supersurgilator
Well-known member
I was surprised to look on youtube tonight and find this! Haven't heard anybody on here talk about the possibility of an exploding Samsung toploader.
Now Samsung
- Thread starter supersurgilator
- Start date
I am not a fan of the hanging suspension system used in many impeller-based machines. That's one thing the Frigidaire Immersion Care had in its favor---a traditional (and excellent) suspension system.
The problem is threefold I think.
The first problem is that stupid suspension system. It feels flimsy. I can easily move the tub around with my hand on these kinds of machines. I don't understand why they can't use a conventional suspension system like what is found in other typical top loaders, unless they're skimping.
Second, these machines are designed with very fast spin speeds, which are completely inappropriate for the suspension. They don't balance out properly and "Go for it" anyway even though it isn't appropriate.
My old GE Top Loader would make a racket when it tried to spin an unbalanced load, but it was programmed so give up and spin slowly or abandon the spin rather than destroy itself.
The third problem, despite the poor suspension and high spin speeds is user error. Even though I very firmly believe that a washer manufacturer should design a machine so that it can't self destruct, the user tends to choose a cycle and/or spin speed which is inappropriate for the load, so the machine can't handle it.
I once put in a pair of pillows into my old Inglis Top Loader machine and the machine gladly shredded them. User error on two parts, first, the gentle cycle wasn't used and second, I tried to wash pillows in an Inglis top loader.
So, basically it all comes down to poor engineering on Samsungs and LG's part. I don't think I'd ever consider buying one of these machines for those very reasons.
The first problem is that stupid suspension system. It feels flimsy. I can easily move the tub around with my hand on these kinds of machines. I don't understand why they can't use a conventional suspension system like what is found in other typical top loaders, unless they're skimping.
Second, these machines are designed with very fast spin speeds, which are completely inappropriate for the suspension. They don't balance out properly and "Go for it" anyway even though it isn't appropriate.
My old GE Top Loader would make a racket when it tried to spin an unbalanced load, but it was programmed so give up and spin slowly or abandon the spin rather than destroy itself.
The third problem, despite the poor suspension and high spin speeds is user error. Even though I very firmly believe that a washer manufacturer should design a machine so that it can't self destruct, the user tends to choose a cycle and/or spin speed which is inappropriate for the load, so the machine can't handle it.
I once put in a pair of pillows into my old Inglis Top Loader machine and the machine gladly shredded them. User error on two parts, first, the gentle cycle wasn't used and second, I tried to wash pillows in an Inglis top loader.
So, basically it all comes down to poor engineering on Samsungs and LG's part. I don't think I'd ever consider buying one of these machines for those very reasons.
dj-gabriele
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What did you expect from Samsung?!
Gosh, their products of are of appalling quality!
The only thing they manage to do good is advertising, convincing people that what they make is always "the next best thing" and in reality it's just expensive crap...
Gosh, their products of are of appalling quality!
The only thing they manage to do good is advertising, convincing people that what they make is always "the next best thing" and in reality it's just expensive crap...
DirectDriveDave
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- Oct 11, 2011
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Not surprising
The (not)quality of these things always shows! I had already previously commented on said video. I wonder if they would pull an LG and slow it down rather than actually fix the problem.
The (not)quality of these things always shows! I had already previously commented on said video. I wonder if they would pull an LG and slow it down rather than actually fix the problem.
LG has called back there machines with the exploding problem and, as I said before, the problem indeed was just to go for it as qualin said. But they are reprogrammed now (and are not slowed down as far as I know, not the thing that happend to Candy/Hoover here in the EU).
I more or less likely think the fault on this one was manufactures sides as the washer was only 7h old and in use. The LG's lasted more then 6 months in the most cases before they exploded.
But anyway, I still would rather buy a LG then a Samsung. They are horrible. Poor you, you don't have Panasonic washers (Till today, I can still say that)...
I more or less likely think the fault on this one was manufactures sides as the washer was only 7h old and in use. The LG's lasted more then 6 months in the most cases before they exploded.
