Heating Oil vs gas

Automatic Washer - The world's coolest Washing Machines, Dryers and Dishwashers

Help Support :

Most oil burners here are swedish

Almost all of the oil burners you come across here are made by a swedish company called Bentone. They seem to have been on the market for a LONG time as you see boilers from the early 1960s with Bentone burners sticking out the front.

Installers and service engineers seem to just prefer them as they're reliable and they always have the parts.

The older models wern't as neatly packaged as that square Bentone burner sticking out of the boiler in the picture.

I've also seen old burners made by Danfoss.

They seem to be extremely reliable as they run for decades with minimal servicing.

There are definitely some differences in terms of the equipment that's been traditionally popular in the Republic of Ireland and the UK. Oil fired hydronic heating was very popular here over the decades. It runs on a very light fuel oil that's classified as Gasoil, sometimes a blend of gasoil and kerosine and burns extremely cleanly with those pressure jet Bentone burners. Until the late 1970s there was no natural gas in Ireland at all. The first gas fields were discovered off the south coast in the mid-1970s. Old-fashioned "town gas" which was made from gassifying oil or coal was available in the cities but was really confined to gas cooking applications and was becoming completely uneconomic to run.

Also, unlike the UK, boilers / heating systems are usually housed in a seperate boiler room / boiler house that isn't attached to the house directly. This is for fire regulations but also because oil-fired pressure jet units make a continious rumble when they're running.

The entire city gas networks had to be rebuilt to safely handle natural gas, so the 1980s saw the towns and cities along the new natural gas grid being completely rebuit for natural gas. Many suburban areas got gas for the first time as the older local gas networks had never been extended that far (the old gas companies were struggling to survive never mind extending their networks)

Anyway, natural gas began to take over in urban areas by the mid 1980s. Although, there are still a signifigant number of homes heated by oil-fired systems. They're very easy to convert to gas.. just remove the old oil bentone burner and pop in a new gas one! The fuel was cheaper, there were various special offers to encourage people to switch over as it reduced pollution (particulates) in urban areas. It also reduced the problem of having to phone up and order 1500Liters of oil every so often and having it delivered by tanker.

Natural gas rapidly replaced oil in power plants too, by the mid 80s most of our energy was being generated by "combined cycle" natural gas power plants.. i.e. the gas is burned first in a gas turbine which generates power, then the hot exhaust from that turbine's fed into the normal power plant to raise steam to drive "traditional" turbines.

The Irish gas fields off the south coast are now almost empty, but there's a big interconnecter that feeds gas in from Northern Europe (Norway, UK, Russia etc) so it'll be heating homes for quite a while yet!

And, I'm in the Republic of Ireland (right on the south coast)

Below is a typical LPG tank for the other popular fuel source in rural areas LPG
 
btw

We use gas for exactly the same things as you do in the USA...

Natural gas or bulk LPG for:
Space heating / water heating.
Clothes dryers (tumble dryers)
Cooking.

Cylinders of LPG (Propane or Butane)
Patio heaters
BBQ

You can also get very large tall cylinders of propane that are installed in a mini "farm" with an automatic switching regulator rather than bulk-LPG deliveries. They're used in some rural areas where it's difficult to get access safely with a large bulk LPG tanker... e.g. remote farms / houses / small hotels in rugged areas.
The cylinders just make delivery easier and safer, but the result is exactly the same.
 
Oddly enough, Carrier Corporation...one of the biggest American air conditioning companies used Riello burners exclusively on their oil fired equipment (boilers and furnaces)

Back in the pre central-air conditioning days here in the USA...well, at least in my hometown of Richmond, and parts further northeast, oil fired hot water heat was the way to go for both simplicity and minimal building expense. This was the system employed by many mid-century developers and architects such as William Levitt, who built in New England and mid Atlantic areas, and by Henry Eichler who built even more modern style homes on the west coast. Many other builders used these systems as well.

Oil fired systems used in many mid-century homes have baseboard radiators in wood-frame homes, which is basically a finned pipe behind a metal cover at the bottom edge of the floor. If the home is built slab-on-grade, the pipes are simply buried in the concrete slab when the house is built. The heating pipes are imbedded in the slab heat the floor of the home. The radiant floor system is really nice for giving out comfortable draft-free heat that many users say is comfortable at a lower thermostat setting than forced-air heating. The baseboard systems have almost the same comfort level as the radiant floor systems as well. Domestic hot water is heated by the same boiler by using a hot water loop within the boiler's heating water tank. If Domestic hot water is needed when the home does not need heating, the boiler's burner will kick in, but the circulator pump for the heating system does not run.

Oil fired hot water heat was cheap for the builder and developer because gas lines did not need to be installed when the infrastructure of the new subdivision was put in place. It was also more inexpensive for the builder, since it elimintates one mechanical system, the hot water heater, due to the fact that the boiler is doing double-duty providing water for both systems. There is also the advantage that the home's frame does not need to be constructed to accommodate the extra "tin" needed for large ductwork in a forced-air system. It's much easier to hide a 3/4 inch pipe behind a wall than a 12 inch round air duct. There's also the advantage that another tech was not needed for the installation. The same plumber that hooked up the bathrooms and sinks can be used to install the heating system.

