beekeyknee
Well-known member
LOL...Nick, I can't imagine. A bolt down coming off the floor! I might have to run. That could tear a place up. Did it fly? LOL.
Kenmore 80 Series
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@beekeyknee
As far as I know it did not go far as only 2 of 4 bolts broke before someone shut the power off.
Wk78
As far as I know it did not go far as only 2 of 4 bolts broke before someone shut the power off.
Wk78
mrcreosote
Member
Shredmore Theory: 5/8" Gap Under Agitator
The slotted agitator blades are an unlikely cause for two reasons 1) as people have said, it's a proven design, and 2) the damage to clothing is more of a cutting/slitting action which is not what I would expect from blade slots.
However, the large clearance between the agitator bottom and drum is another matter. I was checking new machines and this clearance is about 1/4 inch. Mine is about 5/8 inch and I can get my fingers almost completely under it.
If clothing gets pulled under the agitator, the bottom edge of the agitator will produce a slicing action.
I am going to see what is involved to lower the agitator. I don't want to lower the drive/spindle but am going to look at what is required to mod the agitator to lower it.
The slotted agitator blades are an unlikely cause for two reasons 1) as people have said, it's a proven design, and 2) the damage to clothing is more of a cutting/slitting action which is not what I would expect from blade slots.
However, the large clearance between the agitator bottom and drum is another matter. I was checking new machines and this clearance is about 1/4 inch. Mine is about 5/8 inch and I can get my fingers almost completely under it.
If clothing gets pulled under the agitator, the bottom edge of the agitator will produce a slicing action.
I am going to see what is involved to lower the agitator. I don't want to lower the drive/spindle but am going to look at what is required to mod the agitator to lower it.
vacerator
Well-known member
My folks
got a matching 80 series pair back in the late 80's as a Sears test program.
Dad was a division 26 veteran by then.
My sister lives in their house now since they are deceased and it still works.
got a matching 80 series pair back in the late 80's as a Sears test program.
Dad was a division 26 veteran by then.
My sister lives in their house now since they are deceased and it still works.
I just found this forum while looking for info on the timer on my late-80s Kenmore, 110.82881800. One day the knob started to spin freely so I could no longer turn the dial to select cycles.
I had inherited this Kenmore 15 years ago when I bought our house and it was already old back then, but I replaced the agitator dogs and it worked fine. I had to replace the dogs again earlier this year, and that's been the only problem until the timer broke. After determining the knob itself was fine I got a used timer cheap from Ebay and sure enough it's working perfectly again. I've never had any problems with it shredding clothes but I've had bleach spots occur on colored clothes that I washed immediately after doing a load of whites, more than once. I assume bleach water from the white load gets trapped somewhere and then drips onto the next load while the tub is filling. I've never found the source, though. Has anyone else heard of this happening?
Can anyone tell me how the Electronic Temperature Control sets the water temperature in this machine? I know it mixes the hot and cold water back and forth... Does it use a sensor somewhere to determine the water temperature in the tub, or is it just pre-programmed to blindly dispense hot water for a certain length of time, then warm water, etc., without really knowing the actual temperature it's achieving?
I had inherited this Kenmore 15 years ago when I bought our house and it was already old back then, but I replaced the agitator dogs and it worked fine. I had to replace the dogs again earlier this year, and that's been the only problem until the timer broke. After determining the knob itself was fine I got a used timer cheap from Ebay and sure enough it's working perfectly again. I've never had any problems with it shredding clothes but I've had bleach spots occur on colored clothes that I washed immediately after doing a load of whites, more than once. I assume bleach water from the white load gets trapped somewhere and then drips onto the next load while the tub is filling. I've never found the source, though. Has anyone else heard of this happening?
Can anyone tell me how the Electronic Temperature Control sets the water temperature in this machine? I know it mixes the hot and cold water back and forth... Does it use a sensor somewhere to determine the water temperature in the tub, or is it just pre-programmed to blindly dispense hot water for a certain length of time, then warm water, etc., without really knowing the actual temperature it's achieving?
warmsecondrinse
Well-known member
My folks have had one for aeons, lol. Never any problems. Not once has a single thing been shredded. Needs agitator dogs but still has great turnover. Go figure.
Can't say enough good about it.
If I were to buy one for myself I'd look for a 90 as you can set the second rinse automatically.
