Keymatic help

[slimstar]

Hello folks,
For a long time I have been voyeur of this site and all of you're amazing collections!
Never really having a proper classic machine of my own.
But that changed about a week ago and this is where I could really use your collective wisdom and guidance.
I am now the proud keeper of a hoover keymatic 3224.
I have been after one of these beauties since I was about 6. I first spotted one in a 2nd hand store and begged my mum to buy it, but it had already been sold to the science museum!
So long story short I've been searching for nearly 30 years and now I've found one.
The thing is she's a bit worse for wear! Her key plate is missing and so is her impellor.
I've tried to source an old hoovermatic impellor but it's too big.
Her door boot is in good nick though so that's one good thing.
My intention is to properly restore and get her washing again. Any advice, tips diagrams etc is desperately needed and much appreciated .
Many thanks
Alex

 

[triumphdolomite]

3224

Congratulations on your new purchase, you'll no doubt have hours of fun getting her up and running again. Having only recently got my 3224 I'm on the look out for a door boot, as I suspect several people are. There have been some keyplates on ebay, but I think that there are different ones depending on model and machine age. Someone else may be able to clarify this for you. Finding a pulsator may be a little harder...but odd things do appear out of the blue. Have you managed to check out the condition of the electrics yet?
Keep us informed how you get on
Ian

 

[gizmo]

well I have an impeller.....

I'm on the wrong side of the planet for you but I have a brand new Keymatic impeller.

 

It doesn't look new as it has sat under our old house for some years, but it has never been fitted to a machine. I grabbed it when I found a spare parts shop with a couple of Keymatic bits left, about 15 years ago. It might have some slight surface rust to clean up on the shaft, I haven't looked at it for a while.

 

I also MIGHT have a spare keyplate. I'll have a look in the next while. A relative now lives in our old house and I can get access there, but maybe not immediately.  I'll chase it up.

 

If the pulsator is missing, are the other components there? At the pulley end of the pulsator shaft there is a "pulley" (drive block? not sure what it's called), a clutch spring, plastic cap and linkage to the solenoid that de-activates the pulsator. (from memory, when the solenoid pulls in it RELEASES the pulsator, ie: stops drive to the pulsator.) If any of these are missing, the pulsator drive won't work.

 

Personally I don't think that matters - I have used a Keymatic as my main machine some years ago, and the pulsator is a waste of time. It does almost nothing and the pulsator clutch is quite unreliable, so at least here in Australia the pulsator drive was often disconnected by servicemen.  This then led to the odd situation that the cottons wash had a lesser wash than the delicate cycle, so the serviceman would advice doing all washes on delicate. (On cottons, the wash was 4 minutes with pulsator, on delicates it was 8 minutes with no pulsator.) To get your machine back in action you could refit just the pulsator and fit the retaining pulley/drive block at the other end. Don't worry about fitting the clutch etc if you don't have them. All you need the pulsator for is to block water from running down the hollow drum shaft.

 

Anyhow, if I can find the bits and you cover the cost of postage, they are yours.

 

[slimstar]

OMG!!

Ian and gizmo thanks for getting back to me.
I haven't as yet had a chance to get the back off. It's been a mental week at work and there just hasn't been time. So I have no idea what lies beneath. I've had a look inside the drum and it looks like the impellor disk has broken off. ( I've tried to take a photo but it's not very clear) there seems to be bits of Bakelite stuck around a shaft so I'm assuming everything else is intact????

Gizmo, you have made a newbie a very happy boy! I'll happily cover postage and gladly give you something for your trouble too.
I'm not quite sure how send messages via the forum but feel free to email me at [email protected]

I am so excited about the chance of getting this little beauty up and washing again!
This is going to be a real labour of love, done slowly and methodically.

Thanks again to both of you. Hopefully there'll be some restoration pics to follow soon

Alex

 

[matchboxpaul]

Hi Alex.
Conrats on joining the Slant-front Keymatic Club.

I have yet to join this esteemed group myself, though am a member of the FKC See picture below.