But anyway, I still would rather buy a LG then a Samsung. They are horrible. Poor you, you don't have Panasonic washers (Till today, I can still say that)...
Yeah, I think any washer should stop before it blows apart... but I also think this woman does not know how to use her washing machine. Look at all the stuff she packed in there: looks like two heavy blankets along with two pillows.
mrb627
Well-known member
Marketing
I think a large portion of the blame should be placed at the feet of the marketing department. We have all seen the commercials where the woman simply dumps baskets of clothing into the machine without regard for proper loading. The salespeople at the big box stores lead the purchaser into believing that you can wash whatever will fit into the machine.
Shame actually. These machines are huge and impressive in the store, but after all is said and done, they cannot handle being packed with laundry in the way they are depicted on the commercials. At the end of the day, they are 16-18 pound machines.
Malcolm<span style="white-space: pre;"> </span>
I think a large portion of the blame should be placed at the feet of the marketing department. We have all seen the commercials where the woman simply dumps baskets of clothing into the machine without regard for proper loading. The salespeople at the big box stores lead the purchaser into believing that you can wash whatever will fit into the machine.
Shame actually. These machines are huge and impressive in the store, but after all is said and done, they cannot handle being packed with laundry in the way they are depicted on the commercials. At the end of the day, they are 16-18 pound machines.
Malcolm<span style="white-space: pre;"> </span>
At the end of the day, they are 16-18 pound machines.
Whirlpool markets its Cabrio as a 53 lbs. washer in Mexico...
http://whirlpool.com.mx/detalle.php?segmento=1&categoria=1&subcategoria=2&producto=1432
Whirlpool markets its Cabrio as a 53 lbs. washer in Mexico...
http://whirlpool.com.mx/detalle.php?segmento=1&categoria=1&subcategoria=2&producto=1432
dj-gabriele
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24 kg machine!?!?
Gosh, call that false advertising!
my father has a 20 kg washer at the laundry and the thing weights around 350 kg and it's 1,5 x 1,2 x 1 meters... definitely non that wimpy thing they show you.
Gosh, call that false advertising!
my father has a 20 kg washer at the laundry and the thing weights around 350 kg and it's 1,5 x 1,2 x 1 meters... definitely non that wimpy thing they show you.
mieleforever
Well-known member
Marketing...
Yes I think LG & Samsung have got excellent marketing campaigns. I actually read in the Readers Digest of about two months ago that the general South African Public voted LG as a quality and trust worthy brand!!
Can you believe it? That is why LG and Samsung will actually take over the world, its cheap and the ad campaigns are run with military precision. I don't have actual figures but in the average South AFrican Home, LG and Samsung toploaders are the staple. I just can't get over those silly looney tunes at the end of the cycle. The wash performance on those are dismal, but hey as long as it have been in the washer then it's clean!!
Like stated in earlier threads of mine I owned two LG Dishwashers which gave so many troubles, they are Korean Glitter Boxes, and have no substance at all.
I hope this poor lady decides to go with a better brand.
Regards
Yes I think LG & Samsung have got excellent marketing campaigns. I actually read in the Readers Digest of about two months ago that the general South African Public voted LG as a quality and trust worthy brand!!
Can you believe it? That is why LG and Samsung will actually take over the world, its cheap and the ad campaigns are run with military precision. I don't have actual figures but in the average South AFrican Home, LG and Samsung toploaders are the staple. I just can't get over those silly looney tunes at the end of the cycle. The wash performance on those are dismal, but hey as long as it have been in the washer then it's clean!!
Like stated in earlier threads of mine I owned two LG Dishwashers which gave so many troubles, they are Korean Glitter Boxes, and have no substance at all.
I hope this poor lady decides to go with a better brand.
Regards
Speed Queen for me
My eight year old top-loader is used daily. Fixed once (wouldn't agitate) and the serviceman was in and out in about an hour. And after eight years the part was still under warranty.
No "glitter boxes" for me! ( I like that term.) I just want the machine to wash my clothes reliably. So far Speed Queen has done right by me.
