Need help choosing a washer dryer

[warmsecondrinse]

In the EU one has a lot of choices and many factors to consider. Don't get me wrong; this is a good thing.

However, those of us in the US are stuck with what can be done with 120 volts :-(
This means that too high a temperature is never a worry. We just have to contend with longer water heating times (if needed) and much longer drying times. We also have a smaller number of models available.

If one lives in an older building, bringing in 240v is not an option. Neither is venting nor running a gas line. I'm only aware of one ventless 120v condensing dryer, a smallish Equator, so even if one has space for 2 machines a dedicated washer is not really an option. One is sort of stuck with a washer/dryer combo, the Equator if room permits, and a heated drying rack.

I'm a bit jealous of the options you all have ;-)

Jim

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

Hmm, lots to think about. Thank you everyone so far sharing your opinion and experience.

Without sounding stereotypical, (but is largely true) Korean firms and products tend to be style over substance. That's what worries me about the lG. The build quality seems very nice, but how long will that chrome stay on the knob, how long will the rubber seals last, the door on the LG was very light as well. Hmm, I really don't know.

I find myself again going towards the Bosch, which I initially intended on getting. It is relatively pricey at £1,400, but I have seen them on several other sites such as appliance city for £800. In fact I phone up ao.com and asked about price matching theirs and they said "because they don't offer next day delivery service, we cant math them". Whatever the hell that has to do with things, I don't know, but I would wait one week as opposed to one day if It meant I was saving over £600 !!

She said things like "oh it could be graded" but as it turns out the retailers which have the bosch much cheaper than ao.com get their direct from bosch, which is why you have to wait a few days. What do you guys think of this? I bought my bosch dishwasher from an obscure website I had never heard of, which was a couple of hundred pounds cheaper than currys at the time and had no problems with service or anything.

I have a feeling the Bosch will age better in terms of appearance. I prefer the more Teutonic, simple design.

Does anyone know where the Bosch washing machines /washer dryers are made? I have a feeling it is turkey, but I found on another forum that in Australia, they Bosch washer dryers are made in China, with stickers on the front of the machines saying "German engineered".

 

[aquacycle]

Being honest, if you're willing to spend that amount of money, you'd be best off getting a Miele and knowing you're getting a reliable, high performing all rounder. I certainly wouldn't be without mine.

http://www.miele.co.uk/washer-dryers/WT2796-Washer-Dryer-601/#tab-description

 

[BoschExxcel]

Not sure about washers dryers, but IIRC really cheap washers are built in China, but we don't really get them here, mid range are built in Poland, and top of the range Logixx etc are built in Germany. Either way a machine built in Poland wouldn't phase me.

 

[dascot]

As far as I know, the air cooled washer-dryers are built in China, though that could've been initial run only and they've changed it. Either way, where it is built shouldn't make a difference as it should still be to the Bosch standards. All companies are building things in different places to save money (yes, Miele included) but the quality is to do with sourcing components and what standards they have set rather than the country of build.

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

I trust Bosch enough to produce a quality built, durable appliance, wherever they are made. It's just if you are paying a grand and a half on one of their appliances, it would be nice to have it made in the country of origin. I know my fridge freezer which is bosch has been solid throughout its 12 year life - it is made in Germany. The new Bosch fridge freezers are built in Turkey and there seems to be no variation in quality.

If people are saying the Bosch will perform better than the LG, I will obviously go for the Bosch. Yes, the 10 year guarantee for the motor is attractive, but considering there are many other parts and components in washer dryers that can and do go wrong, I don't suppose it looks as good. Both the LG and Bosch have two year warranty's, which mean absolutely nothing as thanks to the sale of goods act '79, all appliances including washing machines and TV's should last a minimum of 6 years, and more companies and especially retailers are actually begrudging it less. They cant say or do anything to not merit this - it's the law.

 

[dascot]

It's not strictly true that they say they should last a minimum of 6 years, however I suspect that you could easily argue that for an appliance costing the amount that the Bosch does.

Have you looked at the Siemens equivalent of the Bosch? It may have an offer on with extended warranty for free, as Siemens seem to do that more often than Bosch do.

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

It's settled.

I have ordered the Bosch washer/dryer. Spoken to a few people about which one would be best and nearly all of them said Bosch.

I have a few Bosch home appliances including a kettle and toaster, as well as a fridge freezer, the FF being 12 years old. All I can say is based on my experience, their products are high quality and they do the job properly.

I shall post a thread once I have received it in 10 days. The wait is due to re-stocking.

 

[passatdoc]

Good luck. The Euro-sized Bosch washers here receive good reviews, though stateside their applications seem to be rather limited: one sees in-kitchen, under-counter installations as in Europe, but it's uncommon because most post-WW2 housing was built with laundry machine areas/room. There are also people who convert a closet next to a kitchen to stacked laundry closet use, though people with money to do this usually go with Miele.

