suds lock?
- Thread starter badgerdx
- Start date
Help Support :
strongenough78
Well-known member
Well, if too much detergent was used in a load of laundry, the suds won't drain out and build up in the outer tub. And believe it or not it can drag down the inner tub during the spin cycle not allowing it to reach full spin speed. I've seen it happen many times, Whirlpools and Kenmore were notorious for it. I didn't get how something as delicate as bubbles can do that, but if you get enough of them in there, it happens. It's like when you drain a sink with sudsy dish soap and it takes a while to get all the suds down the drain. They don't pop as easy as you think.
Oh, Naaaate . . .
It's not the chemical properties only. Consider how you have to have soap and water to blow bubbles; water alone won't form the film necessary to make a bubble; you need the surfactant. As long as that bubble stays wet, the film persists. Bubbles pop usually because the skin dries out. If rinse water were being spun out of a load of clothes in a perforated tub machine, it would go down the pump and out. With detergent water providing the chemicals to make foam, the spinning basket can pump air and water into the foam. It's not so much a fragile bubble, it is the air and water mixture that millions of little bubbles hold suspended between the basket and the outer tub that impede spinning. Because bubbles are lighter than water, they don't fall down toward the pump opening as fast as water so they stay up where they keep growing in number to hold the mass of air and water against the tub which slows it. That's how a friend burned out the motor in her 58 LK. After her husband replaced it, she switched to ALL.
Instructions in the 29" Kenmore combo tell the user to stop the machine and let it rest for 5 minutes in cases of severe oversudsing. It takes every bit of 5 minutes for the bubbles to break down in that wet environment. Only near the very end can you try to open the door without fear of a suds avalance to allow some dry air in to hasten the foamicide.
Instructions in the 29" Kenmore combo tell the user to stop the machine and let it rest for 5 minutes in cases of severe oversudsing. It takes every bit of 5 minutes for the bubbles to break down in that wet environment. Only near the very end can you try to open the door without fear of a suds avalance to allow some dry air in to hasten the foamicide.
mickeyd
Well-known member
ESP, fact or fiction?
In the wee hours, I was contemplating a scenario about suds-locks, and here you were asking at the same time, a million miles away.
Telepathy, serendipity, clairvoyance, or corny coincidence--who cares: I love it when it happens. See yesterday's DDD thread.
In the wee hours, I was contemplating a scenario about suds-locks, and here you were asking at the same time, a million miles away.
Telepathy, serendipity, clairvoyance, or corny coincidence--who cares: I love it when it happens. See yesterday's DDD thread.
henrypeter21
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 13, 2011
- Messages
- 155
What's a Sudslock?
Basically when the machine spins, the water still in the drum which can not be removed by the pump quick enough drags on the drum causing motor stress, this is why new machines use profile spins.
Basically when the machine spins, the water still in the drum which can not be removed by the pump quick enough drags on the drum causing motor stress, this is why new machines use profile spins.
mickeyd
Well-known member
Love his blond bangs, thanks.
It looks he's the one talking and you're the one making horse sounds. Too funny. Boy, 20 years--what a great friend !
It looks he's the one talking and you're the one making horse sounds. Too funny. Boy, 20 years--what a great friend !
Don't Know Nothing About "New" Profile Spins
But my older Miele does a series of graduated spins before the main event to amoung other things, get much of the water and froth out to prevent suds locking.
Mind you like many front and top loaders then and now the machine also has a built in motor/pump protection system that slows down spinning if too much froth/water is being pushed out for the machine to handle at once.
Personally have always felt this is where commercial washers with "dump" valves outshine domestic machines. You've not lived until you've seen a 50lb SQ laundromat front loader with a full load of say terry cloth bath linen go into a spin when high suds are present.
But my older Miele does a series of graduated spins before the main event to amoung other things, get much of the water and froth out to prevent suds locking.
Mind you like many front and top loaders then and now the machine also has a built in motor/pump protection system that slows down spinning if too much froth/water is being pushed out for the machine to handle at once.
Personally have always felt this is where commercial washers with "dump" valves outshine domestic machines. You've not lived until you've seen a 50lb SQ laundromat front loader with a full load of say terry cloth bath linen go into a spin when high suds are present.
arbilab
Well-known member
Oh Launderess, I've watched a few commercial machines spin and it's a major experience in respect.
"Profile" spin is simply a programmed acceleration. Earlier machines had it too, via clutch slippage (e.g. Whirlpool) or belt slippage (e.g. Maytag) or more elegant hydraulic coupling (I'm not knowledgeable enough to quote examples). Machines today do it electronically by gradually ramping the motor speed from tumble to distribute to spin.
"Profile" spin is simply a programmed acceleration. Earlier machines had it too, via clutch slippage (e.g. Whirlpool) or belt slippage (e.g. Maytag) or more elegant hydraulic coupling (I'm not knowledgeable enough to quote examples). Machines today do it electronically by gradually ramping the motor speed from tumble to distribute to spin.