My eight year old top-loader is used daily. Fixed once (wouldn't agitate) and the serviceman was in and out in about an hour. And after eight years the part was still under warranty.
No "glitter boxes" for me! ( I like that term.) I just want the machine to wash my clothes reliably. So far Speed Queen has done right by me.
Is Samsung going to recall their "spin-splode" washers even if its user abuse-yes,agree with others here the machine should be able to protect itself from user errors.First its LG-now its Samsung!With these machines doing your laundry is as exciting as testing jet engines in their factory engine test stands and isolated rooms!And machine makers really should forget trying to say their machines can do a dump-truck load of wash at once.
mrb627
Well-known member
Shipping Brackets?
Perhaps the delivery team forgot to remove the shipping bracket and this is an isolated incident.
Malcolm
Perhaps the delivery team forgot to remove the shipping bracket and this is an isolated incident.
Malcolm
I forgot to mention, LG did issue a field service hotfix for a lot of their washers which limited the spin speed to 700 RPM. This made a lot of people angry. One particular poster on here ranted how they paid for a 1200 RPM machine, they should get one.
In all honesty, the software hotfix was a bit of a hack, but it is an admission by the engineers that they made a mistake when engineering the spin speeds in. They should have either beefed up the suspension or just limted the machines to 700 RPM to begin with.
It makes me wonder now if the newer SQ top loading machines could do 1200 RPM without blowing apart since they have a much better suspension system....
In all honesty, the software hotfix was a bit of a hack, but it is an admission by the engineers that they made a mistake when engineering the spin speeds in. They should have either beefed up the suspension or just limted the machines to 700 RPM to begin with.
It makes me wonder now if the newer SQ top loading machines could do 1200 RPM without blowing apart since they have a much better suspension system....
These TL machines that have the impeller in the tub just invite users to "Fill her up"and not realize the consequence of their action.Hence they feel they should be able to do that "dump truck" load of mixed wash without problems--they'll learn!
Look at how nicely this F&P handles the off-balance.
Samsung Top Load Washer Explodes:
Didn't Samsung FIX these Spin-Splode problems?Or does the man in the video have an older machine that wasn't "fixed"?
As the lady in video number one was a single case, I have my doubts they did anything.
Now this case is the first I really question. First, whats that on the floor there? Just curious, because if that is the load, I would be highly supprised if the load itself was the problem. It would most likely go OOB, but not to cause this kind of damage.
Second: How did that thing dent out one half of the washer more than the other (you see the actual backside of the machine is less dented then the front, which is widley curved), but still manage to turn arround it self by 180°? The washer would have to jump in the air to manage the 180° turn and destroy it self in 3/4ths of a baskets rotation. Not that this is impossible, but verry unlikely.
Further, there is few damage to wall, dryer and other surroundings. So the washer probably destroyed it self the fast way.
My idea so far: The load became OOB with one part of the load at the bottom of the tub, the other on the approximately opposite side pushed up the basket wall about half way. The basket it self was sensed as relatively stabel, it went into spin. Because of the torque the load produced, on side of the tub always produced an upwards force. (Imagine a FL with one part of the load at the back of the drum, the other one at the front, with the washer in distribution. Now, one part of the load is exactly 180° offset to the other. The RPM-pattern of the drum is relativley constant as the 2 parts of the load couter-balance each other. But as one part of the load pushes the back up while the other pushes the front down, the tub devolpes kind of a twisting motion, which gives the drum a front-to-back swing. Same thing can happen to a TL, only that back and front of the tub are tob and bottom.)
Now, this upward force unhooked one of the suspension springs. And from there on, it was a matter of seconds.
But now I wonder, what would happen if the drive system on such a washer shifted into agitation during full speed spin? Wouldn't the tub come to a sudden stop?
Now this case is the first I really question. First, whats that on the floor there? Just curious, because if that is the load, I would be highly supprised if the load itself was the problem. It would most likely go OOB, but not to cause this kind of damage.
