Starbucks Releases US Store Closure List

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Starbucks is evil.

Buy locally-roasted beans only, if at all possible.

One of Austin's premier funky coffeehouses with tons of character and atmosphere was mown down to have some developer put up a faux-New-Orleans abominations. A totally generic Starbucks stands on the exact spot where "Les Ami" stood. It's hard to have any sort of sympathy for them.
 
and back to the original topic

Starbucks expanded here in Florida too quickly. In 2006, they purchased Barnie's Coffee and Tea Co (The corporate owned stores).
I loved Barnie's, but in time I also did grow to love my Venti "skinny" Latte from Starbucks.
It is sad that so many people have to lose their jobs, but this probably needs to happen.
 
Shane, neither Democrats nor Republicans have been deciding presidential elections for the last 25 years. And independent voters love Obama and hate McCain.

Do the math. The latest polls have Obama ahead by 12-15 points, and with the majority of remaining undecided/swing voters he's going to win by something in the neighborhood of 20%.

We'll soon find out.

Bottom line is, McCain has Bob Dole Syndrome: he wants to be president but he can't explain why. Also, with today's news (we're being thrown out of Iraq by their "new" government), McCain's main campaign issue just flew out the window. The lives of 4,100+ Americans, 70,000+ Iraqi civilians and a trillion dollars flushed directly down the toilet.

 
Geez . . .

I can’t see why the closing of some Starbucks stores has to be seen as some big political thing. It’s simply a by-product of running a large retail business: not all locations will work out well enough to be maintained indefinitely, and this will be most apparent during an economic downturn. I like Starbucks, not because they have fabulous coffee but rather because they have consistently OK coffee and good frappacinos at many convenient locations.

Would I prefer to patronize a small, local company? Sure, but they’re not always convenient. This afternoon I was in West Hollywood for a meeting and decided to have a frappacino afterwards. Rather than go to Starbucks, I went to a local shop I like better. It was about three miles out of my way (each way), and that six mile round trip took about 30 minutes due to afternoon traffic. I don’t always have time for that, which is why the ubiquitous nature of Starbucks is a big plus. I actually passed one on the way to the other shop.

As far as beans go, I never, ever buy them at Starbucks. There’s a local shop I that roasts their beans in the shop. If you live in LA, they’re called Village Coffee Roaster and located at the southeast corner of the Ventura Freeway and Mulholland in Woodland Hills - I highly recommend them. However, that doesn’t do much good if I’m over the hill in Santa Monica, West LA, or Hollywood. Another plus about Starbucks is that most of them have good restrooms. That can be very nice when my only alternative is a porta-potty at a construction site, especially on a hot day if I have to look presentable after having spent a couple of hours doing construction observation at a dusty jobsite. At Starbucks I can wash my hands and face, grab a cool drink, and head to my next appointment.

Starbucks may be a little contrived and not as good as they think they are, but on an overall basis they do pretty well and I’d hate to be without them.
 
Shane,

I confess to being curious. The differences between Hillary Clinton's announced policies (which I would have preferred, too) and Obama are very small. McCain, while a refreshing breath of air on many important topics, is an adulterer, opposed to women's civil rights and firmly committed to a war which is costing thousands of American lives yet has met none of the purported goals.
I know you aren't a racist, and you certainly don't believe Obama is a Muslim in hiding or Manchurian Candidate...hence, my curiousity. Why the enormous anger against Obama? It just doesn't make sense to me.
As far as market adjustments go, yes, this was inevitable, but I still feel for the little guys. I've been called mean and other things on this site for lacking compassion for Republican traitors and young-dynamic-managers. But my heart goes out to those hourly workers. This company made a point of training and improving the job skills of these employees; most will not soon find such good jobs.
 
