H1N1 Flu

[panthera]

yes, yes

But we are talking about short term use as an anti-inflammatory, with a cut in mortality here in Germany of 50%.
That's too much to sneeze at, Rich. We are short on vaccine, we have too many people who can't take the time off from their jobs because people in American in most jobs (!) don't have sick days and can and are fired for being sick...

When I was learning CPR, the doctor who taught us said we'd do damage to the victim we were trying to help. If they survived, they'd be OK with the cracked rib or two and the contusions, etc....as opposed to being dead.

 

[sudsmaster]

Of course the risks vs. the benefit must be weight for every medication. Chemotherapy uses a cocktail of quite toxic chemicals, but people survive because it is calibrated to allow them to survive when (hopefully) the cancer cells don't.

But too often doctors seem blindly to prescribe indefinite courses of medication without any apparent concern over the bad side effects the medication might have. In the case of statins, I think most people assume that an elderly can't move or is foggy because of their age or a generic condition like "arthitis" or "dementia" - not because they've being slowly poisoned over months or years by their medications.

There probably needs to be some research done on a statin that reduces inflammation without disrupting cholesterol production. Cholesterol is, most likely, a red herring.

 

[jamiel]

Sudsmaster, believe that statins are actually OTC in Australia/New Zealand, which shows that there is a divergence of opinion on the harm/benefit of these drugs.

 

[panthera]

I agree with Rich

that our knowledge of statins and cholesterals is not nearly as comprehensive as we like to think it is.
Since I first read about their usefulness in flu' treatment last week, have since read that here in Germany, there are now recommendations to hospitals to use them in both H1N1 and the 'normal' flu'.

We are talking about people who are so ill, they are either in the hospital or their doctor would put them there if they lived in civilized country which actually gave a damn about its cititzens, not about long term use. Just as the hysterical red-nex were flipping out about proplyne glycol (which they eat by the ton in their baked goods) and aluminium, mercury and formaldyhde...so we have to be careful to differentiate between a dead body and a limited course of treatment with some otherwise not so nice stuff.

 

[passatdoc]

I am an internist in California. H1N1 vaccine is supposed to be distributed free of charge to physician offices (offices may charge a fee for administration---i.e. compensation for time, registration, paperwork, supplies---but may not charge for the vaccine itself) via the county health department. I placed online orders two months ago and have not seen a single vial. We are keeping a call-back list of patients who need the vaccine, so that we may immunize them in an expedited fashion once the vaccine is available.

Our hospital requires all health care workers to have been immunized for both seasonal and H1N1 flu by 1 November or else they must wear an N95 mask at all times inside the hospital. Since no one has received H1N1 vaccine for adults (the health department did provide inhaled vaccine for children), no one who works at the hospital has thus been immunized for H1N1 and must use masks effective tomorrow. Vaccine status is ascertained by decals which are applied to one's ID badge holder when the vaccine is given at the hospital (or documentation of outside vaccine administration is acceptable).

I've had three patients hospitalized with H1N1 and all three were under 24 years of age. Hospital time ranged from four days to two months in ICU; all survived. This is no joke, particularly for those below age mid-30s. Older patients seem to do well at home with Tamiflu. On Thursday I saw a mid-40s gentleman who'd received seasonal vaccine at work a month ago. He had 104 (40C) fever and "looked like flu". Either he had H1N1 or his seasonal vaccine didn't work. He was raised in the UK and didn't emigrate until his mid-20s, so I don't know what he was exposed to in UK (vs same age US raised peers). He did very well with Tamiflu and called Friday to say he was improved. The only other middle-aged H1N1 case I've seen was a diabetic lymphoma survivor who cleared up at home on Tamiflu.

Our health dept is overwhelmed trying to process all of the swabs sent for H1N1 testing and is asking practitioners to submit specimens only for hospitalized patients. If I see a patient in the office who "looks like flu", I treat accordingly, since outpatient treatment of mild to moderate flu, whether seasonal or H1N1, is the same.

 

[panthera]

Jim,

Thank you. I hope you stay healthy!

 

[sudsmaster]

I heard on the news last night that a young girl who had H1N1 in California was improving, and even said she felt better. 90 minutes later, she was dead. I speculate it was a cytokine storm.

Perhaps the statins suppress that part of the immune response (a form of inflammation, I guess) and that is their usefulness in treating H1N1 type viruses. I think I still have some of the statins I was prescribed two years ago. If I get a bad flu I might just take a few. But the very fact that they can reduce a powerful immune response indicates to me another reason why they should not be taken routinely.

 

[panthera]

That poor child.

Her poor parents.
I wonder if the red-nex and knee-jerk Republicans are paying attention to just how poorly the US is dealing with this crisis compared to the rest of the first-tier nations? It's not enough to compare the US to some banana-republic and pat ourselves on the back, we have to compare things to Europe and Japan.

 

[mattl]

Just an update -- I've been very busy for a few days, but my cousin in NC is doing much better, but still jobless. Panthera, it would be interesting to take on the fight, but ultimately at this point in this country it's a loosing battle. Plus, at least half of her 11 siblings are unemployed or underemployed. This is the worst I've ever seen things.