Second: How did that thing dent out one half of the washer more than the other (you see the actual backside of the machine is less dented then the front, which is widley curved), but still manage to turn arround it self by 180°? The washer would have to jump in the air to manage the 180° turn and destroy it self in 3/4ths of a baskets rotation. Not that this is impossible, but verry unlikely.
Further, there is few damage to wall, dryer and other surroundings. So the washer probably destroyed it self the fast way.
My idea so far: The load became OOB with one part of the load at the bottom of the tub, the other on the approximately opposite side pushed up the basket wall about half way. The basket it self was sensed as relatively stabel, it went into spin. Because of the torque the load produced, on side of the tub always produced an upwards force. (Imagine a FL with one part of the load at the back of the drum, the other one at the front, with the washer in distribution. Now, one part of the load is exactly 180° offset to the other. The RPM-pattern of the drum is relativley constant as the 2 parts of the load couter-balance each other. But as one part of the load pushes the back up while the other pushes the front down, the tub devolpes kind of a twisting motion, which gives the drum a front-to-back swing. Same thing can happen to a TL, only that back and front of the tub are tob and bottom.)
Now, this upward force unhooked one of the suspension springs. And from there on, it was a matter of seconds.
But now I wonder, what would happen if the drive system on such a washer shifted into agitation during full speed spin? Wouldn't the tub come to a sudden stop?
mrb627
Well-known member
Video
It almost looks like there is a piece of the suspension bracket hanger missing. Is there nothing to keep the rod from "Jumping" out of the corner bracket?
Makes me wonder if the rods were properly parked in the bracket at the time of delivery. Maybe the installers tipped the machine on its side during installation and the rod simply dis-lodged from the bracket.
Design Flaw!
Malcolm
It almost looks like there is a piece of the suspension bracket hanger missing. Is there nothing to keep the rod from "Jumping" out of the corner bracket?
Makes me wonder if the rods were properly parked in the bracket at the time of delivery. Maybe the installers tipped the machine on its side during installation and the rod simply dis-lodged from the bracket.
Design Flaw!
Malcolm
washingpowder
Well-known member
IIRC the whole previous exploding recall was due to thin, plastic suspension brackets. Multiple videos on youtube show them split in half.
Samsung officially claimed the spin speeds were so high the washers' OOB sensors didn't have time to react, which to me is a completely oblivious piece of unmentionable. When a washer enters said high speed no way in hell it will go out of balance anymore. And for that kind of damage the OOB needs to occur very suddenly.
The plastic would break, causing the whole issue. Most of the time it occurred when washing bulky items like comforters, which explains the load was to heavy to support.
So Samsung, instead of changing brackets, decided to lower spin speeds as a recall solution, resulting in barely spun loads. Yeah, that's the repair technique one loves and admires. We stand proud behind our product!
Seems like it's one of the new generation washers since the brackets are metal, yet clearly the suspension rods aren't suspended anymore, as in the video.
All that makes me think, no Samsung whatsoever. Mostly because I *despise* that kind of attitude and solutions. Had just recently the same experience with Keurig - instead of fixing the valve that kept causing too much pressure which would result in hot water with coffee grounds sprayed all over the kitchen, they sent me a 'repair kit' consisting of a little curtain-like handle - so it will spray downwards instead, rather than repairing the unit. Coffee still rather gritty.
Samsung officially claimed the spin speeds were so high the washers' OOB sensors didn't have time to react, which to me is a completely oblivious piece of unmentionable. When a washer enters said high speed no way in hell it will go out of balance anymore. And for that kind of damage the OOB needs to occur very suddenly.
The plastic would break, causing the whole issue. Most of the time it occurred when washing bulky items like comforters, which explains the load was to heavy to support.
So Samsung, instead of changing brackets, decided to lower spin speeds as a recall solution, resulting in barely spun loads. Yeah, that's the repair technique one loves and admires. We stand proud behind our product!
Seems like it's one of the new generation washers since the brackets are metal, yet clearly the suspension rods aren't suspended anymore, as in the video.