One thing that Starbucks did, and did well, which a lot of retail operations do not do, is to give at least half way decent jobs, with benefits, to people who needed them. Like many companies have done in the past, they grew too fast. We can all sit and squawk about $2 coffee and $4 lattes, but everyone has their own opinion about whether or not it's worth it. Personally speaking, I'm not a big fan of most of their coffees...either too bitter or too "dark" for me, even though I love strong coffee. And I have many other options that I prefer to Starbucks. But when I hear people revel in their demise, it really makes me question common sense. The US economy is based on sustained economic growth. When that slows, or God forbid, stops, we're all in trouble. We can blame management, the economy, the price of milk, or the price of dog meat in China for that matter, it makes no difference. A company that provided employment, benefits, a place to socialize or to just buy coffee for the addicted is closing 600 stores, leaving people unemployed, without jobs, without benefits. It's nothing to revel in. We may think, well, they deserve it, they were greedy, they were this or that, doesn't matter. The impact on the local communities and their employees is what matters. My area is not impacted at all by the closings; and there are three Starbucks within a mile of my house. Do I go there? No. Will I now? No. But at least those folks still have jobs to go to. Maybe some of us think it's a silly job, but it's a job. And they do pose real nice behind that counter!!
 
>Why the enormous anger against Obama? It just doesn't make sense to me.

Keven, it's more fear than anger, and it's nothing we didn't see with John Kerry.

The answer is easily found on Fox News, on Michael Savage's radio show or on the pulpits of most Christian churches every Sunday morning. These people (this isn't directed at Shane specifically) really are fighting what they perceive to be -- and are brainwashed by our Neocon/global-corporate-state-biased media into believing is -- a "culture war": suicidal Muslims with box cutters. Illegal aliens overrunning our country. The "homosexual lifestyle". Women controlling over their own reproductive systems. Etc. It's all horribly threatening to them.

Here's an interesting piece about the long-term stakes for Republicans in this year's elections. I believe it really is the beginning of the end for them, so their fear and anger is at least understandable:

 
Keven and Jeff~

I will answer your questions, but in fairness to Launderess and of course Robert,I think maybe we should get back to the subject at hand regarding Starbucks...or perhaps start a new thread with Robert's permission...or feel free and e-mail me. I will be happy to explain my position.
 
I was beginning to think that in any city in the US you are always within 2 blocks of a Starbucks. They are all over airports, malls, Target, Krogers, and then there are their standalone stores. In Houston, I can think of at least 5 different locations where you have two Starbucks across the street from each other.
Personally, I think that Starbucks coffee is way too strong for my tastes. I like my coffee standard coffee flavor with one sugar only. No milk, cream or half/half needed.
But if you want to taste truly horrendous coffee, just ask your flight attendant for a cup on your next flight. For awhile, even United Airlines had Starbucks onboard!
We buy our coffee from a local coffee vendor where they roast the beans onsite in a glass enclosed room in the middle of the store. The people who own it offer superior customer service to most other businesses we use. We have been a customer of theirs for over 15 years!
 
A response from a TRUE conservative

As one of the few conservatives on this wonderful site,I just gotta jump in.First,a true conservative is all about freedom-freedom FROM big government.The current crop of Republicans are not true conservatives-just look at the federal budget.In fact,from a conservative point of view,Senator McCain is in fact a Democrat,while Senator Obama is in reality a Socialist.Listen carefully to his remarks-not others interpretation of them,but directly from him.We have been on a course-slowly-toward Socialism for 70 years,and the election of Senator Obama will greatly accelerate that trend.I simply do not want to go in that direction.It has nothing to do with "hating"Senator Obama.If he came to my door he would be treated respectfully and given any comfort my home could offer-but not my vote.
Don't confuse the majority of Republicans with true conservatives on social issues either.True conservatives don't care what people do,as long as it does not hurt someone else.
Finally,it comes down to the size and cost of government.I make no apology for working hard to provide my family(and myself)with nice things. I make no apology for resenting the fact that all the taxes I pay exceed 50% of my income,and a lot of that money is given to those who choose not to produce.The word"entitlement"makes my blood boil.All any of us is"entitled"to is the opportunity to succeed.My government-which is supposed to protect me-is in fact robbing me.
 
