BoschExxcel
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Jetta estate? We don't have those here, I think you meant a Golf estate. 
Need help choosing a washer dryer
- Thread starter oliveoiltinfoil
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BoschExxcel
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Our old Bosch Dishwasher, which is still going strong, is 13 years old. Never had a problem! The rest of the appliances are Bosch, exept the dryer which is Whirlpool and they are all 9 years old and have done great service.
New house has everything Bosch except the washer which is a Whirlpool. The Boschs are 2 years old, and again fault free.
My dads houses both have Bosch appliances, which one of them just having a new Bosch Classixx washer and dryer. I think you may of realised my family likes Bosch!
New house has everything Bosch except the washer which is a Whirlpool. The Boschs are 2 years old, and again fault free.
My dads houses both have Bosch appliances, which one of them just having a new Bosch Classixx washer and dryer. I think you may of realised my family likes Bosch!
passatdoc
Well-known member
re: Passats and stuff
Ooops my bad, must have been a Golf estate. "Golf" here applies only to the smaller hatchback models, though I believe Golf and Jetta share the same platform. The term Jetta here applies to both sedan/saloon and wagon/estate models. They sent me the link to their model and it was clearly what we know as the Jetta wagon/estate (sold here as the Jetta Sportwagen.....Sport-estate just doesn't have the same ring!....and the "wagen" spelling is deliberately German).
The US Sportwagens are running one year behind Europe, in that their 2014 design is not yet available in the USA. We've been told that the 2014 European model will eventually arrive here as the 2015 model, but thus far the VW dealers here have the older 2014 US design.
FYI VW built a factory in Tennessee to build Passats, and from 2012 the US Passat is a different design than what is sold in Europe. Two different animals now. Beyond North America, I"ve heard there are limited exports to Korea or elsewhere in Europe, but that the Tennessee-built Passat is chiefly intended for the North American market.
www.vw.com As has been the case for years, the US is always offered fewer options than in Europe. Typically only one to three engine options exist for a given model, vs. more choices in Europe. In addition, options are typically bundled into a single trim level rather than being offered as stand-alone options.
In my case, the diesel Passat is offered in either SE (mid-range) or SEL (high end) trim levels. There is a more economical S (basic) trim level, but the diesel engine is considered a "premium engine" and diesels are offered only in SE and SEL versions.
I have a mild orthopaedic impairment and needed the power memory seats to aid in getting in/out of the car (can't bend right knee fully so need seat all the way back to enter/exit). The memory feature was not available as a stand-alone option and is available only with the SEL trim level. Don't get me wrong, the Navigation and 400W Fender stereo and leather seats are nice, but I'd rather have saved $2500 and get the SE trim (fake leather ok for me) and just buy the memory seat option by itself, but not possible. Also, SEL is not available in manual transmission, so after 40+ years of driving only manuals, I was forced into automatic mode.
Ooops my bad, must have been a Golf estate. "Golf" here applies only to the smaller hatchback models, though I believe Golf and Jetta share the same platform. The term Jetta here applies to both sedan/saloon and wagon/estate models. They sent me the link to their model and it was clearly what we know as the Jetta wagon/estate (sold here as the Jetta Sportwagen.....Sport-estate just doesn't have the same ring!....and the "wagen" spelling is deliberately German).
The US Sportwagens are running one year behind Europe, in that their 2014 design is not yet available in the USA. We've been told that the 2014 European model will eventually arrive here as the 2015 model, but thus far the VW dealers here have the older 2014 US design.
FYI VW built a factory in Tennessee to build Passats, and from 2012 the US Passat is a different design than what is sold in Europe. Two different animals now. Beyond North America, I"ve heard there are limited exports to Korea or elsewhere in Europe, but that the Tennessee-built Passat is chiefly intended for the North American market.
www.vw.com As has been the case for years, the US is always offered fewer options than in Europe. Typically only one to three engine options exist for a given model, vs. more choices in Europe. In addition, options are typically bundled into a single trim level rather than being offered as stand-alone options.