Nobody's ever used the ATC to my knowledge, lol. There never seemed to be a point as hot water temps rarely fluctuate.
Jim
Can't say enough good about it.
If I were to buy one for myself I'd look for a 90 as you can set the second rinse automatically.
Nobody's ever used the ATC to my knowledge, lol. There never seemed to be a point as hot water temps rarely fluctuate.
Jim
ATC
The water flow from the hot/cold inlet valve passes through a thermistor module before the fill flume. A small circuit board responds to the thermistor signal to control the valves when an ATC temp is selected. The valves are controlled to attain an average temperature reading per whatever are the target temperatures. Possibly 100°F warm wash, 75°F warm rinse, and 70°F cold.
ATC on a machine of this age is less for EnergyStar reasons and more to keep warm and cold from being too cold as may occur in the winter season when tap-cold water is very cold. The ATC choices are Warm/Warm, Cold/Cold, and Warm/Cold. Non-ATC choices, which include Hot/Warm and Hot/Cold, are not regulated.
The water flow from the hot/cold inlet valve passes through a thermistor module before the fill flume. A small circuit board responds to the thermistor signal to control the valves when an ATC temp is selected. The valves are controlled to attain an average temperature reading per whatever are the target temperatures. Possibly 100°F warm wash, 75°F warm rinse, and 70°F cold.
ATC on a machine of this age is less for EnergyStar reasons and more to keep warm and cold from being too cold as may occur in the winter season when tap-cold water is very cold. The ATC choices are Warm/Warm, Cold/Cold, and Warm/Cold. Non-ATC choices, which include Hot/Warm and Hot/Cold, are not regulated.
ATC Water Temperature Control
This is a wonderful feature as it assures consistent washing performance in both summer and winter, in the majority of homes in the US there can be a big difference warm water temperature without ATC and even in homes where there is little fluctuation in the incoming hot and cold water temperatures over a years time this feature still gives better results by assuring correct water temperatures.
I always advise all our customers to always use these settings on washers so equipped.
On KN DD washers of this age warm wash should be between 95 F and 105F.
There is seldom any reason to do a 2nd rinse in a washer like this and unless you have very soft water as you rinse all traces of detergent out of a load you are rinsing minerals back into your clean laundry. This not only makes your laundry less soft but it also makes the clothing re-soil more easily and wear out faster.
Using a full 2nd rinse also greatly increases the wear and tear on the washer as every 2 loads you run with a 2nd rinse is like running 3 loads in terms of wear on the machine.
Customers always ask how long a washer will last and we tell them it is largely determined by the number of loads the machine is called upon to wash and to a lesser degree age, as time always takes a toll.
Out in the field we see a big difference in how long a washer lasts in homes where they almost always use the 2nd rinse feature on top load washers. On modern FL washers it seems to make little difference if you use the extra rinse feature.
John L.
This is a wonderful feature as it assures consistent washing performance in both summer and winter, in the majority of homes in the US there can be a big difference warm water temperature without ATC and even in homes where there is little fluctuation in the incoming hot and cold water temperatures over a years time this feature still gives better results by assuring correct water temperatures.
I always advise all our customers to always use these settings on washers so equipped.
On KN DD washers of this age warm wash should be between 95 F and 105F.
There is seldom any reason to do a 2nd rinse in a washer like this and unless you have very soft water as you rinse all traces of detergent out of a load you are rinsing minerals back into your clean laundry. This not only makes your laundry less soft but it also makes the clothing re-soil more easily and wear out faster.
Using a full 2nd rinse also greatly increases the wear and tear on the washer as every 2 loads you run with a 2nd rinse is like running 3 loads in terms of wear on the machine.
Customers always ask how long a washer will last and we tell them it is largely determined by the number of loads the machine is called upon to wash and to a lesser degree age, as time always takes a toll.
Out in the field we see a big difference in how long a washer lasts in homes where they almost always use the 2nd rinse feature on top load washers. On modern FL washers it seems to make little difference if you use the extra rinse feature.
John L.
Thanks for the ATC info, guys. It's great to know how it actually works.
Speaking of Energy Star, I had the angel and devil fighting on my shoulder when my timer broke. On one hand I thought -- *finally*, an excuse to buy a new, modern, energy efficient machine with all the bells and whistles to replace this old water-guzzling almond and fake woodgrain thing, just in time for Black Friday. Sears even had an LG-made Kenmore front-loader on at a killer price.