New construction normally builds laundry areas on a 27" footprint (rather than 24" as for Euro-sized machines), otherwise the owners would be locked into Miele or Bosch but not much else. Some apartments and condominiums have closet laundry areas. As the depth of US sized machines continues to swell (only 27" wide but 31+" deep), they will be less useful for those with laundry closets because of clearance plus the need to keep the washer door ajar when not in use, which may raise the demand for Bosch as a reasonably priced alternative to Miele. The main issue if I were to buy a Bosch washer would be availability of parts and service. For dishwashers, Bosch supply/service chain is excellent, but I don't know if that includes the washers. Bosch dishwashers are a mainstream, almost domestic brand here, whereas the washing machines are considered an exotic foreign import.

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

Very interesting. Thank you passatdoc.

Well, there is only two of us in this household, so I hope the Bosch washer/dryer is able to cope with our laundry loads. My next purchase will be a Bosch fridge freezer, as the one we have is approaching 12 years old, and although it has never let us down, a couple of bits of trim are starting to fall off, such as the handle which has a rather silly cheap design, and a couple of the draws in the fridge and freezer are cracked. Looking at getting a frost-free FF this time round.

With these two new appliances, I shall nearly have a complete Bosch kitchen ahah! A slim line dishwasher or something along those lines and a bosch microwave will finish it all off, as I don't have a dish washer and the microwave we have is very poor, only 700 watts, but we hardly use it. I have only had this house for just over a year now, and all the kitchen appliances my parents gave me as their hand me downs, purely as stop gaps. They now have bosch appliances as well, only they have a separate washer and dryer and they love them.

May I ask the background to your user name, passatdoc? Anything to do with the car??

 

[passatdoc]

I am a physician and I drive a VW Passat. Actually, I've owned two Passats in a row. The first one 1998-2014, with a 1.8T gas/petrol engine; the only two engine options in USA in 1998 on a Passat were the 1.8T or a 2.8 V6 (latter rather mediocre). The current model with effect from May 2014 is a 2.0 TDI diesel, the current engine options being 2.0T gas/petrol (base engine; derived from the trusted 1.8T), the 2.0 TDI diesel, or a 3.6 V8 gas/petrol motor.

I was at one time Vice President of a car club for Passat and Audi A4 owners. My web handle sounds as if I might be a mechanic specialising in VWs, but such is not the case.

I have relatives in London who drive a new Jetta estate 1.6 TDI diesel (this engine not available in North America). Right hand drive, of course.

Bosch dishwashers are wonderful no matter the country. I have friends in Stockholm, Sweden on their fourth Bosch. I'm only on my first, but it was purchased October 2001 and has NEVER had a service call.

 

[BoschExxcel]

Jetta estate? We don't have those here, I think you meant a Golf estate.

 

[BoschExxcel]

Our old Bosch Dishwasher, which is still going strong, is 13 years old. Never had a problem! The rest of the appliances are Bosch, exept the dryer which is Whirlpool and they are all 9 years old and have done great service.

New house has everything Bosch except the washer which is a Whirlpool. The Boschs are 2 years old, and again fault free.

My dads houses both have Bosch appliances, which one of them just having a new Bosch Classixx washer and dryer. I think you may of realised my family likes Bosch!

 

[passatdoc]

re: Passats and stuff

Ooops my bad, must have been a Golf estate. "Golf" here applies only to the smaller hatchback models, though I believe Golf and Jetta share the same platform. The term Jetta here applies to both sedan/saloon and wagon/estate models. They sent me the link to their model and it was clearly what we know as the Jetta wagon/estate (sold here as the Jetta Sportwagen.....Sport-estate just doesn't have the same ring!....and the "wagen" spelling is deliberately German).

The US Sportwagens are running one year behind Europe, in that their 2014 design is not yet available in the USA. We've been told that the 2014 European model will eventually arrive here as the 2015 model, but thus far the VW dealers here have the older 2014 US design.

FYI VW built a factory in Tennessee to build Passats, and from 2012 the US Passat is a different design than what is sold in Europe. Two different animals now. Beyond North America, I"ve heard there are limited exports to Korea or elsewhere in Europe, but that the Tennessee-built Passat is chiefly intended for the North American market.

www.vw.com As has been the case for years, the US is always offered fewer options than in Europe. Typically only one to three engine options exist for a given model, vs. more choices in Europe. In addition, options are typically bundled into a single trim level rather than being offered as stand-alone options.

In my case, the diesel Passat is offered in either SE (mid-range) or SEL (high end) trim levels. There is a more economical S (basic) trim level, but the diesel engine is considered a "premium engine" and diesels are offered only in SE and SEL versions.