All that makes me think, no Samsung whatsoever. Mostly because I *despise* that kind of attitude and solutions. Had just recently the same experience with Keurig - instead of fixing the valve that kept causing too much pressure which would result in hot water with coffee grounds sprayed all over the kitchen, they sent me a 'repair kit' consisting of a little curtain-like handle - so it will spray downwards instead, rather than repairing the unit. Coffee still rather gritty.
The OOB situation would have to happen verry sudden indeed, but there are 3 ways that can happen.
1. Dislogging. If one rod gets loose, the suspension is made less effective ang uneven it self. And this can happen verry sudden.
2. Mixed loads. Take pillows for example. Soaked with water, they get rather heavy. However, they release a lot of water at low spin speeds quite fast. So, if a user mixes towels and a pillow, and they distribute and seperate (so a bunch of towels on one side, the pillow opposite to them), it could give an severe OOB situation outside the OOB sensing phase. (Washers either use external switches and\or 3D-movement sensors or they only use the RPM\motor current pattern during a certain, predetermined phase. If OOB happens outside this phase, the washer won't sense it. It would only stop if the motor would stall.)
3. Same can happen with waterproof items. If they tangle with some heavy items or create pockets of water, they are pretty heavy and don't release any water, even at low spin speeds. As the washer ramps up, there is certain point at which the water pressure gets to high and the membranes open up. This can mean a lot of weight change in a matter of seconds or less. (Found that out with some waterproof workclothes of my dad. Luckily, I always wash such items seperate!)
1. Dislogging. If one rod gets loose, the suspension is made less effective ang uneven it self. And this can happen verry sudden.
2. Mixed loads. Take pillows for example. Soaked with water, they get rather heavy. However, they release a lot of water at low spin speeds quite fast. So, if a user mixes towels and a pillow, and they distribute and seperate (so a bunch of towels on one side, the pillow opposite to them), it could give an severe OOB situation outside the OOB sensing phase. (Washers either use external switches and\or 3D-movement sensors or they only use the RPM\motor current pattern during a certain, predetermined phase. If OOB happens outside this phase, the washer won't sense it. It would only stop if the motor would stall.)
3. Same can happen with waterproof items. If they tangle with some heavy items or create pockets of water, they are pretty heavy and don't release any water, even at low spin speeds. As the washer ramps up, there is certain point at which the water pressure gets to high and the membranes open up. This can mean a lot of weight change in a matter of seconds or less. (Found that out with some waterproof workclothes of my dad. Luckily, I always wash such items seperate!)
mrb627
Well-known member
Hmm...
Can anyone confirm whether this machine has an OOB sensor or does it use a ramp/coast spin profile to determine balance. I would suspect the latter. Once the initial balance validation passes a shift in the load during ramp up goes undetected.
Malcolm
Can anyone confirm whether this machine has an OOB sensor or does it use a ramp/coast spin profile to determine balance. I would suspect the latter. Once the initial balance validation passes a shift in the load during ramp up goes undetected.
Malcolm
murando531
Well-known member
This is precisely why I would never have a Samsung appliance, ever. And sadly, because Samsung's top-load washers are almost exact clones of LG's, I really wouldn't have either. Too much marketing towards gimmicks and shiny plastic and chrome, and yet no attention to the components of the machine that are actually important. There are several videos and numerous cases of this exact thing happening. Some user-fault, but others caused by lack of proper engineering in the machine itself.
I know that the Bravos uses several slow ramp-ups and slow downs during the final spin. It steps up each time until it senses that the load is balanced. There are some times that I've noticed it hang on whatever minute the timer displays, and sometimes it will stay at a medium speed throughout, but add a few minutes to the cycle. It seems to be very careful about making sure it can properly accelerate to the high-spin. I'm excited that the 880 I'm getting also has the No Spin option, so I'll have more peace of mind washing awkward items and can go in and arrange them properly myself.