Back on topic. my sister-in-law had the regular flu last week, came home early last Monday and spend pretty much all week in bed. She thinks it was just the regular flu. I've been very busy the last week and have been eating fast food daily, something I never normally do, and I had serious reservations about doing so, just to avoid any potential for the flu. Unfortunately my hunger won out and I ate much too much Mc D's Wendys' and Taco bell. It will be good to get back to normal this week, as along as I don't get the flu...

 

[petek]

The handling of the H1N1 vaccine is also in complete disarray here in Canada, they waited till the last minute, everyones confused and lineups are terrible at the clinics offering them. They initially weren't letting family doctors give the shots for fear of wastage but now they are so I'm booked in a week this Thursday for mine.

 

[sudsmaster]

It's a bit early for the regular flu, I gather.

I have read that the H1N1 flu can be spread from person to person even if they are 10 feet away. All it takes is a cough or a sneeze. So I think this one is going to spread very fast, esp when the really cold weather hits and people are more confined in restricted spaces.

 

[mysteryclock]

The CDC is holding off on its big ad-buy to push the vaccine until the supply finally catches up with demand, probably in December sometime the way things are going now. I know the manufacturers are doing everything they can to get it out the door but the darn thing is just not cooperating. There seems to be a better supply of the mist vs. the injectable kind, and IIRC that's because you can get many more doses of vaccine per "egg" (literally) of mist than injection.

And one last thing for the mercury-fearing types -- there is more mercury in a typical can of tuna than the fully-preserved vaccine shot.

60 Minutes did a good piece on the manufacture of the vaccine -- I've posted a link below.

Loading…

news.cnet.com

 

[sikiguya]

My daughter was diagnosed with it today....

My daughter felt slightly bad yesterday with a sore throat and mild fever. By this AM, she had a 104 fever, no voice, sore throat, body aches, and coughing. Went to the Dr for the H1N1 test and it came back in less than 1 minute (usually takes 5-10 minutes). Had to wait on the pharmacy to make Tamiflu for her since they were all out of the kids version of it. She is really sick and she NEVER gets sick.
Since my son has immune issues, Dr said that we must take his temp every 3 hours to make sure he is not starting a fever. If he gets it, he will immediately start Tamiflu and be placed in the hospital. He already has a sinus infection so this would be icing on the cake if he gets it! UGH!
Think positive thoughts for us and that no one else in the house gets it. She is upstairs and the rest of us are down stairs. I am cleaning like a mad woman!!!!

 

[westie2]

Get some masks

Heather get some of the surgical mask to wear in her bedroom and even in the house. Dr's here are saying to do this. My youngest son his wife and daughter all had the H1N1. Son went back to work too early and had relase over the weekend and had to go to the emergency room Saturday. The Dr. there told him not to go back to work until next Monday.

You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers.

 

[panthera]

Heather,

Please keep us up to date.

I hope your daughter feels better soon and your son doesn't get it.

 

[mysteryclock]

My son had it with 104 fever that tapered down to 101 then 99 and finally broke on day 8. MAKE SURE you keep an eye out for secondary infections, especially pneumonia! It took Jacob 17 days of antibiotics to shake the case he got at the same time, and that was just upper-right lobe!!

Be careful and good luck! Let us know when you're all in the clear.

 

[sikiguya]

WOW!

That was a long time for recovery!!! She had a 101 fever this AM and now has no fever but I suspect it's from the Tylenol she is taking for the pain in her throat. Her cough is nasty too. I already told the school that she will not be there at all this week and possibly not next week. I have heard too many people who have had replapses and have gotten super sick. They do think she might have strep throat because of how red her throat was. The rapid test for strep came back negative but that always happened to me and I had to have my tonsils out about 5 months ago.

 

[mysteryclock]

Well keep in mind that Jake's 8 days was without Tamiflu but still on Motrin/Tylenol-- he is an otherwise healthy kid with no underlying medical conditions so our pediatrician decided to skip the antivirals due to the potential side-effects and just keep an eye on him. My wife is an RN who works at that practice part-time so he had very close observation at home... she's the one who spotted the first signs of pneumonia and took him in for confirmation, in fact!

Shockingly, none of the rest of us caught it in spite of being on home-quarantine for a week. I don't think I've ever washed my hands / wiped surfaces / used germex / done laundry (everything he wore/touched/breathed on) as much as I did that week.

We've all been vaccinated now so that risk should be past for us. But there is still a *bunch* of it going around down here.

 

[circlew]

Heather, I hope your daughter is feeling better now, and that no one else in your family comes down with it.

 

[sikiguya]

Well, it happened......

Yesterday I picked my son up from school and his teacher said that he complained of a sore throat. We came home, took his temp and he was at 101. Called the Dr and made an appt for this AM. He is having breathing issues but nothing major at this point. I have steroids and albuterol if anything flares up. The sad part is that he has a sinus infection and an ear infection too. His temp is at 103 now with Tylenol/Advil.
Started the Tamiflu and he's sleeping now. My daughter is much better, with only tiredness and a cough left (which the Dr said might last 2 more weeks). She is not going back to school until Monday at the earlist, depending on how she does.
I can only hope I don't get it as my husband is out of town for work (as usual, when something like this happens, he is NEVER here! Lucky I guess!)
Thanks for all the good thoughts and sharing your experiences with me.