STPP - How much is enough in a FL'er?

[drhardee]

A poster ("Rich") over at the "Gardenweb" Appliance FAQ's stated that he uses STPP at a ratio of 2:1 (2 parts HE detergent to 1 part STPP). So, I've tried this ratio as well. I've mixed up a few pounds of powdered detergent (Sears HE Stain formula) with STPP. For every 2 cups of Sears, I add 1 cup of STPP. Mix well, store and use.

I add one level Sears scoop of this "premix" to a load of clothes in my Frigidaire FL. No oversudsing, no undersudsing, no drama and what I believe to be nicely cleaned clothes. I still use 1/3 cup of clorine bleach on whites, though.

Knowing that some here don't regard some of the experts in Gardenweb too highly (our members here who also are members there notwithstanding) is this a good ratio for moderately soft water and a FL machine??
I'm providing the link to the Gardenweb FAQ for STPP, etc.

http://ths.gardenweb.com/faq/laundry/

 

[launderess]

You can probably cut down the ratio to 1 to 2 if you already have soft water. You really do not need that much STPP, especially if water isn't that hard to start. Remember also making water too soft can cause problems as well.

Myself switch back and forth between STPP and Amway's "Water Softening Compound", which is the precursor to Smashing White. Only use about a scant 1/2 tablespoon to 1 tablespoon of detergent, sometimes less. I don't bother using any sort of water softener on colours and darks.

L.

 

[veg-o-matic]

Not the same?

I went to Lowe's and bought a box of TSP and started using it. I added a Sears detergent scoopful (couple of tablespoons, maybe?) to a load of dingy towels and they came out nice and clean.
Not to mention really, really soft.
Should I not be using this stuff in the laundry? It works really well.

veg

 

[launderess]

Ain't Nothing Like The Real Thing

TSP is trisodium phosphate, but lately in response to local bans on phosphates, it is likely to be mostly washing soda.

This TSP is highly alkaline, more so than STPP and is not the same in terms of water softening as it is a parcitipating water softener, in that it binds with hard water minerals forming a cloudy muck.

As for doing laundry with TSP, if it is the phosphate variety, then things should be ok. However if it is the TSP subsitute then there are better choices, IMHO.

Best of luck

L.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trisodium_phosphate

 

[bellalaundry]

So...where does one

buy STPP? It sounds like a terrific additive, and probably cheaper than Calgon Water Softener (we have this in Canada)

Any ideas?

Guy

 

[launderess]

Don't know if the default source in the United States, "The Chemistry Store" can or even will ship up north. Even if they did it would cost dear, and probably not clear customs. Even if it cleared customs you'd have to pay duty.

You can check chemical supply companies including those that supply laundries and food processing plants.

 

[toggleswitch]

The Chemistry Store
1133 Walter Price St
Cayce, SC 29033

800.224.1430
www.chemistry store.com

STTP
CAS 7758-29-4

http://www.chemistrystore.com/

 

[toggleswitch]

correction:

www.chemistrystore.com

 

[sudsmaster]

STPP is not for hard water only!

Hi Dr. Hardee,

I am the very same Rich from THS. My water is also moderately soft (5 grains or less) and I find the 2:1 ratio of powdered detergent to STPP works very well. It is also the level that detergent mfg's tended to settle upon in the early 70's as the optimum level of phosphates in laundry detergents for good cleaning performance without over-doing it.

A minor correction to what was said before: TSP is always Tri Sodium Phosphate. However, there is an ersatz product on the shelves called T.S.P.* (note the periods). The asterisk will direct you to some fine print on the package that says "Totally Superior Product". As I recall, T.S.P.* is mostly sodium carbonate, with either sodium percarbonate or sodium sesquicarbonate. In other words, washing soda.

Real TSP is a very good cleaner and degreaser for hard surfaces. But, as Laundress has pointed out, since it forms a precipitate with hard water minerals, it's a bit better than washing soda but nowhere near as good for porous laundry as STPP.

I seem to have to repeat the following over and over again: STPP's benefit to laundry is only partly to counteract hard water. It is important to realize that most dirt is in fact hard water mineral-laden. The hard water minerals in the dirt will basically be released into the wash water and have the same deleterious effect on cleaning as if the incoming water were hard to begin with.

An equally important function of STPP is that it is very active in binding hard water minerals from the soiled laundry and hold it in suspension without redeposting it back on the laundry. For this reason it excels in removing all sorts of dirt and related stains from laundry, even in soft water. In other words, even if your water is soft, STPP can help immensely in getting your whites whiter, and much more gently than any bleach.

 

[launderess]

One thing to remember when using STPP or any "water softener" in a front loading machine, along with detergent is foaming.

Ideally one should use an "HE" or low foaming detergent, this way the soft water combined with detergent will not cause problems. Too soft water is just as bad as too hard when it comes to laundry, and the former can create problems as much as the later.

Final thing to consider is the first launderings or two with STPP added will most certianly leech out detergent residue from all but the most well rinsed laundry. Therefore one must take this into account, again so not to create an over detergent problem. Many people think they've added too much detergent along with STPP, when in reality it is the STPP releasing detergent back into the wash water from previously laundered textiles that is causing all that foam.

Sodium Sesquicarbonate:

Am sure one day the EPA is going to raid my house, with it's stash of phosphates, and phosphate containing laundry products ! *LOL* However have been using Amyway's "Water Softening Compound" recently instead of pure STPP, as I nabbed two huge boxes cheaply and it means can put off reordering from TCS any time soon.

Amway's product is now called "Smashing White" and contains STPP and SSC. Works quite well, and though worried about the SSC, have seen no difference between using the Amway product versus pure STPP. Only use a scant 1/4 to 1/4 tablespoon per wash, and even then only on whites and colourfast items.

L.

 

[sudsman]

STPP

Can be purchased at almost any lab supply store some feed stores have it also,(at least in this area) use only 1 tsp at the most it does not take very much .. We use 6 oz on a 150 lb load, The Amway verions are far overpriced for what you get.. dont waste your money , you can find it far cheaper.

 

[launderess]

Well considering I only paid about $3.00 for two 7 pound boxes, don't think the price was too high. Certianly cheaper than what the Chemistry Store charges for only five pounds of STPP.

L.

 

[sudsman]

Launderess

You did get a DEAL but you do know how .

 

[launderess]

You Know How We Do!

*LOL*