For a breif while around here, electric baseboard heat, with separate hot water systems got slightly popular, but quickly faded as electricity prices in the seventies got high...Oddly enough, oil caught back on until the late 70's when heat pumps came on the scenes, and homeowners started demanding central air conditioning in new homes. Nowadays, heat pumps seem to be the defacto standard in new homes. I imagine this is done for the same reasons hot-water baseboard systems became popular...because of minimal building expense and to mimimize mechanical equipment the builder needs to install. The other factor is that homes are much larger now than they were back in the 50's and 60's (1200 sq/ft versus 2500 sq/ft0, and the ductwork is easier to accommodate in the larger rooms. If a hot-water system is used, the new home buy is still going to want air conditioning, which will require ductwork, and a separate mechanical system. Elecric hot water heaters today are much cheaper than a separate central air conditioner. For that reason the heat pump is used, which will serve the purpose for both heating and cooling with a separate electric water heater for domestic water. The problem is that while air conditioning provided by the heat pump makes the home very comfortable during the summer, the heat pump provides cool, drafty, minimal heating comfort during the winter months. Most people end up upgrading their heat pumps after the home is built with a gas backup system fueled by natural gas if the lines come through their neighborhood, or by propane bottles, if there are not gas lines.
 
Levitt used boilers made by York-Shipley, and were tiny little units that were actually installed underneath the kitchen countertop in the lower cabinet! This gave very fast hot water service to the kitchen appliances, and to the bathroom that backed up to the kitchen. Larger (non Levitt-built) homes had the boilers installed in actual utility rooms, where it's noise would not be a factor similar to the way you describe MRX.

The Beckett oil burners have been the standard here in the USA for quite some time. They are actually an older design that used to be produced by several different manufacturers over the years, but they are the only ones left. These units are extremely easy for even the homeowner to service. About once a year the electrodes, spray nozzle, and the filter needs to be changed, and the oil-water separater emptied. The firebox is cleaned and you are good to go for another year. This periodic service requirement has made lots of money for HVAC techs, as many homeowners have no interest in dealing with the black, sooty components, and having stinky fuel oil run all over the kitchen floor.
 
new england heaters and honeywell thermostats

Most of the houses in NE I've seen were oil or steam radiant and a few houses (like the one I'm in now) has forced air gas which is plenty powerful even on the really cold nights.

EVERYONE and their mama here has an old Honeywell round thermostat. I've yet to see another brand of thermostat here. The "Roundies" are definitely my favorite and I've had both the analog and digital one setup in my trailer back home. The digital version is extremely accurate and it never overheated the house like the previous cheap thermostat that was there.
 
Honewwell

Agreed- Honeywell rounds are indeed the standard here. These are 24 volt (low-voltage) units that control the gas solenoid or oil burner motor directly or through a relay to turn on a circulator. (Riello brand oil-burners require a realy in that they dont have one built-in)

I believe they may also be used with mili-volt systems where a tiny pilot-light hits a thermocouple to generate a tiny voltage. Coupled with a mili-volt gas solenoid valve and a steam system, this will run even in a power outage.

With their heat-anticipators they are accurate to 1/2 degree Fareheit (or 1/4 degree celcius.)

The heat-anticipator is a small resistor that heats up the mercuy tub and bi-metal coil. It shuts the heat off sooner so that any residual in the radiators/convetors will bring the room to temp. without overheating it. (In the summer it serves to start the A/C sooner.)

I read that even such a tiny amount of mercury as found within is hugely toxic and can pollute huge acres and acres of lakes/rivers etc, etc.

Line voltage thermostats tend to be accurate to within 2-5 degrees F and are not very well coveted. Their temperature swings are not comfortable or economical.

Slowly electronic thermostats are taking over. Believe it or not the unheard-of "Lux" brand seems to be overtaking electronic Honeywell brands, at least in my area.

Still, with my steam system the electronic themostat cuts-off the boiler (in mild weather) before the steam can come up ..which takes 8 minutes to heat up and 13 minutes to pressurize the pipes to the max 2.5 psi. Of course in colder weather when the room temp rapidly sinks, this is not a problem.
 
Tumble dryers used in Ireland

MrX:

May I request a link to such gas-fired dryers used by you and your "home-ies" [People of your area home-town or in this case used to mean country]

I thought most there were electric "plug & play" (right Jon? LOL) and of the condenser variety.

Thanks.
 
I posted this picture before but I thought it would be appropriate in this thread. It's a picture of the system that heats my apartment and also is a water heater. It's a small appliance that runs on natural gas and it hangs on the wall. The appliance below it is my wringer washer (without wringer), so it's only the appliance with the pipe coming out of the top.
 
