Have I gone crazy?

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oh dear, yes

He was really ok when we met. It just seems like there was a need in him which I could never fill. The whole Bagwahni thing over here in Germany was really big in the Seventies and Eighties. Since I can't even get my head around the Christian religion, I was in no mood to shovel my hard earned money into this jerk's overstuffed bank accounts.
Sort of like fundamentalist Christians - our way or the highway.
I don't understand this whole personality cult thing.

I think it is good when someone finds peace in themselves after a relationship dies. But I still firmly believe in commitment and building a life together. Too many gay men are stuck in the eternal now mentality. That is great - when you are 22, hung like a horse, beautiful, have money and all the world's your oyster.
When you get past that stage, you begin to value other things.
When you are lucky enough to find them - and he is cute and hung it don't hurt, neither. And smells good.
Er, nearly said something nice for a change.
Schreck las' nach...
 
I can't begin to tell you all how touched I am by your outpouring of support and caring for someone you've never even met. Your kind words and thoughts mean alot to me, and I promise to respond to email as soon as I have a free second.

Our story is complicated by the fact that we really do love each other. Our friends that do know are completly shocked. We have a beautiful home together, a large circle of really good friends, and we have so many things and interests in common. This is part of the reason this is so painful.

Thanks again for all your thoughts and I wll keep you posted on how things develop.
With much love,
Jim
 
Jim,

I am going to be really nasty and say: My cat loves me more than this guy loves you.
Love is what you do, not the warm cuddly feeling. Love is the honesty of ending a relationship before starting a new one.
Love is sticking with your partner through the not so terribly interesting times.
Love is not when it is easy to love. Love is when it is hard and challenging and tough to stick together.
Sorry to be so nasty here - but I truly think you deserve better.
Maybe he has it in him...but right now, you're the only one doing the loving.
Oh, as long as I am in High-Bitch mode: Dump the therapist. He or she ain't got clue one.
This all said, I am glad you are part of Automatic Washer. You have a place here.
 
Jim,
Stay the course, you will make it. This is what separates the men from the boys. Think of yourself and WHO YOU really are, your values.
Count yourself fortunate that he was upfront. He could have cheated on you behind your back, then one day you get sick...and I mean in bad way. He was honest, I hope that you will give him some credit for that...even though you feel like neuturing him.

I left my ex many years ago, he was an alcoholic and I just couldn't take it anymore....out of the 7 years we were together only 4 were good. We were either fighting or in bed and there was no inbetween. During the last fight we had he threatened to kill me. I walked out and never looked back....only to be thankful that I'm still standing.
To be honest, I still have a hard time trusting anyone that I meet, anyone that I would meet in a romatic way. I've guarded my heart eversince. It's just something you learn.
My best to you.
Barry
 
Jim- you have my sympathy and empathy. It is so hard when you are on the receiving end of the "I don't love you anymore discussion". It has been almost 7 years since that happened to me after 14 years and you know I still can't figure out what happened. Oh, yes, now I recall. He was 19 years older than I and came from a very different background. So to him I was always this blue collar working class stiff that had the audacity to have a demanding job and could not devote 7 nights a week to partying until the wee hours etc... I was boring, sometimes stressed and when I didn't want to go out drinking with his "buddies" on a Sunday night, I was a "drag". And of course, at the end I got - " well I never really loved you anyway" and "truthfully, none of my friends like you that much" - of course that "friend" was his new lover he had been seeing for almost a year.....

Well, I don't much care what a bunch of rest stop queens think, but I will never forget that lesson. I would like to say that in the end we parted civilly, but we never spoke again. And that included his now adult children that I helped him raise. That hurt more than anything. Strangely, mutual friends have commented how odd that he never even acknowledges that I existed. If my name is mentioned, he shrugs and mumbles something about how we never had a relationship - we were just friends who had occasional sex and I imagined a relationship.

It took a few years of therapy to really feel human again. During the first few months the rest of my world crashed in on me - my mother became desparately ill and died and the day I went back to work, my boss informed me that my job was eliminated and I had the rest of the day to clear out after 15 years. A few months later, my best friend and neighbor was diagnosed with cancer and died within two months.

It was a long climb back through heartbreak, unemployment and financial disaster and I am probably not 100% back yet (financially I am not sure I will ever be). But when I look back, I am amazed at how resilient we are. I made it through things I thought I never could.

Jim, you will make it through. The only thing I can tell you is to be kind to yourself and make sure you don't compromise yourself. I agree that perhaps you need a different therapist and probably need to go alone. It is probably better to heal yourself first before you face anything further with him.....
 