In my case, the diesel Passat is offered in either SE (mid-range) or SEL (high end) trim levels. There is a more economical S (basic) trim level, but the diesel engine is considered a "premium engine" and diesels are offered only in SE and SEL versions.
I have a mild orthopaedic impairment and needed the power memory seats to aid in getting in/out of the car (can't bend right knee fully so need seat all the way back to enter/exit). The memory feature was not available as a stand-alone option and is available only with the SEL trim level. Don't get me wrong, the Navigation and 400W Fender stereo and leather seats are nice, but I'd rather have saved $2500 and get the SE trim (fake leather ok for me) and just buy the memory seat option by itself, but not possible. Also, SEL is not available in manual transmission, so after 40+ years of driving only manuals, I was forced into automatic mode.
BoschExxcel
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Golf here is the usual hatchback, same size as the Focus, and well, the Golf lol. Exept here we can get estates of both cars which you can't in the US. Apparently the car market there is very different to here!
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
I thought so. Very interesting man. My late father predominantly drove Volkswagen group cars, 18 Audis and 11 Volkswagens during his 50 years in the auto industry and he found them to be the finest built cars on the road, and they still are to this day. I drive an Audi A3 2.0 TDI. Bought it at 4,000 miles. It has now done 110,000 and I have had nothing go wrong with it at all. Of course some will say VW's are POS and are un-reliable, I find this not to be the case, but on the contrary. Over in the UK and possibly Europe, Japanese cars (which have a reputation for reliability a most of us know) are actually quite expensive for what they are and not cheap at all when things do go wrong, which they can and do. TDI diesels are fantastic. One of the best was the old 1.9 PD. They were bomb proof, although my cousin has a Golf 2.0 common rail 06 plate which has now just turned over to 190,000 and doesn't even use a drop of oil. Incredible cars really.
My bather had a B5 Passat, 1.8 20v non-turbo model. had that for 8 years and clocked up over 150,000 and was running as sweet as nut even when he got rid of it.
Partially the reason why I am buying Bosch. There are exceptions, but on the whole, German quality is unbeatable, although home built domestic appliances made in Britain and the US are also very good, but much harder to get hold of.
My bather had a B5 Passat, 1.8 20v non-turbo model. had that for 8 years and clocked up over 150,000 and was running as sweet as nut even when he got rid of it.
Partially the reason why I am buying Bosch. There are exceptions, but on the whole, German quality is unbeatable, although home built domestic appliances made in Britain and the US are also very good, but much harder to get hold of.
I think the most important thing with a washer-dryer is the drum size : get the biggest you can if you intend to use it to dry regularly.
I've used low-end washer-dryers in rental places when I was a student and they're invariably utterly useless and I ended up just doing my laundry in a laundrette or drying on airers (which technically wasn't allowed in the building).
In one place, I actually gave up and bought an Electrolux condenser dryer and just kept it in the corner of a room. It made a huge difference as I could actually get towels dry in reasonable time and my clothes weren't being destroyed by high temperatures and coming out smelling like detergent and rubber!
If you have the space for a washer-dryer stack, consider that option instead.
I've used low-end washer-dryers in rental places when I was a student and they're invariably utterly useless and I ended up just doing my laundry in a laundrette or drying on airers (which technically wasn't allowed in the building).
In one place, I actually gave up and bought an Electrolux condenser dryer and just kept it in the corner of a room. It made a huge difference as I could actually get towels dry in reasonable time and my clothes weren't being destroyed by high temperatures and coming out smelling like detergent and rubber!
If you have the space for a washer-dryer stack, consider that option instead.
BoschExxcel
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We had two Audis which were both rubbish. Both 2008, one was an A3 and one an A4 both 2.0TDI and they both spent most of their time in the garage! Got rid of them about a year later and now have a Range Rover and a Peugeot. Strangely enough they have been fault free!
