NON USA Dryers; what is typical, electric, gas, clothes line?

[MrX]

Sockets / Power points:

Kitchen : 19
Utility : 6
Living Room : 8
Hallway 4
Study 8
Dining Room : 6
Master Bedroom : 8
Bedroom 1: 4
Bedroom 2: 4
Bedroom 3: 4
Hallway : 2
Bathrooms : 1 X isolation transformer supplied shaver socket in each (normal sockets are illegal here in bathrooms)
Garage : 2
Outside : 4 (Weather proof)
Attic : 2 (for data equipment)

I am counting each socket, most of them are double plates so they're counted as "2".

 

[ronhic]

WOW!

 

I thought we had plenty.....but I have to say that I love the idea of having 19 in the kitchen....

 

Though, I did miss one....the dishwashers...

 

[MrX]

@launderess

The vast majority of homes in Europe are heated with natural gas and natural gas cooking is also pretty popular. For some reason though, gas tumble dryers never really have been much more than a niche item. I am not entirely sure why that is as they are cheaper to run.

Gas, initially coal-gas, has been used in European cities for as long as it has been in existence and was introduced to homes as early as the 1807, so it drastically predates the 1900 house

In the UK and Ireland, gas-fired hydronic (water-filled radiator) heating systems are by far the most common in use.

I don't think that you'll find much natural gas in rural anywhere, including the United States. It's not economic to provide remote houses with network connections.

So, in rural areas, if gas is used, it's usually LPG (liquified petroleum gas) i.e. propane delivered by bulk tanker or in over-sized canisters.

@hoover1100

Re: Northern Ireland Natural Gas.

Natural gas is available in Northern Ireland. It's just not provided by the same companies as Britain.
There are connections to Northern Ireland from the gas grid in Britain and from the Republic of Ireland. The two main suppliers of Natural Gas up there are Phoenix Energy and Firmus (which is owned by BGE, the main gas company in the Republic of Ireland)

Because a lot of Ireland (North and South) is relatively rural / non-dense urban you will tend to find that there are probably a higher % of LPG (propane) installations than in say the South of England. But, natural gas is widely available in any major urban area and even some quite small/middle sized towns.

Natural gas came on stream in the Republic of Ireland in the 1970s when the Kinsale Head Gas field was discovered. It rapidly replaced "town gas" (coal gas) just as it did in Britain after the discovery of gas in the North Sea in the 1960s/70s.

Northern Ireland remained "off grid" until the 1990s though!

Natural gas network in Ireland : (Gas fields : Corrib Gas and Kinsale Gas)

 

[logixx]

I ALWAYS use the dryer - it's just part of "doing laundry" for me. Even though we have a rotary clothes dryer in our garden, actually a quite expensive one that retracts the lines into its "arms" when not in use to keep them clean, I never use it. I much prefer using the dryer: no bleaching from the sun, no roughness, no creases and no stink. I know, some people say they love the smell of laundry dried outside but I don't. The air around here is pretty clean - after all, I'm practically surrounded by trees in this area of Germany - yet, I think air-dried clothes smell nasty. I either want them to smell of softener or of nothing. Also, I can't stand to fiddle around with every little sock, piece of underwear etc. etc. No! Just toss it all in the dryer and let the sensors take care of everything.

As for dryers themselves: the most common type of tumble dryer in Germany is the sensor-controlled condenser dryer. Out of the approx. 50 dryers we have on the sales floor, only three are vented and not a single one is time-controlled. We do have (and sell) an increasing amount of heat-pump dryers, as they typically use half the energy of a traditional dryer. Gas dryer are practically non-existent. As are dryers that are larger than 24x24 inches - unless one would get a professional unit, of course.

Capacity-wise, the largest drums are 4.2 cu.ft., which is enough for 13 lbs. Yet, some manufacturers claim their dryers hold almost 20 pounds, which, I guess, they do but the result will be a wrinkled mess. Most dryers change drum rotation like a washing machine, although Bosch/Siemens and others make uni-directional dryers these days. Our Electrolux changes direction every five minutes for about 10 seconds. Miele dryers have a sensor that can detect a balled-up load and reverse accordingly.