I have a mild orthopaedic impairment and needed the power memory seats to aid in getting in/out of the car (can't bend right knee fully so need seat all the way back to enter/exit). The memory feature was not available as a stand-alone option and is available only with the SEL trim level. Don't get me wrong, the Navigation and 400W Fender stereo and leather seats are nice, but I'd rather have saved $2500 and get the SE trim (fake leather ok for me) and just buy the memory seat option by itself, but not possible. Also, SEL is not available in manual transmission, so after 40+ years of driving only manuals, I was forced into automatic mode.

 

[BoschExxcel]

Golf here is the usual hatchback, same size as the Focus, and well, the Golf lol. Exept here we can get estates of both cars which you can't in the US. Apparently the car market there is very different to here!

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

I thought so. Very interesting man. My late father predominantly drove Volkswagen group cars, 18 Audis and 11 Volkswagens during his 50 years in the auto industry and he found them to be the finest built cars on the road, and they still are to this day. I drive an Audi A3 2.0 TDI. Bought it at 4,000 miles. It has now done 110,000 and I have had nothing go wrong with it at all. Of course some will say VW's are POS and are un-reliable, I find this not to be the case, but on the contrary. Over in the UK and possibly Europe, Japanese cars (which have a reputation for reliability a most of us know) are actually quite expensive for what they are and not cheap at all when things do go wrong, which they can and do. TDI diesels are fantastic. One of the best was the old 1.9 PD. They were bomb proof, although my cousin has a Golf 2.0 common rail 06 plate which has now just turned over to 190,000 and doesn't even use a drop of oil. Incredible cars really.

My bather had a B5 Passat, 1.8 20v non-turbo model. had that for 8 years and clocked up over 150,000 and was running as sweet as nut even when he got rid of it.

Partially the reason why I am buying Bosch. There are exceptions, but on the whole, German quality is unbeatable, although home built domestic appliances made in Britain and the US are also very good, but much harder to get hold of.

 

[iej]

I think the most important thing with a washer-dryer is the drum size : get the biggest you can if you intend to use it to dry regularly.

I've used low-end washer-dryers in rental places when I was a student and they're invariably utterly useless and I ended up just doing my laundry in a laundrette or drying on airers (which technically wasn't allowed in the building).

In one place, I actually gave up and bought an Electrolux condenser dryer and just kept it in the corner of a room. It made a huge difference as I could actually get towels dry in reasonable time and my clothes weren't being destroyed by high temperatures and coming out smelling like detergent and rubber!

If you have the space for a washer-dryer stack, consider that option instead.

 

[BoschExxcel]

We had two Audis which were both rubbish. Both 2008, one was an A3 and one an A4 both 2.0TDI and they both spent most of their time in the garage! Got rid of them about a year later and now have a Range Rover and a Peugeot. Strangely enough they have been fault free!

I agree with Bosch though, they are excellent quality products and most are the price of a Miele, can't reeally go wrong!

 

[passatdoc]

The only person I know who ever regretted a Bosch purchase is a secondary school friend who gutted and renovated the kitchen when they moved into a 1970s-era house in 2004. The Bosch dishwasher they bought then still works great. However, she also selected a Bosch double wall oven (built in) which has been nothing but trouble. The oven cuts out, makes too much noise, doesn't heat as it's supposed to, etc. It was replaced once by Bosch and the replacement doesn't work properly either. She chose the oven based on design and features, probably assuming that a company that makes such wonderful dishwashers and laundry machines can't make a bad oven. One other thing: while Bosch dishwashers were recommended to her by a number of friends (myself included) who owned them, she didn't know anyone personally with Bosch oven experience, so in a sense she was going it alone in terms of advice (or lack thereof).

My 1998 Passat was amazing. Never broke down or stopped working. Went 178K miles with original power train including clutch. I replaced it when interior pieces began breaking/nonoperating and parts became hard to find. Maintenance costs climbed to 3-4K/year dollars, which in my mind was throwing good money after bad.

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

Back after a few months...

So it has been a few months since I posted this. I couldn't make my mind up, only I am investing quite a bit of money, I want to make the right decision as you can imagine.

I don't think I will go for the LG. Too concerned about their safety and reliability, after hearing about exploding machines and from a technician who came out to service our stove the other week, saying that LG are not as durable or as reliable as European brands. He said they have weak seals and fragile water pumps. That 10 year motor warranty is of course only for the motor and Bosch do the same for their brushless motor models. Apparently LG's are quite expensive and difficult to repair, so I will steer clear of them.

I would have gone for the Bosch but they have had stock issues all this time but they are back in stock.

Only reason I haven't gone for it yet is because I searched for AEG and noticed they do quite an attractive model (linked below).

It has a larger drum capacity (8KG), brushless motor of course but according to the comparison statistics, is more energy efficient than the Bosch by around £30 per year, but more important has A ratings for wash and spin performance, versus the Bosch's B performance for spinning. The AEG is rated at 1600 rpm.

Would the AEG be a better choice then ?

http://ao.com/product/l77685wd-aeg-lavamat-turbo-washer-dryer-white-27519-2.aspx