I agree with Bosch though, they are excellent quality products and most are the price of a Miele, can't reeally go wrong!
I agree with Bosch though, they are excellent quality products and most are the price of a Miele, can't reeally go wrong!
passatdoc
Well-known member
The only person I know who ever regretted a Bosch purchase is a secondary school friend who gutted and renovated the kitchen when they moved into a 1970s-era house in 2004. The Bosch dishwasher they bought then still works great. However, she also selected a Bosch double wall oven (built in) which has been nothing but trouble. The oven cuts out, makes too much noise, doesn't heat as it's supposed to, etc. It was replaced once by Bosch and the replacement doesn't work properly either. She chose the oven based on design and features, probably assuming that a company that makes such wonderful dishwashers and laundry machines can't make a bad oven. One other thing: while Bosch dishwashers were recommended to her by a number of friends (myself included) who owned them, she didn't know anyone personally with Bosch oven experience, so in a sense she was going it alone in terms of advice (or lack thereof).
My 1998 Passat was amazing. Never broke down or stopped working. Went 178K miles with original power train including clutch. I replaced it when interior pieces began breaking/nonoperating and parts became hard to find. Maintenance costs climbed to 3-4K/year dollars, which in my mind was throwing good money after bad.
My 1998 Passat was amazing. Never broke down or stopped working. Went 178K miles with original power train including clutch. I replaced it when interior pieces began breaking/nonoperating and parts became hard to find. Maintenance costs climbed to 3-4K/year dollars, which in my mind was throwing good money after bad.
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
Back after a few months...
So it has been a few months since I posted this. I couldn't make my mind up, only I am investing quite a bit of money, I want to make the right decision as you can imagine.
I don't think I will go for the LG. Too concerned about their safety and reliability, after hearing about exploding machines and from a technician who came out to service our stove the other week, saying that LG are not as durable or as reliable as European brands. He said they have weak seals and fragile water pumps. That 10 year motor warranty is of course only for the motor and Bosch do the same for their brushless motor models. Apparently LG's are quite expensive and difficult to repair, so I will steer clear of them.
I would have gone for the Bosch but they have had stock issues all this time but they are back in stock.
Only reason I haven't gone for it yet is because I searched for AEG and noticed they do quite an attractive model (linked below).
It has a larger drum capacity (8KG), brushless motor of course but according to the comparison statistics, is more energy efficient than the Bosch by around £30 per year, but more important has A ratings for wash and spin performance, versus the Bosch's B performance for spinning. The AEG is rated at 1600 rpm.
Would the AEG be a better choice then ?
http://ao.com/product/l77685wd-aeg-lavamat-turbo-washer-dryer-white-27519-2.aspx
So it has been a few months since I posted this. I couldn't make my mind up, only I am investing quite a bit of money, I want to make the right decision as you can imagine.
I don't think I will go for the LG. Too concerned about their safety and reliability, after hearing about exploding machines and from a technician who came out to service our stove the other week, saying that LG are not as durable or as reliable as European brands. He said they have weak seals and fragile water pumps. That 10 year motor warranty is of course only for the motor and Bosch do the same for their brushless motor models. Apparently LG's are quite expensive and difficult to repair, so I will steer clear of them.
I would have gone for the Bosch but they have had stock issues all this time but they are back in stock.
Only reason I haven't gone for it yet is because I searched for AEG and noticed they do quite an attractive model (linked below).
It has a larger drum capacity (8KG), brushless motor of course but according to the comparison statistics, is more energy efficient than the Bosch by around £30 per year, but more important has A ratings for wash and spin performance, versus the Bosch's B performance for spinning. The AEG is rated at 1600 rpm.
Would the AEG be a better choice then ?
http://ao.com/product/l77685wd-aeg-lavamat-turbo-washer-dryer-white-27519-2.aspx
aquacycle
Well-known member
I don't know about a BETTER choice, but it would certainly be a good choice. I never pay any attention to those ratings to be honest. My Miele is a B rated spin but it spins things dryer than an A rated Hotpoint of the same speed. Performance between the Bosch and the AEG should be fairly similar, if not the same.