"Profile Spin"
In the UK it is when a spin cycle is broken into programmed segments and NOT continuous.....it was a feature that started in the 80`s with Creda (Rythmn Spin) and marketed by Hotpoint (Profile spin), later adopted by most other manufacturers, saying that Asko and V-Zug have a continuous gradual spin over 9 mins ramping up slowly but powerfully!!
Example of Profile Spin: (By no means the definitive)
Distribution - pinning the clothes against the drum pumping out the water
First spin - up to around 600rpm for 30 - 60 secs then stop, pumping out water
Tumbling and loosening clothes , pumping
Re-Distribution - again pinning clothes evenly
2nd spin - can be higher speed, more water extracted, continuous or breaks in pump out
Tumbling and loosening clothes
3rd spin gardually building up to fastest speed selected
So the biggest ammounts of water are taken out early on at low revs allowing the breaks which help the pump clear the backlog of water, as these days the tolerences between the tubs are so narrow and most machines have pumps that are average..
Also allows for re-distribution of clothing allowing even balance around the drum so less OOB and creasing - saying that with all the will in the world it can tend to be the random laws of nature as to whether one spin will be super smooth or another be a bone shaker!!!
In the UK it is when a spin cycle is broken into programmed segments and NOT continuous.....it was a feature that started in the 80`s with Creda (Rythmn Spin) and marketed by Hotpoint (Profile spin), later adopted by most other manufacturers, saying that Asko and V-Zug have a continuous gradual spin over 9 mins ramping up slowly but powerfully!!
Example of Profile Spin: (By no means the definitive)
Distribution - pinning the clothes against the drum pumping out the water
First spin - up to around 600rpm for 30 - 60 secs then stop, pumping out water
Tumbling and loosening clothes , pumping
Re-Distribution - again pinning clothes evenly
2nd spin - can be higher speed, more water extracted, continuous or breaks in pump out
Tumbling and loosening clothes
3rd spin gardually building up to fastest speed selected
So the biggest ammounts of water are taken out early on at low revs allowing the breaks which help the pump clear the backlog of water, as these days the tolerences between the tubs are so narrow and most machines have pumps that are average..
Also allows for re-distribution of clothing allowing even balance around the drum so less OOB and creasing - saying that with all the will in the world it can tend to be the random laws of nature as to whether one spin will be super smooth or another be a bone shaker!!!
Educated once again...
Kool, interesting read guys. I've actually leant summit here by the workings of old and new machines. Mike, "Profile Spin" does that apply to the Bosch V series too, as these line of machine's did up to Nine intervals, so I'm guessing there was hardly no water to pump out by the end of the 9th interval... Do you have any idea to why they went on for that long, if I recall, it would go on for at least 20mins at a time?
There have been machines that has equally coped with sud locks, for example the Indesit L5, when it just went straight into its spin phase, with soapy water and the risk of suds lock was higher.
Badgerdx you do come up with interesting topics, so thumbs up
Hass.
Kool, interesting read guys. I've actually leant summit here by the workings of old and new machines. Mike, "Profile Spin" does that apply to the Bosch V series too, as these line of machine's did up to Nine intervals, so I'm guessing there was hardly no water to pump out by the end of the 9th interval... Do you have any idea to why they went on for that long, if I recall, it would go on for at least 20mins at a time?
There have been machines that has equally coped with sud locks, for example the Indesit L5, when it just went straight into its spin phase, with soapy water and the risk of suds lock was higher.
Badgerdx you do come up with interesting topics, so thumbs up
Hass.
Profile Spin
Yes Hass, the Bosch Siemens "Interval Spin" was the same thing, remove the bulk of the water at low revs whilst tumbling to reduce creasing and to get a good even balance around the drum....those machines where much quieter than say Hotpoints, and yes up to nine intervals!!!
Interestingly its not promoted as much as it was years ago when new, I suppose its part of the programme cycle we have gotten used to!!
Yes Hass, the Bosch Siemens "Interval Spin" was the same thing, remove the bulk of the water at low revs whilst tumbling to reduce creasing and to get a good even balance around the drum....those machines where much quieter than say Hotpoints, and yes up to nine intervals!!!
Interestingly its not promoted as much as it was years ago when new, I suppose its part of the programme cycle we have gotten used to!!
mickeyd
Well-known member
Another shot of Suds-lock
~
Mikey, the Hoover thread needs your attention.
~
Mikey, the Hoover thread needs your attention.
I had a suds-lock the other day in the Speed Queen! Small load and Foca - and only like 2 tablespoons of it! I was doing other things and walked by to find this. It sudslocked in the first spin but some fabric softener and a pitcher of water cured it quick.
Greg, what do the Chinese characters say? Are they a prayer against oversudsing, placed there after you discovered the machine creaming the laundry room? Or, is that the machine's name in Chinese or maybe that universal Chinese term for trouble, Sum Ting Wong?
洗衣机 xi yi ji＝ Wash Clothes Machine
干衣机 gan yi ji ＝ Dry Clothes Machine
洗晚机 xi wan ji ＝ Wash Dishes Machine
I have yellow labels all over the house
干衣机 gan yi ji ＝ Dry Clothes Machine
洗晚机 xi wan ji ＝ Wash Dishes Machine
I have yellow labels all over the house
Similar threads