Had a few encounters with the 3224 and 3226 when I was a youngster and certainly a design classic. The more that are saved the better.
Cannot remember if there are any older threads with circuit diagrams on the forum or not. Have a search through the archives (I will do too) and if nothing can be found, I will photograph and post the servicing literature for you.
Good that the door seal seems sound - be gentle with it, as these are much much rarer than any hens teeth you may have found on any hens.

will go searching and report back with any old threads that might be interesting.
welcome to the forum!

Paul

 

[matchboxpaul]

The 3224 Keymatic - 1961 to 1964 ....

 

[matchboxpaul]

Might be some interesting bits and bobs here, though the thread was set up to reference the Model 3226 Keymatic:

Hoover Keymatic 3226 question

I sold my Hoover Keymatic to a German collector, who is restoring it right now. He has a problem with the machine, the timer stops at every increment where it only pumps. The timer has to be advanced manually then. It goes through all other increments automatically. Is this a common problem...

www.automaticwasher.org

 

[slimstar]

FKC lol ; )

Hey Paul,
Hope all is well?
Thanks for the advice about the boot. I'll be careful with it. And thanks for the link too.
Your flat keymatic looks way ahead of its time, I just love the way it's styled. I remember as a kid having an old hardback book of how things work and it had an illustration of that machine and a servis twin tub too.
Why did hoover step away from the tilted drum? And why did they not continue with the key plate design? To me it seems a shame and a bit of a backward step ???
Also when new, did the keymatics come with a full selection of plates or could you buy more and potentially upgrade your machine?
I've got so many questions and I'm soooo excited about having one that I'm worried I'm going to come across like a teenage girl at a justin bieber concert. So I'm going to pace myself and awate further replies.
Many thanks

 

[triumphdolomite]

Door Seals

I'll second what Paul says about door seals, mine still has its original turquoise one,in places it's the texture of a biscuit and has a large hole in the bottom :-( I did wonder about the feasibility of getting one made but I fear that the cost may be prohibitive. Do we know if anyone has tried this in the past?

Ian

 

[slimstar]

Door seals and replacement parts

Hey Ian,
I've been thinking about what you said about getting a boot made but it being too expensive just for one. I've been looking into plastic injection moulding companies to see about getting a keyplate copied and that too seems expensive. But what if all the folks who need parts ( sump hoses, key plates door boots) got quotes and clubbed together to get what we need made? It still might be a bit pricey but we'd all get parts which would save us all the headache of an eBay war for a few hens teeth.
Just a thought ?

 

[gizmo]

Keyplate upgrades

I'm pretty sure an old ad for Keymatics I have here somewhere mentions the possibility of upgrades  by releasing new keyplates as a feature of the system. However I know of only one such upgrade that ever happened - here in Australia, Hoover released a cold wash keyplate. I had one cold wash keyplate, but I don't remember if it had just one cold wash option, or whether the whole keyplate was various cold washes. I think it was just one cold wash option.

 

The earliest machines (3224?) had the green outer casing and a timeline progress indicator, and came with a solid black  bakelite keyplate for cold only fills and a solid red bakelite keyplate for hot or warm water fills.

 

The second series (3226?) had the white outer casing, blue metallic dashboard with circular progress indicator. They had plastic keyplates with black outer edges and a white centre square, hot / warm fill keyplate had red text on the white centre, cold fill keyplate had black text on the white centre.

 

the cold wash keyplate I had was black plastic plate with a pressed aluminium centre, the markings were painted on - from memory, black text on a green background.

 

I had several spare keyplates including one cold wash plate. I don't think I have disposed of them, but I can't find them.

 

I will go up to our old house in the next few days and have a thorough search under the house. I know there are some Keymatic parts there, but don't recall seeing keyplates recently. I know I HAVE seen the spare pulsator there.

 

[gizmo]

sump hoses

Someone here has cobbled together one of those weird sump hoses out of other bits.

 

Today when scouring in my garage for Keymatic bits I found a spare hose for a UK Hotpoint front loader, the one with the "catch pot" at the bottom. I reckon that might form the basis of an improvised Keymatic sump hose. Only the bit that connects to the drum needs to be flexible, the rest could be made up from PVC pipe. I'm lucky, I still have a good sump hose, but it won't last forever.