In my experience, Electrolux group washer-dryers tend to be one of the better machines for drying and AEG are pretty solid machines (although with most brands, they're not what they used to be). Certainly looks to be a wise choice, spec wise.
In my experience, Electrolux group washer-dryers tend to be one of the better machines for drying and AEG are pretty solid machines (although with most brands, they're not what they used to be). Certainly looks to be a wise choice, spec wise
.The AEG would for sure be a reasonable choice, how ever I would not pay 100£ more for only 200rpm difference. The "lower" model would be a better option in terms of price to value, but in the end, its up to you.
What passed my mind was this one:
http://ao.com/product/wda91440w-beko-washer-dryer-white-28322-2.aspx
They have been launched a few months back and seem to be pretty good deals. They have air cooled condensators as well and are the "cheap" alternative to BSH. Bekos are known for good washing results in short times, so that probably will be true for their washer-dryers as well. Just to consider
What passed my mind was this one:
http://ao.com/product/wda91440w-beko-washer-dryer-white-28322-2.aspx
They have been launched a few months back and seem to be pretty good deals. They have air cooled condensators as well and are the "cheap" alternative to BSH. Bekos are known for good washing results in short times, so that probably will be true for their washer-dryers as well. Just to consider
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
The thing is, the top of the line AEG has a brushless motor which is going to be quitter and longer lasting than a standard brushed motor.
I would not go for BEKO at all. My auntie once had a BEKO cooker and it literally lasted 2 and a half years before it gave up an she meticulously looks after her cookers. Elements warped, fan motor needed replacing it burnt itself near the hob. No. I am after a nice washer dryer that will last a few years.
Again, it is down between the Bosch and the AEG. The AEG on paper looks like a better machine and also it is £250 less expensive, however, it is made in Italy. That makes me wonder if its made by the Candy group with there horrible metal bodies which rust out.
Everything else in my kitchen is Bosch, from the kettle to the fridge freezer, and I love all of them. The oldest of which is the kettle which is about 7 years old gets used several times a day and has been flawless. The fridge freezer I got back in January is lovely and quite and really well made, so I have no reason to not go for the Bosch, but I do want to get my moneys worth regarding longevity and performance and I trust Bosch more over AEG which I am not familiar with, although the AEG has scored well according to "Which?"
So many swings and roundabouts !
I would not go for BEKO at all. My auntie once had a BEKO cooker and it literally lasted 2 and a half years before it gave up an she meticulously looks after her cookers. Elements warped, fan motor needed replacing it burnt itself near the hob. No. I am after a nice washer dryer that will last a few years.
Again, it is down between the Bosch and the AEG. The AEG on paper looks like a better machine and also it is £250 less expensive, however, it is made in Italy. That makes me wonder if its made by the Candy group with there horrible metal bodies which rust out.
Everything else in my kitchen is Bosch, from the kettle to the fridge freezer, and I love all of them. The oldest of which is the kettle which is about 7 years old gets used several times a day and has been flawless. The fridge freezer I got back in January is lovely and quite and really well made, so I have no reason to not go for the Bosch, but I do want to get my moneys worth regarding longevity and performance and I trust Bosch more over AEG which I am not familiar with, although the AEG has scored well according to "Which?"
So many swings and roundabouts !
aquacycle
Well-known member
I would not go for BEKO at all.
My best friend has a bog standard Beko - 1200rpm, 5kg, variable spin. It's just gone 6 years old and it washes for 2 adults and 2 kids. Never been any trouble *touch wood* and it's not too loud either.
Beko seem to get a bed rep, because they're cheap. But in reality, they're no less reliable than any other modern brand. They're certainly a lot better than anything else in the low-mid price range of the market (Indesit, Whirlpool, Candy, Haier and low end Vestel made machines).