Oh Angus!!

What a journey you have been on!!! You are living proof that the old addage is true "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger". Keep on keeping on!!!!

Rich
 
Why be unhappy??? It just makes ya feel worse..Besides is something like sex or? worth it... Not really

I try to live each day to the fullest i can...
 
~Jim

I am a true believer in Karma. You get back what you give.
7 years ago my so called straight,divorced friend told me he was in love with me. he pursued me relentlessly until he got me in bed. He was the most passionate,intense love I had ever felt and we had alot in common as far as interests go.
The problem?..he was from a wealthy family who controlled his life financially and being lebanese, he was expected to produce a 100% lebanese heir. We secretly carried on our romance even though his family, whom i knew, suspected we were involved. To make a long story short, he dumped me for a woman he met at a lebanese convention in Canada. he went back in the closet. When he broke up with me, he told me I was everything he was looking for in a partner, I just couldn't bear children for him. How could i compete with that? he then actually had the gall to expect me to continue seeing him, Sorry, I wont play second fiddle to anyone. He married her and 3 kids later, he is miserable,overweight and and does nothing but work.
My life?..I met the love of my life on Match.Com in early 2004, he treats me with the love,kindness and respect I have never known. My soulmate! We have a home together and a great circle of friends. His only issue with me is he cannot relate to my love for washers and automaticwasher.org! LOL..
My point is, life can throw curve balls at a moments notice. Sometimes they are good, other times not so good.. Its all in how you react to those situations.
Merry Christmas and peace to all on the boards.
This site beats the bar any old time!
~Shane
 
Leave your behind in your pants

For those that love to romanticize the past (when we were cute, young, care-free..etc). If your head is turned behind you to see what was and came and went, you can not see ahead of you the beauty that is and is to be.Only the present really matters, as does the hope of the future. Mold the present to be the best time ever in your life. It is the only time you really have control over. The past is gone and can not be relived. We can change the past in the sense that we can remember it (and SELECTIVELY remember) what we want to. It is your choice to focus on the positive or the negative of what was.

Sometimes, with additioanl insight that comes with maturity, the past is seen in a totally different light and with a diffent set of eyes.For example: How magical were holidays for us kids? Did anyone as kid realize that the folks may have not been able to make the rent or the mortgage at that time? Did we truly get what they were going thorugh as parents? Probably not. Now that we "get it" does that not change our perception and make such things even more special?

When we are 40 the "good old days" were when we were 20.
When we are 60 the good old days were when we were 40. SO MAKE TODAY THE BEST DAY EVER! TODAY IS THE FIRST DAY OF THE REST OF YOUR LIFE!

excuse me while I adjust my vestments (and bra and girdle) and leave the pulpit. LOL
 
Steve, you are a very wise man!! What you say is so true and a great reminder for all of us.
 
sorry to hear that jmm63

im really sorry to hear this however its common in realtionships that there can be a test of what you have.
I would suggest not taking the anti-depressants because md's are way to quick to prescribe them! Try working things out I know you already are and from what im reading you seem to want to save this relationship however, If your partner cant' effectively communicate with you how he feels and vice versa with you then, I hate to say it but maybe it's time to say goodbye. If someone cant see how great you are or appreciate you for what you bring in a relationship send them packing! If your not sharing the same room and have reasonable suspicions about his other "friend" let him know a few things and cut him a new one. I really dont know you but still from what i've read i wish you the best hope I helped and dont worry life goes on. Now you must look at your partner with new eyes and you must choose what you really feel like YOU want to do! Im sorry your partner sounds a slight bit selfish so you need to take care of you! dont be used ok keep your head up and have a great holiday suround yourself with your best friends and family ok take care and god bless. :)
Sincerely, Randy
aka vintagesearch
 
Holiday break ups

I went through a breakup right before christmas once-I thought this girl was THE one-but it takes two thinking that way.The timing was rough,but I have always tried to use New Years as a jumping off point to leave hurt or disapointment behind.Time heals all wounds,but it sure is slow!I made it through that christmas,hit the new year and never looked back.Good things started to happen that year,and I am convinced that the fact that I was determined to do my best to look forward instead of backward helped.
Tom
 
Hi Jim, I'm so sorry to hear of this. I know how painful something like this is. It does not sound like he is treating you with the respect you deserve, especially after all your years together. His going off to meet a "friend" and flaunting it in front of you is simply horrible. Sometimes relationships do end, but there are many paths one can to take to end it, all of them hurt, but some are downright mean.