"Entitlement"

....there's that word that I just hate...makes my blood boil. Way too many "entitled" people around these days.
 
Response to the true conservative, from a true liberal

>As one of the few conservatives on this wonderful site,I just gotta jump in.First,a true conservative is all about freedom-freedom FROM big government.<

Actually that's the textbook definition of a liberal: one who advocates personal liberty, personal responsibility and freedom from intrusive government.

> The current crop of Republicans are not true conservatives-just look at the federal budget.In fact,from a conservative point of view,Senator McCain is in fact a Democrat,while Senator Obama is in reality a Socialist.<

The current crop of Republicans are not Democrats, they're Neoconservative totalitarians. Some are fascists. Proof of this claim is easy to come by: They're trying to intrude government into every nook and cranny of our lives, from women's uteruses to gay people's bedrooms. For the last several years Mr. Bush has even been intruding it (illegally) into our phone conversations, banking and passport records.

> Listen carefully to his remarks-not others interpretation of them,but directly from him.We have been on a course-slowly-toward Socialism for 70 years,and the election of Senator Obama will greatly accelerate that trend.<

That's a media scare tactic which anyone who actually has listened to Obama knows is complete nonsense. Republicans, just in the 12 years they held control of Congress expanded our federal government more and plunged us into deeper debt than the so-called "socialist" "tax and spend" Democrats did in the 40+ years they held control of Congress. That's a simple fact, and it's one of the main reasons Republicans were thrown out on their asses in 2006.

> I simply do not want to go in that direction.It has nothing to do with "hating"Senator Obama.If he came to my door he would be treated respectfully and given any comfort my home could offer-but not my vote.
Don't confuse the majority of Republicans with true conservatives on social issues either.True conservatives don't care what people do,as long as it does not hurt someone else.
Finally,it comes down to the size and cost of government.I make no apology for working hard to provide my family(and myself)with nice things. I make no apology for resenting the fact that all the taxes I pay exceed 50% of my income,and a lot of that money is given to those who choose not to produce.The word"entitlement"makes my blood boil.All any of us is"entitled"to is the opportunity to succeed.My government-which is supposed to protect me-is in fact robbing me.<

That's the standard string of outrageous mistruths and half-truths spouted by the Republican Party. Do you know who has universal healthcare? Iraq and Afghanistan. And who's paying for it? We are. Our hospitals, highways etc are falling apart, but guess who has brand new hospitals and highways? Yep, same answer. Who's paying for it? Same answer.

Remember the bankruptcy "reform" of 2005? Republicans passed this poor-bashing obscenity two weeks before they voted to forgive $90 billion in debts from foreign countries.

So we arrive at the main reason Republicans were booted out of Congress in 2006, and will continue to be booted out this November: an obscene and relentless perversion of priorities.

The claim that America's elderly and disabled, the ones who're taking the major bulk of entitlement money, "choose not to produce" is something straight out of the Third Reich. What are you saying, we should fire up the ovens?

These people are simply taking back their own money, which they paid into the system (in most cases) for 30, 40 or more years. Social Security has been one of the most successful government programs in U.S. and world history, and a mere 3.5% increase in payroll taxes will keep the program solvent indefinitely.
 
Good rebuttal

JeffG,
Interesting and well written reply.I certainly did not count retirees as non-producers.As you pointed out,these people paid the price for their benefits.I was referring to those-and there are tens of millions-who make a career out of riding on the back of others.The problem is that SS is such a terrible investment.I could only wish I had my money even in a CD at 4% I would be miles ahead.I am self employed and have to pay both sides of SS.At age 50,I would now have SEVEN FIGURES in my account.As for the disability program,it's probably the most abused program we have.I have terminated two friendships lately over it-guys I thought were honest just decided they did not want to work anymore.