I know that the Bravos uses several slow ramp-ups and slow downs during the final spin. It steps up each time until it senses that the load is balanced. There are some times that I've noticed it hang on whatever minute the timer displays, and sometimes it will stay at a medium speed throughout, but add a few minutes to the cycle. It seems to be very careful about making sure it can properly accelerate to the high-spin. I'm excited that the 880 I'm getting also has the No Spin option, so I'll have more peace of mind washing awkward items and can go in and arrange them properly myself.
I'm still verry indifferent about these events.
You see, in my opinion, what ever day to day load you wash (and with that I mean jeans, towels, shirts, underwear, bedding, such stuff; basicly anything day to day, made of cotton, wool or sysnthetic fiber or mixes of such), ANY machine can sense ANY OOB situation and won't do that, unless the suspension fails at more then 1 anchor point. And seeing one machine there with all 4 suspension rods still in place, I doubt that will happen.
And, the 7 hour lady mentioned in that video; I saw her YT channel, and how she loaded it, and honestly, I can see them all doing such stuff, especially because ALL these incidents happend within the warranty period. You know, new machine, lets just throw ANYTHING at it. Manuals? Common sense? Who cares?
This just drives me nuts. You know, its dangerous, no question about that. But why the hell is there no one single person doing the logical thing and take a photo of the load, or write down what was in there, or which cycle they used, or such stuff? I mean, a quick bit of math tells me a usual load of laundry can be well worth north of a few hundred $, with ease. Why is there just a huge "YOU ARE GUILTY!!!" scream by everybody?
And, one odd thing: They seriously keep their broken washers in their laundry room for probably weeks, don't get a replacement, and yet there is no single piece of clothing to be seen, neither arround the broken machine nor the laundry room?
You see, in my opinion, what ever day to day load you wash (and with that I mean jeans, towels, shirts, underwear, bedding, such stuff; basicly anything day to day, made of cotton, wool or sysnthetic fiber or mixes of such), ANY machine can sense ANY OOB situation and won't do that, unless the suspension fails at more then 1 anchor point. And seeing one machine there with all 4 suspension rods still in place, I doubt that will happen.
And, the 7 hour lady mentioned in that video; I saw her YT channel, and how she loaded it, and honestly, I can see them all doing such stuff, especially because ALL these incidents happend within the warranty period. You know, new machine, lets just throw ANYTHING at it. Manuals? Common sense? Who cares?
This just drives me nuts. You know, its dangerous, no question about that. But why the hell is there no one single person doing the logical thing and take a photo of the load, or write down what was in there, or which cycle they used, or such stuff? I mean, a quick bit of math tells me a usual load of laundry can be well worth north of a few hundred $, with ease. Why is there just a huge "YOU ARE GUILTY!!!" scream by everybody?
And, one odd thing: They seriously keep their broken washers in their laundry room for probably weeks, don't get a replacement, and yet there is no single piece of clothing to be seen, neither arround the broken machine nor the laundry room?
mark_wpduet
Well-known member
I agree common sense
is lacking in A LOT of people - but this has ALWAYS been the case - yet , lately, you hear of these washer explosions, where you didn't really hear about them before - Perhaps the ratio of ignorant people has increased, combined with crappy engineering is the recipe for disaster.....
is lacking in A LOT of people - but this has ALWAYS been the case - yet , lately, you hear of these washer explosions, where you didn't really hear about them before - Perhaps the ratio of ignorant people has increased, combined with crappy engineering is the recipe for disaster.....
Beforehand, people only did such day to day loads. Pillows and most comforters were kind of no go for traditional TLs.
Now, cause they don't know better, they do such comforters and pillows, but don't treat them as special and just bunch them up with normal loads.
Then, the highly absorbent pillow ends up on one side, the rest, less absorbent load on the other side, and then the softer suspension used to get them so silent just can't handle it any more.
Now, cause they don't know better, they do such comforters and pillows, but don't treat them as special and just bunch them up with normal loads.
Then, the highly absorbent pillow ends up on one side, the rest, less absorbent load on the other side, and then the softer suspension used to get them so silent just can't handle it any more.
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