On the other hand it's so well built, simple, durable, cheap and easy to DIY-fix. Over 25 years old, and it still just works. No mold issues, no monthly cleaning tablets required, no expensive electronics to fail 5 years down the road. The only thing that bugs me is the bleach spotting issue I mentioned above, but I've learned to work around it. So I popped in the replacement timer and it's back in service again, for probably at least another few years.
Speaking of Energy Star, I had the angel and devil fighting on my shoulder when my timer broke. On one hand I thought -- *finally*, an excuse to buy a new, modern, energy efficient machine with all the bells and whistles to replace this old water-guzzling almond and fake woodgrain thing, just in time for Black Friday. Sears even had an LG-made Kenmore front-loader on at a killer price.
On the other hand it's so well built, simple, durable, cheap and easy to DIY-fix. Over 25 years old, and it still just works. No mold issues, no monthly cleaning tablets required, no expensive electronics to fail 5 years down the road. The only thing that bugs me is the bleach spotting issue I mentioned above, but I've learned to work around it. So I popped in the replacement timer and it's back in service again, for probably at least another few years.
A few thoughts:
1) I am not a Whirlpool fan (bet that was a surprise to some here, no?) but this is a very nice machine. I wouldn't mind having it.
2) My personal experience with THAT agitator and THAT tub and THAT DD transmission has PROVED that YES, machines in THIS configuration ARE SHREDMORES.
So - replace the agitator with one which doesn't shred and 8/10s of the objections anyone might possible have to this machine go away.
The remaining two - that fabric softener dispenser is hard to release and the ATC is pointless - are easily avoided.
Again, I'd be happy to have this machine and I am not a Whirlpool fan. At.All. There's a difference between recognizing a good machine and disliking a company and this machine makes the argument for what good appliances Whirlpool once built. Their stuff is trash today, but once upon a time....
1) I am not a Whirlpool fan (bet that was a surprise to some here, no?) but this is a very nice machine. I wouldn't mind having it.
2) My personal experience with THAT agitator and THAT tub and THAT DD transmission has PROVED that YES, machines in THIS configuration ARE SHREDMORES.
So - replace the agitator with one which doesn't shred and 8/10s of the objections anyone might possible have to this machine go away.
The remaining two - that fabric softener dispenser is hard to release and the ATC is pointless - are easily avoided.
Again, I'd be happy to have this machine and I am not a Whirlpool fan. At.All. There's a difference between recognizing a good machine and disliking a company and this machine makes the argument for what good appliances Whirlpool once built. Their stuff is trash today, but once upon a time....
I suggest you ask the Whirlpool experts
Here. Their knowledge far outstrips mine. I'll take a picture of one we have in one of our Whirlpool BDs which is quite gentle on the clothes but still cleans up a storm in them morning.
Love the machine!
Here. Their knowledge far outstrips mine. I'll take a picture of one we have in one of our Whirlpool BDs which is quite gentle on the clothes but still cleans up a storm in them morning.
Love the machine!
lordkenmore
Well-known member
I think repairing this washer was a reasonable option vs. replacing. Admittedly, a modern washer will use less water/energy...but a cheap modern washer won't realistically go 25 years with only minor repairs. If that cheap washer dies in 5 years or less, the environmental and the personal utility savings might be totally cancelled out.
lordkenmore
Well-known member
> I am not a Whirlpool fan (bet that was a surprise to some here, no?)
That was a HUGE shock, particularly after reading those loving comments about modern KA mixers! LOL
That was a HUGE shock, particularly after reading those loving comments about modern KA mixers! LOL
lordkenmore
Well-known member
>Again, I'd be happy to have this machine and I am not a Whirlpool fan. At.All. There's a difference between recognizing a good machine and disliking a company and this machine makes the argument for what good appliances Whirlpool once built.
Agreed. Although I have mixed feelings about owning these direct drive WP washers. Part of it is personal--a 1980s Kenmore reminds me of an era of my life I want to forget, and the chugga chugga sound of any WP DD machine has a bad habit of pulling me back to that time... Practically, I don't like the Shredmore aspect, although I've not had the problems some report. BUT the direct drive machines were wonderfully durable, and repairable. I haven't done repairs, but I've read of many basic repairs, and they seem like something ANYONE can do. Even Lord Kenmore. I don't own my own washer--I live in a rental--but the practicality of WP DD would make it compelling if I were buying my own washer, and looking for something that would be a reasonably fuss free daily driver.