I must take exception with one thing you said-that liberals advocate personal responsibility.I say respectfully that that statement is 180 degrees off from reality.The fact is that personal IRRESPONSIBILITY is well rewarded by liberals-that is their power base.
I would have added one thing to the list of freedoms we want to enjoy-the freedom from excessive taxation and regulation.
 
"freedom FROM big government."
hows that going? The government has grown larger than ever in the last 8 years.

"conservative point of view"
The name is a contradiction. Something you will find often when talking to a republican.
Conservative = radical with no moral limits.
We the people = the 5% FINANCIALLY wealthiest
defending the people = defending corporations and the 5% above
No new taxes = tax cuts for those above at the expense of the rest.
We don't torture = we do it AND we enjoy it.
the disgusting list goes on.

"Senator McCain is in fact a Democrat"
are we delusional or trying to talk others into something?

"We have been on a course-slowly-toward Socialism"
Yes, and it was good. It is certainly better than FASCISM. You know what this don't you.
That is when government is in defense of business. When society is set around business. NOT ACCEPTABLE. and our society has definately been pushed in that direction.

"True conservatives don't care what people do,as long as it does not hurt someone else."
another contradiction. How Does the NRA fit into this? What with the rise in gun violence and school shooting. Virginia HELLO.

"I make no apology for working hard to provide my family(and myself)with nice things"
??? did anyone ask you to?

"I make no apology for resenting the fact that all the taxes I pay "
You should. A true PATRIOT pays their FAIR share for the maintenance and betterment of our society.

"the taxes I pay exceed 50% of my income,and a lot of that money is given to those who choose not to produce."
lol, Why am I doubting that you carry such a HEAVY burden.
and I am sure that most of that money you do pay goes right into the pockets of street bums and layabouts, not the BILLIONS of dollars that have been wasted in Iraq. NO.

"All any of us is"entitled"to is the opportunity to succeed"
people are ENTITLED to a lot more than that. Clean Air, Clean Water, good education, healthy relationship with family, etc. Life isn't just about career and making money.

"My government-which is supposed to protect me-is in fact robbing me."
I this one you might be right. Why then do republicans vote to not fund our governmental services like police and fire. Try and break the Unions for the Firefighters who have backed Barack? Your republican, why have republicans FAILED to protect our shipping ports? Why did our republican run government let the 9/11 event happen when they knew ahead of time that this event was planned. ITs documented.
Why, Mr. Hides in obscurity behind a blank profile. (anti-social)

"The problem is that SS is such a terrible investment."
really. It has served well ALL these years. It is still working that is why our blow-monkey pres and the other lame republicans tried to push for privatization in 2004 he got his ass handed to him.

"I could only wish I had my money even in a CD at 4% I would be miles ahead"
Let me explain what SS is since you were probably 'too busy making a living' or playing golf somewhere instead of getting a basic education.
Social Security is a Safety net for ALL people. If you don't need it than great, take that as a form of success FINANCIALLY anyway.
However there are millions of people who, for whatever reason, are not protected financially. And suffer from lack of bare minimum. These are people who need help and may well need help financially for the rest of their lives.

Maybe they are Military Veterans, Disabled, People who have been cheated out of their pensions because greedy corporate moves, or job elimations due to moving factories over seas(more greed), or technilogical changes in the work place or increases in efficiency in manufacturing. There are lots of reasons. We know that bush administration have skewed the unemployment numbers as well and in fact the unemployment at least twice what they claim. (surprise) and it is only going to get worse with this recession/depression.

"I have terminated two friendships lately over it"
Nobody wants to hear about your delusional sense of Moral Superiority. Money doesn't make you a better person. This is a clear act of judging someone based on money. sick.

"the list of freedoms we (there is that WE again, 5%?)want to enjoy-the freedom from excessive taxation and regulation"
Well if your are making over $1,000,000, you've got it. for now. You don't deserve it.