I'll keep everything crossed for you guys that things will work out, but if they don't time will heal, but you will need lots of space away from him in order to begin the healing process.
 
Looks like

You couldn't possibly have hoped for any wiser, sincere, or more helpful advice than you got above.

Believe in yourself and trust yourself that you will come out of this OK and that the next chapter will be even better than you ever imagined. It's human nature to obsessively sort through the past and wonder what you could or should have done differently. Try not to worry about fighting it. Eventually those voices in your head will quiet, and peace will come to you as you start to not only realize, but internalize, that you deserve better. Cherish and be grateful for the good times you had. Eventually you'll come to accept that even though the times were good in the past, they simply weren't meant to last any longer than they did -- for two reasons: one, you simply weren't compatible, and far more importantly, you deserve far better, and it's time for you to begin the journey of finding someone far better.

You WILL recover. It's just that it takes time, and it will happen in its own time. It might be only 6 months, it might be several years. But if it takes longer, don't worry. Nature always heals. Therapy and medication might be helpful to some people some times, but they won't cause the healing process to come about or accelerate it. Only nature can do that. And it most assuredly will, difficult as that might be for you to imagine right now. Try your best to remain confident and to trust that healing will one day arrive. This planet does not contain even one person you can't get over. You'll realize that one day. The morning sunrise always hurts the most, but one of those mornings, the sun will rise and you will find yourself thinking, "What in the world did I ever see in him?! Good riddance!"

And then after you've healed, you simply won't believe how many guys in this club will be scratching each other's eyes out to be the first to pound on your front door.

Try to relax, smile, and laugh. It's going to hurt for awhile, and there's nothing you can do to avoid that. But it's also going to heal, and healing will automatically come in its own natural course, without any effort on your part. And so too, probably, will the next, even happier, chapter of your life.

OK, I've tried to avoid talking about myself until now, but maybe this might have some application for you. I'm embarrassed to admit that it took me longer than 5 years to get over my last relationship. But one morning as the sun was rising, I did finally wake up and realize I was over him. What finally did it? Well, two things. The first thing: it took that long for me to look beyond the good memories and honestly remember and confront the bad times for what they were -- the mean things, the insensitivty, the constant criticism, the constant attitude that nothing I did was ever good enough for him, the double standards, all the hallowed rules that applied only to everyone else, etc. I came to realize that he wouldn't have done those things and been that critical at times if we were truly compatible. I came to realize that no, the good times did NOT make up for the bad, contrary to my earlier delusions, and I would be a very conflicted, mentally unhealthy, and hurt person if I had lived any longer with that kind of treatment. The second thing: as background, you have to know that he was the world's most professional charmer. He was always doing something cute and charming, such as calling me and telling me to meet him someplace, and then when I got there, there he was, grinning like a Cheshire cat, wearing clothes and shoes that belonged to me. Anyway, throughout our dating, I thought he was doing all those cute, charming things the first time, for me, because he thought I was that special to him. Wrong. In time, his old boyfriends and subsequent boyfriends eventually told me the same cute stories, and they of course were thinking that he had done those things only to them. That was when I finally realized that he's simply a people-pleaser -- he instinctively does anything and everything to please and charm people, but, charming though he may have been, it did NOT mean it was real for him or that it meant anything to him. Once I realized that, healing followed.

Trust yourself. Healing will come in its own time, and in its own way. And something better will follow.
 
Steve, we call those guys "players" where I come from.

Watch out for that type. If it's too good to be true, the dude is "working" it too hard. Look out, he's a player,straight up.

I try to keep in mind that there is a beginning and an end to everything in this world. I do not regret any relationship I have had with anyone. I still love a couple of the guys I have had relationships with. Still have a relationship with one of them, but we cannot be together. Would hate to see anything bad happen to any one of them.

I would say, if a relationship lasted for over a few years, then both people must have really loved each other during most of that time. I would not want to spoil the wonderful memories from the relationship by saying horrible things to each other. That would be a real tragedy.
I would rather part as special friends if at all possible. Do not think I could bring myself to hate anyone that I really loved at one time.
 
beginnings and endings

That is good Rick. I do get a little tired of the jerks who excuse their hoaring around with the "but everything has to end sometime" mentality. I know that is NOT what you are saying - just my own little thoughts here.
I firmly believe, unless a man is willing to commit to forever, he should be enjoyed for the transitory pleasure he (may) be...but don't waste a second of your time on him, cause he surely isn't on you.
When youth fades, when the good times become the victories you have won instead of the natural "due" of youth...that is when you want somebody at your side who will stick through the good and the bad. Anything else may be good sex, but it is neither friendship nor love.
If you find yourself feeling only "sunny-day" friendly towards someone, be honest with him - don't lie about how he is the man of your life, etc.
 