My best friend has a bog standard Beko - 1200rpm, 5kg, variable spin. It's just gone 6 years old and it washes for 2 adults and 2 kids. Never been any trouble *touch wood* and it's not too loud either.
Beko seem to get a bed rep, because they're cheap. But in reality, they're no less reliable than any other modern brand. They're certainly a lot better than anything else in the low-mid price range of the market (Indesit, Whirlpool, Candy, Haier and low end Vestel made machines).
aquacycle
Well-known member
That makes me wonder if its made by the Candy group
It's definitely not made by Candy. It's made at the Zanussi plant along with most modern Electrolux-made machines.
It's definitely not made by Candy. It's made at the Zanussi plant along with most modern Electrolux-made machines.
We had a 800€ Siemens Induction cooktop and oven, and the hoob literally exploded on me. We have a Bosch DW that had 2 new PCBs installed in its warranty time.
Beko changed. They recognized that the market is going down and people got angry over applainces, so they changed to better quality. Still, they are not a Miele, but for 500£, an air condesation washer dryer, that might last "only" 5-6 years, that seems ok.
All AEG washer-dryers have an brushless motor.
Beko changed. They recognized that the market is going down and people got angry over applainces, so they changed to better quality. Still, they are not a Miele, but for 500£, an air condesation washer dryer, that might last "only" 5-6 years, that seems ok.
All AEG washer-dryers have an brushless motor.
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
Well put it this way, my friend replaced a heating element on his Beko washing machine which was just under 2 years old and all I can say is I can see why they are cheap. They are not built to last and they are very crude. They are not flimsy or terrible quality, but they are deserving of their price, but their are better ones out there, and I don't buy the " it may only last half as long but it costs half as much" as I think that is a false economy. Based on my personal experience with bosch products and family who have bosch washers and dishwasher which last years and years with no problems, I would rather spend a little bit more on something which will last and may do the job better.
As far as reliability goes, Hotpoint are very low down on the Which? list along with Indesit, but bosch are second only to Miele and there isn't a huge difference in the rating between them, but Beko got 68% reliability rate, bosch got 82%
As far as reliability goes, Hotpoint are very low down on the Which? list along with Indesit, but bosch are second only to Miele and there isn't a huge difference in the rating between them, but Beko got 68% reliability rate, bosch got 82%
aquacycle
Well-known member
Well, speaking from my experience, I've had no issue with any Beko products. As mentioned above, my best friend has her bog standard model and a friend of my other half has one of the first Beko Eco Care 1000's with the mechanical timer that's at least 10 years old now and still going strong. Not bad for £200.
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
I may have found exactly what I am looking for.
It appears to be a Siemens version of the Bosch washer dryer. I have compared the specs and there is no differences I can see. Both look visually identical, both have eco silence drive brushless motors, both are the same capacity and both have the same dimensions. The difference is, the Siemens is nearly £200 cheaper? Why on earth would that be?
I know Siemens is part of Bosch but why would there be such a price difference? Are the Siemens versions seconds? Are they made from slightly lesser materials? I can't imagine so, but what justifies the price difference ?
http://ao.com/product/wd14h421gb-si..._PC=WD14H421GB_WH&WT.srch=1&WT.z_CN==SEO-rete
It appears to be a Siemens version of the Bosch washer dryer. I have compared the specs and there is no differences I can see. Both look visually identical, both have eco silence drive brushless motors, both are the same capacity and both have the same dimensions. The difference is, the Siemens is nearly £200 cheaper? Why on earth would that be?
I know Siemens is part of Bosch but why would there be such a price difference? Are the Siemens versions seconds? Are they made from slightly lesser materials? I can't imagine so, but what justifies the price difference ?
http://ao.com/product/wd14h421gb-si..._PC=WD14H421GB_WH&WT.srch=1&WT.z_CN==SEO-rete
Thats the first generation model. It uses more energy (Class B) and takes slightly longer. There are 3 generations of these by now, with the new ones haveing some different cycles like Hygenie which uses a low temp wash, rinses and then dries you clothes on extra high heat to disinfect them.