Don't bother with a phoney facade of niceity
"If he came to my door he would be treated respectfully and given any comfort my home"
and
"Interesting and well written reply"
and
"I say respectfully that"
no sale.

You claim you are age 50. Which means that in 1980 or so you were just at the ripe turning point of the reagan spurred corruption that was the 1980s. I remember as a teenager watching those 10 years older and up BASKing in the unbridled greed that was being encouraged at the time. Much as we have had in the last 8 years.
Society as a whole is distracted, be it with sex or encouraging greed, stupid cars, whatever, while the fox robs the henhouse (government).

It was only a matter of time that those that got a taste back then would want more. Only this time the end results are even worse than in 1989 or so.

People like you make me sick. I should think that people like you would be afraid for your lives. No wonder republicans support the NRA. It is only a matter of time that the general public will tolerate the abuse and inconsideration. And there is a whole hell of a lot more of 'the general public' than there are of your type.

If you actually are one in the minority FINANCIALLY 5% or so. You owe our society and don't forget it!

You may be FINANCIALLY wealthy, but in all the other areas of life, specifically of moral dignity, you are highly impoverished. But don't worry, I'm sure you can find someone to victimize, a disabled veteran to boot out of his hospital bed, someone to belittle so you can pump your ego and make your self feel better instead of actually doing something positive.




 
IndyMac is the 2nd biggest bank failure in our nations history.
To date.
More to follow ?
All I can think is I want wrap my hands around the neck of a greedy p.o.s. white trash, republican and squeeze.

But I,
don't need to do that.

I wouldn't want to be considered a 'whiner' lol
 
If you know your ex-friends are defrauding the government, have you reported them? It's your responsibility to do so.

I have several disabled friends, and in every case not only are they disabled, they were forced to hire lawyers, have hearings and wait TWO OR EVEN THREE YEARS to receive their due benefits. So I'm not sure how much tougher you think the approval process should be.

I'm not claiming fraud doesn't exist in this or any other major government program, but in general your stereotyping falls into the same cauldren of poor-bashing and ignorance that America's neo-right is now famous for: you know, the "crack moms squirting out babies" etc. In my experience most people who regurgitate this nonsense have never stepped foot in a county health clinic or welfare agency, or ever allowed facts to get in the way of their prejudgments.
 
Don't get me wrong...

I have nothing against Money.
I have had money, some money myself.

There are lots of wonderful, wonderful people who are worth Millions and perhaps Billions of dollars.

And they know their station in life.
They owe society and they go out of their WAY to act charitible.

just as there is good and BAD in EVERYTHING.
There are people with a little coin in their pocket and suddenly their former lowly self feels they can turn around and spew on everyone else.

New money is often undeserved money. And prior generations were not taught how to act with coin in pocket. These are the ________ who need a good ass kicking. or more properly a sitting down and educating of their station in life. That they are not King and can end up losing that coin too. Then they just might need that Social Security.
Oh my.
 
I'm not in the 5%

Nor am I a Republican-haven't been since the end of President Reagan's second term.I also think,as many of our other members do,that President Bush has made a mess of things.That can't be denied by any logical person.
I am not in the top 5% of income earners-but they do not deserve to be over taxed either.I don't hate them because they have more than I do.I don't want the government to go take their money and give it to me-I did not earn it and do not deserve it.
My income is somewhat above average in my area,and again being self employed I pay double SS-that is about 18%-before any actual income tax is paid.Add the property taxes,the sales taxes,the gas taxes,the income tax itself,and so on.
You state that everyone should pay their fair share,and on that we can agree-but I contend that there is nothing in any way fair about so much being taken.Obama said -I saw the clip-that using the tax code to"equalize income"was fine.He also said that anyone making above the average income should not mind having the excess taxed at a high rate.Pure Socialism.
A shame.
 

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