Very good advice, all, and very humbling as well, for I'm very impressed with how so many of you have managed to transcend these tricky U-turns of the expressway of life....

It's important to be able to look back without bitterness....I never wanted to be about all that, and both of us are working hard to make sure that doesn't creep in the door...

NOW!! On to thought-stopping, and silent ridicule!

lol...
 
~ ...It took me longer than 5 years to get over my last relationship.

Yup this has happened to me too!

~EDITED:
You simply won't believe how many guys (in this club) will be scratching each other's eyes out.

~Some will want to be the first to pound on your front door.

I have always heard that back-door guests are best.
 
Jim and all, If the pain of the loss, any loss, persists and begins to drag you down, impairs your immune system or affects your work, acupuncture can work wonders by bringing your energy up and getting you focused on feeling better. Acupuncture can relieve depression for short periods so frequent visits might be necessary when you first start, but the longer you stick with the treatments, the longer the benefits will last so that you can lengthen the times between treatments. Along the way, you just might notice that your allergies go away or are greatly reduced. I mention this because many people might not think that acupuncture can help with broken hearts, but it can. I wish you all the best and pray for your emotional and physical recovery at this awful time in your life. Tom
 
Problems solved. $1 In the thrift aisle of your supermarket.

Jim, despite the joke in the pic, I sincerely hope you had a nice Christmas, all said-and-told.

Please don't forget to lean upon us, all of the above, your cite friends and acquaintances who posted with the greatest concern.
 
Jmm63

Hey Jim..

Saw your pic on my other thread. You are a handsome guy, don't sell yourself short. remember, if you need to vent we are here on the boards

Peace out brotha!
 
Just remember.....what goes around, comes around. Every turkey gets his Thanksgiving, sometimes it just takes a little more patience then we think we have, but karma always turns around to bite you in the ass. I've been there and done that with my ex, shithead that he was, and he paid dearly for the things he did. All in good time.......

Jim, you're a handsome guy; it will hurt and you'll need time to heal, but you will, and you will look back at this and realize you came out ahead. You deserve so much better....as in, someone who truly loves you and wants to make you happy (and vice versa)!
 
While reading this thread

I became amazed at how much love, support and togetherness that this AW forum has shown someone who could be you or me. I'm quite new to this forum (I did post my too-large photo on the other thread)and am still shaking my head at the support that the family here (yup, it's a family)has provided. Something else that gladdened my heart...no straight men chiming in with crude jokes or insults. Not that all men of that persuasion behave in that manner, it's just nice to see that we're all so..civil. At least when one of us has intense pain in his/her life.

I'm in a stable partnership of 12.5 years, and if I can add anything to what has already been posted, it's this:

You MUST have clear communication and honesty in a relationship. You simply cannot work on a "Oh, I thought you knew about XX", or "Oh, you always.." Nope. Doesn't work.
And for your sake (not God's), DON'T LIE TO ONE ANOTHER. Lies don't work, and you always, always always get caught. Or worse yet, you have to tell another lie (or series of lies) to maintain the original lie. There's a fine and subtle difference between being brutally honest (God, you're fat!)and telling the truth.

My partner suffered a stroke and lost his eyesight completely about 10 years ago. He went from "acclaimed hairdresser of 25 years" to "blind guy" overnight. Life'll do that to you when you least expect it to. That said, we have to use different ways of communicating in our relationship. We have to talk more than we ever did when he was sighted and busy 6 days a week. It changed our relationship in a thousand subtle and not-so-subtle ways. It also got me over my "perfectionist" streak in a big hurry.

After reading this thread, I walked into the bedroom where he was napping and kissed him. "What was that for?" he asked. "Oh, I was just reminding myself what lucky, lucky boys we are", I replied. He's 18 years my senior, HIV+ and blind, and I wouldn't trade him for the world.

Love your partner/wife/husband. Tell them you love them every day, and, if necessary, fight like hell if there's something there to fight for. Life and love are truly precious things, they're an all-too-rare commodity in this instant hook-up Internet world in which we live.

Just my .02 from a new member.

~Out
 
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