And being fair, one can also argue that GE and Frigidaire don't make appliances as good was once the case.
Agreed. Although I have mixed feelings about owning these direct drive WP washers. Part of it is personal--a 1980s Kenmore reminds me of an era of my life I want to forget, and the chugga chugga sound of any WP DD machine has a bad habit of pulling me back to that time... Practically, I don't like the Shredmore aspect, although I've not had the problems some report. BUT the direct drive machines were wonderfully durable, and repairable. I haven't done repairs, but I've read of many basic repairs, and they seem like something ANYONE can do. Even Lord Kenmore. I don't own my own washer--I live in a rental--but the practicality of WP DD would make it compelling if I were buying my own washer, and looking for something that would be a reasonably fuss free daily driver.
And being fair, one can also argue that GE and Frigidaire don't make appliances as good was once the case.
John,
You have a sense of humour. Some, here, don't. I've been on the 'naughty' list (it's more like the: Destroy with Maximum Prejudice list) of some of the Imperial Queens since Yahoo days for disliking modern day Whirlpool.
Vintage Whirlpool appliances were quite good and I'd genuinely love to have this machine in our collection.
As to KitchenAid, the washer they briefly sold was another one I'd love to have.
You have a sense of humour. Some, here, don't. I've been on the 'naughty' list (it's more like the: Destroy with Maximum Prejudice list) of some of the Imperial Queens since Yahoo days for disliking modern day Whirlpool.
Vintage Whirlpool appliances were quite good and I'd genuinely love to have this machine in our collection.
As to KitchenAid, the washer they briefly sold was another one I'd love to have.
lordkenmore
Well-known member
Panthera
I don't know the full history of your experiences with the "Imperial Queens", but I do remember some ugly situations that could erupt on Super subforum back before there were the two full membership subforums.
What is unfortunate is that this sort of thing can drive people away, and those people can have valuable things to say. Indeed, I was really glad when you started posting again, because I honestly missed your posts. (My only regret is the lack of $$$$ for upgraded membership, because I bet you've had some things to say about the recent election on Dirty Laundry!)
I don't know the full history of your experiences with the "Imperial Queens", but I do remember some ugly situations that could erupt on Super subforum back before there were the two full membership subforums.
What is unfortunate is that this sort of thing can drive people away, and those people can have valuable things to say. Indeed, I was really glad when you started posting again, because I honestly missed your posts. (My only regret is the lack of $$$$ for upgraded membership, because I bet you've had some things to say about the recent election on Dirty Laundry!)
lordkenmore
Well-known member
Despite the issues I mentioned above as far as this KM DD (both practical and emotional), I have to admit that that would be a high contender if I were buying a DD machine. Although it seems to me that there were models that could set motor speed independently of the timer. That feature would be nice to get a slow/gentle agitation (gentle on clothes) and fast spin.
I think the KA could also be interesting, and it seems to me I've heard the agitation speed was lower, which would presumably translate to easier treatment of clothes.
I am currently using a BOL WP DD washer/dryer from ca. 2007, and I can say that the quality is NOT what it was once. Although it may last a reasonable life span for all I know, and I'm at least grateful it can use a full tub of water when rinsing. (Unlike those last DD machines that apparentlyat least sometimes were fixed at a partial tub fill for rinse. What a great idea--take a washer that is already hard on clothes, and do something to make it worse! A cynic might wonder if WP wasn't getting a kickback from clothing makers...)
I think the KA could also be interesting, and it seems to me I've heard the agitation speed was lower, which would presumably translate to easier treatment of clothes.
I am currently using a BOL WP DD washer/dryer from ca. 2007, and I can say that the quality is NOT what it was once. Although it may last a reasonable life span for all I know, and I'm at least grateful it can use a full tub of water when rinsing. (Unlike those last DD machines that apparentlyat least sometimes were fixed at a partial tub fill for rinse. What a great idea--take a washer that is already hard on clothes, and do something to make it worse! A cynic might wonder if WP wasn't getting a kickback from clothing makers...)