 

[gizmo]

found the pulsator

Here are a couple of pics of the Keymatic pulsator, next to a Hoovermatic pulsator for comparison.

 

Note the Keymatic pulsator, on the right, has a longer, thinner shaft and smaller diameter.

 

Unfortunately, I can't find any keyplates. I have looked thoroughly and I just don't seem to have them any longer. I have one keyplate in the machine I have kept, but the spare plates I thought I had have evaporated.

 

Also the pulsator I found is NOT brand new. I must have swapped the new one on to a machine. It is however in excellent condition. No sign of wear at the bearing locations on the shaft. It had a few specks of surface rust on the shaft but I have cleaned them up now.

 

[slimstar]

Gizmo

Hey, thanks again for getting back to me and offering up so much so generously.
I've dropped you an email because I didn't want to take up too much space with my many questions but just wanted to say thanks again for taking an interest in this thread

Alex

 

[slimstar]

Just had a quick look inside

Hello again folks,
So I've had a sneaky peek under her skirts and this is what I've found...

 

[slimstar]

Where do I begin???

It looks like the pump has been replaced at some point. The wiring looks ok but to be honest I haven't a clue where begin. Much of the internal rubber hoses seems to be in good condition. However the belts look pretty worn and is there something missing from the back of the drive pulley?

 

[gizmo]

Yes, there is a lot missing there. the pulsator shaft should protrude through that hole in the centre of the shaft.
The entire pulsator clutch assembly is missing. So is the pulsator solenoid. So unless you can scrounge up the missing parts, you won't get the pulsator working.

I haven't yet posted the pulsator to you. I've been too busy with other stuff. I hope to in the next few days.

I have spare belts and I think I have one only part of the pulsator clutch assembly - on the pulley in your photo you can see two pins sticking out. They drive the first stage of the clutch. The part I have is a flat plate with two holes drilled to mate over those two pins, and a hub in the centre which is the driving part of the clutch. There is a lot more of the clutch that you need and I don't have those parts.

Personally I would just fit the pulsator I am sending you, to block the centre shaft. Don't bother trying to get the pulsator working, they don't do anything useful in the Keymatic, and it could take years to find the parts.

I will enclose the belts when I send the pulsator. And the clutch part if I can find it. I will look for other clutch parts but don't hold your breath.

You will need to dodgy up some way to retain the pulsator in position.

Yes, your pump is a modern substitute.

Another thing - from the photo your drum assembly is hanging crooked (could just be the angle of the photo.) The drum is suspended on a fine steel cable and a couple of large coil springs. The cable can rust through and break. If it has broken, a bike shop could help you make up a new one with derailleur cable.

It isn't really possible to test the machine without a keyplate. I DON'T have one spare, does anyone else have a spare keyplate?

Chris.

 

[brib68]

Tilted tubs

As to the comment questioning why Hoover switched away from the tilted drum...I certainly can't say, but US manufacturers did the same. Slant-fronted Westinghouse machines (for instance) over here were on the market for many years, but eventually gave way to the flat-front design that became pretty much universally accepted. It probably had to do with taking up less floor space in the home and/or making them fit the same footprint as a top-loader so that buyers could have their choice without having to worry about measurements. With the advent of the stackables and under-counter models, the slant-front and tilted tub would stick out into the room a bit.

All that being said, I DO get a smile that tilted drums have returned in modern front loaders (like my LG Tromm) and are a selling point, even though the tilt is no where near the angle of the old slant fronts.

 

[hotpoint95622]

Hoover Keymatic

Hi Alex

Now that’s what I call a classic machine, bit of a challenge the condition she is in but that’s how I love to find them.

Take your time and savour the work ahead of you, it’s surprising how much can be done over a few months of odd jobbing.

Solutions to problems suddenly come and it's done and onto the next, good luck and keep us updated with your progress.

Lee
PS Include as many photos as you can, it’s great for those of us who don’t get to see a classic like this.