Another difference is the moisture-sensing system: most (all?) US dryer with moisture sensors (not Auto Dry) have metal bars either at the front or back of the drum. Typically, European dryers use the drum vanes as sensors, which works very precisely. Our dryer actually uses the entire drum to sense moisture so even a single item can be dried on a sensor setting! If no clothes are in the drum, it'll shut off within seconds. That's how good the sensors are. Again, some manufactures (Bosch/Siemens) are using the "metal bar" system on their Euro units, too.

We also didn't have more than two temp settings until recently. Normal (+/- 158F) or low (+/- 122F). What I wonder is how do US dryers control their five different settings? I suppose they just turn the heater on and off? Especially gas dryers? German dryers - being electric - have two heaters, which they engage according to the temp selected. Our dryer has a 1000W and a 1400W element. Combined or individually, they are cycled throughout the drying process.

Full stainless steel drums are the norm. Glass doors can be had from many manufacturers, now.

Alex

 

[hydralique]

Modern Condenser Dryers . . .

Are these the type that use some tap water to dissipate the heat from drying, or is there another method?

 

[joe_in_philly]

I have a gas dryer, and yes, it does cycle the gas on and off to maintain the set temperature.

 

[foraloysius]

Modern condenser dryers use room air to cool the condenser.

 

[3beltwesty]

On older US electric dryers there is just a thermostat that cycles on and off that controls the temperature.

My old 1976 Westinghouse dryer is about 23 amps at 240 single phase; or 20 amps for 3 phase 208 volts; or about 13 to 14 amps when wired for only 120 volts.

Mine is today on 240 volts plugged into a 30 amp socket; with #10 wire in the wall to a 30 amp double pole breaker. #10 wire is about 1/10 inch dia; approx 2.5mm.

An old dryer like mine uses the Neutral too; the AC motor runs on one 120 volt leg; the heater coil on 240 volts for 5400 watts and just say 1400 watts when on 120 volts ie low heat setting.

Westinghouse and some other brands used the coil at 1/2 voltage for low heat settings.

Other electric dryer makers in the USA use a special thermostat; that has an interal heater. They "heat" thermostat up to get a low temp setting, the thermostat has many leads. The dryers low and mid heat settings are with external resistors that vary the heat "inside" the thermostat; to alter the temp at which cycling happens.

My own 1976 westinghouse dryer heats up the air with coils and this passes through the drum; then through the door, through the suction blower blower below and by the THERMOSTAT; then goes outside in the 4" /100mm vent tube.

The thermostat turns off about 145F to 150 F and back on say 10 to 15 F lower

 

[3beltwesty]

.

 

[3beltwesty]

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[3beltwesty]

2 terminal dumb termostat in output tube/vent

.

 

[hydralique]

I thought modern condenser dryers used room air for cooling and so was amazed at the lack of vented dryers on the European market, given that they're often located in kitchens rather than laundry rooms or garages. I'm aware that winter temperatures in Europe are often quite cold aside from Mediterranean climates - I've spent time in eastern France and Germany during the winter - but it can get unpleasantly hot and humid in the summer. Cutting a dryer vent in most walls, even masonry walls, is no big thing, so I wonder why there are so few vented dryers? And in the warmer parts of Spain and Italy I can't imagine paying European electrical rates to keep the a/c going while the dryer heats up the room!

 

[3beltwesty]

2 terminal dumb termostat in output tube/vent

.

 

[dj-gabriele]

in the warmer parts of Spain and Italy I can't imagine p

I'm sure nobody would use a dryer in summer in Italy also because the "standard" power contract is limited to 3,3kW of power and with "high-power" contracts limited to 6,6 kW, so at best you have 15 or 30 Ampere at 230V!

 

[MrX]

I'm not entirely sure about the energy efficiency of air-to-air condensor dryers either to be honest. I would like to see a side-by-side comparison.