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
According the AO specification table, the Siemens is more energy efficient than the Bosch ? Only difference being the Siemens is 60 DB when dryer, versus the Bosch's 50, but other than the Bosch having 5 drying programs instead of 3.
Strange...
I know in Germany, these models were only first generation.
These are the newest:
http://www.siemens-home.de/produktl...aschtrockner/WD15H540?breadcrumb=washerdryers
And these are the second generation:
http://www.ao.de/produkt/wd14h540-s...1&WT.z_CN=NA&gclid=CNvBgf-O7sQCFavpwgodJU0AwA
These with the simple displays were only sold as Energy class B rated here.
I know in Germany, these models were only first generation.
These are the newest:
http://www.siemens-home.de/produktl...aschtrockner/WD15H540?breadcrumb=washerdryers
And these are the second generation:
http://www.ao.de/produkt/wd14h540-s...1&WT.z_CN=NA&gclid=CNvBgf-O7sQCFavpwgodJU0AwA
These with the simple displays were only sold as Energy class B rated here.
Just checked the websites. Bosch and Siemens only offer these midrange machines in the UK. So, I guess, AO just made a good deal when buying them.
Never recognized there was ao.de either...
Never recognized there was ao.de either...
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
On several website, the Siemens is cheaper, and the Bosch is more expensive, and if the Siemens is an older generation, it seems odd that it is more energy efficient. There are some slight differences with the control panel but that is it.
aquacycle
Well-known member
the Siemens is nearly £200 cheaper? Why on earth would that
Siemens are actually the higher spec, like AEG is to Zanussi. However, BSH are pulling the Siemens brand out of the domestic appliance market, so it could be that they are on clearance ready for a new Bosch range being introduced.
Siemens are actually the higher spec, like AEG is to Zanussi. However, BSH are pulling the Siemens brand out of the domestic appliance market, so it could be that they are on clearance ready for a new Bosch range being introduced.
brucelucenta
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best choice
Sounds like you are informed and have done your homework about the various choices. I personally have a Kenmore Elite front load washer & matching dryer set made by LG that I like very much. It does a wonderful job with much less water than my old top load Maytag set. I guess it depends on where you live and what's available to you. But I'm sure you'll make the right choice for yourself. Happy laundering!
Sounds like you are informed and have done your homework about the various choices. I personally have a Kenmore Elite front load washer & matching dryer set made by LG that I like very much. It does a wonderful job with much less water than my old top load Maytag set. I guess it depends on where you live and what's available to you. But I'm sure you'll make the right choice for yourself. Happy laundering!
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
Well thank you everyone for your help.
I have ordered the Siemens and it should be arriving on Tuesday. I shall post pictures and my verdict soon after
I have ordered the Siemens and it should be arriving on Tuesday. I shall post pictures and my verdict soon after
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
So I was just browsing through some achieved threads and there was a post up saying all Siemens washer-dryers are made in China? Is this true? That would explain the price difference. Surely the quality should be no different especially at this price point...
oliveoiltinfoil
Well-known member
That is true. Bosch products built in other countries are built in Bosch factories with Bosch standards, I know that for a fact. They don't outsource any of their manufacturing, and I have Chinese made Bosch products, my kettle and toaster and they are 7 years old and are like new so haven't really got any worries thinking about it now. Cant wait for it to come
BoschExxcel
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You're right not to worry, Bosch make brilliant appliances no matter where they are built. We've had numerous Bosch appliances over the last 12 years and only one of those had ever broken. Most of them weren't/aren't even German built!
Enjoy the new machine, I don't like washer dryers myself but a Bosch one should be one of the best.
Enjoy the new machine, I don't like washer dryers myself but a Bosch one should be one of the best.
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