kenmore direct drive lint

[mhorn]

need some advise mom is 80 years old and a washaholic ,washer seems to run every other day sometimes twice,, we use a kenmore top loader direct drive 2006 made by whirlpool 110.16922504, i am a john deere service manager and i am handy on all types of repairs,, so far i have changed motor couplings, agitator pawls and now the inner spin basket,,, problem in the last 4 months the washer has finished all loads with lint, hair and fuzz all over, tried differnet soap, no softner , everything no better, so i took it all apart to clean, found alot of rust inside tube on spin basket changed it but did not expect it to help and it did not,, pump works great,,, but lint lint lint,, now mom hangs all clothes on line against her rules to waste money on dryer and everyone tells me thats why lint is their but thats how she did wash for the last 25 years,, now one last thing i lifted the lid up just so switch is still ok and watched it run and what i see is that the unit fills, agitates then stops ok has small delay then shifts to drain but the tub spins right away in drain mode, i guess that means no neutral drain working, this is the only item i can find wrong with washer but many pros tell me thats an issue but not going to help with the lint,,,,,any thoughts i hate to tear unit down and get no where fast,,, cant afford a new unit yet,, thank you

 

[yogitunes]

well this is a loaded question, and no rhyme or reason as to why one person/machine will get one set of results, and another will not...

lets stick with the basics, and your choice to execute them....

any machine with a lint filter, no matter if its a self clean, manual clean, or just plain removed....doesn't affect anything....mine are just there for looks, and removed when using the machine...

people have been line and/or machine drying for years....

linting usually comes from:

overloading
not enough detergent
excessive wash time
excessive wash speed
not separating lint givers from lint receivers

and usually falls to, the more you agitate, the more lint you are creating...

washing something like towels, yeah, your going to get lint......the next load could be darks, and you may have a residue of lint from the past load transferring to another....

and there may be a far chance, since you switched out the tub, but that the agitator may have a jagged/rough edge or two, causing items to snag, creating linting...

I goofed a few times in forgetting, in a TLer, you have separate all loads, in a FLer, I can mix loads, no issues.....

my mother will leave Kleenex in her pockets.....in a TLer, it is shredded all over the load......in a FLer, it comes back out as one full piece....

your mileage may vary....

 

[philcobendixduo]

Kenmore DD Lint

I have the exact same issue with lint but ONLY when the "neutral drain" fails and the washer "spin drains".
This usually happens during the "gentle" cycle and/or with loads that are very light in weight.
I don't know if the collected lint is somehow discharged into the tub during "spin drain" or if the action of the water swirling around as it "spin drains" causes lint to be dislodged from the outer tub.
Whatever the case, I then find the finished load has a lot of lint etc. and I then have to either dry it in the dryer or, after line drying, use a lint roller on the items after they are dry.

 

[mrb627]

Lint Ring

That would make sense if the lint was captured by the ring underneath the tub. Spinning and Draining would dislodge the lint, sending it back into the water. Re-depositing throughout the wash load.

Malcolm

 

[askolover]

I was just thinking the same thing Malcolm.

 

[DADoES]

 
Oh my, that can't be!  Spin-drain is always better!  ;-)

 

[combo52]

Linty clothing from a direct drive whirlpool built washer

The problem is the lack of a neutral drain, as we all know or should by now a neutral drain is superior for getting dirt in lint out of clothing rather than spinning it back into the clothing.

We get several service calls like this every year and we have to replace the transmission to get it to neutral drain again because of the complaints of excessive linting.

As all of us appliance collectors know Whirlpool orignly built this washer with a spin and drain system and was forced to redesign it with the neutral drain because of complaints of linting.

All spin drain washers with preforted baskets have had trouble with excessive lifting including GE filter flow Maytag dependable cares and Frigidaire 1-18s.

Usually people that line dry clothing notice this more often.

John L

 

[mhorn]

neutral drain

i really feel that the lack of the neutral drain is my issue,, since everything checks out from pump flow to timer to watching unit work and timing with a watch how each cycle changes, and since the lint was not an issue years back, it must be the lack of a neutral drain giving my lint issue, but so many sites that i have checked with alot say no way ,,,i am very handy on repairs of any type do i try to put a new neutral drain repair parts in old trans,, or do i put in a new trans on a 2006 washer,,, thank you for the help with this issue,,,

 

[combo52]

Linty clothing from a direct drive whirlpool built washer

The problem is the lack of a neutral drain, as we all know or should by now a neutral drain is superior for getting dirt in lint out of clothing rather than spinning it back into the clothing.

We get several service calls like this every year and we have to replace the transmission to get it to neutral drain again because of the complaints of excessive linting.

As all of us appliance collectors know Whirlpool orignly built this washer with a spin and drain system and was forced to redesign it with the neutral drain because of complaints of linting.

All spin drain washers with preforted baskets have had trouble with excessive lifting including GE filter flow Maytag dependable cares and Frigidaire 1-18s.

Usually people that line dry clothing notice this more often.

John L

 

[pumpkina]

Thanks, John L. What year and starting with what model did Whirlpool convert from spin and dry to neutral drain?

Also, is there an easy way to determine if a particular unit has neutral drain?

 

[combo52]

Whirlpool neutral drain washers

All Whirlpool top load washers ever built did a neutral drain before attempting to spin with the exception of the first direct drives from late 1981 through sometime in 1984 before they realized they could not get away with taking the shortcut but most other manufactures had managed to get away with.

Even Speed Queen today makes neutral dream washers for markets like Australia where many people use line drying.

The next generation of Speed Queen top load washers in the United states will also do a neutral drain.

John L.

 

[brucelucenta]

Combo52

I knew that if anyone knew the answer, you would. It does surprise me that it would result in a great deal of linting. I would not have guessed that, but it makes sense when you think about it. I think also that neutral drain lets the clothes settle down lower in the bottom before spinning and thus making it easier on the bearings too. I think the reason Maytag got away with that was the fact that they didn't create a lot of lint in washing.

 

[jerrod6]

My parents had a maytag top loader that always did a spin drain for the wash and rinses.  Why was lint not a problem in that machine?

 

[mhorn]

neutral drain

thanks for all the good advise, no substitute for experience, special thanks to john l. do you suggest i take trans apart and find issue try to fix with a kit,, or throw in complete trans,,, and also should i change the clutch lining,,, thanks

 

[foraloysius]

Why was lint not a problem in that machine?

Because there is no problem. We had lots of discussions about neutral and spin drains. So Robert compared both ways of draining. He didn't noticed any difference between the both of them. So all these discussions are much ado about nothing.

 

[yogitunes]

Louis beat me to it, but he is right, if there isn't a problem, don't go looking for it!...

you can also take the same machine, same load, but two different operators, and still end up with different results...

way too many variables to conclude what may or may not cause lint for one, and not for another...

 

[mrb627]

Problem - Me Thinks...

Has to do with the existence and location of a lint filter.

Maytag's filter is either in the barrel of the agitator, or a flat screen embedded in the wash tub. Lint on the screen under the tub would be less likely to cling during the pause and start of spin. Also, the spin torque with a full tub of water may play into it. Maytag's belt slippage keeps the tub slow when full where a WP DD clutch is a little more grab and go.

In the WP design, the filter fingers would hold onto the lint during neutral drain. Casting it away during spin for flushing down the drain. Spinning those fingers in a full tub of water would certainly cast that lint back into the load.

Malcolm

 

[johnb300m]

While I've not done any experiments personally, I'm inclined to agree with Malcolm's theory.

 

[brucelucenta]

mrb627

I think you are right on the money!