newer front loaders cost more
 
Maybe Europe's machines use more water?

I always thought that Europe's 24" frontloaders did not use much water, until I saw this video: )

 

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