I just noticed those Honeywell digital roundies the other day when I was poking around. I'll get one for my mom, she likes things uncomplicated and when they put in her new furnace/ac all they gave her was a cheap rectangular manual job that you can't really tell where it's set. I was going to put her in a set-back like my Honeywell, but she says it's too complicated and fussy, for her anyways.
 
Toggleswitch:

Condensor dryers are a relatively new fangled thing over here too. The majority of dryers are still very definitely normal vented type machines.

There's really very little point in putting a condensor dryer in when there is a possiblity of boring a duct out through a near-by wall.

The electric models are all around 3000W max (thus can be plugged into a normal outlet)

A UK company called White Knight does a range of gas dryers that typically put out about 4.7KW and do dry quite a bit faster and a lot cheaper than an electric equivilant. Obviously they're ducted out!

Whirlpool have also started selling gas dryers over here.
Mostly the dream space models but there are US-style dryers available by special order, they have obviously tweaked them for 230V + the gas system standards over here and had them approved for use.

The white knight link is below, unforutnatley their website's not great.
 
Themostat for mom

Personally I have never figured out how to use the Honeywell digital roundies.

May I suggest something like an inexpsensive mechanical White-Rodgers (sic) that has a blue (low) and a red (high) levers on the side? A clock mechanically adjusts which of the two lever/ mercury tubes and coils are in effect. Super easy!

Hmmm cant't find. I'm betting the electronic ones ae taking-over!
 
Indutrial-combustion Inc. is THE standard by which all else is judged in the commericial oil burner head field. These are the burners I see on my job every day as a commerical real-estate appraiser/inspector. They are used in apartment buildings that have 20+ apartments. [Yes world... would you believe that the landlord provides heat in New York City rental apartments? Further, tentants can not regulate it!]

Many industrial burners are combination oil/gas. Some use natural gas instead of electric spark ignition.

Duel fuel models normally use oil when least expensive [the oil tanks can be fiiled in the summer or when oil is cheapest.] and gas when least expensive or when temperatures go below 20.F or -5.C. The gas utility commpany offers commerical users a who sign an "Interruptable Flow" agreement large discounts. Gas use stops when outdoor temperatures are at or below the above-listed ponts. Apparently there is not enough supply to ensure all can use simultaneously. The switch-over [gas to oil] is via an automatic device that recieves a signal by the utility co.

There is a residential duel-fuel burner co.as well ..let me do some digging....

Also the use of natural gas by electric generating utilites to generate power is a huge burden on the supplier/pipleline/metworks.

BTW => in the winter crude oil is fractionally distilled into fuel-oil, in the summer into gasoline as people use their vehicles more.!!!

P/S => There was an article in Time magazine that states that due to "new" and booming economies in India and China and their new thirst for crude oil, price may go as high as $5 per gallon (@ 1.33 USD /Euro that's just about 1 euro per litre.[ 0.94 actually]) Considering we pay around $2 now. to us that's high.

 
Digital Honey

The Digital round is EASY to setup and use. No levelling or heat anticipator. Just set the dip switches for the appropriate system and go. AND it remembers your set points for cool and heat so a flick of the switch is all it needs.

Get them at Home Depot.
 
Very Interesting about oil heat

I still think it's the way to go. Pricewise is not always competative with natural gas, but I understand that it can be with market price.

The new home builders in this area still install gas forced-air heat and electric A/C more than anything else. The heating unit is usually located nowadays in the attic (a horizontal model) and the A/C compressor unit is outside.

I seldom ever see heatpumps, even in total electric construction. I have heard the air is rather cool for even this southern winter climate. All electric homes aren't very common in new contruction anymore. Back in the 70's and 80's there was a lot more all electric construction than there is today. New construction in my neighborhood has the gas heat, water heating and fireplace starter, and the kitchen is almost always electric. Laundry has a choice of electric or gas for dryers. Contractor says its the preference of most buyers to buy homes configured like this.

I only wish we had the option of oil if we wanted it. But it may not be a big draw with the general consumers lack of familiarity with it.
 
Heat pumps

Yes, heat-pumps do deliver air that is below body-temp. 98.6 F (37 C ) so it does feel cool to the touch.

BTW => 98.6 F was orginally supposed to be 100.F as body-temp. But early thermometers were "off" LOL.

32.F is freezing because 0.F was the coldest that could be artifically created "then" HA SO MUCH FOR THINKING AHEAD.
 
Benefits of gas/oil

Oil is prepaid and sits in your tank. You are not at the mercy of supply lines, cold snaps, shortages etc. as one is with gas.

Also you can buy from anyone, not limited to utility co.

Gas can explode (within a narrow range of concentrations.)
I'll never forget my parents 2nd home [but first with oil-fired heat and hot water] when the repairman threw a lit match into a bucket of oil.. OOOOH LOOK HOW SAFE! HA

It is physically impossible to burn (or compress ) a liquid. The liquid must first be tranformed into a gas. Even a candle does this by pre-heating the liquid wax!!!
LOL.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top