We have a vented Miele dryer and it's a fantastic machine. It just dries reliably, quickly and doesn't produce crinkles or over-heated clothes.

It's going strong, without a single repair since 1998 and still looks new.

That machine gets used almost daily.

I have found that some condensors run very hot and they also seem to take a very long time to dry compared to vented dryers.

I am not really sure why they became so popular in Europe. From what I can see it's mostly marketing hype.

I have even seen people install condensors in utility rooms that already had ducting for dryer venting pre-installed!

 

[hoover1100]

I can't imagine paying European electrical rates to keep

As Gabriele says, you would never use the dryer in that weather (there's no point)

Also, even in Southern Europe, A/C is nowhere near as widespread as it is in the US. Some homes have them, but from what I've seen in Spain and Italy, many (most?) do not.

In the UK, A/C it's basically non-existant (especially in domestic environments), and it's use reserved for large shops and office buildings, even then, it wouldn't be used very much at all.

Matt

 

[launderess]

Condenser Dryers

Cannot speak for the rest of Europe, but at least in Paris and other parts of France with strict building zoning, it is either a condenser dryer or nothing. One simply cannot drill holes into walls of those Baron Haussmann buildings to make a vent. Indeed think that applies to most all "older" (and we're talking anything still standing from the 1600's through perhaps built just prior or after WWII. Same goes for air conditioning, which also explains those portable units with ducting that goes out a window.

IIRC, consumer magazine tests on both sides of the pond usually put vented dryers ahead of condensers in terms of drying time. As for water cooled condenser dryers, only remember seeing one of those. It was in our high school's "home ec" suite. For some reason "Whirlpool" sticks in my mind, though many here in the group say it wasn't possible. Only remember teacher having to turn on a water tap behind the machine before starting up the unit. This she complained about bitterly as having to use the thing even during a "water shortage". However can see why it was installed. The classroom suite did not face an exterior wall, and there was no way to run ducting to where it could exit. As the school still stands and is use, wonder if the dryer remains?

 

[hydralique]

I am not surprised that there is a market for condenser dryers in Europe, what surprises me is that there is virtually no market for vented dryers (as Logixx notes above only 3 out of 50 dryers on a showroom floor).  

 

As far as using the dryer in the summer, I see good reasons to do this. If your yard has lots of trees as mine does, there may not be much place to put a clothesline in a location that's both attractive and not under the trees, and if you dry under the trees you're going to get bird droppings plus the shade inhibits drying. In addition, many people leave in the morning for work at 8:00 to get there by 9:00, and don't get home until 6:00 at the earliest. That really doesn't leave much time for hanging clothes, especially if you often do your laundry in the evening. When I was a small child my mother line dried all her wash. It smelled great and was fun to help with, but at that time she was a stay at home housewife and had the time to do it. Once she went back to work everything went into the dryer.

 

[3beltwesty]

Here on the Miss coast it was so hot Sunday that I turned on one AC unit; since the humidity was so high inside that my glasses kept fogging up.

In line drying of clothes this time of year sometimes one gets gobs of pollen, thus line drying gets pollen all over ones items.

Sometimes a humid approach is used, the line is used to mostly dry items then the dryer is used to fully dry and fluff towels and fully dry jeans.

In big casinos locally; AC units are running often in January where many folks are bunched together, while other parts of the casinos are using heat. ie both heating and cooling in the same building.

 

[dj-gabriele]

Exact, as Matt pointed out, Air conditioning is a "new" thing to have in the house, if you look at the 2010 situation, only around 40% of the houses of my town had air conditioning and most only in the bedrooms.
My family was one of the first to put aircon in the 90s and at the time it was regarded as an expensive luxury!
And I must say it is! With our prices, the electric bill for june and july alone, usually is around 400-500 euros (570-710 USD)!!!!

At the moment we're putting on a new tri-split De Longhi inverter airconditioner for the bedrooms and two separate machines for the living rooms and kitchen